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WATCH: 9/11 Whistleblowers

“But someone would have talked,” say the self-styled skeptics who believe the government’s official conspiracy theory of 9/11. But there’s a problem with this logically fallacious non-argument. “Someone” did talk.

In fact, numerous people have come out to blow the whistle on the events of September 11, 2001, and the cover-up that surrounds those events.

These are the stories of the 9/11 Whistleblowers.

To download this video, or for the audio-only version click here. For a full transcript and links to sources, click here. Please share widely.
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Petra Liverani

Answering vexarb’s comment here cos getting too narrow
———————
Petra, you really ought to consult a clinical psychiatrist instead of engaging in endless altercations — like a child who won’t admit she has lost a game of draughts.

You ask, #1: Do I believe that actors or people otherwise in on the 9/11 psyop were present at the WTC on 9/11?

My answer, No they were not. For instance Larry Silverstein did not turn up at the office, first time ever. Israel shipping company ZIM vacated their office at a financial loss. And there is e-talk of many dual-citizen Israeli-NewYorkers getting emails not to turn up on the day.

You then ask: If not, why not?
I answer, Because they did not want to die.

You ask, #2: Do I believe that people involved in the psyop would have been able to avoid being exposed to the dust covering the WTC? If yes, how?
I answer, mainly by not turning up that day. But also by not being New Yorkers eg, Cheney, Bush, Rumsfeld, Wolfie and the rest of the Washington conspirators. And above all, by not being fire fighters or helpers.

Here is a question for you, Petra: What is better than presence of mind in a dangerous situation?
Answer: Absence of body.

“And when the crime’s discovered, MacAvity’s not there” — TS Eliot, Practical Cats.
—————————
vexarb, I did have a chuckle. They TOLD us Larry had a dermatology appointment and they TOLD us about e-talk – truther-targeted propaganda. Course Larry wasn’t there but then we really do have to wonder who exactly was in the buildings, don’t we? I wasn’t thinking of people like Larry more like the people on the ground, agency response staff and media. Perhaps you think none of them were in the know? You think just a few at the top managed to pull all the strings without knowing collaborators on the ground?

Conversation between Brian Williams, MSNBC News Anchor and David Restuccio, FDNY EMS Lieutenant about WTC-7, the third building to collapse at the WTC on 9/11, after its collapse:
“Can you confirm that it was No 7 that just went in?” [“Went in” is a term used in controlled demolition that comes from the fact that the buildings fall in on themselves.]
“Yes, sir.”
“And you guys knew this was comin’ all day.”
“We had heard reports that the building was unstable and that eventually it would either come down on its own or it would be taken down.”

The cubic volume of WTC-7 was 4.5 times less than that of the combined twin towers but we don’t see about 20% of the dust. If you compare images of the dust around the twin towers to that around WTC-7 it is far greater than 5 times more. Demolitions are about cutting supports not about pulverising concrete and the dust is like powder – it’s much finer than you’d expect from demolition. It is very obvious when you see all the people covered in dust and the two or three inches covering lower Manhattan that the dust is not simply a result of the demolitions.

Editor:
Petra, Steve De’ak looks like a con artist selling intentionally ridiculous claims about 9/11 in order to discredit the Truth movement. The WTC buildings were not empty tubes filled with fake dust. Several people on this page have patiently explained that to you. Please don’t fill these threads with evidentially nul, physically impossible and basically insane claims. Open discussion is one thing, but please at least respect basic rational thinking and the laws of physics

flaxgirl

Editor, I have not looked closely at the claims of any gutting of the buildings, however, I think the evidence shows clearly that dust was stored in the buildings regardless and used for a multiplicity of purposes. As I say, the cubic volume of WTC-7 was about 20% of that of the combined twin towers and it doesn’t look as if 20% of the dust was produced in its demolition. As I also say, demolition is about cutting supports not pulverising concrete – that is wasted energy.

Regardless of the size of the towers why would we see so much dust of a powder-type nature covering the surrounding area?

http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/evidence/dust.html

The dust settled to a depth of 3 inches in locations as far as six blocks from the World Trade Center.

Can you point to a single other demolition where you see a layer of dust of any depth let alone two or three inches of dust stretching as far as six blocks?

If you watch these demolitions you will see the clouds emanating as the buildings come down do not go very far. Also, while it may seem that the clouds are dust clouds I believe the cauliflower shape of the clouds indicates that they are pyroclastic clouds of gases from the explosives similar to those from volcanic eruptions. They may not contain as much dust as they seem to but in any case there is no sense of any kind of inches-thick layer of dust settling to extend far and wide.

Please try to think in terms of logic and reason as well as evidence. We can see that there would be a number of reasons the perps might want to use planted dust – a motive does not prove anything, of course, but it helps support what seems to be compelling evidence.

axisofoil
axisofoil

Just to recall 2 past whistle blower Generals. They were the experts in this field. It was their job. Remember how they were ignored. They spoke up anyway. They stood for the people. They discovered as we have, that the lives of ‘we the people’ are of no significance to our owners unless doing their bidding.

Major general on 9/11
https://youtu.be/T2XV3Edd2dc

USAF Brig. General on OK City bombing
https://youtu.be/VR4Iyo9mhy0

RobG

In the hall of mirrors we live in it will probably be a long time – if ever – before we find out what really happened on 9/11.

I think the important thing is to stop squabbling about how it was done, but to just generally acknowledge that ‘something was done’ and the official explanation is a crock of whatsis. That way the ‘9/11 was an inside job’ might start getting into a far wider public consciousness; and who knows, we might even get a proper enquiry into it all.

vexarb
vexarb

Hey, Kids, is this video about science, technology, health, psychology, politics, environment; or is it, as Kevin Ryan whistleblew: “about what sort of world we want to live in”? You decide.

“Let me ask you a political question: Will you marry me?” — Fiddler on the Roof

Cesca
Cesca

I seriously respect James Corbett’s work, he has done so much to help cut thru the disinfo we’re fed in the MSM, the vid shown here by OffG is one of his best.

What surprises me is that 7/7 doesn’t get as much as attention as 9/11. Very similar M.O. for both, main suspects connected to the Intelligence Services, similar security exercises being staged at the same time, even the same places in 7/7, inoperative security cameras, ppl being warned in advance etc. Also, the investigation for 7/7 is just as iffy as that of 9/11.

Operation Gladio never stopped, these abominations are meant to shock and scare us so much we’ll plead for the lunatics to take over the asylum.

TFS
TFS

7/7 Truth website

http://julyseventh.co.uk/

RobG

I have a big problem with Corbett, in that he has always refused to see Fukushima for what it is; ie, probably the biggest manmade disaster in history. I’m sure Corbett will enjoy the 2020 Tokyo Olympics (you-couldn’t-make-it-up).

The so-called ‘alternate media’ is just as infiltrated and corrupted as the mainstream media. Be very wary of alternate media bods who have unlimited funds and put out slick productions.

ps. as far as I’m aware, nothing Corbett says about 9/11 is radical or particularly new. The spooks know that all this stuff is already out there, and in my opinion the likes of Corbett repeat it in order to give themselves credibility.

Petra Liverani

… or he could be one himself, no? One should always be very circumspect about “whistleblowers”. They make great disinformation agents. And as a YouTuber says with regard to ex-CIA agents: “There is no ex. There is no ex-CIA.” Whistleblowers and ex-CIA agents – perfect cover for disinformation agents. We must also, as you indicate, always bear in mind that the perps are willing to push out heaps of truth … only to cover important lies … although to give them their due … they always tell us the truth extra to propagandistic purposes with their signs – the popped out nose cone, the melting-into-buildings-planes, the popped-up alive terrorists, the perfect implosion of WTC-7 completely unnecessary for their TERROR story.

milosevic
milosevic

perfect cover for disinformation agents

Do tell.

Petra Liverani

I won’t stick my neck out on 9/11 – just to say there’s wall-to-wall controlled opposition as is only to be expected … but sometimes it’s hard to tell the pros from the useful idiots.

Wikileaks whistleblower disinfo agent – Chelsea Manning
https://occamsrazorterrorevents.weebly.com/wikileaks-controlled-opposition.html

Australian military whistleblower disinfo agent – David McBride
https://www.michaelwest.com.au/afp-raids-and-prosecution-of-whistleblowers-sparks-global-condemnation/#comment-4521235249

PSJ
PSJ

Petra, while you’re touting videos claiming the WTCs were pumped full of thousands of tonnes of fake dust and nine-foot high mannequins were being thrown out the windows by persons unknown – does it ever cross your mind that you just might be one of those useful idiots?

Petra Liverani

So PSJ, hypothetically, do you not think packing the towers with dust a genius idea for the psyop? I have to say I do. It would achieve all the following and no doubt even more. What do you think hypothetically? You like hypothesizing, don’t you?

The dust had a multiplicity of functions including (but I’m sure not limited to):
— make the collapses more spectacular
— make controlled demolition less obvious
— make WTC look like a warzone, enhancing the sense of enormity and terror of the event
— provide distraction in the form of Judy Woods’, “Where did the towers go?”, nonsense
— provide distraction and to entrench the sense of evilness of the perpetrators making real death and injury more plausible in the alleged deaths of first responders and others due to illness caused by the “toxic dust”
— provide the “handfuls of dust containing human remains” propaganda

vexarb
vexarb

Petra, no need to _add_ dust: there is always enough coming from pulverized concrete. See videos of normal, run-of-the-mill controlled demolitions. WTC was dustier than usual because it is (was) bigger than usual, and needed more explosive than usual. Also those old towers contained a lot of fine asbestos fibre.

“King Pompey, the Emperor’s ape,
Shuddering black in his temporal cape
Of dust, said: “The dust is everywhere:
Indianopolis and the Acropolis …” — Edith Sitwell

Petra Liverani

I will get back to you on whether dust was added or not, vexarb, however I think the de-asbestosising bill was propaganda to reinforce the callousness of the perps. They wouldn’t do something so injurious to health. That would be crazy. Those involved would have been at the WTC themselves. Either there never was asbestos – I think the far likelier possibility – or they removed it. What was the alleged quote for? 1 billion? Think they might be pulling out legs there? There is so much to suggest they knew when they built those buildings they were going to bring them down.

vexarb
vexarb

Petra: “They wouldn’t do something so injurious to health”.

Dear Petra / Flaxgirl,
We all like you and admire your intelligence but please, please take Admin’s advice and consult a psychiatrist, or at least a therapist. Your tender heart forces your mind to look away (and lock away) from some aspects of reality. Psychiatrists call it “being in denial”; I know because I suffer from that syndrome myself. The tendency is not incapacitating as long as one is aware and keeps it in check.
With very best wishes.

Petra Liverani

Vexarb, Apologies. I’ve expressed myself imperfectly. I think the perps are perfectly capable of extreme callousness. When I say they wouldn’t do something so injurious to health I don’t mean it from the standpoint of any delicacy of feeling, I mean it would be stupid because they are so obviously guilty of the psyop and we can only infer that all that asbestos showered everywhere could result in numerous cases of disease rather than the the modest number that seem to have a “profile”. Just as the number of people jumping up and down about the government murdering their loved ones seems vastly incommensurate with the number you’d expect from the deaths of 3,000 people, the number of those jumping up and down suffering from the dust-related problems also seems vastly incommensurate with the number you’d expect.

Also, similarly to Admin, you miss an important reason I proffer: some of those involved in the psyop would be at the WTC and dust does not discriminate in its target. Do you agree, vexarb, that those involved in the psyop did not exist in a protective bubble at the WTC and thus would not have been able to avoid contamination by asbestos-contaminated dust should any have been showered down?

Petra Liverani

In terms of commensurate it is really quite hard to judge. All I will say is that I have a sense of these people having a “profile”. I’d probably expect class actions. I’d expect lots of legal things to be going on and not just the single “Lawyers’ Committee” we’ve been told about. In 1666 they set up a committee to investigate the cause of the fire a few weeks after it occurred and in 2002 they set up a 9/11 Commission. Now we have a Lawyers’ Committee.

Petra Liverani

Edited to remove link-spamming

Case for deaths for dust being a lie.
— They lied about death and injury and we can tell that part of the propaganda strategy targeted at truthers is to make us believe that the perps are very evil and will stop at nothing so there is no special reason to believe their stories of people dying agonising deaths from toxic dust.
— People involved in the psyop were at the WTC. Dust does not discriminate so it makes no sense for toxic dust to be showered down on those involved in the operation as well as those not involved.
— They told us Janette McKinlay died from dust-related illness, however, we can infer that Janette McKinlay is/was a disinformation agent because she said that she saved a handful of dust and that human remains were found in it but the evidence favours death and injury being staged.

You need to have a base of knowledge and understanding to build on when you judge things, Admin. You don’t seem to have built yourself any kind of knowledge base or comprehension of the nature of the event that was 9/11. You do not seem to see how it fits on a continuum dating from at least 1666, as shown by Gloria Moss’s recent article. You seem to accept without question and become highly-emotionally invested in any old narrative fed to you. Being emotionally invested in stories is not the appropriate mindset to analyse 9/11. Detachment is key. Can you please identify what lies you think have been told about 9/11 from the perps’ side?

What do you consider your contribution to the understanding of 9/11, if any, and how has your understanding evolved over the time you started to study it? I have a website on which is quite a lot of evidence-based analysis of 9/11 and other staged events. My understanding has evolved considerably in the 5 years I’ve studied it and other staged events.

Petra Liverani

So not censorship exactly but editorialising of comments. That’s interesting. And editorialising with false reason. I did not link to my challenge, Editor, but to my EVIDENCE. Not challenge.

At my link which I will repeat here and ask you not to editorialise are the 10 points I provide to support death and injury staged.

So far, Editor, you have not provided a single point to support that death and injury were real.

Not.a.single.point.

https://occamsrazorterrorevents.weebly.com/3000-dead-and-6000-injured-a-lie.html

Petra Liverani

You may assert that I linked to my challenge but I remember linking to the evidence.

Relevant citations from your links? I don’t know what you mean. I say there are 10 points favouring staged death and injury on that page and I give links where appropriate. I’m not sure what else I should do.

I don’t hold what you hold as good evidence of high value, Editor, because you display that you don’t use reason and logic well. Your understanding of 9/11 or staged events in general shows no signs of evolving. I wouldn’t be in the least surprised if all you feel you know to be true is that the buildings collapsed by controlled demolition – which is, of course, the level of knowledge the perps want you to stay at.

Planes don’t melt into buildings but perhaps you think that Newtonian physics was broken on 9/11? So if planes don’t melt into buildings we know right off the bat that 265 people did not die in plane crashes.

The perpetrators give us the signs and this is evidenced all over the place. I have a page on 10 of them but there are scores, if not hundreds more. It’s even got a name: “revelation of the method”. But if you never take this highly evident fact on board then you can’t use it in your analysis. You’re not working with a full tool set.

So while to you only the anomalous death records work as evidence other things work as evidence too. The doctored photos of Bob and Bobby, for example.

I provide three items that support jumpers being fake:
— the smoke looks as if it’s being pumped at regular intervals from where the alleged jumpers are jumping
— there is a dead body and I describe how it looks fake – can you describe how it looks real?
— the photographer who allegedly photographed the falling man happened to be behind Robert Kennedy when he was assassinated. You believe that?

But the thing is, Editor, you are under as much obligation as I am to provide evidence. If anything, if they lied about the buildings and the planes then isn’t it far more likely that they lied about death and injury than not … and, in fact, we know they did because no one died in plane crashes. There is no default in relation to 9/11. No default.

You may not accept my 10 points but the fact is that you have not even provided for consideration a single piece of evidence to support real death and injury.

Not.a.single.piece.

What I wonder is: why do you believe that 3,000 people died and 6,000 were injured on 9/11? Why do you believe it? I mean the PERPS are the ones telling you this alleged fact. Why do you believe them on this alleged fact but not on others.

Petra Liverani

Just to add, vexarb, while Admin’s comment to me was full of sound and fury, its validity is not at all commensurate with its vehemence. In response to their outrage at my claim that death and injury were staged I merely asked for a single piece of evidence that supports they were real with a link to my 10 points supporting staged. No response, as usual. Where is the validity of this outrage? And where is the validity of the suggestion I seek some kind of help. Surely, it is people who have no evidence to back their passionately-supported beliefs who are the ones needing help.

vexarb
vexarb

Dear Petra,
Far from being “full of sound and fury” Admin went out of their way to praise a contribution of yours. But unwillingness to acknowledge that thousands of New Yorkers died and continue to die because of 911, or to acknowledge that dust is a normal byproduct of controlled demolition: these are signals that Admin was rightly alarmed to warn you about. The psychiatric term is “being in denial”. A clinical psychologist might help you to avoid getting entangled in lengthy altercations. There are therapeutic methods that strengthen the faculty for objectivity and “reality testing”; the exercises include board games conducted in a friendly manner but with rules (as opposed to creative play or free association).
With best wishes.

Petra Liverani

Vexarb,
Questions:

— Do you believe that actors or people otherwise in on the 9/11 psyop were present at the WTC on 9/11? If not, why not?

— Do you believe that people involved in the psyop would have been able to avoid being exposed to the dust covering the WTC? If yes, how?

— In view of the fact that people in on the psyop were at WTC do you believe that toxic dust would have been showered on these people regardless?

— Do you believe that it is preposterous to suggest that the stories of people dying agonising deaths from toxic dust is propaganda of a “controlled opposition” kind? If so, why?

vexarb
vexarb

Petra, you really ought to consult a clinical psychiatrist instead of engaging in endless altercations — like a child who won’t admit she has lost a game of draughts.

You ask, #1: Do I believe that actors or people otherwise in on the 9/11 psyop were present at the WTC on 9/11?

My answer, No they were not. For instance Larry Silverstein did not turn up at the office, first time ever. Israel shipping company ZIM vacated their office at a financial loss. And there is e-talk of many dual-citizen Israeli-NewYorkers getting emails not to turn up on the day.

You then ask: If not, why not?
I answer, Because they did not want to die.

You ask, #2: Do I believe that people involved in the psyop would have been able to avoid being exposed to the dust covering the WTC? If yes, how?
I answer, mainly by not turning up that day. But also by not being New Yorkers eg, Cheney, Bush, Rumsfeld, Wolfie and the rest of the Washington conspirators. And above all, by not being fire fighters or helpers.

Here is a question for you, Petra: What is better than presence of mind in a dangerous situation?
Answer: Absence of body.

“And when the crime’s discovered, MacAvity’s not there” — TS Eliot, Practical Cats.

PSJ
PSJ

Petra — The hypothesis you’re presenting is that the WTC towers were essentially fake buildings with no poured concrete above lobby height. This assumed absence is then used as a basis for believing the massive amounts of dust generated by the implosions was not pulverised WTC concrete but ‘fake’ dust introduced by the perps.

This hypothesis is presented without data and is fundamentally implausible.

1. I simply don’t have any idea how one would possibly go about ‘packing’ two 100-floor buildings with dust even supposing you wanted to and had limitless resources. We’re talking upwards of 1,000 tonnes of material. How would it be remotely achievable?

2. The claim on the website you link to that the towers had no concrete or fixtures or furnishing in them beyond the lobby is refuted by the fact the towers are known to have been functional buildings with numerous tenants. If it’s to be alleged these data are fake then some evidence for this needs to be adduced. Currently none is presented.

Frankly this looks like Judy Wood’s nonsense taken to the next level of absurdity.

milosevic
milosevic

does it ever cross your mind that you just might be one of those useful idiots?

Well, better a useful idiot than a useless idiot — there’s not much of a market for those.

Petra Liverani

I thought of another reason for the dust, PSJ. I knew there’d be at least one more. Makes it easier to get all those poor traumatised people looking as if they were there at the time, doesn’t it? They could film all these people covered in flour or whatever at some other time (a bit inconvenient on the day) so the dust works its magic by making the people look like they fit right in to the WTC-covered-in-dust scene.

Remember this woman? She had me totally fooled – not saying she was in on it. For all I know, she may have believed she was participating in some random drill but no doubt she had signed a tight confidentiality clause. It’s pretty hilarious watching the witness testimony now that I know better. Pretty hilarious.

I do owe you some thanks, PSJ. I think your challenging me on the planes helped refine my thoughts to realise that the planes are where truthers should focus. It’s a much more direct line to the key truth of staged death and injury.

Start with planes:
Fake planes ergo no building collapses by fire and ergo 265 faked deaths … not so far to go to complete staged death and injury, no?

Start with buildings:
Planes might still be real, death and injury might still be real … for those who have no clue about how psyops are conducted and think the US government would use real planes and kill all those people in such a cold-blooded and callous way when controlled demolition is so obvious.

They’ve got us all running round like headless chickens, haven’t they, over the buildings? Hats off!

Muchas gracias!

Ramdan
Ramdan

Another MUST SEE!

different frank
different frank

So off topic.
The documentary about Attica is now watchable.

Thomas Murphy

Contrary to what they assumed, there were signs of bowing and sagging in the towers well before the collapse Facts “9/11 Skeptics” don’t want you to see: REAL 911 Truth

axisofoil
axisofoil

What has that got to do with the remaining 99.999999999999999999999% of the facts?
You have put a whole new absurdly restrictive focus on tunnel vision. You apparently have a logic issue. Why are you doing this?

Cesca
Cesca

What the hell does a li’l external damage have to do with the structural integrity of the buildings Tom? The internal core is what supports such buildings, they can take loadsa external damage yet ppl still be totally safe inside.

Ken
Ken

Doesn’t matter one little bit about any bowing or sagging; the fires, North Tower debris strikes and whatever else you’d care to throw in caused asymmetrical damage and therefore could not have caused the core columns to all fail instantaneously, completely, and near simultaneously as would be required for the observed global collapse. Jesus God, don’t they teach elementary physics in schools any more?

Thomas Murphy

When you point out facts Kevin Ryan blocks you. I explained that: Controlled demolitions aren’t done by setting off explosives an hour before the building is to come down. & it was a top-down collapse so your argument about lobby & basement level explosives is dumb. Why are you tweeting this crap?


And Kevin Ryan blocked me.
Contrary to what Kevin Ryan assumed, there were signs of bowing and sagging in the towers well before the collapse: https://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1sqf1se

Jesse Da Silva
Jesse Da Silva

While we can argue all day about whether your pictures actually show evidence of sagging, I’m wondering if you actually watched the whistleblower video before dismissing it as “trash” out of hand? If you watched it you would see that there are two eye witnesses whose accounts of the events that day clearly contradict the official conspiracy theory, as well as a few officials who had first hand experience of other government officials lying and/or covering up information what would contradict the official conspiracy theory. Ofcourse I’m sure you’ll have a bunch of Olympic level verbal gymnastics to get around all of that as well.

axisofoil
axisofoil

Are you serious?

wardropper
wardropper

It’s okay. He can’t be.
There is no “evidence” of sagging at all, and I have good eyesight, as well as being very familiar with the idea of “See what you see, not what you are supposed to see.”…

Harry Stotle
Harry Stotle

Key points.

The official 9/11 conspiracy theory lacks even the tiniest shred of credibility, be it events purported to have taken place at the WTC, Shanksville or the Pentagon – it amazes how anyone is daft enough to believe a word of it, unless they are either too afraid or too dim to question those who rule over them.

Key evidence was wilfully destroyed by the authorities, presumably with the intention of subverting any subsequent investigation.

So far there has never been any enquiry not tainted by those who initiate them – it seems pretty obvious that asking neocons to investigate their own crime is akin to asking a corrupt white sheriff in the deep south to investigate the suspicious death of a black man while in police custody.

But most importantly this post is about media lies regarding whistleblowers: the media pretend there aren’t whistleblowers when in fact there are – they just ignore them as they do virtually all other facts that contradict the fantasy created by George Bush and his criminal accomplices.

Needless to say when whistleblowers do come forward it is usually at great personal cost to themselves while suffering the double whammy of being sneered at by internet commentators.

Personally I think most of this is pretty straightforward but some individuals still seem to lack sufficient comprehension problems to see the wider picture.

TFS
TFS

Er, they possibly could both be true

1. People (Firefighters etc ) did hear explosions going off at the basement and sub basement level in WTC1&2.
2. Barry Jennings clearly was aware of explosions going off in WTC7 basement prior to callapsing in a controlled demolition type manner.
2. Say What You See.

WTC1&2. Didn’t Collapse as in a normal contolled demolition. WTC1&2 exploded floor by floor, top to bottom.

WTC7, collapsed more like a controlled demolition.

vexarb
vexarb

TFS, you are right, WTC1&2 ‘exploded floor by floor, top to bottom.’ The detonations were bviously synced to disintegrate from top (where the planes hit) downwards — to fit with the Official Report (drafted by the extremely influential Senator who Chaired the Official Commitee).

Explosions in all 3 basements may be standard practice in demolition: take out some of the foundation pillars. Kevin Ryan’s previous article has a Link (if I remember rightly) where some engineer had actually inspected a previous, much older, explosion in the basement of one of the WTC towers; he was amazed at the strength of the design: still standing even though that explosion had taken out some of the basement pillars (presumably those particular pillars on that particular WTC tower had been repaired before 911; but the incident attests to the fact that the WTC towers were over-designed rather than under-designed for safety.

wardropper
wardropper

A fine video. It avoids the common pitfall of having loud, distracting music to give it fake “dramatic” validity, and is actually extremely dramatic as a result. That is because we are free to focus on its content instead of some fool’s idea of a bezazzy presentation.

wardropper
wardropper

Please, folks, be careful.
The “fine video” to which I refer is the header at the top of this page, not Thomas Murphy’s complaint about being blocked by Kevin Ryan.

Alaric Balth
Alaric Balth

I remember visiting New York from Miami on September 3 through September 8, 2001. I was staying at the Millennium Hilton in downtown New York. My birthday was during that week and I had business to attend to in the city. On Thursday September 6, I called a friend and asked her if she would like to join me on my birthday for a drink at Windows on the World at the top of the north tower of the World Trade Center. She said yes and we agreed to meet in the lobby of the north tower and then go up the elevator together. When we met each other in the lobby that evening we were informed by Security that no one was being allowed upstairs. Windows on the World was closed for a few days. We did notice walking around the lobby were some instruction work crews carrying bags.

We then decided to walk over to the South tower and go up to the observation deck at the top, just to enjoy the scenery before heading out into the city to celebrate my birthday. When we arrived in the lobby of the south tower, again we were informed that no one was allowed up that evening due to the fact that there was construction going on on the observation deck, and the upper floors, and that no one was allowed up there. We also noticed in the south tower lobby other similar looking workers carrying bags.

We then left the World Trade Center and headed uptown for an enjoyable evening. We thought it was unusual that both towers had closed the upper floors and we each commented that in all our years in New York we have never seen such an occurrence.

When the trade center towers came down on September 11, my girlfriend called me from the city, and she was in shock. As she sobbed, she remembered those workers in the towers and the fact that no one was being allowed upstairs in either tower.

I commented to her that there are no coincidences.

I have kept my airline seat assignment ticket and my bill from the hotel just in case anyone ever asked me to confirm that I was there before the towers came down.

axisofoil
axisofoil
vexarb
vexarb

axis, at 7 minutes in your f irst link a patriotic U$ General tells how he could not believe his government could have committed this terrible atrocity against his own country; then by minute 18 this General from U$ Military Intelligence (an institution which up till now I had called an Oxy Moron) has brilliantly connected all the dots which demonstrate that the Bush / Cheney regime had: shut down U$ air defenses to allow the planes unimpeded access to WTC; controlled demolition after the fire spectacle; shut down all surveillance cameras around the Pentagon — except one; that camera showed the approach of a missile not a plane; altered the video to disguise the missile as a plane. The General ends by recounting the patriotism he had felt as a boy, which had stirred him to serve his country. A formidable enemy to the enemy of his people. Reminds me of Scott Ritter and Kevin Ryan. Except that this General asks the ultimate question: Why?”

“Will you, I pray you, ask this demi-devil
Why he hath thus ensnared my soul and body”. — Othello.

Truly, the traitors within have thus ensnared both the soul as well as the body of our country.

axisofoil
axisofoil

The human dilemma is quite a spectacle. It would be interesting to be able to move away from it far enough to obtain a really objective perspective. Is there one? I suppose we would have to completely release our own thoughts about everything, as also being possibly suspect, to achieve that. We might then see if the traitors within were not also ensnared themselves, and how. By what device, or do they simply have no souls….no conscience?
This is somewhat like an insane asylum where some of us just want to relax and others want to kill people. How did the killers get to wear the white coats? While we were napping? What on earth is really running this show? Algorithms? An evolution program gone bad? Have we been hacked by pranksters? The seemingly endless psychopathy of blundering dolts as they help each other rise to power should give us pause to question the whole construct of our reality. Including ourselves. This surely is a lot of violent nonsense. Is there a point to it all?

vexarb
vexarb

Axis: “Is there a point to it all?”. Ask a Christian or a Moslem, and the answer will be Yes:

“Things change but one thing never changes: the fight between Good and Evil…” — TS Eliot

axisofoil
axisofoil

Verbax…How do we define evil? When we consider evil, it must be done with some basic idea of good. It should stand to reason that some fundamental understanding of how one effects the other would be agreed on by now. Unfortunately, this consideration is by default a subjective observation in a polarized paradigm. We are always provided an excuse to justify doing what would otherwise be understood as evil. Our minds are wired for this transition. We know how easily we can twist the good and evil paradigm. It’s almost like we look forward to it. When we are told “They are our enemy” “They’ have no God” “They have the wrong God” “We good people must save them from killing themselves, so…..let’s kill them”, we seem to get excited. Do we tell ourselves these things because we want a reason to rape and pillage, but we know we better have a good excuse? To whom or what do we instinctively feel accountable? Is this accountability merely another trick of the mind to add an element of suspense to this game we like to play? At least the Vikings said”Hey, let’s go on a raid” Does the absurdity of it all not give us the slightest suspicion that there is something else entirely going on around here? We can’t be this stupid.

vexarb
vexarb

AxisOfOil: “How do we define evil?”.

After studying Socrates, Plato, Kant and Dante I gave up trying to define Good and Evil. And I gave up even trying to combat Sophistries like this: “We know how easily we can twist the good and evil paradigm.” It’s a fight, not a logical argument. Even Good vs Evil could be argued, I doubt that argument can be followed to a satisfactory conclusion among a species of hairless apes 99% of whose DNA is similar to that of chimpanzees.

The best preachers use simple words: Love God, Love your fellow beings, Don’t kill, Don’t steal, Don’t covet, Don’t lie, Respect your elders, Respect tradition, Respect learning. They also preach by acting as role models.

“Preach the Gospel — use words, if necessary.” — St.Francis of Assisi.

Lately I have come to believe the fight is in earnest:

“For we wrestle not [only?] against Flesh and Blood, but [also?] against Principalities and Powers in the Heavens.” — St.Paul

It is a fight, people get hurt, faith is tried to the utmost, the outcome is uncertain:

“Eli, Eli! Lama sabachthani?”.

axisofoil
axisofoil

Damn….you are probably right.