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30 years after Tiananmen Square, the U.S. is still trying to destabilize China

Max Parry

Last month marked three decades since the conclusion of the 1989 Tiananmen Square demonstrations in China. The anniversary is opportune for Washington and its Western partners to ramp-up their Sinophobic smear campaign while recycling the hoax they have propagated ever since the June Fourth incident occurred.

Coverage of the commemoration has been wedded with the ongoing propaganda and wild accusation that the People’s Republic has currently detained up to 1 million Turkic Uyghur Muslims from the autonomous Xinjiang province in “concentration camps.”

Simultaneously, opposition marches have erupted in the former British colony of Hong Kong with the financial backing of astro-turfing NGOs against a controversial extradition bill with the mainland.

Like Tiananmen Square thirty years ago, the “pro-democracy” gatherings in the self-governing territory have become increasingly violent as rioters have stormed legislative buildings while hoisting the colonial-era dragon and lion flag as their emblem.

The adoption of the Union Jack is reminiscent of the Syrian opposition’s appropriation of the French Mandate-era flag as its ensign — and we all know how “peaceful” those protests turned out to be.

In August of last year, the United Nations Committee on the Elimination of Racial Discrimination (CERD) performed a routine analysis of China’s accordance with the International Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Racial Discrimination.

The only member to include the charge of Uyghur ‘internment camps’ was the committee’s American vice-chair, Gay McDougall, who did so based on allegations made by a shadowy opposition group located in Washington, D.C., known as the Network of Chinese Human Rights Defenders (CHRD).

In other words, the UN did not officially make this determination but was only the interpretation of one American representative based on the conjecture of a dubious and biased “human rights” organization. Nevertheless, Western corporate media reported this unquestioningly second-hand under the assumption that the CERD committee consisted of UN internal sources when it is actually comprised of “independent experts” like McDougall.

Unsurprisingly, CHRD is directly tied to the highly politicized Human Rights Watch (HRW) NGO, which despite its name could not be more at odds with its declared vocation given its shared personnel and history of policies in lock-step with the world’s greatest violator of human rights, especially against Muslim countries, in the United States government.

A Turkish scholar recently claimed that as many as 12.5 million Muslims have died in wars in the past 25 years, the vast majority a result of American foreign policy. Not to mention the fact that the U.S. still operates a very real concentration camp for Muslims in its naval base on the coast of Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, which President Donald Trump has signed an executive order to keep open indefinitely.

For seventeen years, GITMO prisoners have been held and tortured without trial in total violation of international law. At the end of the day, “human rights” is a weapon to manipulate credulous liberals into supporting hawkish foreign policy whereby minority groups like China’s Tibetans and Uyghurs become pawns on the geopolitical chess board to undermine Washington’s adversaries.

An investigation showed that CHRD gets most of its funds from government grants, which its safe to assume comes from the U.S.-government bankrolled National Endowment for Democracy (NED) NGO that is also subsidizing the Hong Kong protests.

The paradoxically named CIA slush fund was created in 1983 as a front for the intelligence service to conceal its operations after the agency’s standing was disgraced following the revelations of illicit crimes in the prior decades sabotaging democracies around the world to install U.S. puppet regimes. Founded by Ronald Reagan, the NED has poured money into programs related to Xinjiang such as the World Uyghur Congress.

In March, Secretary of State Mike Pompeo met with four Uyghur representatives, though it turned out that at least one of those he convened with was a reporter for the U.S. government-owned Radio Free Asia which is the equivalent of the CIA’s Radio Free Europe in the continent. Just two months later, Pompeo would make a clean breast of his previous tenure as CIA director in a speech at Texas A&M University [emphasis added]:

Having said that, not all tough places are the same. They each present a different set of challenges. I — it reminds me, you would know this as — it’s a bit of an aside. But in terms of how you think about problem sets, I — when I was a cadet, what’s the first — what’s the cadet motto at West Point? You will not lie, cheat, or steal, or tolerate those who do. I was the CIA director. We lied, we cheated, we stole. It’s — it was like — we had entire training courses. It reminds you of the glory of the American experiment.”

The fact that Pompeo admitted spinning the CIA’s yarn just a short time after meeting with the Uyghurs hasn’t prevented many on the left from lining up behind mainstream media in spreading the West’s disinformation without verification of the camps existence. The Intercept, a popular progressive news publication known for its coverage of leaks by NSA whistleblower Edward Snowden, published an article calling for “global outrage” in response.

The piece was written by Mehdi Hasan, a journalist who also works for Al-Jazeera, the state news network of Qatar’s ruling emirs whose government co-sponsors much of the Islamic terrorism plaguing Xinjiang that has been the basis for China’s policies regarding its Uyghur question.

The Intercept is also owned by First Look Media, established by eBay co-founder Pierre Omidyar, whose investment firm financed many of the NGOs in Ukraine which organized the Euromaidan protests which ousted Kiev’s democratically-elected government in 2014. It is possible the billionaire has a similar conflict of interest in China.

A Reuters journalist who gained rare access to the facilities was interviewed, and his on-the-ground observations were rather banal in comparison to such sensationalized vicarious reporting.

The Chinese government acknowledges that what does exist in the energy-rich Northwestern province are re-education centers training and rehabilitating individuals with links to Turkic separatism, Uyghur nationalism and ISIS/Daesh to combat the spread of jihadism into the Uyghur community by U.S. ally Saudi Arabia.

For fifty years, the Gulf State kingdom has propagated an intolerant and ultra-conservative strain of Islam while evading any consequences as the source of international terrorism. This long believed association was confirmed in a leaked Hillary Clinton email from 2014 published by WikiLeaks:

While this military/para-military operation is moving forward, we need to use our diplomatic and more traditional intelligence assets to bring pressure on the governments of Qatar and Saudi Arabia, which are providing clandestine financial and logistic support to ISIL and other radical Sunni groups in the region.”

The embattled Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman admitted that the previously obscure and fundamentalist Wahhabi sect of Islam was deliberately exported at the West’s encouragement during the Cold War to undermine Soviet influence in Muslim countries.

Today, Saudi-trained imams around the world are preaching the supremacy of Sharia law and waging jihad, from Kosovo to the Philippines. The Turkic-speaking Sunni minority concentrated in Xinjiang have not avoided this contamination as the region has been infested with terrorism since the 1990s with violence committed overwhelmingly by radicalized Uyghurs, from suicide bombings to knife attacks.

It is notable that China’s dozens of other Muslim ethnoreligious groups, such as the Hui people, are relatively well assimilated into Chinese society and have been immune to such ills, casting doubt on the West’s characterization of China as anti-Islam.

Meanwhile, the Uyghur extremism problem is so abundant that many were recruited in Syria to fight alongside al-Qaeda in the U.S.-Saudi proxy army rebranded as “moderate rebels” that unsuccessfully sought to overthrow the secular government of Bashar al-Assad.

As only American exceptionalism permits, Washington is now simulating outrage at the PRC’s crackdown on the very religious fanaticism its allies have instigated, in the hopes that a separatist uprising could balkanize Xinjiang and halt China’s development of its new silk road, the Belt and Road Initiative (BRI), through the region connecting its trade routes with Africa and Europe. The feigned outcry of the West toward any unsubstantiated human rights abuses rings hollow given that which is taking place in GITMO and numerous U.S. black sites around the world.

The American “human rights expert” who made the assertion, Gay McDougall, is an advisory board member of the Open Society Foundation NGO, founded by the controversial international financier George Soros.

It is ironic that Soros has become so hated on the political right in the West when it was his “philanthropic” agencies that were instrumental in the collapse of communism in Eastern Europe and attempted the same in China.

During the 1980s, his nonprofits partnered with other CIA soft-power intermediaries to destabilize the Eastern bloc and foment “pro-democracy” movements behind the Iron Curtain, from Poland’s Solidarity to Czechoslovakia’s Velvet Revolution.

Later, Soros would invest heavily in Serbia’s Otpor! movement which ousted the last bastion of semi-socialism in Eurasia in the government of Slobodan Milosevic following the breakup of the former Yugoslavia after the end of the Cold War.

The success of Otpor! became the formulaic blueprint for the Western-engineered Color Revolutions in Eastern Europe against Moscow-backed states in the years to come, even after the reinstatement of the free market. Otpor! (“Resistance!”) became Georgia’s Kmara (“Enough!”) in the Rose Revolution, Kyrgystan’s KelKel (Pink or Tulip Revolution), Ukraine’s Pora (“It’s time”) in the Orange Revolution and many others which used the same protest tactics, slogans, and vexillography to transform peaceful protests into regime change operations.

The anti-war movement should be deeply suspicious of Soros’ recent reported venture in an unlikely partnership with right-wing billionaire Charles Koch to establish a think tank whose aim is to “end America’s forever wars”, considering the Hungarian-born hedge fund tycoon has played an enormous role in US foreign policy for decades.

The methodology behind Color Revolutions takes inspiration from the writings of Gene Sharp, aka the “Machiavelli of non-violence”, a little known political scientist whose doctrine on strategies of non-violent resistance became useful to the Western establishment in training activists to incite unrest in order to topple governments in countries it seeks to dominate.

Sharp’s work, From Dictatorship to Democracy, was used as a training manual in Otpor! and later became pivotal in the Arab Spring uprisings, another instance where what were presented as authentic, spontaneous protests quickly transformed into U.S.-friendly insurrections. Sharp’s theories became the modus operandi in depersonalizing political movements in order to manipulate them to suit the ends of regime change puppet masters in the Anglosphere.

What a coincidence that Gene Sharp himself was reportedly present in Tiananmen Square, aka the Gate of Heavenly Peace, back in 1989.

Meanwhile, Soros was busy establishing the Fund for the Reform and Opening of China, aka the China Fund, which was shut down by the PRC after it suspected the foundation of connections with the CIA in the ensuing months that year. There is little doubt that the China Fund was attempting the same as what was done in Soros’s native Hungary, as well as Czechoslovakia and Poland.

In hindsight, Tiananmen Square was one of the first attempts of what would become known as Color Revolutions, albeit a failed one. While Washington was successful in unseating communism in the Eastern Bloc it was unable to do in Beijing, though it was an enormous victory in the propaganda war of forever cementing the Chinese government as synonymous with authoritarianism in the impressionable minds of Westerners.

To this day the story according to the yellow press is that the People’s Liberation Army (PLA) opened fire indiscriminately and massacred “thousands” of “non-violent” demonstrators when it finally cleared the city square after nearly 2 months of student-led protests.

This was accepted as orthodoxy, even on much of the left, until this version of events was revealed to be contradicted by the U.S.’s own embassy cables published in 2011 by Wikileaks.

These cables divulged that the U.S. government had knowingly been allowing to the media to recount a fictitious narrative for decades. The confidential telegrams summarized the eyewitness account of Carlos Gallo, a Chilean diplomat, who was present during the June Fourth incident and told a very different story.

8. GALLO EVENTUALLY ENDED UP AT THE RED CROSS STATION, AGAIN HOPING THAT TROOPS WOULD NOT FIRE ON THE MEDICAL PERSONNEL THERE. HE WATCHED THE MILITARY ENTER THE SQUARE AND DID NOT OBSERVE ANY MASS FIRING OF WEAPONS INTO THE CROWDS, ALTHOUGH SPORADIC GUNFIRE WAS HEARD. HE SAID THAT MOST OF THE TROOPS WHICH ENTERED THE SQUARE WERE ACTUALLY ARMED ONLY WITH ANTI-RIOT GEAR — TRUNCHEONS AND WOODEN CLUBS; THEY WERE BACKED UP BY ARMED SOLDIERS. AS THE MILITARY CONSOLIDATED ITS CONTROL OF THE SQUARE’S PERIMETER, STUDENTS AND CIVILIANS GATHERED AROUND THE MONUMENT TO THE PEOPLE’S HEROES. GALLO SAID WOUNDED, INCLUDING SOME SOLDIERS, CONTINUED TO BE BROUGHT TO THE RED CROSS STATION.

10. ALTHOUGH GUNFIRE COULD BE HEARD, GALLO SAID THAT APART FROM SOME BEATING OF STUDENTS, THERE WAS NO MASS FIRING INTO THE CROWD OF STUDENTS AT THE MONUMENT. WHEN POLOFF MENTIONED SOME REPORTEDLY EYEWITNESS ACCOUNTS OF MASSACRES AT THE MONUMENT WITH AUTOMATIC WEAPONS, GALLO SAID THAT THERE WAS NO SUCH SLAUGHTER. ONCE AGREEMENT WAS REACHED FOR THE STUDENTS TO WITHDRAW, LINKING HANDS TO FORM A COLUMN, THE STUDENTS LEFT THE SQUARE THROUGH THE SOUTHEAST CORNER. ESSENTIALLY EVERYONE, INCLUDING GALLO, LEFT. THE FEW THAT ATTEMPTED TO REMAIN BEHIND WERE BEATEN AND DRIVEN TO JOIN THE END OF THE DEPARTING PROCESSION. ONCE OUTSIDE THE SQUARE, THE STUDENTS HEADED WEST ON QIANMEN DAJIE WHILE GALLO HEADED EAST TO HIS CAR. THEREFORE, HE COULD NOT COMMENT ON REPORTS THAT STUDENTS WERE AMBUSHED AND SLAUGHTERED IN THE ALLEY JUST WEST OF THE SQUARE NEAR THE BEIJING CONCERT HALL.

The communique corroborates the account of the Chinese government that the injured and deceased included many unarmed soldiers and police. While there is no evidence or footage of the “thousands” of alleged corpses of CIA-trained student demonstrators, there is ample documentation of the armed thug participants setting fire to and even lynching PLA troops from buses during the confrontation.

It was only on the final day that some police and soldiers were equipped with weapons as during the weeks prior the government had unsuccessfully attempted to put down the gatherings sending in defenseless PLA troops who were then attacked by the mobs.

Not only were the riots brought under control mostly without lethal force, Gallo’s testimony upheld much of the PRC’s side of the story. The truth seems to be much closer to the Chinese government figures of around a few hundred fatalities, not thousands, during what were violent clashes and not any one-sided massacre.

It’s no wonder the anonymous ‘tank man’ in the internationally circulated iconic footage isn’t surrounded by the “thousands” of presumed corpses in the streets of what was then the largest public space in the world.

Then again, the infamous stand-off between the unidentified protester and the tanks didn’t actually occur until June 5th, the following day after the protests concluded, a significant detail that has been curiously suppressed. That is to say, the image associated by most people around the world with the events — and one of the most universally recognizable of the 20th century — did not even occur during it.

Not to mention that the unknown man was actually preventing the tanks from leaving, not entering, the city square.

Nevertheless, the mysterious incident became the perfect extract for Western propaganda to put its spin on the crisis. If only the tanks had not exercised such restraint and run him over – like the Israeli Defense Forces when they crushed the body of activist Rachel Corrie with a Caterpillar bulldozer in the Gaza Strip – then China would be considered a ‘democracy.’

Recently, former President Jimmy Carter reportedly phoned Trump to discuss China about their mutual concern that it will soon exceed the U.S. as a superpower on the world stage. While Trump nixed the Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) trade deal which excluded China and could have kickstarted WWIII, he has launched a protectionist trade war with tariffs on Chinese imports in an ill-fated attempt at stimulating domestic manufacturing and industry.

Carter noted that while the U.S. is spending hundreds of billions on defense instead of redeveloping its crumbling infrastructure, China is using its productive power to help its people and leading the way in constructing high-speed railroads. He contrasted the wasteful Pentagon budget with the PRC “which has not wasted a penny on war” which he attributed to his own credit in “normalizing diplomatic relations with China in 1979.”

While these days Carter seems to lean towards social democracy, his critique is ironic considering a path can be traced from today’s obscene military budget back to his administration’s decision in 1979 to arm the mujahideen in Afghanistan to undermine the Soviet Union and divide Eurasia at the direction of his National Security Adviser Zbigniew Brzezinski.

So, too, can the Uyghurs falling prey to the spread of Wahhabism during the 1980s when China relaxed its policies and radical Islamist groups from neighboring Central Asia and Pakistan infiltrated the region.

Meanwhile, the breakup of the Soviet Union, resulting in the independence of former Soviet and Muslim-majority Central Asian republics like Kazakhstan bordering Xinjiang, only increased the resurgence of Uyghur separatism.

While the PRC may not be squandering on endless war, an enormous portion of the U.S. defense budget in recent years has been in the Pacific with the deployment of naval and missile systems in close proximity to China which was part of the Obama administration’s ‘Pivot to Asia’ foreign policy shift, a regional strategy akin to Imperial Japan’s encirclement of the mainland in the lead-up to WWII.

The strategy of the empire’s information warfare is to invert reality and depict China as a regional tyrant and surveillance state persecuting its religious minorities while seeking colonial dominance and polluting the environment. It’s hard to imagine a clearer case of imperial projection, where the U.S.’s own signature wrongdoings are being displaced onto its chief rival.

Leaving aside the obvious in regards to American hegemony militarily, within its own borders the U.S. has more people incarcerated despite the fact that China has a population three times as large. Even more startling, China has less people living in poverty despite its exponentially bigger populace.

Then there is the hysteria over Apple’s tech rival Huawei and the completely baseless espionage allegations by the CIA against its 5G technology. The irony that Washington is trying to bully Germany for installing the cellular network when it was the U.S intelligence services that were caught red-handed tapping the personal phone of Chancellor Angela Merkel. It is is clear that the U.S. is in pathological denial of its own sins while attributing them to China.

The demonization of China has been so successful that it has become commonplace on the Western ‘left’ which characterizes Beijing and Washington as an ‘inter-imperial rivalry’ of equal footing. Yet China’s development and aid in the continents like Africa is regarded by their leaders as one of mutual benefit, not plunder like its debt crisis manufactured by Western financial institutions.

Unfortunately, this hasn’t stopped much of the left from agreeing with the likes of John Bolton in characterizing China’s assistance as ‘neocolonial.’ Liberalism is supplanting internationalism and anti-imperialism in many ‘leftist’ circles and it is especially disappointing to observe many who may be innately skeptical of corporate media narratives of a crisis in the Middle East or Latin America suddenly abandon their suspicions to rely on the very same sources as dependable in their coverage of China.

This failure shows the residual effects of post-WWII reinterpretations of Marxism in the West that is institutionalized in the academic canon, such as the Frankfurt School hybrid that prioritizes using Marxism only as a theoretical lens in their corresponding disciplines of examining culture and critiquing the arts.

While there is no denying that ‘socialism’ is ascendant since the 2008 financial crisis – which a recent Gallup poll shows that 40% of Americans support in some form – the version budding leftists are encountering is a variety that strongly demonizes all previous historical attempts at putting Marx’s theories into practice. Whereby, the first requisite is to denounce all existing revolutions and achievements by socialism in the last century as totalitarian failures.

For this reason, China is dismissed as a “state capitalist” or ‘Stalinist’ deformation. Michael Parenti warned of this in Blackshirts & Reds:

[R]eal socialism, it is argued, would be controlled by the workers themselves through direct participation instead of being run by Leninists, Stalinists, Castroites, or other ill-willed, power-hungry, bureaucratic, cabals of evil men who betray revolutions. Unfortunately, this ‘pure socialism’ view is ahistorical and nonfalsifiable; it cannot be tested against the actualities of history. It compares an ideal against an imperfect reality, and the reality comes off a poor second. It imagines what socialism would be like in a world far better than this one, where no strong state structure or security force is required, where none of the value produced by workers needs to be expropriated to rebuild society and defend it from invasion and internal sabotage.

The hesitancy to defend China can also be ascribed to the widespread misconception that because of its market-oriented reforms, the People’s Republic is no longer socialist. The truth is much more complicated. The Tiananmen Square protests occurred at a time when China was undergoing economic liberalization, not unlike and perestroika in the USSR under Mikhail Gorbachev.

The demonstrations themselves even consisted of many Maoists who opposed the reforms under Deng Xiaoping such as the privatization of agribusiness and the social safety net, as the participants were not all united under the same demands or political tendencies. Still, Deng was no Gorbachev as he oversaw the ratification of the most recent constitution which maintained much of the socialist system.

Through all its many significant faults, the People’s Republic has lifted nearly a billion people out of poverty since 1949 and while it is true there are still tens of millions who are poor, the Communist Party continues to organize the economy to eventually raise those remaining to a higher standard of living under the guide of its self-professed ‘socialism with Chinese characteristics.’

Despite its market economy and the adoption of some outward capitalist features, its public and state-owned enterprises are of much greater prevalence. The state sector has a bigger share in everything from transit to energy while virtually all land and property is still owned by collectivities or the state. There is not a single private bank in China which includes the world’s largest that is state-controlled, as are virtually all major media outlets from television to newspapers.

Fundamentally, its advances on the world stage are more attributable to a planned economy than the free market.

That Beijing is increasingly in the crosshairs of imperialism is only a further sign of the inevitable decline of the American empire. As for the fact that China is not only producing more cars than the West but many of the world’s billionaires is indeed an internal contradiction — but only an inherent one to those who have been duped into believing that socialism is about making everyone equally poor.

If you believe that, there is a proverbial bridge in Brooklyn to sell you.

Independent journalist and geopolitical analyst. My work has appeared in CounterPunch, Greanville Post, OffGuardian, Global Research, Dissident Voice, and more. Max may be reached at [email protected]

Filed under: China, featured, latest

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Independent journalist and geopolitical analyst. My work has appeared in CounterPunch, Greanville Post, OffGuardian, Global Research, Dissident Voice, and more. Max may be reached at [email protected]

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A. Scott Buch
Reader

I thought this was an excellent polemic. My sensibilities dissented around the conclusion, though. I am wondering who the target audience for this piece is, because I am hard pressed to think of a leftist who would be of the opinion that socialism is incapable of bringing about economic prosperity. For this reason I couldn’t help but feel a target on more left leaning leftists, such as the anarcho-communist, or just anarchists in general, or those who feel that ends should be conflated with means. A rather outdated argument put forward I guess, by the stereotypical Marxist-Leninist, or Maoist type, would be that such views are “unrealistic” or “utopian.” As such I apologize for reading the subtext of this polemic as being overly reactionary and largely outdated in that respect.

DunGroanin
Reader
DunGroanin

I had an eye opener this weekend as i got to confirm directly how a institute of education is manned and deployed to propogate the Uighar false flagging myth (as they have historical been in all parts of the world)

The prime purpose is to try and derail the 20 year progress of the Shanghai Cooperation Organisation.

The success of the SCO in tying together through international law, two thirds of the Eurasian land mass and half the worlds population, is totally ignored by the media in the ‘west’.

The fact that they are extending their economic and security ties has the yankee and City banker overlords truly worried. They are even trying to get on board – Israel and ukraine have asked to join! Lol.

Of course the thousands of Uighar mercenaries paid and wahhabisised via the Saudis and trained by our boys, battle hardened in the Syrian escapade need to be deployed back to stop the SCO. That is these that aren’t left to be shredded in Idlib.

At some point in the not so distant fiture the SCO and the EU will too formally join up. Informally this is currently happening with international trading partnerships and financial cooperation – such as Nordstream 2, the Belt and Road Iniative, the alternative to the Bank of International Settlement, the decoupling from the petro$ hagemony and unwinding from the Federal$ as the reserve currency within the SCO.

The incorporation of India AND Pakistan and the imminent new membership of Iran, Syria AND Turkey will be the final nails in the several hundred year reign of the racist Anglo Imperialist pillagery of the planet. And puts paid to the accusation of the SCO being anti-islamic. Closely followed by Africa and South America, the rump empire will consist of the 5 eyes + 1 (the foothold).

Heck even most ASEAN countries are down with not missing the emancipation train. As are the owned Japanese.

So what are the Nato bully boys gonna do? Bring on the rapture? Nuke the majority of the planet and themselves back to the stone age and go and live on space stations and Mars? under the guidance of Noah Branson and Moses Elon Musk, to preserve the mythical super race?

Lols in the meantime enjoy the SOAS Silk Road Collective – consisting of not one authentic group but a jumble of outfits and instruments with a message of support for the Uighar fantasy.

Lol.

You are going to need a much bigger boat’ if you want to kill the SCO!

Happy monday and full moon, all.

Mikalina
Reader
Mikalina

The above polemic serves two functions:

Firstly, to begin the process of popping Tienanmen Square down Orwell’s memory hole by testing the waters to see how ready the populous are for this action (as with the Holodomor – something I knew nothing about (even though my children have Ukrainian blood) until Milo mentioned it – see The Soviet Story on youtube for a gut wrenching reminder);

Secondly, as an ‘apology’ for international socialism (go back and read it again and see if you can spot the propaganda), ending with the obligatory bullying comment at the end – if you believe socialism means poverty, you are STUPID and NOT one of us.

International Socialism does actually mean equality in poverty, which was the purpose of the GATT treaty (and the reason why China makes more cars than the US).

Antonym
Reader
Antonym

As if Chinese imperialism doesn’t exist; ask all other nations bordering the South China sea, even 1000 miles south, or Tibet, India or Bhutan. String of Pearls in the India ocean, Belt and Road in central Asia, both development projects only – for the naive.
Chinese “socialism” is getting rich mainly by foul playing global capitalism, and some animals (CCP top) are more important than others.
Go for street protests 30 years ago, not for recent events in Hong Kong to “prove” your point when on shaky ground.
The US has a monopoly on evil and elsewhere its fairy land.
Shoe horn Israel into any topic and Off -Guardian you go!

George
Reader
George

So THEY are evil too? Well in that case there is only one course of action. The US must once again reluctantly assume its role as global policeman and, with much expressed regret, BOMB THE BASTARDS! (And the fact that we have just, once again, gone along with US imperialist interests is, of course, the purest coincidence.)

Tim Jenkins
Reader
Tim Jenkins

Many thanks < Max, that was one damn fine complex historic objective synopsis: whereby I can confirm that everything you've stated is correct and my brother better still (35 years in China and in Beijing on that quiet & subdued day in Tiananmen Sq. post US backed rioting): even I feel you've understated the despicable corruption of minds, especially of the Uyghur population, some of which are really pleased that their kids have been detained and getting schooled to speak Chinese free of charge & kept far away from the evil forces trying to promote Terrorism amongst the Turkic peoples. Parents who remember times long before the CIA backed Jihadists arrived … now see the distinct difference in the opposing values of East & West, with their kids being embroiled in a societal brainwash from Western backed forces promoting divisions.

It should be added that, before the Chinese military determined to remove the CIA Operative, the Dalai Lama, with his annual wages of $180,000 and his brutal monarchist Lama Terrorists, (trained in the Rocky Mountains by the CIA at a cost of $5 million p.a.), the brutal Lamas murdered 500 innocent unarmed Chinese Municipality employees first. The CIA financed the Lama Terrorists directly from WW2 until 1974, when Nixon of all people decided to change the game and engineered the Nobel Peace prize for the murderous actions of the Dalai Lama in 1989. Only 10 years later in 1999 the Dalai Lama stated publicly, that his biggest mistake & regret in life was working for the CIA against China and I think it is fair to say that Richard Gere is a clueless tosser & CIA Hollywood propaganda tool, who should be ashamed of himself & who doesn't even seem to know that, STILL to this day and for over 200 years, the Governor of Tibet is a Tibetan and has always had a Chinese Deputy, out of mutual respect.

The key outrageously sick strategy of the CIA was to control & corrupt the water supply from the Himalayas, for the production of Rice downstream … and anybody who has ever had the responsibility of putting One Billion Three Hundred Million portions of Rice on the table, every darn day, will understand why Tibet will remain governed exactly the way the Chinese have conceived & operated control of this quintessential water supply, for many centuries. No other nation shall be permitted to interfere with such an HUGE logistical responsibility ever again: not the Dalai Lama nor Maroon 5 or any other happy hippy band of propaganda agents for that matter, who clearly wish to starve the Chinese workforce and promote UNCLE $CAM's global imperialist programmes to dominate the world.

Once again, great journalism Max Parry:
you should try and get that published in the Guardian and
suggest that an arrest warrant be issued for Georgi Soros 🙂

Robbobbobin
Reader
Robbobbobin

“30 years after Tiananmen Square, the U.S. is still trying to destabilize China”

What has 30 years got to do with it? But to continue:

“Founded by Ronald Reagan, the NED has poured money into programs related to Xinjiang such as the World Uyghur Congress […] Unfortunately, this hasn’t stopped much of the left from agreeing with the likes of John Bolton in characterizing China’s assistance as ‘neocolonial.’”

What, is that Wikipedia’s ‘John Bolton’, the world’s most consistent long-term neocon-like slimeball?

During the Reagan and George H. W. Bush administrations, [Bolton’s] governmental roles were within the State Department, the Justice Department, and the U.S. Agency for International Development. He was a protégé of conservative North Carolina Senator Jesse Helms.

His Justice Department position as an assistant attorney general required him to advance Reagan administration positions…

Why would that ever-consistent ‘John Bolton’ apply a different mindset to any more recent ‘problems’ on the road to a violence-established and maintained US hegemony than that he applied to similar US hegemonic problems of 30 years ago (including the more personal problem of his being for the Vietnam war while intricately dodging its draft)?

As an aside, the utter filth still known as ‘John Bolton’ after all this time has form on Iran too, equally intricated with the required neocon fellow traveller position of exercising ultimate sleaze in the pursuit of more fungible personal assets than the skin of one’s bloodstained teeth: https://www.theamericanconservative.com/larison/boltons-relationship-with-the-mek-is-a-scandal/

30 years? In the penetration of total, consistent despicability into the highest levels of government in places like the US, Israel and others too numerous to mention outside of a Guardian “Long Read”, 30 years is nothing but a single heartbeat in the willfully destroyed lives of millions upon millions of now forever dead humans, animals and ancient environments.

Berlin Vogue
Reader
Berlin Vogue

I asked for some information re Iran believing that I was requesting it from mature, respectful sources. Instead I get sarcasm, a somewhat personal attack and credibility doubts. Children throwing rocks is what I was reminded of. An exclusive club that mocked any inquiries that didn’t fit the accepted narrative. Not something I want to be a part of. I’ll look for answers elsewhere, thank you all for the time you took to reply.
Re Saudi Arabia and women’s issue
Re sovereignty rights
I am fully aware of what is involved. It did not answer my Iran question though. Why the ‘support’ for Iran from the alternative media continues when it’s internal political situation is repressive and some very questionable foreign policy interets, are pursued.
Thank you, once again.

Robbobbobin
Reader
Robbobbobin

“Why the ‘support’ for Iran from the alternative media continues when it’s internal political situation is repressive and some very questionable foreign policy interets, are pursued.”

None of the answers that fit, Honeybun? It’s a crying shame the way we treat our little ladies round here.

kevin morris
Reader
kevin morris

China is clearly putting a lot of money into persuading the left to believe that Tiananmen was a nasty western plot and sadly, many of the left want to believe it.

Tim Jenkins
Reader
Tim Jenkins

Kevin d’Morris dancing troll or IJUT, my brother was there in Beijing before the CIA backed riots & on that fateful quiet day of Tiananmen Sq. post rioting, as well, he also speaks Chinese fluently: do you KEV’ ? were you there ?

You should hang out with that tosser Richard Gere in some dumbfuck echo chamber back in, Uncle $cam’s Hollywood: imho, either yer’ a brainwashed wanker, like Maroon 5 morons, walking like jagger, or yer’ trolling , see ?

The Dalai Lama’s personal CIA wages were $180,000 per annum from WW2 until 1974.
Why don’t you research US STATE RECORDS available under the FOIA and even you’ll find this much on the wholly corrupted Wikipedia … get some therapy !

kevin morris
Reader
kevin morris

N0- having studied China for many years I have a very different view to you. You are, of course, welcome to your view, as am I mine. Your need to resort to ad hominems suggests you know deep down that you’ve failed to make your case.

Tim Jenkins
Reader
Tim Jenkins

Do you speak Chinese & were you there and did you witness which people from the West were bundled on to trains leaving Beijing,
after all the false reporting going down by CNN & Co. ???

The fact is that the Dalai Lama is & was a fully paid up CIA TOOL PROVEN and i must presume you to be also, because the facts and US State records & solid Research clearly don’t interest you and your wholly affected opinions …

IJUT or Troll, you choose Kev’ !

Max Parry
Reader
Max Parry

A lot of money? Please let me know where I can be paid accordingly.

William HBonney
Reader
William HBonney

Yep, as if the west has any influence at all on China.

You run a country as closed as China, and you have no one else to blame when it all goes tits up.

Tim Jenkins
Reader
Tim Jenkins

WHB another moronic troll, who doesn’t even speak Chinese and most certainly
was not in Beijing when the CIA orchestrated the collision of faecal matter with the rotating oscillator. I should add that your regular as clockwork, wholly Sinophobic Racism is boring, billyboybollocks … and extremely ignorant of any & all Tech. reality.

The Chinese do not need Israel, but Israel needs Chinese Technology, urgently,
to both reach …

1) The Dark side of the Moon

2) & operate the Photon internet of the future, which is already an inspiration for their military, from space sputniks and on land, 1,200 Km antenna to antenna with perfect encryption of quantum random bundles of photons and since 2016, the Chinese are producing their own semi-conductors, also without Israeli Intel inside … i don’t wish to overload your midget brain, so read something of old first …

https://semiengineering.com/fab-spending-hits-new-high/

Yawn, every fuckin’ day, boring as fuck, you fuckw/git-mojo, the best place for you is Guantanomo ;), coz’ next you’ll be pleading for the bleeding extremist CIA backed Uyghur Terrorists, you Talmudic Tart, who knows darn well and is jealous of the Chinese Tech. 2-5 years ahead of your bosses Tech. , with shekels in hand for pimps like you … 😉

去舔你母亲臭臭的阴道

In case you doubt how a wee tiny gnat or mosquito sized midget brain pattern like yours can be detected, lol, you’ve been warned, we can spot you a mile away … chuckle.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/radar-mosquito-chinese-scientists-detect-flight-malaria-a8281821.html

Berlin Vogue
Reader
Berlin Vogue

Please direct me to an article that might explain the following: Iran has at present a repressive policy towards women’s rights. (? ) The hijab or veil controversy as portrayed by Western media and Iranian women, in and out of country. I have knowledge of American intereference in Iran and studied the history after the Shah’s fall. I get the impression that Iran is portrayed by the alternative media as the ‘good, sensible, rational’ guy and the Americans as out of control shrill sirens. Here’s my question, where does the women’s issue come in? Is it real or a propoganda mechanism? What is the harm in exposing a repressive government towards its female population? How rational and sensible is the regime then? I’m no expert. Neither am I trying to be pro or against. Knowledge is what I seek.

Francis Lee
Reader
Francis Lee

Hmmm, interesting to see the ‘women’s issue’ being weaponized, but you seemed to have forgotten Saudi Arabia in your list of feminist grievances. But for grown-ups the fact you apparently disapprove of the internal affairs and practices of a sovereign state is none of your business or, as a matter of fact of mine. Iran is not threatening the US or anyone else in the Anglo-Zionist empire. This is in stark contrast to the murderous Anglo-Zionist crusade which arrogates to itself the right to invade, bomb, destroy, kill, maim, another state of which it disapproves, all against UN rules incidentally. This is called ‘spreading democracy’ (sic)

This sort of moral disapprobation went out with the Treaty of Westphalia 1646 which put an end to the wars of the Reformation. Perhaps a little enlightenment will suffice for you.

Under the Westphalian system states existed within recognised borders. Each states’ sovereignty was recognised by others. Principles of non-interference was agreed. Religious differences between states were tolerated. States might be monarchies or republics. Permanent states interests – raison de etat – was the organizing principle of international relations … the object of a balance of power was to prevent one state becoming too powerful that it could destroy the others and the world order.

Sadly this is not the case anymore. Today, however, seems America does seem to be ‘out of control’ and a latent threat to world peace and world order. And according to the latest polls on the issue, the US is regarded as a number one candidate endangering world peace.

BTW. Your ‘disinterested’ enquiry into the internal situation of women, is of course completely disingenuous. You are simply using an internal issue – women’s rights – to frame a casus belli and attack a sovereign state, which forms the propaganda playbook of the CIA.

Wilmers31
Reader
Wilmers31

Iran is called an Islamic Republic and you might find the answers talking to a Shiite Cleric. The Shiite network was the only one that the Shah and his secret police SAVAK could not penetrate and as a religious group it could not be outlawed. Islam has a different perception towards women than we have but it is not the root problem.

“State capitalism” is what America fights against, in China, Iran, Russia – everywhere. In their ideology everything must be owned by the big private corporations but economic progress can only come from a good mix.

Investors like Soros dabble in politics systematically because everything must be owned by private companies – his and his ilk are NOT result orientated.

See the list where he dabbles:
http://www.maltwood.uvic.ca/tmr/contact.html

Tim Jenkins
Reader
Tim Jenkins

Bang on Wilmers, you nailed it …

mark
Reader
mark

What we need to do is bomb Iran in the interests of women’s rights, just as Human Rights Watch and all the NGOs supported bombing Afghanistan for the same reason. There’s nothing that helps repressed women more than a few Hellfire missiles.

Tim Jenkins
Reader
Tim Jenkins

Have a Cigar 😉
that was classic 🙂

Stephen Morrell
Reader
Stephen Morrell

Sorry, there was indeed a massacre, on the night of June 4. The official estimates (“the PRC’s side of the story”) were: 3,000 civilians wounded and 200 killed, with security forces sustaining 6,000 injured and a few dozen killed. NYT correspondent Nicholas Kristoff estimated 400-800 civilian deaths, with the high end being Amnesty International’s ~1,300 civilian deaths (ignoring the Japanese Kyodo news agency estimate of 2,600, strongly denied by the Chinese Red Cross). [See James Miles’ “The Legacy of Tiananmen”]

It needs to be understood that Tiananmen was an incipient political revolution against the corrupt and widely despised Deng regime, a parasitic and brittle bureaucratic caste administering the Chinese workers state in place of the working class. Tiananmen was not a ‘pro-western’, ‘pro-democracy’ uprising, as portrayed alike by western governments, their kept corporate media and by proto-Stalinists. Many Tiananmen student leaders and participants were the offspring of the bureaucracy, and despite many with pro-western illusions, one of their anthems was the Internationale. It was only the entry of the working class into the uprising that changed the whole complexion of Tiananmen and pushed Deng into unleashing the PLA on the demonstrators, an unprecedented and traumatic event. The real threat of working class power against the bureaucracy had to be put down quickly and early, or Deng and his cohorts likely would have been put to the sword.

What would have happened if the workers had prevailed, if the bureaucracy were shattered and organs of workers power (eg, soviets) had become ascendant? It’s extremely difficult to say, but the result most likely would have been as politically unstable as the bureaucracy itself, since the workers had no leadership with a program to deal with the burning issues of the day: rampant unemployment and dissolution of the ‘Iron Ricebowl’, dispossessed peasants numbering 100,000,000 or more, a rising capitalist class, endemic corruption, and so on. Without a program of workers democracy to harness the whole economy to rational, democratically-decided planning, and without an internationalist outlook to overthrow capitalism in Japan and beyond, then the resulting regime would likely have been a Bonapartist one wide open to imperialist penetration and encirclement. While today’s relatively higher living standards have blunted Tiananmen, the memories and underlying issues remain.

It should also be remembered also that Tiananmen pales into insignificance compared to the bloodshed of the so-called ‘Great Cultural Revolution’, Mao’s campaign to regain power against the Liu Shaoqi wing of the bureaucracy after being ousted following the abject failure of his ‘Great Leap Forward’.

Finally, unlike Hong Kong today, Tiananmen was not a counterrevolutionary movement, nor was it aided and abetted by CIA soft-power agencies like the NED et al. [For an incriminating rap sheet of the US-funded lead actors in Hong Kong today, see this: https://21stcenturywire.com/2019/06/25/problems-arise-with-washingtons-latest-color-revolution-in-hong-kong/%5D

China (along with North Korea, Laos, Viet Nam and Cuba) remains a workers state despite the capitalist inroads, and must be defended unconditionally against imperialist attack and internal counterrevolution. Tiananmen was indeed bloody but it was not a counterrevolutionary uprising.

Ramon Mercader
Reader
Ramon Mercader

So you’re saying the likes of the New York Times and Amnesty Intl. are more reliable than WikiLeaks which published diplomatic cables that had contrary information the U.S. had deliberately concealed? Trots are the worst.

Stephen Morrell
Reader
Stephen Morrell

And the PRC’s own estimates? Slightly more reliable than one witness and US cables.

Coming from someone who names themselves after Stalin’s hitman, I’m proud to be called ‘the worst’.

DunGroanin
Reader
DunGroanin

Beautiful essay.

The fruit certainly didn’t fall far from the tree with Max.

We are grateful. Your dad would be proud.

Max Parry
Reader
Max Parry

Who is this?

DunGroanin
Reader
DunGroanin

Just one random reader, from the UK, who has learnt a lot about the world from both your writings in recent years. Sorry if my comment came across as over familiar – no offence meant.

Max Parry
Reader
Max Parry

None taken – but your comment implies you know my parents?

DunGroanin
Reader
DunGroanin

No i don’t know them I’m sorry for implying it.

I have never been to the US. My only knowledge of your father is via Consortium News online. I am a regular visitor but have never commented there -it is one of the best sites in the world.

My only mitigation for the hopefully heartfelt comment on reading the extensive and detailed article is that it was late at night after a social evening which ended with me in a ‘tired and emotional’ state and i was overwhelmed by the tone and comprehensiveness of the essay. i will certainly be re-reading it and sharing it whenever the subject is raised.Especially the Uighar fantasy being peddaled to ferment a ‘new caliphate’ in these parts. I have talked with a english teacher who had many years in China, who had told me that the ‘weegers’ were settled peoples even while maintaining their ethnicity. I have since then been hoping that a authoratative independent journalist would back that up. My joy was instant and heartfelt.

My inadvertent offence was based on being being grateful for people like you and your esteemed Father, who hold a light to guide us with knowledge and perseverance in the mainstream darkness.

I’m sorry once again for the implication in my opening post and will hopefully learn from it.

I will not object if you wish to get Off-G to take this further or remove my comment or make direct contact via my email they have.

I wish you and Consortium News all the best.

Max Parry
Reader
Max Parry

For the record I am NOT related to Robert Parry nor have I ever written for Consortium news though I am a fan of both.

DunGroanin
Reader
DunGroanin

Lol. As i said it was late night.

Surely can’t be the first time you’ve been confused!

It is an article that would be good on CN.

Max Parry
Reader
Max Parry

Believe me i wish i were related to him and no, you ain’t the first!

mark
Reader
mark

In 1980, the income per head in China was $312. Last year, it was $9,769.
The US still maintains its global gulag of concentration camps, torture chambers and secret prisons in dozens of countries (including UK territory), where people are tortured and murdered on an industrial scale, with the full collusion of past and present UK regimes.
Guantanamo and waterboarding are not even the tip of the iceberg.
In just one case, a prisoner was stripped naked in a freezing cell and chained to the wall in a standing position, and just left. It was only noticed that he had died of starvation/ thirst/ exposure 17 days later.
Not that such issues inhibit Washington and the UK from climbing up on their high horses and giving lofty sermons and pious lectures to the benighted lesser breeds about their human rights failings and need to pull their socks up to match the exalted standards of our “rules based order.”

However many people died in Tiananmen 30 years ago, it was a VERY small price to pay if it prevented another CIA/ Soros orchestrated Regime Change of the type seen in Maidan, Syria, Venezuela, and half a hundred other countries. China, Russia and other nations should crack down on Washington’s terrorists, subversives and stooges as quickly and as ruthlessly as possible with however much force is required. Failure to do so will involve a much higher US instigated butcher’s bill at a later date.

kevin morris
Reader
kevin morris

All prisoners in China are tissue typed and prisoners of conscience are murdered to order to supply the demand for organ transplants. Estimates of a million killed in this foul trade, many of them members of Falun Gong. Before you start thinking Tiananmen was a price worth paying, consider that many of the readers of OffGrauniad would be classified in China as enemies of the state and likely to end up donating organs to those with enough money to pay- and all of this in a socialist country?

mark
Reader
mark

Are the bodies turned into soap and lamp shades as well?

mark
Reader
mark

Are you sure it wasn’t “six million”?
Or “a hundred and six million”?
Like the “half a million” executed in Syria?

kevin morris
Reader
kevin morris

Research the case yourself. The first incidence I’ve seen reported was the early nineties, described by a freed dissident. When Jiang zemin began the persecution and imprisonment of Falun Gong practitioners, suddenly organ transplantation went from organs being difficult to obtain to waiting lists of less that a week in many cases. Chinese people do not generally donate organs but unlike the west where waits for transplantation can be long, there is almost no wait in China.

If you’re so sceptical look into the story yourself. These are the people you hope will take over the world.

Jen
Reader
Jen

Very interesting … you are saying that for nearly 30 years at least the Chinese government has harvesting organs from prisoners, of whom many are political prisoners and a considerable proportion of those being followers of a religious group whose founder and leader lives in an apartment in Manhattan in New York City, and whose beliefs include a considerable dose of homophobia.

I would assume in all that time there would be a few independent sources of information on the Chinese government organ-harvesting program, completely separate from Falun Gong / The Epoch Times sources, which would help to verify the Falun Gong sources, and which would include videos and mobile phone films and photographs. Are there any such sources or do they all lead back to Falun Gong in one way or another?

kevin morris
Reader
kevin morris

Well if you want to believe that the sudden mass appearance of organs in China following the persecution of Falun Gong members is untrue, fine, but if you have a modicum of intellectual curiosity, feel free to research the matter yourself. If you do, you will find that the movement to uncover the trade includes several Chinese doctors who have been appalled at what they found. After all people usually take to medicine in order to save life; they find killing in order to harvest organs against their principles.

If you are interested, you might begin with the proceedings of the China Tribunal, chaired by Sir Geoffrey Nice QC.

William HBonney
Reader
William HBonney

However many people died in Tiananmen 30 years ago, it was a VERY small price to pay

Written with absolutely no experience of China. Those who have don’t romanticise it as you do.

Tim Jenkins
Reader
Tim Jenkins

“Written with absolutely no experience of China.”
finally you admit, obviously you rely on pure hearsay.

Having lost track & count of my visits and number of Chinese family members from romantic interludes of over 4 decades, I’m thinking of moving back, just to getaway from the untrustworthy & corrupted mindsets of people like you with zero integrity, a lazy imperialist arrogance, & dumb to boot, you know, Talmudic Tarts of a Totalitarian Fascist Apartheid state like Israel, who now wish to make the goy boys of the whole of NATO subservient, including you … Fortunately, the Chinese see exactly how you WHB KOWTOW to racism and then project & transfer your inadequacies & sexual frustration, on to others.

Thank fuck for the Chinese; i & my brothers have zero romantic delusions, nor a teacher friend from Vancouver, who has been teaching there for many decades: we love it in China and the people ! You should have been there for the Handover of Hong Kong, you bullyboy racist, it was a gas and you might have learnt something by now …

William HBonney
Reader
William HBonney

you bullyboy racist

hilarious, accusations of racism from someone so antisemitic, that you cannot resist having a pop at Israel even on a wholely unrelated topic.

Whatever their faults, the Chinese aren’t stupid, and are liable to regard foreign advocates of the PRC as utter failures in their own country–something your posting history does nothing to dispel.

kevin morris
Reader
kevin morris

China has given a great deal to the world and speaking personally I owe Traditional Chinese Medicine a lot. When the dictatorship over the people by the Communist Party ends, China will truly have a great future. I know that apart from the party members and cadres most Chinese will be happy when it happens. A view which I support is that as long as the economy grows most Chinese will reluctantly support the CCP, but
China’s economic position is quite precarious. I pray that the end will come soon.

Mikalina
Reader
Mikalina

Laws for Xinjiang Uyghur Autonomous Region Regulation on De-extremification

(5) Interfering with cultural and recreational activities, rejecting or refusing public goods and services such as radio and television.
(6) Generalizing the concept of Halal, to make Halal expand into areas other beyond Halal foods, and using the idea of something being not-halal to reject or interfere with others secular lives;
(7) Wearing, or compelling others to wear, burqas with face coverings, or to bear symbols of extremification;
(8) Spreading religious fanaticism through irregular beards or name selection;
(9) Failing to perform the legal formalities in marrying or divorcing by religious methods;
(10) Not allowing children to receive public education, obstructing the implementation of the national education system;
(11) Intimidating or inducing others to boycott national policies; to intentionally destroy state documents prescribed for by law, such as resident identity cards, household registration books; or to deface currency;
(12) Intentionally damaging or destroying public or private property;
(13) Publishing, printing, distributing, selling, producing, downloading, storing, reproducing, accessing, copying, or possessing articles, publications, audio or video with extremification content;
(14) Deliberately interfering with or undermining the implementation of family planning policies;

So, if Dad is Mohammed with a long beard, and Mom chooses to cover her face, and you both prefer to educate your children yourself; don’t want a television (don’t say it’s halal); do wish to control your own family planning; wish to marry according to your own customs; wish to protest against something like the poll tax and object to carrying a biometric identity card – you are well and truly stuffed.

Presumably 13 will be the Koran and the Bible?

Tim Jenkins
Reader
Tim Jenkins

That all sounds pretty damn fine to me, Mikalina: how about you ?

Mikalina
Reader
Mikalina

Sorry, TJ. Don’t have the jackboots. You’re on your own for this one….

Tim Jenkins
Reader
Tim Jenkins

Lol, let’s meet in China, then: i’ll sort you some boots and they’ll sure as hell be made for walking the path of accountability in ‘Nancy & Frankly’ Style, “my way,” if you like: but with serious responsibilities & guarantees, I assure you, and I’m sure you’ll look just grand in them, all things considered … 😉 ,

otherwise you can wear sandals, to climb every mountain 🙂
and just cover your face @Altitude …

Mikalina
Reader
Mikalina

Always walk in your own boots, Tim. Then there’s no surprises.

I used to go to Kunming for a break when it all got too much – Scandinavian style hotel, a small cafe serving a passable breakfast – once you’d scared off the beggar kids, that is, and a hotel swimming pool (transparent roof) . Catch the no 5 as far as it goes, then the no 6 and climb those hills. Listen to some music created by a Chinese professor of music who would scour the contours of China looking for old, forgotten wooden instruments and compose for them.

And feel the sadness.

My song – cue the violins – I’ll do my cryin’ in the rain.

mark
Reader
mark

Sounds very much like “Prevent.”
Do teachers report 5 year olds for “extremism” there as well?

Tim Jenkins
Reader
Tim Jenkins

Prevention always the best form of cure and under the circumstances of what I know to be true, it all sounds totally reasonable to me mark: even some ethnic Turkic parents have been expressing pleasure that their kids are being steered away from the CIA backed Terrorist Talmudic doctrines, which they see clearly as orchestrated imported divisions: a few have actually openly said they are really pleased their kids are now taking learning Chinese seriously … because it will improve their employment possibilities, bearing in mind that Turkey today imports more from China than any other nation > fact.

William HBonney
Reader
William HBonney

Sounds very much like “Prevent.”

Only if your a China apologist. If not, it bears an uncanny similarity to Belsen, Auschwitz….

I’m not unfamiliar with China, the motto ‘work sets you free’ is totally in accord with the Chinese ethos.

Tim Jenkins
Reader
Tim Jenkins

Arbeit macht Frei and that is exactly what scares you, you lazy imperialist decadent wimp …

Give me Jack Ma 996 every time , above unproductive simple minded goyboy talmudic trolls, like you, so technologically ignorant, with low IQs who Kowtow to Corporate Computerised Fascist Collusion for Apartheid & Dictatorship …

You clearly have zero knowledge or experience of the Chinese Culture & certainly don’t speak the language, so stop pretending and kidding yourself, to enhance your diminutive ego & stature, as goy serf

William HBonney
Reader
William HBonney

Even the Chinese are rebelling against 996 (which is the only reason you’re aware of it, you cretin)

mark
Reader
mark

Maybe you could put out a few good stories about the Chinks turning bodies into soap and lamp shades. The old favourites are always the best.

Carnyx
Reader
Carnyx

Uyghur Islam has not traditionally involved facial covering or burkas, the adoption of these foreign customs is indeed a sign of spreading Wahabi and Salafi practises, which was being promoted by Saudi and Turkey (which often fancies itself as the leader of a new Turkic empire, Turanism). China seems to be adopting somewhat hamfisted and authoritarian methods of countering the spread of radical Islam, which may well be counter productive, but this list of traits supposed to identify radicals here isn’t irrational or all that different from ones used in the west.

Uyghurs are increasing in China due to positive discrimination, both in numbers and as a proportion of the overall population, only ethnic Hans are subject to the one child policy, and state enterprises follow a policy of employing minorities at larger proportion than their numbers in general.

Also were exactly did you get this list, obviously intended to identify Jihadis, that you call “laws”?

Jen
Reader
Jen

Dear Carnyx,

I found the source of the list that Mikalina quotes at this link.

The International Uyghur Human Rights and Democracy Foundation helpfully provides its Washington DC address and contact details at the bottom of the page if you’d like more information.

Mikalina
Reader
Mikalina

You found ‘a’ source, Jen, not ‘the’ source.

Tim Jenkins
Reader
Tim Jenkins

Sound research Jen 😉

Carnyx
Reader
Carnyx

Thanks Jen, as I suspected, a US govt funded and based group, the very same group branding the figures of huge numbers for Uyghur’s interned in the re-education camps.

kevin morris
Reader
kevin morris

‘only ethnic Hans are subject to the one child policy, and state enterprises follow a policy of employing minorities at larger proportion than their numbers in general’

Certainly not in the case of Tibet where many women have been subjected to forced sterilisations. I have been aware for getting on for fifty years how the Han really treat their minorities and for a similar length of time I have been saddened at how the left wishes to be taken in by the blandishments of the so called People’s Republic of China. Three times the International Commission of Jurists has accused China of genocide in Tibet, and with the head of the so called Tibet Autonomous Region now calling the shots in erstwhile Eastern Turkestan, it is clear that the Uighurs are now suffering as the Tibetans have since 1951.

Tim Jenkins
Reader
Tim Jenkins

What did you expect the Chinese to do with a Lama load of CIA Trained & Paid Terrorists and the Dalai Lama paid $180,000 bucks per year to kill innocent Chinese municipality workers … from WW2 until 1974 !!

Fuck off and study Tibetan History (tosser) it’s even in Wikipedia !

kevin morris
Reader
kevin morris

Well if its in wikipedia it must be true!

Carnyx
Reader
Carnyx

The one child policy did not apply to Tibetans, they were allowed to have second children, maybe 3 depending on other factors like how well they get on with authorities but that doesn’t stop the state interfering with some. Tibet is after all a territory annexed by China, whereas Xinjiang was already part of Qing China.

The demographics of Tibetans are disputed due to poor historical records and disputes over the geographical extent of Tibet, nevertheless the Chinese govt claim the population of Tibetans has grown under their rule, from 2.7 million (disputed) in 1953 to 4.5 in the 1990 census to 6.2 in 2010. They have not grown as a proportion of the whole population though, whereas Uyghurs have grown from 0.62% to 0.76%.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_China#Ethnic_groups

mark
Reader
mark

Tibet has been part of China for most of its history. It was independent when China collapsed into warlordism after the country was carved up by western imperialism. Life for most Tibetans was crushing feudal near slavery.

kevin morris
Reader
kevin morris

You clearly have little understanding of Tibetan history. Around a thousand years ago Tibet was the dominant nation and it controlled much of China. The pillars that recorded its treaty with China disappeared following the Chinese invasion of 1951, since the inscriptions call into question China’s claims.

Tibet has a different language more closely related to Burmese, and Tibetan, not Chinese was the lingua franca of Central Asia. Although at certain points, especially during the rule of the Dalai Lamas, China installed ambassadors known as Ambans and these did interfere to a certain extent in Tibetan politics. Tibet fought a number of battles with neighbouring countries and signed a number of treaties. In 1904, when Younghusband invaded Tibet, Britain signed a treaty with the country which had very amicable relations with Britain until Indian Independence. Following China’s invasion, Tibetan diplomats presented their case at the United Nations and travelled on Tibetan passports which were fully recognised.

A fact I can expect very few materialists to understand is the pre-eminence of Tibetan Buddhism throughout Asia. Long before the Dalai Lama, the Karmapas and later Sakya Trizin were spiritual advisers to Mongol rulers and later to Chinese Emperors. In fact, although the Communists have little desire for it to be known the relationship between Tibet and China was said for centuries to be one between spiritual adviser and patron.

It is true that during the Long March, Mao entered Tibet and it is true too that he saw the huge potential of the country known to China as the ‘western treasure house’. The truth is though that the history of Tibet is a good deal more complicated that the CCP would have you believe.

Tim Jenkins
Reader
Tim Jenkins

Nat Geo Archives now belonging to the Carlyle Group, means likely it has been removed from you tube: but some old film I saw of the brutal monarchist fascist Nazi loving Lamas, pre-WW2 , was sickeningly shocking and they were NEVER loved by the true Tibetans, who were wholly abused in that extremely feudal Lama system for serfs.

The Lamas truly entertained the Nazis in Tibet and were fascinated by Goebbels and his propaganda methods, also a matter of public record: like the post war transference of loyalties to the CIA Talmudic Fascist Nazi methods of Apartheid and $180,000 bucks a year personal wages for the Dalai Lama back then in 1945, was a serious amount of shekels by anybody’s godforsaken standards of living …

compared to Dr.Alan Turing’s rewards for his 1938 software designs & patents in Boston MIT, no copies permitted still today ?! and subsequent enigma-tic computerised machine thought processes for the M.o.D. , alles nur geklaut and then they injected him with hormones … clearly their darling Dalai was more valuable as a propaganda tool, than Turing …

kevin morris
Reader
kevin morris

Judging by the spurious and wide rangingly disturbed claims you make, I suspect you are unwell. I have no desire to engage you in most of your claims but feel I must comment on your claims about Lamas and Nazis. It is true that the Heinrich Himmler’s Ahnenerbe did visit Tibet and conduct research connected with their aims of finding the origins of the so called Aryan Race. Film still exists of the experiments conducted and the good humour with which they were met by ordinary Tibetans who had no idea of the Racial theories that underlay the Ahnenerbe’s work.

I think more important is the effect that being in Tibet had on a number of Foreigners. Francis Younghusband who invaded Tibet and beseiged Lhasa became a changed man and devoted his life to world peace. Heinrich Harrer, who with Peter Aufsheitter escaped captivity in a British POW camp in India had been convinced Nazis. After some years spent tutoring the Dalai Lama and installing a drainage system in Lhasa, Heinrich Harrer returned to Austria but devoted his very full life to keeping the struggle of Tibet independence alive.

During the late forties Robert W Ford (1923-2013), radio operator for the Tibetan government, spent several years imprisoned by the Communist Chinese. On release, he too devoted much of his long life to publicising Tibet’s struggle for independence.

Britain’s two ambassadors to Tibet both travelled widely and wrote widely on Tibetan culture. Although both made reference to the relative poverty of most Tibetans both clearly respected the Tibetan way of life and their accounts are very much at odds with the spurious claims of the communist Chinese.

Interestingly, two countries still have largely Tibetan cultures- Ladakh and Bhutan. Travellers report on the happy demeanour of Ladakhis and Bhutan is claimed to be the happiest country on earth. Clearly, they are much happier than evidenced by those mealy mouthed critics who extol the virtues of a communist Chinese way of life.

Tim Jenkins
Reader
Tim Jenkins

Spoken like a true monarchist’s serf: with an oy vey selective art of messaging the bits n’ bobs of a poor ignorant imperial education, with zero reference to the existential dynastic philosophies in play today.

Shallow, kev’, very shallow, where waters & rivers run deep & long, and rice production is more important than any Dalai Lama: search the birth place of Buddha and you’ll see why the Dalai Lama and his CIA Terrorist Operative Lamas of old, belong in ‘their’ sovereign origins on the South Face of the Himalayas.

Your arrogantly patronising tones & drones of condescension, are of zero interest or use to the Chinese Or Tibetans, who’ve thrived peacefully for 100’s of years, with a Tibetan Governor & Chinese Deputy: a peaceful coexistence, which you pretend to wish to disturb & stand in judgement of, from your position of systemic failure, where even Christine Lagarde has said publicly to the Square Mile Elitist Jurisdiction,

“Capitalism has failed”
Mansion House 26/5/2014

Lynn d’Rothschild invited her friend Christine to speak to Prince Charles & all, to bring you up to speed and see why the Rothschilds moved their business interests out of the World Trade Centre 2 weeks before the 11th September 2001 . Next you’ll be spouting miracles, like how the sidekick Psychic BBC knew in advance of the incredible fire and collapse of WTC7 …

Riddle me WTC 7 , go on Kev 🙂

eddie
Reader
eddie

More than 50% of all Chinese are atheist, 23% practice a folk religion, 18% are Buddhist, and less than 5% are Muslim or Christian.
The Quarter where I live in Yunnan contains 23 ethnic minorities, who operate shops and restaurants, and live happy peaceful lives with the rest.
There hasn’t been a one-child policy in China for years, people are often having more than 2, and they can pay a 1000 c.n.y. fee to have more.
China never stops marching into the future, and all citizens are expected to put the country first. If some radicals in Xinjiang don’t like this policy, they are due for education or deportation.

kevin morris
Reader
kevin morris

You surely know the one about lies damned lies and statistics? If religion plays such a small part in Chinese life, then why is the CCP so fearful of religion. Why does it warn people of the dangers. Why does it still murder practitioners of exercises praised by Chairman Mao and the Party as benefitting the health and well being of Chinese society.

In the early naughties I had contact with two figures, one a Chinese doctor, former Red Guard and member of the Party. The other was a biophysicist who was seeking somebody English to co-author is book on dissipattive wave structures. A small sample admittedly but the doctor described herself as a Daoist and the biophysicist a Christian. Certainly, at that time, The CCP was exercising itself about the number of Chinese who had become Christians.

Of course, persecution might have deterred some, but I suspect the figures on atheists and religious adherents sound faked to me.

mark
Reader
mark

Why is the CCP so fearful of religion?
The Chinese in general are fearful of religion.
Because of the mayhem it has caused in China historically.
The Chinese were very tolerant of western missionaries in the 19th century.
Many Chinese converted.
The result was the Taiping Rebellion of the 1860s, when perhaps as many as 20 million Chinese died. Nobody really knows – it could have been more. A Chinese convert, who was a nutjob, claimed to be the brother of Jesus Christ and led an uprising that resulted in a disastrous civil war.
CIA front organisations like USAID and the NED have a history of infiltrating and manipulating Islamic extremists and weird Moonie like cults such as the Falun Gong as useful idiots to cause unrest inside China.
The same pattern occurred in Japan. They were originally very tolerant of western missionaries in the 16th century, but later suppressed them on public order grounds. Catholic Portuguese missionaries and Dutch Protestant missionaries recruited Japanese into their particular dogmas and superstitions and the result was pitched battles between the two factions. The Japanese authorities had had enough and simply banned them as the sensible thing to do.

kevin morris
Reader
kevin morris

Sounds plausible- until you examine the history of China. Both Buddhism and Daoism have been central to Chinese way of life for millennia. Christianity is growing rapidly in China The thing that most apologists for the current regime in China fail to understand is that the CCP is terrified of any organisation other than itself, for it fears that one day, one or more of them will supplant it.

The Chinese have suffered greatly under Communism. Many were persuaded that the reforms of Deng (who himself was imprisoned and ill treated during the Cultural Revolution) would offer a better way for China, but the technocratic approach the CCP has taken in recent years is disliked by many if not most Chinese. Add to that the rapid change that has seen many displaced from their homes and without any form of redress and straight away the solace and sense of community that religious practice offers meets a clear and growing need.

Jiang Zemin’s appalling treatment of practitioners of Falun Gong, which earlier had been described by the party as building a healthy socialist society appalled and terrified many millions. It is easy to see why Jiang felt the need since many of the millions of those practitioners were middle level Communist Party officials. The persecution of Falun Gong which coincided with the free availability of transplant organs is a terrible scandal which the left by and large refuses to acknowledge. I can only suggest that people of open mind examine the proceedings of the China Tribunal chaired by SIr Geoffrey Nice QC.

As for the CIA exploiting unrest, the obvious question is, which came first, the unrest or the brutal treatment of the minorities? Tibet was invaded in 1951 and the Tibetan Kashag tried to reach a peaceful settlement despite the great provocation, with the Communists. Fearing for his own life and taking the advice of the State Oracle, the Dalia Lama fled in March 1959. It is worth adding that every year many thousands of Tibetans risk amputation from frostbite and murder by Chinese border guards in order to flee to India where they might practice their religion freely.

The uprising that followed was brutally suppressed and many thousands served long prison sentences whilst many Tibetans died in the famine after the Chinese insisted that wheat, rather than the native barley was grown. The CIA most certainly did recruit and train a largely Kampa guerilla force, although the Dalai Lama tried to get the force to stand down. The US abandoned them following Nixon’s rapprochement with China in the seventies and many of the fighters, based in Mustang in northern Nepal, committed suicide.

As for the Uighurs, they were seen as exemplars of China’s minority policy and that only began to change following the murder of several Uighurs by Han Chinese in July 1995 in the event known in China as 7/5. Certainly, a number of Uighurs have fought in Syria, but the real question should be, ‘How have the erstwhile peaceful Uighurs become radicalised? The fact that at present over a million are in prison camps and the fact of colonial mistreatment of minorities by the Han, amply assisted by the CCP surely cannot have anything to do with it- or so the left would have us believe!

William HBonney
Reader
William HBonney

and all citizens are expected to put the country first

My country, right or wrong? Is that about the size of it?

The point being that apply that standard to most commentators here, and they wouldn’t see the light of day.

Admiration for China/Iran/Russia etc is something mostly practiced from afar.

Carnyx
Reader
Carnyx

My country, right or wrong? Is that about the size of it?

And like where exactly do you challenge your own state? The US has killed 20 million people since the end of WW II. It’s the most geographically secure power ever behind it oceans it barely needs defending and yet it has the largest military budget on Earth, has military bases everywhere and is continually bombing the developing world, while Americans themselves have no national health care, failing infrastructure and crap education so they can’t tell they are being mislead, just tell them everyone else is Hitler and they’ll follow orders like sheep. And you can’t even acknowledge that your govt has overthrown foreign democratic govts for it’s own profit, even though your govt has basically admitted it.

You sneer at other people’s trust in their govts, while saluting the flag and believing everything your own govt tells you, but you think it’s only “them” who are brainwashed, blissfully unaware of your utter hypocrisy.

Mikalina
Reader
Mikalina

Excellent piece of disinformation there. Well done. Couldn’t have crafted that better myself.

There is NO positive discrimination and there is NO policy for employing minorities at larger proportions. The only opening for all minority ethnicity Chinese is in tourism enclaves – such cute dances, unusual music, colourful crafts and, well, the food is to die for…….

Xinjiang Uyghur Autonomous Region Regulation on De-extremification
(Adopted at the 28th meeting of the Standing Committee of the Twelfth People’s Congress for the Xinjiang Uygur Autonomous Region on March 29 2017)
This Regulation enters into force on April 1, 2017.

Tim Jenkins
Reader
Tim Jenkins

You seem to be trying to craft something: I’m just not sure what & for whom ?

Do you speak Chinese, as well? It would help you to understand the Culture and the present cultural conflicts being flamed by external forces, much better, not just the food …

Mikalina
Reader
Mikalina

Crafting nothing, TJ. You will need to put the James Bond outfit back in the dressing up box for this one:

Purpose – Sincere compassion for the Uighur families I have met.

Carnyx
Reader
Carnyx
Reader
Mikalina
Reader
Mikalina

Wow, deep dive search! Articles 20 to 30 years old. NYT? Wikipedia!! An oldie from Quackademia. I like the Seattle one though:

Instead, the Chinese people, for the most part, remain completely at ease with racial stereotypes. Affirmative action here does not mean re-evaluating the Han belief that all minorities are “backward, primitive barbarians” who need the help of their “Han older brothers” – to quote some cliches.

China’s policy is purely pragmatic. The idea is to give the minorities just enough power, education or economic success to keep them quiet. As opposed to empowering minorities, it is meant to encourage assimilation and the creation of a peaceful, unified and essentially Han country.

Indeed, treatment of minorities in the popular press, and for example, the creation of a “minority theme park” – a sideshow-like museum in Beijing, where curious Han can have their pictures taken with minorities like Ya – make continued Han chauvinism painfully apparent.

I say it with “convincing certainty” because I lived there.

Tim Jenkins
Reader
Tim Jenkins

“I lived there.”

How long and did you learn Mandarin or Cantonese and then study history of the various dynastic philosophical conflicts of old … ?
3 simple questions.

Carnyx
Reader
Carnyx

China’s policy is purely pragmatic.

A policy you said didn’t exist at all in your last post, but now one you criticise for not having the proper moral reasons motivating it and not reflecting the latest American intersectional theory properly, everything needs to be standardised to whatever the settler societies deem appropriate for their own history.

lysias
Reader
lysias

China has no private banks. That’s why it is winning and will continue to win: its economy is not sabotaged by the short-term rent-seeking of a financial industry.

kevin morris
Reader
kevin morris

China has very little by way of a welfare state too and ordinary Chinese traditionally saved far more than do westerners because families have to provide for their children’s education, for medical assistance and for old age.

Whilst this has worked relatively well, the party having built vast new housing developments using borrowed money is encouraging people to buy properties at prices they cannot afford with money reserved for other things. Sound vaguely familiar? It should do. Many ordinary people have been badly burned and although the party has not been forthcoming with statistics, many have now left cities to return to the land on the basis that although they have no money, at least in the countryside they can grow their own food.

Clearly the Chinese have grounds to thank the CCP that their economy isn’t sabotaged by western short termism.

William HBonney
Reader
William HBonney

While Washington was successful in unseating communism in the Eastern Bloc it was unable to do in Beijing

This is actually insulting to anyone not American. It turns out that, according to the author, no other nationality has any agency whatsoever in its own fate, it is all controlled by malevolent beings in Washington.

The idea that two million Hong Kongers took to the streets at the behest of the CIA is ludicrous. The Hong Kong leadership fucked up all by itself, in an attempt to impress Beijing.

mark
Reader
mark

The idea that “2 million Hong Kongers took to the streets” at all is ludicrous.
There are 7 million people in Hong Kong, including new born babies and geriatrics.
This is like the claim that “30/33/34 million” Egyptians (choose whatever figure suits you) “took to the streets” to get rid of an elected president and replace him with Washington’s Zionist puppet Morsi.
The true figure is probably around 200-240,000.

mark
Reader
mark

Replace Morsi with the puppet Sisi.

mark
Reader
mark

Just another cautionary note on swallowing inflated figures whole.

In 1989, there was a violent insurrection in Rumania against Ceaucescu, who was subsequently deposed and murdered.
Violent street fighting went on for some time, with snipers on rooftops and tanks rumbling through the streets firing their main armament at buildings.
During the uprising, the rebel leadership announced that 60,000 people had been killed in the fighting, and this was generally accepted.
When the fighting was over, enquiries were made at hospital mortuaries and police stations, and it transpired that the number of dead was actually about 800.

On this basis, “2 million” would translate into about 30,000.
A certain “6 million” figure into about 80,000.

mark
Reader
mark

In the case of Egypt it was 500,000.

Carnyx
Reader
Carnyx

The idea that two million Hong Kongers took to the streets at the behest of the CIA is ludicrous.

Why? The west managed it in Iran to set up the coup against Mossadegh, they managed it in Ukraine. Of course not every member of the crowd is taking orders from the CIA/NED or MI6 or the BND or whoever, but they are often involved with organisers.

mark
Reader
mark

In the case of Ukraine, $5 billion, including $25 a day from the US embassy for demonstrators, plus free booze, drugs and prostitutes.

William HBonney
Reader
William HBonney

but they are often involved with organisers.

Now why would you believe that?

Tribalism makes you stupid.

Carnyx
Reader
Carnyx

Uhm what tribe do you think I belong to then Mr Smart?

During Operation Ajax MI6 and the CIA were involved in both paying rioters and infiltrating and influencing the Tudeh Party to riot they also paid “anti-Communists” to fight back against them, creating a large scale civil disturbance which gave the military the excuse to take over the streets. In Ukraine many of the Maidan supporting organisations were funded by western govts. This is all a matter of record.

William HBonney
Reader
William HBonney

This is all a matter of record

The fevered imaginings of conspiracy theorists, and fruitcake do not equate to a ‘matter of record’.

Uhm what tribe do you think I belong to then

I think I got your number, sunshine.

Carnyx
Reader
Carnyx

Here’s a reference you ignoramus

“64 Years Later, CIA Finally Releases Details of Iranian Coup”

https://foreignpolicy.com/2017/06/20/64-years-later-cia-finally-releases-details-of-iranian-coup-iran-tehran-oil/

I think I got your number, sunshine.

Oh blow it out your arse you patronising old fart, either provide a supporting argument or get off the pot.

William HBonney
Reader
William HBonney

a) it was 64 years ago

b) you only know this because of American freedom of information.

Where is your extensive research of the other side of the story, Iranian records of the time? Yours is a curious method of historical research, conclusion first, then look for supporting evidence.

I don’t regard you and your ilk as idiots for no reason.

Carnyx
Reader
Carnyx

b) you only know this because of American freedom of information.

Oh Jesus … why are you even doing here, don’t you have a flag to go stand and salute or something?

Oh and Euromaidan was 4 years ago

Where is your extensive research of the other side of the story, Iranian records of the time? Yours is a curious method of historical research, conclusion first, then look for supporting evidence.

What on earth are you talking about, what exactly was this “conclusion” of mine you are talking about? What “research” did I conduct? I merely pointed out that it’s not “ludicrous” to suspect a protest in any state regarded as a rival to the ‘Rules Based International Empire’ and promoted in western media has western intelligence backing, because we have past examples (which apparently you were completely ignorant about). That is not a “conclusion” it’s an argument.

I don’t regard you and your ilk as idiots for no reason.

I don’t have any reason to care what you think, it’s not like you are exactly dazzling me with your wit, is it! I take it you have the misfortune of being American and that explains your lack of education and inability to process new information.

Tim Jenkins
Reader
Tim Jenkins

Actually , WHB is a Talmudic Troll goyboy of diminutive stature & ego, used to KOWTOWING to Corporate Computerised Fascist Collusion and Dictatorship of Apartheid Doctrines, coz’ he needs the shekels and must pimp himself daily and any principle he may have once held dearly, has been flushed as he kneels to drink water from the toilet (AOC border style) 😉

William HBonney
Reader
William HBonney

Your one sided view of something America did a lifetime ago has no relevance to present day HK. People are disappearing in HK only to reappear in prison, on the mainland..It’s not something that used to happen under British rule, and one can understand the nostalgia for happier times.

A well run territory doesn’t have the populace in a state of apoplexy, and then seek to blame foreign powers. There is absolutely no evidence to suggest this is anything but a loathsome mixture of oppression and incompetence.

Mikalina
Reader
Mikalina

You’ll have to stop with the nuances and subtleties – this is paint by numbers history and our poor brain damaged thought processes only have black, white, red, yellow and green.

wardropper
Reader
wardropper

You might as well call it “insulting” to anyone not American that the Earth is not flat.
Washington’s malevolence (unprecedented lust for power and money) is real enough, and it has far more money and power to crush the country I live in than the country I live in has money or power to resist it.
I am not insulted by facts, because the Earth is either flat, or it isn’t.
Similarly, Washington is either controlling the fate of my country, or it isn’t
But the attitude shown by Washington to the rest of the world is the ultimate insult to everybody.
As for Hong Kong, it is as vulnerable to infiltration as anybody else, and there are undoubtedly both intelligent people and stupid people in its leadership.
I agree with you that the CIA is unlikely to have requested that 2 million take to the streets, but I wouldn’t be surprised if it had meddled a bit and done some encouraging.

wardropper
Reader
wardropper

Oh, and it might be a good idea to have in mind that China, too, has moved on since 1950 . . .

George
Reader
George

“If only the tanks had not exercised such restraint and run him over – like the Israeli Defense Forces when they crushed the body of activist Rachel Corrie with a Caterpillar bulldozer in the Gaza Strip – then China would be considered a ‘democracy.’”

Nice touch!

Tim Jenkins
Reader
Tim Jenkins

I particularly enjoyed that neat lil’ dig & analogy, as well: most revealing, i thought and a compliment to Max 🙂