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DISCUSS: Iran Seizes UK Oil Tanker – UPDATED Latest incident in Straits of Hormuz, clear response to UK’s seizure of Grace 1

As the media world and the twitterati are abuzz with whether or not Trump was racist and what Ilhan Omar will say next, the real world just ploughs right along, steaming straight toward another meltdown in the Middle East.

Iran is heating up, again.

The Iranian Navy has allegedly seized not one, but two UK operated oil tankers. The British press is reporting the ships were “hijacked”, whilst Iran claims they are merely enforcing maritime law.

This comes hot on the heels of another incident in the Strait, two days ago Iran stopped the Panamanian ship the MT Riah, accusing it of smuggling Iranian oil.

This can be seen as the inevitable Iranian response to the British seizure of an Iranian oil tanker off the coast of Gibraltar earlier this month. Jeremy Hunt claimed the ship, the Grace 1, was seized because it was transporting oil to Syria, in defiance of Western sanctions. Iran denies this. (Ed. Not an expert, but fairly sure under international law the UK has no right to enforce these sanctions. Iran and Syria are sovereign nations with every right to engage in bilateral trade).

Alongside all of this, yesterday President Donald Trump claimed the US military had downed an Iranian drone to “protect” one of their warships. Iran denies any of their drones have been destroyed.

One of two things is happening here:

1. US/UK are deliberately sailing ships into Iran’s waters to provoke a response.

2. Iran is flexing its muscles in the area, trying to demonstrate how they can hurt international oil markets if they are pushed into doing so.

The motivation for the US is clear in that scenario, they are hoping they can force Iran to do something, or else credibly invent an incident, that will justify their torpedoing of the nuclear deal. This could then be used to pressure the EU to join the US in applying new sanctions, or be lead to all-out war. It’s not clear which the US wants right now, but the historical precedents all point to America’s itchy trigger fingers.

If Iran is forcing the issue themselves, it’s a bold move. Fully capable of blowing up in their faces. It also contradicts some of their other moves – notably the deal the Iranian foreign minister proposed just yesterday, whereby the US would drop their sanctions in exchange for the Iranian government allowing immediate and regular inspections of all their nuclear facilities.

This deal would, essentially, be reintroducing the terms of the deal Trump tore up, but on a much-accelerated timeline.

There has been no word yet on whether or not the US would accept this deal (although those of you paying attention could probably make an educated guess).

Of course, with all the talk of drones, tankers and whathaveyou, the proposed peace deal has been pretty much ignored in the mainstream media.

The questions become:

  • Is this Iran attempting a Good Cop-Bad Cop move?
  • Or are the US upping tensions to overshadow the proposed deal, and/or provide an excuse to reject it?
  • Do the Neocons really want a new war, or are they satisfied with sanctions?
  • If Iran is attempting to boss the situation, will the US back down?
  • What is the UK’s role in this?
  • Are they just doing what the US tells them, or does Westminster have their own reasons for stoking tensions?

UPDATE 20/07/19: Footage released showing Iranian Revolutionary Guard boarding Stena Impero:

Iran’s government has, predictably, described the incident as “reciprocation”.

The UK media have described Iran’s actions as “taunting the UK” and “stoking tensions”

Meanwhile, the US is increasing its military presence in Saudi Arabia.

As always, discuss below and we will update if and when it becomes necessary.

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kidocelot
kidocelot
Jul 23, 2019 4:38 PM

The movement of the chess pieces!

1. This could be the UK creating an emergency to defer Brexit further or totally…..and return the UK to the desired business as usual neoliberal agenda.

2. A fight that then allows the USA to engage later on a secondary level and say we didn’t do it or want it but have a moral and overseeing imperative to intercede.

Stephen Morrell
Stephen Morrell
Jul 21, 2019 6:43 AM

Well done Iran.

davemass
davemass
Jul 21, 2019 6:04 AM

The oil price must go to 100 USD to make shale and fracked oil pay!
What better way to get that than to fabricate an incident or more than one?
It makes my country, (U.K.) look like a bunch of total twats.
Wasn’t it Zhuo EnLai who said “peoples are not evil, only governments….”
BTW, U.K. in its naval heyday was an expert at piracy, especially against Spanish
gold galleons!

Tim Jenkins
Tim Jenkins
Jul 21, 2019 1:07 PM
Reply to  davemass

“U.K. in its naval heyday was an expert at piracy,”. . . & False Flags.

The West has Panamanian flags of convenience & False Flagged bank accounting systems, from Iran-Contra-days of old, so maybe Gaza could initiate something remarkably similar, in memory of the USS Liberty & out of Respect for the Bridge Signals Officer on the day of the attack, still actively demonstrating today for Gaza,

Joe Meadors Maritime Flags of Gazan Convenience, 😉

And Iran, China & Russia could register a sh8t load of ships, in memory of the days of the USS Liberty & when Freedom of information was murdered in the West, simultaneously with the illegal invasion of the Golan Heights, on that fateful day where all respect for international LAWs & maritime law, was blown out of the water by the IAF & IDF … attacking life rafts even, according to other witnesses & Joe Meadors, even after Joe having raised the USA Flag Twice, during the attacks on an unarmed vessel in international waters.

The JMM/FGC could change the balance of powers on the high seas & on land 🙂

Gazans & Palestinians must totally re-think their game strategy and any future steps to improve their status internationally must involve quality communications systems &

Urgent Legitimate ‘TRANSPORTS’ & Transport Laws that are respected & upheld & enforced, under a considered equitable jurisdiction from multi-polar players…
coz’ the U.N. is wholly incapable of thinking legitimately, already well proven.

If I were Chinese and could register my ships on the cheap in the Med. , next to Greece with existing Chinese investments and foreign militaries to observe swarming all around the region, Gaza could prove an interesting spot to develop, one way or another . . . 🙂

Tim Jenkins
Tim Jenkins
Jul 21, 2019 1:38 PM
Reply to  davemass

I should add, that given Turkey’s proposed purchase of the Russian S-400’s air defence systems and their historic support of Gazans & Palestinians, including Turkish Seafarers loss of life to Israeli Military thugs’ illegal actions in international waters, again, en route to Gaza, it is fair to suggest that NATO’s second largest military contingent, is vey much for turning and certain forces will want Erdogan dead again, after their first failed attempt, when Putin warned Erdogan mid-flight to Istanbul in July 2016 …

Iran, Russia & China are playing the long game on oil prices, coz they see the harm it is doing to morally & financially bankrupted western governments & the Turkish Lira has suffered badly, but the Belt & Road initiative needs Turkey and Turkey imports more from China than it does from any other nation … think about that reality hard fact, coz’ it looks to me like Erdogan is enjoying the long game of chess, more than Israel … who are behind the Chinese technologically, & in many electronic departments, that must bridge future societal & cultural differences for the resources & markets of …

Tomorrow:-

tune in, next week, to flags of convenience wanna’ FUKUS Modulations 🙂 FOCW FM

Ramdan
Ramdan
Jul 21, 2019 5:22 AM

….and now…taran…(dramatic music):

“The Daily Mirror report claims that UK intelligence service MI6 and the Government Communication Headquarters (GCHQ) initiated an investigation on whether omnipotent Russian spies used their cyber-warfare prowess to spoof the GPS signal on the UK-flagged Stena Impero tanker seized by the Islamic Revolutionary Guards Corps”

…..to be continue…dont miss next episode of UK (and the “CIVILIZED” West resist the attacks of the evils russians and Ayatollahs….

(Epic music fade in and slowly fades out)

…We’ll go to commercials and be back in a second. Dont move from your seats my fellow hypnotized consumers…(SMILE).

JungleRulez
JungleRulez
Jul 20, 2019 10:58 PM

Iran has taken time to study the rule book used by the US and Europe to diminish the strength then destroy the countries they deem as possible economic or militarily a threat.
US and Europe step by step strategy for a new world Oder.

Step1:
Harass them

Step2:
Give them an opportunity to complain thru the UN and the Security Council

Step3:
Ignore the UN and SC and harass then even more

Step4:
Offer them a way out if they destroy their weapons.

Step5:
Once they are weak and cannot defend themselves attack them and destroy any semblance of normality making sure they do not recover for the next 100 years. Prop up a regime of your choice (preferably a Military Junta) under your control

Step6:
Create a militia that will ensure perpetual chaos

Step7:
Offer to protect and rebuild them in exchange for all their wealth.

Step8:
Plunder their wealth

Step9:
Repeat Step8 in perpetuity

Step10:
Repeat Step1 to Step9 on every country that has wealth to plunder.

JungleRulez
JungleRulez
Jul 20, 2019 10:27 PM

So let me get this straight.
UK seizes an Oil tanker because they suspect it to be supplying crude oil to Syria and that’s OK after all it’s their right even if no evidence exists. Then they turn and ask Iran to promise it’s going to Turkey, how patronizing, but that’s OK after all it’s the British doing it they are the good guys regardless of their action.

Iran retaliates in kind and it’s a big issue worth raising at the UNSC or even threatening war.

Did I miss something or are the defenders of truth and freedom (As the British like to think of themselves) only willing to look at their truth only and no one is allowed to question their version of truth, a.k.a Alternative truth

Frank Speaker
Frank Speaker
Jul 20, 2019 8:29 PM

Pathetic.

What’s pathetic Frank?

1. That the US and UK still believe that they own the world, when everyone else is moving against them.
2. That Marxists here support an anti LGBT, hanging and headchopping bunch of religious nutters.

mark
mark
Jul 20, 2019 10:27 PM
Reply to  Frank Speaker

Maybe they should support the “religious nutters” waiting for The Rapture in the JEWSA instead.
Or the “religious nutters” in Talmudistan plotting to blow up the Dome Of The Rock so they can sacrifice their red heifer.
They execute almost as many people as Texas. Surprising they don’t get on like house on fire.

William HBonney
William HBonney
Jul 21, 2019 12:14 AM
Reply to  mark

Is there any topic you are incapable of shoehorning Israel into!?

mark
mark
Jul 21, 2019 1:07 AM

Why not? This is the latest in a long series of wars for Talmudistan. None of them would have happened otherwise. Iraq. Afghanistan. Libya. Syria. All kosher wars for the Chosen Folk, plotted, incited and engineered by the Neocohens, fought with goy muscle, money and blood. The old, old story.

johnny
johnny
Jul 21, 2019 4:59 AM

howz langley hasbara boy?

George
George
Jul 21, 2019 9:28 AM
Reply to  Frank Speaker

What’s pathetic is that you now seem to be talking to yourself Frank. Myyyy prrresssssscious!

DunGroanin
DunGroanin
Jul 20, 2019 6:19 PM

But this is relevant ain’t it, Admin?

Hello… some more leekage from the tanker kerfuffle.

‘A Royal Navy warship escorting the Stena Impero tanker before its Friday detention by the IRGC attempted to put up “resistance and interference” to stop the Iranian military from bringing the tanker to shore’
https://sputniknews.com/middleeast/201907201076306630-british-warship-tried-to-stop-iran-from-seizing-uk-flagged-tanker-in-hormuz-strait—irgc/

So … our sailors didn’t manage to get sunk as they were supposed to. Smart guys.

DunGroanin
DunGroanin
Jul 20, 2019 5:28 PM

Bad connection to Off-G briefly there ..

Lets chew on this breaking news.

Hello… some more leekage from the tanker kerfuffle.

‘A Royal Navy warship escorting the Stena Impero tanker before its Friday detention by the IRGC attempted to put up “resistance and interference” to stop the Iranian military from bringing the tanker to shore’
https://sputniknews.com/middleeast/201907201076306630-british-warship-tried-to-stop-iran-from-seizing-uk-flagged-tanker-in-hormuz-strait—irgc/

So … our sailors didn’t manage to get sunk as they were supposed to. Smart guys.

espartaco
espartaco
Jul 20, 2019 3:58 PM

We are facing a ‘conspiracy’, a game, a fake conflict engineered by the UK’s immigrationist Establishment and its pals, the Ayatollahs of Iran, to boost the chances of Jeremy Hunt to become PM and prevent BoJo, Trump’s favourite, to win and boost the position of the USA against the Iran Deal. A few hours ago, a former First Sea Lord was showing his disgust in a BBC interview regarding the ‘unbelievable’ and suspicious ‘unpreparedness’ of the Royal Navy for a scenario that was completely foreseeable… In short… Iran helping Hunt.

Tim jenkins
Tim jenkins
Jul 21, 2019 1:56 PM
Reply to  espartaco

In short, espartaco, What you need is a commmiiittteee and to bury yer’ heads on the beach @Bognor, ole’ buggers … gimme’ more ole’ TATT
(TATT-Tel Aviva Talmudic Trans-missions) &

Llareggub tally-Ho: a few hours ago a former first sea lord was getting invited by secret services to report on his endless colonial missionary expeditions & positions on Epstein Island in an inflatable, with Ghislaine Maxwell …

Don’t give up the dayjob…

espartaco
espartaco
Jul 21, 2019 6:34 PM
Reply to  Tim jenkins

Come on JINX… you did not really think we could fall for ‘Jenkins’… surely, even a retarded and paranoid antisemitic Nazi like you could see that we prefer that ‘YOU’ pay us the DOLE… keep working hard for us in your ‘dayjob’… thanks…!!!

LeRuscino
LeRuscino
Jul 20, 2019 12:51 PM

UK looks silly & weak. Better to have not touched the Tanker at Gibraltar & retained the 007 illusion of strength.

Jeremy Hunt is toast for this mistake……..

mark
mark
Jul 21, 2019 1:08 AM
Reply to  LeRuscino

With May, Bojo and Hunt at the helm, what could possibly go wrong?

Seamus Padraig
Seamus Padraig
Jul 20, 2019 12:47 PM

White pill: with a little bit of luck, this could well be Washington’s Suez Crisis, where their empire in the ME finally comes to an inglorious–but bloodless–end.

Seamus Padraig
Seamus Padraig
Jul 20, 2019 12:45 PM

This could then be used to pressure the EU to join the US in applying new sanctions …

The Euro-muppets never actually lifted the old sanctions against Iran in the first place. It seems they’re too afraid of getting sanctioned by the US themselves, so they’re just going to wait it out quietly until 2021, when Trump is finally out of office … they hope.

Robbobbobin
Robbobbobin
Jul 20, 2019 11:41 AM

“One of two things is happening here:

1. US/UK are deliberately sailing ships into Iran’s waters to provoke a response.

2. Iran is flexing its muscles in the area, trying to demonstrate how they can hurt international oil markets if they are pushed into doing so.”

One of two and a half things:

1. US/UK are deliberately sailing ships into Iran’s waters to provoke a response.

1.5. Iran is reacting to Gulf smuggling activity it normally ignores by waiting until it catches a UK or US vessel engaging in it as a UN-level provable incident that, nevertheless, has all the warning signalling and propaganda value (and then some) but decidely less of the risk of detaining a bona fide shipment.

2. Iran is flexing its muscles in the area, trying to demonstrate how they can hurt international oil markets if they are pushed into doing so.

Them that ask no questions isn’t told a lie.
Watch the wall my darling while the Gentlemen go by.

Carnyx
Carnyx
Jul 20, 2019 10:37 AM

Okay here’s my reading, Iran is flexing it’s muscles, it’s letting Trump and the world know that if it’s economy suffers from sanctions they’ll push up oil prices and hurt everyone back, as such their proxies will conduct attacks on gulf shipping of increasing frequency and scale, giving Trump enough time and warning to pull back from his stupid sanctions.

I don’t think Trump wants war with Iran, he just wants a deal he can claim is better than Obama’s and thinks carrot and stick will work, but the Iranians will not fold, Trump has no idea what he is dealing with. Trouble is there are a whole bunch of people in the Trump admin that really do want war and they are doing everything they can to drag Trump into one. Iran meanwhile waited to see if Europe would stand up to Trump but they failed, European companies are too scared of being sanctioned by the US if they work with Iran. Iran is only stepping up now after Europe failed to ignore US sanctions.

Brexit means the UK desperately needs a favourable US trade deal and that means doing anything Washington wants, subsequently they stupidly and illegally ceased the Iranian tanker and played themselves and have now put UK shipping in the firing zone.

Trump doesn’t want war with Iran, the British govt doesn’t, Iran doesn’t want war either, but the neocons are working away to get as many people killed as possible.

Mikalina
Mikalina
Jul 20, 2019 12:11 PM
Reply to  Carnyx

You should put that in a comic strip……

Carnyx
Carnyx
Jul 20, 2019 1:09 PM
Reply to  Mikalina

I cannot think of any reason the neocons aren’t cartoon villains. I know they prefer to think of themselves as superhero white knights dashing around the world fighting evil … but then, I’m more of a Utilitarian than a Kantian, screw the intentions, look at the effing results and that tells you exactly what they are!

lundiel
lundiel
Jul 20, 2019 7:18 PM
Reply to  Carnyx

Britain doesn’t need a trade deal with America. We always do what America wants. However, the British public doesn’t want a trade deal with America, most people are happy to keep parity with European regulations and trade with America under current terms. They don’t want or need, American food and they definitely don’t want further inroads by American health care corporates.

Carnyx
Carnyx
Jul 20, 2019 10:51 PM
Reply to  lundiel

Britain cannot continue to trade with it’s EU partners with the same conditions because it’s leaving, the British owning elite needs access to other markets to make up for the loss and hence the US. The more power the British establishment have over UK policy the worse it gets for the bulk of British people outside London, the UK has greater disparity in wealth between it’s regions than anywhere else in Northern Europe and that is entirely the fault of the British establishment. See, that’s what English Brexiters aren’t appreciating, the British state isn’t the same thing as themselves collectively. It wasn’t the British people who wanted to invade Iraq, but the British establishment, with it’s imperial heritage, aspires to global significance so it goes along with Washington, and Brexit only increases that.

The British elite are also now promoting a dangerous russophobic new Cold War, because they hope it will unite themselves from Brexit divisions and help maintain the UK’s global position if they have a big foreign enemy to unite the US and Europe against. That’s why the Brits were involved in Russiagate and all the Skipal BS.

Brexiter’s problem isn’t that they don’t understand the EU, they don’t understand the British state. This applies to Lexiters too, there are indeed some good reasons to Leave the EU, although these apply mostly to countries (that aren’t Germany or next to Germany) inside the Eurozone, but whatever you need to have faith in the British state to think it can be any better outside the EU, and I have none, the British state sucks, it has a decrepit top down centralised constitution that denies sovereignty to the people of the UK, which is why it can never be federal. Brexiters in regional England are in for a hell of a nasty shock when they realise they just voted to give the architectects of their own decline even greater powers.

Never trust the British establishment.

lundiel
lundiel
Jul 21, 2019 8:59 AM
Reply to  Carnyx

there are indeed some good reasons to Leave the EU, although these apply mostly to countries (that aren’t Germany or next to Germany) inside the Eurozone,

See, you know yourself, the Eurozone is bound to fail and only Germany does alright out of the EU.

Never trust the British establishment.

But have faith in the neoliberal EU….the only trading block in the world that has neoliberalism enshrined forever in law. No thanks. I don’t trust any of them, nor should you. The EU is a bunch of right-wing states awaiting the next economic crisis.

Carnux
Carnux
Jul 21, 2019 11:47 AM
Reply to  lundiel

See, you know yourself, the Eurozone is bound to fail and only Germany does alright out of the EU.

Yes I do, I’m writing this in Greece. Although I’d say that Germany does well out of the Euro (rather than EU) because they insisted on more neoliberal measures which were advantageous to them as part of joining it. The Germans were at first very reluctant to join the Euro because they took pride in the strong DM, however the weaker Euro boosts their export market which centralises the EZ economy in Germany while removing competition under cutting them.

The British establishment meanwhile were happy to let Britain’s industry rot (in the north), leave manufacturing to the Germans and put all their eggs into financial services (based in the south east) because finance was the only realm left where the UK could be a global power, and so what if people in Glasgow or Liverpool are impoverished, they can “get on their bike”.

But have faith in the neoliberal EU

And guess who was pushing the neoliberalism and Alanticism within the EU? Who wanted rapid eastern expansion, who was promoting Turkish membership, who was working to ensure that the EU was more of a market than a federal state by insisting on ever greater size? Who traded fishing rights so the Spanish would support measures advantageous to The City? What did Thatcher introduce to the developed world?

Fact is the UK itself made the EU worse, the EU would have been better of without it, although it’s too late now … still the British people will be worse off without the EU tempering the British state’s institutional culture. Out of the frying pan into the fire.

Thing is no remainer from the British establishment can advance the ultimate remain argument “we are even worse for you than that lot in Brussels”.

lundiel
lundiel
Jul 21, 2019 2:07 PM
Reply to  Carnux

What the EU has done to Greece is truly appalling. They put a failed economic model before the lives of people. Austerity will be forced on Greece for another 60 years, if they continue to record economic growth year on year for every one of those 60 years. The country has been effectively destroyed.
I am very glad we are leaving.

Carnyx
Carnyx
Jul 21, 2019 2:20 PM
Reply to  lundiel

And yet the UK imposed austerity on itself without anything near the degree of crisis (before the “bailout”) that Greece was experiencing.

lundiel
lundiel
Jul 21, 2019 2:59 PM
Reply to  Carnyx

I’m sorry, what’s your point? I don’t represent the British government or agree with it’s political or economic policy. Many people here know that austerity was imposed for ideological purposes and had no economic necessity. I will repeat what I said before: We (UK), can change policy with governments….The countries of the EU can’t. Good day.

Carnyx
Carnyx
Jul 21, 2019 5:46 PM
Reply to  lundiel

The British elite freely choose to do something to it’s own people that was forced on Greece by circumstance, the Germans had more excuse to impose austerity on Greece than the UK had to impose it on the UK! Thus there is no way returning to the singular rule of the British establishment can improve things for the British people, they’ll screw us over faster and harder than the EU.

lundiel
lundiel
Jul 21, 2019 7:18 PM
Reply to  Carnyx

Keep telling yourself that from your retirement/holiday home in Greece. Your comments leak self-interest.

Carnyx
Carnyx
Jul 21, 2019 8:10 PM
Reply to  lundiel

I’m married to a Greek, my daughter is half Greek and neither of us are retired, the Greek crisis has affected my family more than yours. Thank you for your presumption.

You are apparently poor at recognising where opposing arguments are stemming from, mine in particular stems from a Scottish Nationalist perspective.

lundiel
lundiel
Jul 21, 2019 8:15 PM
Reply to  Carnyx

Says it all. Scottish Nationalists are out and out neoliberals.

Carnyx
Carnyx
Jul 21, 2019 8:26 PM
Reply to  lundiel

The SNP and their Nordic social democratic aims, do not represent the entire Indy movement and they are still well to the left of Slab. I’m worried they are getting too comfortable in Westminster when the whole point is to break up Britain so it can be replaced in Scotland, England and Wales by something better. Indy gives us and England a chance to drop the imperial baggage and reform govt from the bottom up, in Scotland’s it already has a predominantly leftist electorate.

lundiel
lundiel
Jul 21, 2019 9:38 PM
Reply to  Carnyx

Good luck with that.

lundiel
lundiel
Jul 21, 2019 2:16 PM
Reply to  Carnux

I would also say that, in this country (UK), we can change government and economic models. I’m well aware we’ve had 50 years of neoliberalism. But the EU is stuck with it until 27 countries can agree to scrap every treaty since Maastricht and rewrite European law. In other words, they are stuck with neoliberalism until the Euro collapses and several countries leave. Therefore, I’d rather take my chances outside.

Francis Lee
Francis Lee
Jul 20, 2019 9:34 AM

Hurrah! We’ve sent a gunboat to sort out those querolous natives. Hmmm, I take it that the British establishment is aware that we are no longer living in the 19th century? But given the abject stupidity of the British ruling establishment I could be wrong.

How does the historical record go.

1. The Battle of the Somme/Passchendale 1916/17
2. Policy of Appeasement 1938
3. Fall of Singapore 1941
4. The American loan 1945/6 the end of the Sterling area and the UK as a great power
5. Colonial wars in Kenya, Cyprus, Palestine, Malaya all of which ended in retreat. Ireland ongoing.
6. The ongoing occupation of the UK by the US resulting in the vassalisation of the UK. This is called ‘The Special repationship.’

” … somehow, from 1920-1940, the British ruling class decayed, lost its ability, its daring, finally even its ruthlessness. Until a time came when stuffed shirts like Anthony Eden, or Lord Halifax could stand out as men of exceptional talent. As for Baldwin one could not even dignify him with the name of stuffed shirt. he was simply a hole in the air. The mishandling of England’s domestic problems during the 1920s was bad enough, but British foreign policy between 1930 and 1939 is one of the wonders of the world. Why? What had happened? What was it that at every decisive moment made every British statesman do precisely the wrong thing with so unerring and instinct.

The fact was that the UK ruling class had reached a state of advanced decay. But the British ruling class obviously could not admit to themselves that their usefullness was at an end. Had the done that they would have had to abdicate … Clearly there was only one escape for them – into stupidity.”

(George Orwell – The Lion and the Unicorn – In Collected Essays – Volume 2 – 1940-43)

Dear Readers I give you Boris Johnson and Jeremy Hunt – prize specemins.

Gezzah Potts
Gezzah Potts
Jul 20, 2019 12:06 PM
Reply to  Francis Lee

Brilliant Francis. Hmmm, with Hunt and Johnson vying for the title of Vassal State Cheif Bootlicker, as well as being just plain cringeworthy, in a way I’m glad am way down here in the Southern Hemisphere. Have you thought of moving to Orkney?

eagle eye
eagle eye
Jul 20, 2019 1:00 PM
Reply to  Gezzah Potts

C’mon Gezz. exponential descent into stupidity is hardly the exclusive domain of British upper class twats.

Personally I think it has more to do with the baked in nature of party politics. The need to slavishly adhere to the party line repels those who can think for themselves and a lack of such people in any organisation leads to a crisis in leadership.

I hold up any number of state and federal governments in Oz as examples.

Gezzah Potts
Gezzah Potts
Jul 20, 2019 1:37 PM
Reply to  eagle eye

Okay, you’re right eagle eye, the bumbling cringeworthy level of stupidity is not just in the UK. Its everywhere. And yeah, I fully concur about state & federal politics in Oz. Which is another reason I no longer watch or read mainstream media here. Upset my stomach too much….

Tim Jenkins
Tim Jenkins
Jul 20, 2019 2:48 PM
Reply to  Francis Lee

Q:- what’s blackened, blue, white and rubbery,
and flew over the Atlantic @160 mph ?

A: Lord Louis’ plimsol … 😉

mark
mark
Jul 20, 2019 4:06 PM
Reply to  Francis Lee

The policies of the 1930s just reflected hard realities.
By the end of the 1920s, half of all the tax revenue collected in the UK was eaten up paying the INTEREST on the (largely US) debts run up to fight WW1.
WW1 was a death blow to the declining British Empire, which had always had the character of a gigantic bluff, with an army the size of Belgium or Bulgaria.
It was bound to disintegrate when faced with a serious challenger. The events of the 1930s just reflected that weakness.
WW2 was the final nail in the coffin.
By June 1940, Britain was actually bankrupt. Churchill went cap in hand to Roosevelt for $5 billion (1940s money) of weapons, oil, food, raw materials. Roosevelt had him over a barrel, and drove a very hard bargain.
The US demanded that all British assets in North and South America, that had been built up over a century, had to be sold off to US investors at fire sale prices, within 2 weeks. The Du Pont chemicals conglomerate, for example, was sold off at a 50% discount.
British manufacturers were not allowed to export to any markets where they competed with US products, a surrender of markets on a vast scale.
The US took direct control of the British economy. The US dictated the gold and foreign currency reserves Britain was allowed to hold.
There was much else besides. Britain was reduced to a US satellite, a status it was held ever since. Britain became, and has remained, even more of a US satellite than East Germany ever was of the USSR. ( This is no hyperbole – the GDR occasionally asserted its independence and defied Moscow.)
Lend Lease was only finally paid off on 31/12/2006.
Since 1940, the UK has never been more than a glorified Puerto Rico. That is the hard reality.
Churchill invented all this “Special Relationship” BS as a form of self delusion or denial of this humiliating reality.

William HBonney
William HBonney
Jul 21, 2019 12:19 AM
Reply to  mark

This is no hyperbole – the GDR occasionally asserted its independence and defied Moscow.)

Don’t post bollocks. If the GDR ever defied Moscow it was in the spirit of obsequiousness, similar to Carrie Lam’s present day attempt to impress Beijing.

mark
mark
Jul 21, 2019 1:25 AM

The GDR was more genuinely independent of the USSR than the UK of the US (though admittedly that is setting a very low bar.) It frequently pursued policies that were opposed by the Kremlin in pursuit of its own interests. A prime example is the decision to build the Berlin Wall in 1961. This was strongly opposed by Moscow, but they went ahead and did it anyway. There were other examples, where Wandlitz tried to make socialism work as well as it was capable of working.

That’s not a case of singing the praises of the GDR, though they did the best they could under the prevailing circumstances. It just highlights the debased and degraded status of Washington’s UK satraps.

Tim Jenkins
Tim Jenkins
Jul 21, 2019 2:04 PM

BBB – PTSD projection.transference.strawman.distractions.
BillyBoyBollocks – pure gaslighting

DunGroanin
DunGroanin
Jul 20, 2019 8:52 AM

Anyone else notice the headline change on the Groan?
They are now talking about British ‘linked’ tankers.
Article link still not changed
‘british-tanker-iran-capture-fears-stena-impero-uk-ship-latest’

DunGroanin
DunGroanin
Jul 20, 2019 11:30 AM
Reply to  DunGroanin

Changed again
‘iran-on-dangerous-path-with-seizure-of-stena-impero-says-uk’

Talk of rowing back! Tankers aren’t easy to row.

Even the gung-ho Tuggenhat is claiming there should be no retaliation.

‘the British government advised UK ships to stay out of the area “for an interim period”’

I mean wtf? What are they supposed to do stop, turn around? Take a long way around?

Also does it mean British registered? British owned? British flagged? Vaguely British? Does it apply to naval craft?

Whichever turds that got us involved in pirating that tanker in Gibraltar ought to be removed from their posts for incompetence or worse!
That is anyone from May and the Chiefs down, including the civil servants and back benchers, the defence committee and the field commanders who would know they were in the wrong.

A shut down of traffic through the Strait would spike the spot prices, which would trigget all sorts of financial instruments, cdf’s and the like, which would trigger a meltdown like 2008…all within minutes.

Playing with fire rather than negotiating an end to the never ending pressure on Iran.
It is a no-win scenario for us.

Molloy
Molloy
Jul 20, 2019 1:25 PM
Reply to  DunGroanin

.
The stupidity is deliberate. Elites profit from confusion and antagonism.

.

mark
mark
Jul 20, 2019 4:13 PM
Reply to  DunGroanin

Just seizing one ship has closed the Straits to UK/ US shipping in one afternoon.
For the past 12 months, Iran’s nuts have been squeezed by US economic strangulation.
Iran is now squeezing the nuts of the UK and EU.

William HBonney
William HBonney
Jul 21, 2019 12:21 AM
Reply to  mark

If you are so eager to impress Iran, why not live there?

I know why, you wouldn’t be as useful an idiot there.

mark
mark
Jul 21, 2019 1:30 AM

Why not live there?
Hadn’t thought of that.
Nice cats. Nice carpets too.

Ken Kenn
Ken Kenn
Jul 20, 2019 1:14 PM
Reply to  DunGroanin

Yes – they are bit coy in their descriptions of the movements of the two ‘ British ‘ ships.
( one under a British flag and one under a Liberian flag ) and they talk of transponders being turned off and alarming changes in direction of these ships.

A bit 9/11 ish vis: the transponders.

I’m not expert but if you turn them off no-one knows where you are I think so not surprisingly the Iranians had a look.

Trump says the US has no ships in the Straits except warships so not so much oil carriers than missile carriers.

Trump needs a war with Iran like he needs a change of hairstyle.

Imagine him in a ginger curly wig then imagine his prospects if all this goes wrong pre next years election.

It doesn’t sit well with his promise to his people that the US wasn’t going to get involved in this type of thing in the future.

Just as an addition – have any new steelworks been built yet and has a brick been laid to build ‘ a ‘ wall?

The steelworks idea I like – the wall idea I don’t.

Should we build a wall around Trump/Pompeo and Bolton?

I know a 2 and 1 gang of brickies who are short of work.

They are very good at building circular brick walls.

I await the call.

pàul metcalf
pàul metcalf
Jul 20, 2019 8:08 AM

Thanks Judy,but didn’t i read somewhere that the Grace 1 was too large for any of the Syrian ports?

William HBonney
William HBonney
Jul 21, 2019 12:22 AM
Reply to  pàul metcalf

Citation needed

mathias alexand
mathias alexand
Aug 2, 2019 7:15 PM

Surely a citation is needed to sat which permits the siezure of the Grace 1.

JudyJ
JudyJ
Aug 2, 2019 9:55 PM

Mathias

Indeed. I wrote to my MP two weeks ago asking for him to obtain for me from the Foreign Office details of the legal basis for the seizure. No acknowledgement received, and I am still waiting for the information. Silence speaks volumes.

JudyJ
JudyJ
Jul 21, 2019 6:30 PM
Reply to  pàul metcalf

That may well be but the key point about the seizure of the Grace 1 is that the UK/EU has no jurisdiction over Iran’s trade in oil, whichever country they may be delivering it to.

Loverat
Loverat
Jul 20, 2019 6:34 AM

I think it’s time for Corbyn to openly distance himself from the crimes of the British. Saying the seizure is unacceptable does not help. By now he should have condemned the aggression in the middle east and spoken for the right of states to defend themselves and trade between each other. Corbyn doesn’t seem to know what is really going on or is still appeasing a British government pushing for yet more war. The Iranians have every right to respond to piracy. It’s the only way to stand up to bullies. Restraint can only be effective up to a point.

DunGroanin
DunGroanin
Jul 20, 2019 11:49 AM
Reply to  Loverat

I’m sure ‘Corbyn’ – you obviously mean the Labour leadership?- is fully cogniscient via official and independent sources; as he is equally bound by the rules of the Privy Council (a turgid system that exists at the behest of the Crown – a bunch of Aristos and the various high priest of UK governance – we really do not have a democratic parliamentry government here)

To come out against the ‘Crown’ probably means something akin to volunteering to be taken to the Tower and feeding your eyeballs to the ravens!

Only time the Opposition can do anything effective is if there is a parliamentry debate and vote. Until then it would be just a lot of pressure groups and ineffective marches, like the pointless stop Brexit one today.

The only way to stop Brexit, to change the policy on Iran, Russia, USA etc is by having parliamentry power to do so.

And the only way to get that parliamentry power is … a general election or a soft coup like the tories are doing now or what the NuLabInc PLooPers and nazgul lords are attempting.

A General Election is what everyone wanting change should be demanding and manifestos that we can hold the winner to.

Molloy
Molloy
Jul 20, 2019 1:22 PM
Reply to  DunGroanin

.
Yes. But. (….remember.) The System is Still Rigged.

.

mark
mark
Jul 20, 2019 4:18 PM
Reply to  DunGroanin

Be careful what you wish for. Anything could happen when the next election comes – in weeks, or months at most. Tory and Labour meltdowns, Farage forming a government – not that fanciful.

DunGroanin
DunGroanin
Jul 21, 2019 12:48 AM
Reply to  mark

I’m always happy to get a chance to have a vote. Especially to decide who governs. Especially in a minority government.
I’d live with the result.
Whether i liked it or not.
I will get a chance to vote at the next election.
That’s democracy

Seamus Padraig
Seamus Padraig
Jul 20, 2019 12:56 PM
Reply to  Loverat

Corbyn’s too weak to do any such thing.

Basher
Basher
Jul 20, 2019 3:52 PM
Reply to  Loverat

FFS. Not everything is Corbyn’s fault. But it may seen that way to corporate press readers. Really unhelpful comment.

mark
mark
Jul 20, 2019 4:15 PM
Reply to  Loverat

Restraint is just taken for weakness in Washington/ London/ Brussels/ Tel Aviv.

UreKismet
UreKismet
Jul 20, 2019 5:59 AM

While there is some chance that the 5th rate english politicians might lose the plot during their interminable gabfests over “what to do?” this weekend, somehow I suspect that Trump’s latest international advisor Rupert Murdoch speaking through fox news talking head Tucker Carlson will go for the war option rather than some mutually face-saving, quietly negotiated agreement with Iran.

Dingbat a l’orange has but one major concern right now, winning re-election in 2020 and it seems to me that now control of fox news has been taken from the late but unlamented Roger Ailes, Murdoch is using the network in a dual carrot/stick ploy to have the trump deliver what Murdoch and his syndicate of greedies demand.

The link above from the Tufts’ alumni fanzine, foreignpolicy.com, tells us that Bolton has been pushed so far to the outer at Murdoch’s insistence, that his task for the month of July is to sort out a storm in a teacup contretemps between Japan & South Korea.
I have no clue what that means long term for the zionist influence over Mr Orange’s administration as Murdoch has a lot of his most sensitive and secret enterprises based in occupied Palestine, one can only suppose that the quants have gone head down arse up and calculated that right now, war is less profitable than some preferred alternative.
So Trump will be about finding a way to force the Hunt and Johnson morons to concur. Trouble is that the particularly silly englanders who currently control in england may still imagine plagiarizing from the Thatcher model when she cemented her hold on power by making a fuss over a mob of shitty south atlantic rocks.
Both are sufficiently stupid to believe the nonsense about rallying around the flag and forgetting exactly how divided brits are right now regarding the union.

We shall see, but right now the most likely cry around DC is gonna be “Rand who?” while Paul junior secretly makes a deal with Iranian Foreign Minister MJ Zarif.

UreKismet
UreKismet
Jul 20, 2019 6:05 AM
Reply to  UreKismet

right well that post is a mess the first para should read : While there is some chance that the 5th rate english politicians might lose the plot during their interminable gabfests over “what to do?” this weekend, somehow I suspect that Trump’s latest international advisor Rupert Murdoch speaking through fox news talking head Tucker Carlson won’t go for the war option, rather some mutually face-saving, quietly negotiated agreement with Iran.

message to self ‘proof before hitting post’.

Sorry bout that chief.

DunGroanin
DunGroanin
Jul 20, 2019 8:23 AM
Reply to  UreKismet

I think most regulars are able to spot typos and such round here 🙂

I gently reject your assertion that

‘Thatcher model when she cemented her hold on power by making a fuss over a mob of
shitty south atlantic rocks.’

It wasn’t enough by itself to get her second term.

It was the mark one of Blairism, the SDP gang of 4, Atlantist, ‘neo’ con/lib , deep cover moles that were used to split the Labour vote, that ‘cemented’ Thatcher and the NWO that we have suffered under for 40 years since.

They were ALL well rewarded by Thatcher and their neocon bosses for starting the snatching back the gains of the war sacrifices by the population.

Never forget that the splitters from the post war social democratic consensus did that.

They even had the gall to call themselves the SDP !

Well, sdp2,3…whatever the latest iteration of the Funny Tingers is, ain’t fooling anyone THIS time.

UreKismet
UreKismet
Jul 20, 2019 11:07 AM
Reply to  DunGroanin

Fair enough you make a valid point, but neither C**t nor nor Blondie ever scratch beneath the surface, the first because he cannot, the second because he cannot be arsed.
Does it really matter if a thing is correct when a sleazy vote seducing pol acts upon it? The immediate outcome is the same. Sure, it creates room for historians to argue the toss about 50 years after the issue has become irrelevant but afaik, it doesn’t do a lot else.

Maybe it proffers some ammo for those pushing back using boring stuff like logic and/or the facts (Shock horror), but right now in this instant, most humans do not appear to be reacting to either.

IMO stopping this push to self destruction is gonna require more direct intercession – -not that anything other than me acknowledging such would be useful here.

I realise it may just come with the turf (becoming ancient) but the ninnies with the keys to all of it right now, do seem to be the most moronic in known history.

milosevic
milosevic
Jul 21, 2019 9:07 AM
Reply to  UreKismet

C**t

what’s the point of engaging in misogynist slurs, if you feel that you have to obfuscate them? that’s your better judgement reminding you that you ought to refrain completely.

Mikalina
Mikalina
Jul 21, 2019 1:46 PM
Reply to  milosevic

The next generation will get it right as 8 year olds are now taught in ‘Relationship’ lessons to label all male and female genitalia.

Oh, that Jeremy Hunt – what a vagina!

mark
mark
Jul 20, 2019 4:20 PM
Reply to  UreKismet

Carlson has been one of the few relatively sane voices in the US media.

Antonym
Antonym
Jul 20, 2019 4:59 AM

The is US/UK probably run by embedded Neocons with Trump/Johnson as “The” wild cards; Iran is surely run by Ayatollahs with no deviant insight alas.
Biggest victims: normal Iranians.

Antipropo
Antipropo
Jul 20, 2019 6:12 AM
Reply to  Antonym

You say “run by ayatollahs” with the unstated but clear inference that this is no good thing. Let’s be clear, Iran was conned into the JCOP deal to “prevent” the development of weapons for which there was and is no evidence. Mossad for fuck sake and the assessment of TWO US intelligence estimates, that’s the combined view of all US intelligence agencies, stated that unequivocally. The IAEA has repeatedly stated there is no evidence of diversion of fissile material. Enriching uranium is a normal part of the nuclear process, done by all the nuclear countries. Weapons grade is above 80%, Iran never enriched beyond 20%. A bit long winded but the point is this deal was meant bring an end to sanctions. The only partner to that deal to scrupulously and verifiably adhere to it is Iran. The sanctions were never lifted, the US unilaterally withdrew and IS sanctioning third parties who dare to trade with Iran. The US, at the behest of their master Israel, is insisting on a new “deal”- which they can just walk away from as now- to include missile development which was not part of the deal. Iran will NEVER agree to that because those missiles are what prevents Israel and Saudi Arabia from attacking them. Lest you think their missiles are abut crude I think in 2017 or 2018 Iran fired cruise missiles at terrorists in Syria with pinpoint accuracy to where nearby (illegal) US troops squealed about “being at risk”.

Mikalina
Mikalina
Jul 20, 2019 12:19 PM
Reply to  Antonym

Biggest victims: normal Iranians.

Normal ‘everybody’, Antonym but we are too stupid to realise it.

mark
mark
Jul 20, 2019 4:22 PM
Reply to  Antonym

Kosherstan is run by rabid Talmudic Supremacist warmongers.

lamingosarepink
lamingosarepink
Jul 20, 2019 4:24 AM

UP goes the price of oil in USA driving season and DOWN goes Chump’s chance of reelection. The markets will get the jitters and UP goes the price of oil further. The insurers have already dramatically escalated the cover price for middle east oil shipping so UP it will go again.

You see with a little push Iran can always rely on the markets to leverage the cost. Ain’t capitalism grand?

BigB
BigB
Jul 20, 2019 7:09 AM

I’m sure there is an element of what you say: trying to leverage the price of oil. That has to be set against the global market slowdown, OPEC’s go slow, and a resulting global oil glut. It is not supply that determines oil price: the price is demand constrained. They cannot sell the oil they have got if no one wants it. Right now, there is clear evidence capitalism is as dead as the JPOC.

Monobazeus
Monobazeus
Jul 20, 2019 4:14 AM

https://www.checkpointasia.net/iran-seizes-british-flagged-tanker-in-the-hormuz-strait/

Might be best to view through the prism of what ‘things’ like the UK and France want to happen to the US. What they want is for the US to fall. Happy chaps just assisting the US to overextend itself and lose a major war. Iran allied with Russia is the best chance the former empire’s have of seeing the US hegemony broken…and their chance to reclaim their empires. The US will be forced to go up against Russia on its own…no allies by her side…and she will fall.

DunGroanin
DunGroanin
Jul 20, 2019 8:40 AM
Reply to  Monobazeus

Er… you haven’t caught up with tge Shanghai Cooperation Organisation and its latest presidency I guess?

Britain is obviously deemed to be a future toe hold against the inevitable Eurasian /EU block that would run from the Atlantic to the Pacific, and from the Artic to indian Ocean and South China Sea.

We are supposed to be the ‘Cuba’ to the giant US. The Singapore/HK to China. The fairytale to the truth.

The old empires are dead and buried – Ozymandais, Alexander, Caesars.
Recent ones are zombies, they refuse to lay down -French/English.
They are animated by their joint US/Canada/Oz/Israeli sorcery.

milosevic
milosevic
Jul 21, 2019 9:14 AM
Reply to  DunGroanin

We are supposed to be the ‘Cuba’ to the giant US. The Singapore/HK to China. The fairytale to the truth.

Surely you mean, the Airstrip One to the Eurasian Empire.

Mikalina
Mikalina
Jul 20, 2019 12:39 AM

You have to wonder whether Elsie Tanner will ever go down the Rovers Return without that hairnet on. And, who will pop their clogs first – Minnie Cauldwell or Albert Tatlock. My money’s on….

Oh, wait a minute, sorry, wrong soap.

John A
John A
Jul 20, 2019 3:27 AM
Reply to  Mikalina

You are thinking of Ena Sharples, she was the one always in the hairnet.

Mikalina
Mikalina
Jul 20, 2019 11:56 AM
Reply to  John A

Well spotted, there. Elsie Tanner was the piece who ‘was no better than she ought to be’ (never understood that remark but heard it a lot where I grew up).

We no longer have the ability to recognise entertainment from reality.

Savorywill
Savorywill
Jul 20, 2019 12:15 AM

I don’t believe for a moment that Trump would start a war with Iran. Doing so would completely negate a central issue in his campaign of no more ‘regime’ change wars. The war in Afghanistan is still going on, after nearly 8 years, which the US was unable to win. Taking on Iran is another matter altogether, with its much larger population with formidable fighting forces. There is no way Trump will go there.

My hopes is that he sends Rand Paul, which is the rumor, to negotiate a ‘deal’. Rand Paul is on the same page, in many ways, as his father, Ron Paul, a former congressman and presidential candidate himself, a staunch and principled person who always is against any military intervention by the US.

mark
mark
Jul 20, 2019 1:30 AM
Reply to  Savorywill

You mean like he was going to Build The Wall?
You mean like he was going to Drain The Swamp?
You mean like he was going to Lock Her Up?
You mean like he was going to pull out of Syria?
You mean like he was going to pull out of Afghanistan?
You mean like he was going to sort out health care?
You mean like he was going to rebuild the crumbling infrastructure?

His only priorities have been to jump through hoops for his Adelson and the rest of his kosher handlers.
Destroy another country on Nuttyyahoo’s hit list like a good little Shabbos goy.
Giving the Jews Jerusalem. Giving the Jews the Golan. Giving the Jews the West Bank. Giving the Jews Outer Space.
Those are priorities that can’t wait.

Don’t confuse the monkey and the organ grinder.

William HBonney
William HBonney
Jul 21, 2019 12:28 AM
Reply to  mark

You mean like he was going to pull out of Syria?
You mean like he was going to pull out of Afghanistan?

If only your father had done some pulling out… I wonder if he had any Jewish blood in him;-)

milosevic
milosevic
Jul 21, 2019 9:31 AM

Look at me, I’m a dancing monkey! Zionist billionaires pull my strings!

https://electronicintifada.net/content/inside-israels-million-dollar-troll-army/27566

William HBonney
William HBonney
Jul 21, 2019 3:53 PM
Reply to  milosevic

You could be a little more imaginative with your insults – that was pathetic.

wardropper
wardropper
Jul 20, 2019 4:15 AM
Reply to  Savorywill

He might, however, rather enjoy dropping the UK into a war with Iran, then retreat to the very far sidelines of, say, San Francisco, and watch what happens with infantile glee . . .

We western humans really shouldn’t have let ourselves go to the extent of allowing our governments to descend to this level.

I suppose it’s traceable to generations of in-bred military families who still think we have an empire, and whose thinking got stuck somewhere around the time of the Battle of the Somme in WW1 – a war which nobody even remembers any more, and the lessons of which have, therefore, never been learnt.

“Military thinking” . . . What a sobering oxymoron . . .

Antipropo
Antipropo
Jul 20, 2019 6:16 AM
Reply to  Savorywill

I know that 8 years Afghan war is a typo it’s much closer to 18 years and no end in sight. The mightiest army the world has ever known can’t beat the AK wielding Taliban.

mathias alexand
mathias alexand
Jul 20, 2019 7:44 AM
Reply to  Antipropo

The US has done enough in Iran to control the opium/heroin trade and to provide bases for feeding its destabalising terrorists (newly arrived from Syria) into Central Asia and Iran.

Savorywill
Savorywill
Jul 20, 2019 7:56 AM
Reply to  Antipropo

Actually, it wasn’t a typo. I got it mixed up with the Libyan war, I guess, which was 2011. Or maybe, I just couldn’t imagine that a war in modern times could go on for so long, almost like the 20 years war I read about in history class (or was it the 50 years war)? Those were the days when men in different colored uniforms lined up on fields and shot one another, mercifully, in most cases, sparing those not wearing uniforms, signifying non-combatants.

Antipropo
Antipropo
Jul 20, 2019 9:02 AM
Reply to  Savorywill

I like your response,on the matter of civilian to military casualties I read somewhere and now can’t remember the exact statistics but it’s telling. In WW1, 90/10 military to civilian, by WW2 it’s around 50/50, by Vietnam war its 20/80,now it’s around 10/90. This with supposedly super accurate weapons with satellite imagery that can detect that the targeted person is wearing a false beard, etc yet mysteriously school buses and produce markets, passenger trains and hospitals, churches and mosques keep getting in the way. The Germans called the bomber people terror flyers-think Dresden and Hamburg fire bombings where tens of thousands were incinerated. Before Hiroshima and Nagasaki many Japanese cities were extensively and repeatedly fire bombed. That utter shit, mr “bomb bomb bomb bomb Iran” was bombing civilian targets in Hanoi when shot down.

Mikalina
Mikalina
Jul 20, 2019 12:35 PM
Reply to  Antipropo

The ghosts of Dresden can be seen
Climbing carefully over the bricks and beams
Taking time and trouble
to call through the rubble
To the ‘folks’ of Mosul
Buried beneath.

“You must come out now,
you’re dead, you see.
I know, because once
it happened to me.”

Slowly, they rose and believe what they saw
Their city, their lives, their children, no more.
And Dresden ghosts and Mosul ghosts
Look to the deadly sky
And 75 years later, no-one asks why.

I call it “Squashed”.

milosevic
milosevic
Jul 21, 2019 9:23 AM
Reply to  Savorywill

almost like the 20 years war I read about in history class, or was it the 50 years war?

why limit your ambitions? go big, or go home.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hundred_Years_War

cirsium
cirsium
Jul 19, 2019 11:56 PM
DunGroanin
DunGroanin
Jul 19, 2019 11:41 PM

Well one of the ships has been ‘released’ and sent on its way with a warning to not do it again.

The other one, has been claimed to have made 3 violations. Is being held. Of its crewe, 3 are apparently Russian, who apparently have been notified of that.

I am going to need a bigger boat full of popcorn.

Moon of Alabama and Sputnik are my citations for the above … way ahead of the msm we are getting here or Hunts tweets

John G
John G
Jul 19, 2019 11:28 PM

And how does the Epstein arrest play into it?

JudyJ
JudyJ
Jul 19, 2019 11:22 PM

Editors note: Not an expert, but fairly sure under international law the UK has no right to enforce these sanctions. Iran and Syria are sovereign nations with every right to engage in bilateral trade.

Hoorah! At last someone else has made this point. I wrote this on another blog two weeks ago but seemingly no one on that blog felt this rather fundamental point was worthy of any further discussion. It made me wonder if I was missing something.

I had found it unbelievable that the msm and politicians alike were all blithely stating that the Iranian tanker had been seized “because it wasn’t in compliance with EU sanctions” yet nowhere could I find any reference to the precise form of these supposed sanctions. I knew from my many years working as a civil servant implementing EU trade legislation that there was no way that the EU had any jurisdiction over trade between non-EU countries so this justification for the seizure really puzzled me.

I found an article on al Jazeera which quoted a UK spokesperson as saying that the tanker had been seized in accordance with EU Council Regulation 36/2012.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2019/07/iran-demands-uk-release-syria-bound-oil-tanker-held-gibraltar-190705065000381.html

So I looked at Council Regulation 36/2012 (sanctions applicable to Syria) and found that Article 6 is the section relating to crude oil in the context of Syria. The restrictions therein are addressed to EU MEMBER STATES and state that it shall be prohibited to import, purchase or transport oil originating FROM Syria or being exported FROM Syria. And that’s all it says. As I had thought, unless anyone can prove to me otherwise by quoting chapter and verse, the EU has no right to impose any restrictions on Syria’s non-EU economic activities. It’s absolutely unbelievable that the UK can even argue that their actions are supported by law and even more unbelievable that the EU themselves haven’t pointed out that this is not so, or that nobody in the msm has asked for clarification.

https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/GA/TXT/?uri=CELEX:32012R0036

mark
mark
Jul 20, 2019 1:33 AM
Reply to  JudyJ

It’s like Iran issuing a decree that the EU is not allowed to import oil from Saudi Arabia.

JudyJ
JudyJ
Jul 20, 2019 9:08 AM
Reply to  mark

Exactly, Mark. Or, post-Brexit, the EU declaring that bilateral UK/US trade is not allowed. Can you imagine the reaction?! The EU/US joint activities in determining who can and cannot trade with each other throughout the world – which is what we are effectively talking about here – rather makes the UN redundant and there appears to be complete silence on the matters from the UN. Those who stay silent are endorsing the US’s deluded and psychotic belief that it is legitimately entitled to be the ‘Flashman’ to the ‘Tom Brown’s’ of the world. It is clear to me that even the UN/EU are victims of Flashman.

David Macilwain
David Macilwain
Jul 20, 2019 3:07 AM
Reply to  JudyJ

Thanks Judy – and surely not only does Iran know this, but of course the UK knows it also; it’s a ruse which was the pretext for the staged “attempt to hijack the British Heritage” a week later. This was amply exposed as a fraud directed straight at Western media audiences, as the tanker was EMPTY. It’s not even clear that IRGC boats approached the tanker.
Personally I believe that the UK is at least an equal partner in this trickery and military brinkmanship, with both the US and Israel. If you look at its role in the Skripal operation, instigated and presented exclusively by the GCHQ-BBC coalition while the CIA and Mossad looked on – though with a little assistance from the Dutch, …. I think this is all connected.
And if they would just stop making more provocations I could finish the article I’m writing on it.. Meanwhile I just heard that the Cobra committee is meeting, and Hunt says that interference in freedom of navigation is unnacceptable – even when it is hostile foreign military powers sailing through your backyard! Remember the Russian carrier in the channel, buzzed by RAF jets? Did the Russians shoot them down? What’s the difference?

Meanwhile here in OZ we brace ourselves for the announcement that we have already sent more forces to the Persian Gulf, with no oversight, nor even protest from any side of parliament, media or commentators.

Gezzah Potts
Gezzah Potts
Jul 20, 2019 12:44 PM

Your comment is the first I’ve heard about Aussie sending more forces to the Persian Gulf, no doubt playing its role as the dutiful little vassal following orders. I peruse the headlines of ABC when I get up in the morning, but apart from that, now avoid Oz media like you’d avoid a dog with rabies. Labor will gleefully support this also, getting their pat on the head from Washington. A few Greens may put out a statement, but that’ll be it. Australia is not an independent sovereign nation. It follows orders. Its part of the Anglo Zionist Empire. In my opinion, most here couldn’t give a flying fig as long as they can still go shopping, go on their overseas holidays, and enjoy their creature comforts at home while going into debt to maintain their ‘lifestyle’. Australia is so different to when I first lived here from 1985 – 1994. So different.

David Macilwain
David Macilwain
Jul 20, 2019 1:01 PM
Reply to  Gezzah Potts

It wasn’t exactly what I meant Gezzah – but what I believe will happen, and quite possibly already has! What I DID hear a few days ago however, was the Australia has just “expanded its commitment” to support the “coalition in Syria” with its surveillance plane and tanker – that have been there since we pulled out the fighter jets in 2017. I don’t suppose they’ve been just sitting on the tarmac in Minhad or Al Udeid. It was also announced around Wed that the defence minister and ex Raytheon employee Linda Reynolds was visiting Iraq and Afghanistan, for some reason.
In that old Aussie vernacular, we are like mushrooms – kept in the dark and fed on horse-shit!

Gezzah Potts
Gezzah Potts
Jul 21, 2019 12:49 AM

Thanks for the clarification David. Yes, Aussie will send more forces to the Persian Gulf – you can put your house on it happening. After all, we are part of the ‘international rules based community’. Cough. The mind boggling hypocrisy is such, I can barely find words to describe it…. Sigh. Keep prodding and provoking Iran, keep supporting the MEK terrorist cult, keep sticking the knife in with more and more sanctions, and sooner or later it will all blow up in the West’s face. The old adage: you reap what you sow….

Mikalina
Mikalina
Jul 21, 2019 1:56 PM
Reply to  Gezzah Potts

Meanwhile, Gazza, the Chinese are coming through your back door and nicking the family silver……

Ramdan
Ramdan
Jul 20, 2019 1:54 PM
Reply to  JudyJ

Irony, cynicism…. isn’t UK fighting to LEAVE the EU??…why to bother “enforcing” things of something you do not even consider yourself part of…????

JudyJ
JudyJ
Jul 20, 2019 6:50 PM
Reply to  Ramdan

Ramdan

True enough in principle…but the reality is that the UK is doing nothing but acting on the orders of its controller across the Atlantic on the pretext of enforcing the non-existent EU sanctions.

Chris Tye
Chris Tye
Jul 30, 2019 10:30 AM
Reply to  JudyJ

” EU Restrictive Measures in Syria – FAQs – SCOPE OF APPLICATION (JURISDICTION) Who needs to comply with the Regulation? (Article 35 of the Regulation)
EU restrictive measures apply in situations where links exist with the European Union (“EU”). The application of the Regulation is defined in Article 35 of the Regulation. It applies:
(a) within the territory of the Union, including its airspace” – i.e. the tanker entered Gibraltan territorial waters from what I understand.

JudyJ
JudyJ
Jul 30, 2019 8:33 PM
Reply to  Chris Tye

Chris

Thanks for pointing out this reference. Although clause (a) of Article 35 states that the Regulation shall apply “…within the territory of the Union, including its airspace” it must only be read in conjunction with all the other Articles in the regulation and not distinct from them. So , in the case of Syria/oil, the provisions of Article 6 are only applicable in the situations described in Article 35. A court would have to decide first and foremost whether it was believed that the sanctions in Article 6 had been breached – consideration of that decision would include an identification of which of the sub-clauses in Article 35 applied. In the case of the seized Grace 1, the provisions of Article 6 do not apply to the consignment of oil; the fact that it was seized in the territorial waters of Gibraltar is therefore immaterial.

Judge mental
Judge mental
Jul 19, 2019 11:00 PM

No change here then….dick waving on both sides🤔

Tim Jenkins
Tim Jenkins
Jul 21, 2019 3:58 PM
Reply to  Judge mental

What did you expect ?

With Dick Cheney – Prime mover & shaker of fellow ‘Dicks’ all over the globe,
who needs enemies ? Just Genie Energy Oil & Gas, with James Woolsey, Rupert Murdoch & d’Rothschilds, pulling a few jolly rogers of convenience for smoke & mirrors on matters most pressing in the UK … where chaos rules.

Clearly politicians profit from corporate fascism & instil further false spheres of fears & rule ruthlessly meanwhile over their own, as mercenary mothers of Zion’s scheme for ‘Chaos & Social forces’ is propagated, by tuning societal swarming: with systematic absurd notions of a budget for national security, reliant upon fear, false pride and of course Apartheid . . .
tied to debt-bondage & masochism ?

Nope, no change here.

Most seem to be still struggling with opening a dictionary or doing even a preliminary search on the meaning of the word ‘Semite’ … let alone considering what are the legal implications & ramifications of Binney & Weibe’s whistleblowing on …

“Parllel Platforms”

or the fact that alien forces can actually ‘Fake Text’ from them, then take control of their gas pedal, indeed all controls on many new cars of today …
somebody should open their windows/eyes 😉

mark
mark
Jul 19, 2019 10:43 PM

Iran can either sit back and allow itself to be slowly strangled like Iraq, and watch their children starving and dying for lack of basic medicine, or strike back proactively and inflict some real pain on its own account.

The Jews have issued instructions to their stooge goys in Washington and London to start another kosher war for Talmudistan, so that’s what’s has happened. These whores always do as they’re told by their Zionist masters. They have been escalating step by step as instructed leading inevitably towards war. Economic strangulation is an act of war. Seizing the tanker off Gibraltar is an act of war. Conducting cyber warfare against Iran is an act of war. Sponsoring MEK terror against Iran is an act of war. Not that they have been particularly coy or surreptitious about this. There have been threats to “obliterate” Iran both from the Kosher Folk themselves and the Jewnited Snakes virtually on a daily basis for the past 20 years.

Trying to pretend otherwise or spout hot air about “diplomacy” or “restraint” is an exercise in futility. You don’t wait for a rattlesnake to strike. It’s not a question of if there will be a war, the war has already begun. It actually began quite a while ago. That’s the reality of it. We have been dragged into another shooting war on behalf of Talmudistan. What was once a world power is now a flea on the back of a bigger flea serving Zionist interests. Get used to it. This is the biggie. Iraq was the Friday night fracas outside the kebab shop.

Do the Neocohens want a new war?
Is the US upping the tensions?
Is the UK doing what the US (Talmudistan) tells it?

Is the Pope Catholic?
Does river water flow downstream?
Do bears sh*t in the woods?

Let’s all give the Kosher Folk three rousing cheers for getting us into yet another war.

Peugeot
Peugeot
Jul 20, 2019 7:58 AM
Reply to  mark

I disagree, the warmongering yanks only attack a country that it knows can’t fight back, Iran has already said if it kicks off, Israel is the first to go, and the yanks and the UK lapdogs will back off, the only problem we will have is when the Oaf ,hairy arse Johnson gets behind the wheel.

mark
mark
Jul 20, 2019 6:11 PM
Reply to  Peugeot

They’re sand niggers! We’re Muricans! We’re exceptional!! We’re indispensable!!! The sun shines out of our assholes!!!!

lynette chaplin
lynette chaplin
Jul 19, 2019 10:39 PM

I like to think that Iran’s astuteness is out witting the bully boys.

Andy
Andy
Jul 19, 2019 10:10 PM

US- Saddam, get rid of your WMDs….Saddam- Why?…. US- because then we’ll stop all sanctions and we can all be friends….Saddam- ok….US- are they all gone…..Saddam- yes it is all good, now we can be friends again…..US- evil laughter!…………………..hey Iran.

Furnace
Furnace
Jul 19, 2019 9:56 PM

Well, point #3 can be discounted. When are Neocons ever satisfied with just sanctions?

mark
mark
Jul 21, 2019 1:36 AM
Reply to  Furnace

“Sanctions” are always just a prelude to war.