Hong Kong is Scared….of the Rioters
Andre Vltchek
It was once a British police station, as well as the Victoria Prison Compound. Hong Kong inhabitants used to tremble just from hearing its name mentioned. This is where people were detained, interrogated, humiliated, tortured and disappeared.
Now, after Hong Kong ‘returned to China’, it was converted into the Tai Kwun Center – one of the biggest and the most vibrant art institutions in Asia.
This transformation was symbolic, the same as the conversion of the former British-era slums into public parks has been symbolic.
But now, as the pro-Western and anti-Chinese treasonous hooligans are dividing and ruining this former UK colony, the old-colonialist flags of “British Hong Kong” are being waved alongside the flags of the United States, while Chinese flags are being humiliated, and thrown into the bay.
Rioters seem to remember nothing about those ‘good old times’ (according to them), when signs shamelessly declared: “No Dogs and Chinese”. As they seem to close both eyes and ignore the neo-colonialism and massacres, that both North America and Europe are constantly committing in all corners of the world.
Now, the citizens of Hong Kong are scared. Not of the “government”, not of the police, or Beijing: they are frightened of the so-called protesters, of ninja-like looking young people with covered faces and metal bars in their hands.
Mr. Edmond, who works for the Tai Kwun Center, speaks bitterly about the events in his city:
“What is truly scary now, is that families here in HK are deeply divided. Father does not talk to his son. Silence reigns inside the families. Colleagues do not touch the subject of riots. The situation is thoroughly ruining our city, our society, our families.”
“If someone publicly disagrees with the protesters, they get beaten. They managed to silence people.”
“People come here, to this wonderful art center, and if they are from Beijing, they are now hiding their identity. It is because they are scared.”
Mr. Edmond keeps repeating that “disagreements should be like disputes inside the family”. He means, disagreements between the Hong Kong inhabitants, and Beijing. According to him, the outsiders should not be involved.
This is what the majority of the people feels in Hong Kong now. This is what they felt in 2014, when I wrote about another prolonged and destructive event which was sponsored by the West – the so-called “Umbrella” uprising.
They feel this, but most of them would not dare to express it. The rioters are young, in good physical shape, and armed with sticks and bars. They have no identity, as their faces are covered by scarves. They are drunk on fanatical self-righteousness; stoned on a primitive sense of purpose. Their behavior is not rational – it is religious.
I have been talking to them. In 2014, and now. Most of them know nothing about the foreign policy of the West. They have no clue about the brutality of the British Empire. They do not want to hear about the humiliation and pain of the Chinese people, when their country was invaded, broken into pieces and occupied.
They are selfish; grandstanders, and extremely arrogant.
They wave flags; foreign flags. They spit on their own banners. They do what they are told to do: by the hostile, foreign powers. And they do, what they are paid to do. It is as depressing, as it is embarrassing, to watch.
“President Trump, please liberate us!” “Please Save us, President Trump!” That is what they shout. That is what their posters say.
It is very hard to talk to them. I tried. Most of them do not want to uncover their faces, and to speak. They seem to feel secure only when in packs, in multitudes. When challenged, they reveal that they know very little, even about China; or even about Hong Kong itself.
But they are ready to preach; to lecture.
When faced with logical arguments, which they cannot refute, they become brutal.
Just a few days ago, they attacked a local teacher who was singing the national anthem of China. They beat him up. A child witnessing the event was horrified. He cried. The teacher kept singing.
They are beating those who try to make them stop destroying the city. They are beating those who are shaming them.
Whenever I manage to have longer exchanges with them, it somehow feels the same as when I am confronting religious fanatics in the Middle East. Perhaps, it should not even be surprising, as both are products of the Western propagandists and their allies.
People refusing to accept their leaflets at the airport –get beaten. If visitors to shopping centers challenge the rioters – a public beating takes place.
This covering of faces with black scarves would be illegal in many parts of the West, were the black scarves to be worn by, let’s say, Muslim women, or local rioters. But the Western media, outrageously selective in its coverage, is glorifying it here, simply because it is against the interests of the People’s Republic of China.
Chinese people, with thousands of years of culture, mostly tolerant, are not used to all this. These events of the last three months are something extremely foreign to them. Therefore, many are scared. Very scared. Desperate.
Ninjas of this nature are usually jumping and hitting in all directions, but from the screens of television sets, not right in the middle of the streets.
*
As I am filming in Hong Kong, as I am reporting for television stations, the picture is becoming clearer and clearer.
There are U.S. flags being carried, the U.S. anthem is sung, then immediately, hundreds of Western media crews start filming.
But when public property is being damaged, subway stations vandalized, pedestrians and motorists attacked, Western cameras are nowhere in sight.
If rioters were to trash Heathrow Airport in London, the army would be called, immediately. Here, the rioters are cheered on by foreigners.
It is obvious that Western mass media outlets and the rioters are working hand-in-hand. They have the same goals.
*
Fear is mixed with shame. No one in Hong Kong is speaking openly, on the record. Even on such seemingly ‘innocent’ topics like the collapse of tourism.
Those who are destroying the city, are obviously not willing to take responsibility for the hardship they are causing to its citizens.
Those who are with Beijing, those who believe in “one China”, which is the silent majority of the citizens, feel shame, because there are so many traitors living among them, in one overcrowded urban area.
Therefore, silence!
Everyone here in Hong Kong and in Mainland China, understands how dangerous the situation really is. Leaders of the riots, like Joshua Wong, are groomed by Washington, London and Berlin.
They are morally and financially supported, not unlike people like Guaido in Venezuela. Mr. Wong is known to associate himself with organizations such as the “White Helmets”, which is working on behalf of the West for “regime change” in Syria.
To damage, to break China into pieces, is now the main goal of Western foreign policy. Beijing is being attacked on all fronts: Uyghurs, the Belt and Road Initiative, Taiwan, Tibet, South China Sea, trade. The more successful China gets; the more attacks it has to face.
Hong Kong used to be a city where “streets were paved with gold”, according to the legend. Mainland Chinese used to see it as a semi-paradise. All this has changed, reversed now. Neighboring cities like Shenzhen and Guangzhou, count with much better infrastructure, a greater cultural life, and lesser levels of poverty.
In one of the international hotels of Hong Kong, I was told by a manager:
Mainland Chinese people do not see Hong Kong as something attractive, anymore. They do not travel here often, anymore. They are not treated well here. They go to Thailand or to Europe instead.”
The citizens of Hong Kong feel frustrated and angry. Their “uniqueness” is evaporating. They are being left behind. Poverty rates are high. English language proficiency is declining, and businesses are moving to Singapore. Hong Kong is the most expensive city on earth, and it is unaffordable for most of its citizens.
Extreme capitalism here has brought nothing spectacular to the people. It is increasingly obvious that the Communist (or call it “socialism with the Chinese characteristics”) system has become much more successful than the old British-style neo-liberalism; in terms of social policies, infrastructure, the arts and general quality of life.
The spoiled, egotistical young people of Hong Kong are outraged. What? They are suddenly not on top of the world? The Commies across the line are better at almost everything they touch?
Instead of working harder, they turn against China; against the Mainland.
They want to convince the entirety of Hong Kong and even the Mainland, that the ‘Hong Kong way’ is the only correct way. And of course, there is plenty of funding available to support their insane claims. The funding comes from the fellow-collapsing societies – those in the West.
*
Most of the citizens of Hong Kong are scared that the rioters may succeed.
They have already forced the withdrawal of the Extradition Bill, which could help Hong Kong to fight the endemic corruption and invulnerability of its business elites.
They have already managed to scare the Hong Kong government into compromises.
The rioters are acting like huge, violent gangs, and they are enjoying full propaganda support from the West.
But whether they like it or not, Hong Kong is China. Ask a grocery vendor at North Point, ask coolies, old ladies on a park bench, or an elementary school teacher, and you will understand. These people do not care whether Hong Kong is exceptional or not. They do not need to show-off. They just want to live, to survive, to look forward to a better future.
And a better future is definitely with Beijing, not with Washington or London.
They already had London. They had enough of it.
“More Beijing, not less”, you would hear if people were not scared to talk. In 2014, when things were not as extreme as now, they used to tell me.
Now, it is not easy to fight the hundreds of thousands of face-covering and metal-bar-waving zealots and fanatics. Their religion is simply “The West”. It is abstract. As are their demands. As are their violent outbursts of inferiority complexes.
Both, the local majority, and Beijing, have to think hard as to what strategy to apply, in order to protect, and to defend Hong Kong and China against those brutal, frustrated, morally corrupt hooligans and treasonous cadres.
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We saw the same thing in 1989. Vacuous juvenile thugs and rioters worshipping at the altar of their American handlers, complete with a statue of liberty. These snowflake traitors should be taught the lesson they richly deserve with however much force is necessary. They are just useful idiots in the campaign to destabilise China. Strange how Soros, the NED, and all the CIA front groups never go in for the same stunts in Shady Wahabia, where teenagers are crucified.
I thought I saw mention in this article of the various sexual assaults that accompany the riots, although perhaps that was at Moon of Alabama. Anyway, the stories about the rapes are true, but in many cases they take a particular form, whereby the older rioters pressure and intimidate their (literal) fangirls (often underage) to have free sex with many of them seriatim (they get ‘train-lined’ in the usual porn parlance) ‘for the cause’. I stress ‘free’ because these girls are not prostitutes, merely misguided idealists. When they are treated to meals and drink and drugs and karaoke and then told, ‘We brave heroes put our bodies on the line fighting the evil Hong Kong police. You too should sacrifice your body, for us, to show your appreciation for our bravery’, they readily succumb. And often regret it afterwards. Here is a link to one such girl telling her story.… Read more »
Dear Herr Ringbone,
My Cantonese is non-existent so I am checking with the folks at 21SilkRoad Facebook group to see if they can help. (Crossing my fingers.)
Many thanks, Jen!
Some of the pro-rioter propaganda here is so idiotic, irrelevant, and even contradictory to their cause that it is hard to believe HK people are so stupid and so utterly ignorant of history. Let me give the worst example I have seen here. First, you must understand the setting. I live in a private estate with a large semi-circular plaza at the front. The space is often used collectively for fairs and celebrations for traditional holidays. But although I have lived here for five years, I have not once seen a cinema screen set up to screen a film. But earlier this week I saw just that, with an audience of about one hundred watching it. Suddenly an awful realization hit me: as films are never screened here, this just had to be pro-rioter anti-China propaganda. So I went to take a look. You won’t believe this. The film was… Read more »
Sorry Mods, I really hope that people realize by ‘here’, I mean Hong Kong, not Off-G! I live in HK so I make this mistake frequently. Apologies!
These pro-democracy protesters are just thugs, pure and simple. Imagine storming and destroying your own parliament, destroying infrastructure and so on. Try that in the democratic west and a lesson or two will have been learnt by now. I wonder what China’s strategy is in dealing with these thugs
Thanks Andre for your observations. It might also be pointed out that the majority of the protesters in this ‘colour revolution’, whose colour appears to be black, probably weren’t born before the British relinquished their colonial rule there in 1997. And many of those who were, were too young to remember what it was like living under the ‘Butchers Apron’. The whole CIA playbook is there for all to see in the Hong Kong events, as outlined by many (and not so well or completely below): 1. For a regime you want to change, find a legitimate cause that people are beginning to protest about. Tick. Ordinary people in Hong Kong have plenty to protest about, but none of that is part of this ‘movement’, even though it’s the underlying fuel: the wildly growing wealth and income disparities (20% poverty rate); totally unaffordable real estate/rent (up 300% in the last… Read more »
Hong Kong is a part of China. The CCP is the current government of China, but it is not China itself. It governs the Middle Kingdom with a system that has been called “socialism with Chinese characteristics.” Note that this is not Communism, but indeed, a form of State Capitalism. Now is it rational to believe that the reign of the CCP will out last that of the Dynasties of old? Are you unaware that nothing is permanent? Call these protestors “traitors” all you want, but to say that they are “zealots [whose] religion is simply ‘The West’” is completely disingenuous. I have heard that the protestors have a slogan, “Be Water.” I may be getting this wrong but it sounds like something the late, great Bruce Lee once said. It sounds very, very much like the philosophy of Lee, whose own philosophy, as I understand, is in accordance with… Read more »
It’s neoliberalism, Scott, it’s neoliberalism …with or without ‘Chinese Characteristics’ [Harvey]. Economic illiterates – like Andre – are so desperate for their to be an alternative to neoliberalism – they invented one in their imaginations. Then they project a Manga-like comic book ontology onto real events …the dark forces of the Western Empire struggle in vain to thwart the forces of light of the Eastern Ecological Civilisation …whose only purpose in arising is to save mankind from the clutches of their Western Imperial foes. (To the sound of mocking hysterical laughter) I do not know who is more deluded: Andre: or his uncritical ‘comic-book’ and contrafactual sycophants? One click away from this page are any number of links that could return us to economic epistemology and a critical realist reason. Two questions no one has even attempted to answer are: if China is ‘rising’ – how come the Yuan is… Read more »
I hear you, BigB.
Also, “No Dogs or Chinese Allowed” would be the wrong way to put it in British English in semi-colonial times. It would potatively have been “Dogs and Chinese not allowed” — according to Mainland Chinese made-up fellow traveller propaganda we were fed in the fifties, sixties and seventies.
The Hòngkóng rioter thugs are “rebels without a cause” — i.e., the cind belioved ti and by reactionary imperialists. Please tell them that by the standards of their masters, they’ld end up being regarded ar just a little bit less unworthy than Blacks. ((This is my piece de coupe de crace when confronted with racist SIno-Japanese in all the East.)
This very good article is marred by one falsely-attribuded illustration: A photo of a sign saying “No dogs or Chinese allowed” (“夠輿華人不得入內”)。This is a long standing misinterpretation of what was written at the entrance to the small park at the waterside Bund guardens and esplanade in Shànghâi before the two world wars. The sign said something like this: “We humbly regret to having to remind visitors that that dogs and bicycles are still not permitted brought into the park, and that servants are not included when buying admittance on a family seasons ticket” (but stated more succinctly buath in English and in Chinese writing).
One proof of the falsehood is that the phrasing on the photo is not in the correct Chinese, where the sign for “not” (bù’/不) would have been (wù/勿or毋得).
Otherwise, a very goood and well informed article from an established and mostely accurate observer!
Andre, it happens that every anti-Chinese Chinese I’ve met is crazy about Jesus and worship US State Department officials as well.
Is that your experience as well?
I see most of the Trotskyist groups supporting yet another western backed “revolution” that they think will bring on a world revolution! Trotskyists are a special kind of cunts
This Trotskyist group didn’t, and their analysis of the situation is second to none:
https://www.icl-fi.org/english/wv/1160/hong_kong.html
Wow one tiny group with no followers and even less views online. All Trotskyists are fake as fuck and love a good vice news and bbc led “revolution”
Yes, maybe they have a small following, but are they right or wrong? Who has a better analysis of Hong Kong?
Before WRITING these deeply ignorant idiots OFF, is it worth it, to investigate the possibility that these protesters being exposed to some radiation or chemicals causing some deep flaws in the brain wiring?
Andre again writes a rousing mythology about a dying dream narrative. Hong Kong itself is an icon of a dying economic system: soon to be historic capitalism. The dreams of Hong Kongers – whether they be libertarian anarchists in the USUK thrall or not – are similarly ill-predicated in economic illusion. The illusion of perpetual growth. Andre’s semantic framing – the outmoded and illusionary structural framework he uses to index real event into – is flawed and economically illiterate. Sure, Washington and London represent a dying Empire and an ending capitalist epoch. Everyone gets this. But only economic illiteracy allows the semantic and economic fallacy that somehow China offers any alternative. Economic literacy knows the dollar and yuan are fatefully interconnected. It’s not really a debating point. It’s just a brute economic fact. One that Andre denies every time to employ his fantasy narrative framing. The dollar is fucked: imploding… Read more »
Hello Big B. Genuin enquiery: I looked at both articles and note that there was only one mention of China’s US dollar debt holding and nothing about her massive gold reserves. Any thoughts?
Yes: there is not enough gold in the multiverse to underpin the amount of debt we or China are in. The thing about debt is that all asset classes are proxy for each other. A dollar shortage pulls them all down together. The price mechanism is the transmission mechanism, according to Jack Rasmus. That’s just a fancy way of saying it’s all interconnected. The scary thing about the current repo market failure is that in order to get a short term loan: the financial institution has to put up collateral that can be resold to cover the loan. They promise to repurchase the collateral the next day – plus a fee. According to the Feds balance sheet: it looks as though though are taking Mortgage Backed Securities and other Wealth Management products as collateral. In plain English: they are swapping virtual currency for worthless collateral. You need a supercomputer to… Read more »
The USA has significant debt overhang too, eh. Moreover, American is insolvent and will never pay back creditors owing $22 trillion +. Not even small incremental discharge of debt is occurring in the USA as it just keeps building as Congress takes a nap whenever debt conundrums get discussed.
The USA taught China how to speculate like a world class criminal Oligarch.
MOU
That’s what the repo markets indicate. It is more complicated than that. The US Fed is not just the backstop for the US. It is the backstop for the whole world. Which is what people do not get. Very quickly: there are dollars and eurodollars. A eurodollar is a dollar created in the offshore Eurobond markets – using actual dollars as a monetary base. From which unregulated bonds are created and lent on …and on …and on. In short: there are many more times dollars floating around in the bond market than there are actual dollars to cover them. Which creates an imbalance and deficit. Of up to $6.5tn on the eve of Bear Stearns – according to the BIS. In my simplex: the Fed has no choice but to cover the whole market …whether it created the money or not. Which plays actual carnage with everyones balance sheets. Which… Read more »
I fully agree with most of your comments on macro most of the time, BigB. Additionally, I have been following the CB shenanigans since I watched Nixon close the gold window in 1971 whilst being lectured on Finance by my Chartered Accountant father. Clearly, the securitization process gave us all the betting universe of dark pool derivatives that brought us all to this juncture of global economic implosion. Moreover, anyone with our knowledge base does not believe that growth & prosperity are coming back at all. We both know that this will end in kinetic nuclear world war and nuclear winter given the impossibility of appropriately addressing the intractability of debts at the sovereign level. Like you I’m just waiting for the world to blow up now whilst I share in that knowledge base with likeminded people like yourself. Like you I am growing tired of attempting to warn the… Read more »
They did rewrite economics – with Behavioural Economics – using such insights garnered from Game Theory to make even more money. I’m kinda hoping we’ll skip the whole thermonuclear ending …going out, not with a bang: but a whimper. Preferably after I’m long gone.
We have the capability to turn this around; even at this late hour. We’re not the only ones who can see what comes next: everyone can feel it, if not admit. The myth of eternal growth is a weak one, epistemologically. Maybe we can see through it one day? That’s my little bubble of hopium, anyway.
Cheers, BB.
I’m purely Quantum Behavioural Economics which is my own variant of Behaviour Economics. Lehman leverage at 44:1 blew the system architecture that essentially was built by Goldman & JPMorgan right to smithereens. I know you are adept like myself, BigB. You cannot entertain the idea that this is not going to go kinetic & thermonuclear given that the Fractional Reserve System is designed only for growth. If deflation hits an economy that has undergone the secular finance process of securitization in an environment that is built to be supported off of growth alone there can only be one end result. That end result is zero sum. You cannot own a bubble of hopium when I will snatch it from you, BigB. All you need to do to keep yourself sane is to remember Clerk Maxwell & the Second Law of Thermodynamics. The Maxwellian Demon let the gas out of the… Read more »
BigB: “If you thought you had me – if you even bothered to look – the graph is inverted. The rise is the fall of the yuan against the dollar. ” I bothered to look, and I understood that the graph showed a relentless self-depreciation of the yuan from 1981 to 1995 (to make Chinese goods cheaper hence increase exports?); followed by a neat flat plateau from 1995 to 2005 (consolidation?). I remember vaguely loud cries of pain from Clinton and Bush regimes for China to strengthen the yuan so Ussies would buy less Chinese crap and more “good old American crap”. Which the Chinese obligingly did from 2005 to 2015 (China no longer being so dependent on exports to U$?). So far, IMO, thirty years of rational behaviour by a developing country. But I do not understand China’s renewed depreciation of the yuan since 2015, nor its borrowing of… Read more »
Vex: What you call ‘consolidation’ is called ‘pegging’. China deliberately devalued the Yuan (vertical line on graph) to create a favourable price differential between the Yuan and Dollar (CNY and USD). Favourable to both sides, I might add: as 49% of Chinese imports are from outsourced American firms (plus a good deal of trade by stealth coming in from Canada and Mexico. Think Mexico has the capacity to be America’s biggest trading partner? It does when a lot of the goods are ’round-tripping’ from China). All the noise about China ‘manipulating its currency’ (pegging) is just noise. As Jack Rasmus recently tweeted: what does Trump want them to do – let their currency freefall? Which would collapse the global economy and collapse the USD? Which is exactly what will happen if China cannot get enough dollars to maintain the value of the CNY – at around 7.1 to the USD… Read more »
BigB, I do not understand economics but it seems to me you are saying that China is now financing infrastructure by borrowing from Rothschild banks. In other words, China works for Wall Street — and may have been doing so ever since Kissinger-Nixon initiated U$ firms outsourcing their capital for hardware manufacture to China. This can’t be good IMO.
Re debt, all I know is an old joke: if the debtor can’t repay, that’s the creditor’s worry. Could you kindly remind us what unheard of action Iceland took about her debt after a great crash (2008?). They did not accept the solution proffered to Britain by financial genius Gordon Brown. The Icelanders did something so outrageous that Brown threatened to unleash his Anti-Terrorist squad onto them. I am not clear what Iceland did about its debt but I guess it wasn’t “Quantitative Easing” ie borrowing even more from Rothschild banks.
You don’t understand economics: neither do I! What the hell are they playing at? There is no economic simplex. The USD and CNY are so interpenetrated they might as well as considered as a symbiosis. Which goes right down to corporate part ownership. The USD has very little penetration into the mainland; but the intermingling on the littoral periphery – the Special Economic Zones that have stalled in the current economic crisis – threatens the onshore CNY to. Many of the reasons are outlined in the SCMP articles. One of the things to highlight is ideology. They believe that ‘printing’ CNY causes inflation. So they borrow USD as collateral and convert it into CNY (which makes the currency fragile). Don’t ask me why: it is pure neoliberal dogma. Michael Hudson and PCR have said quite a lot about this: there is no real reason for it other than neoliberal ideology.… Read more »
Systemically. the weakest link across the global economic system & Fractional Reserve Banking is sovereign Debt-to-GDP & the $1.9 quadrillion estimated notional dark pool derivatives universe. Nothing in existence compares to the systemic risk of the dark pool derivatives universe. Buffett said these were ‘weapons of mass destruction’ and everyone went back to sleep thinking Uncle Warren Buffett would bail everyone out if it ever failed. Warren Buffett has pulled Berkshire Hathaway off the table to the tune of something on the order of $55 billion cash so that when the stock market blows fat tails in October he will then be able to swoop in and buy up everything for pennies on the petro-dollar. Weapons of mass destruction in the Finance sector are derivatives hiding in dark shadowy places like the Non-Bank Sector of Finance in the USA & China. Imagine that you are Wily Fox walking through the… Read more »
BigB, Thanks for that reply. I get the part about China foolishly buying U$D; also partly agree that if world trade stops then New Silk Road infrastructure will be less useful. But I think Russia and China (and Cuba and Syria and Iran) have enough Socialist / Communist know how to fall back on their own resources. Also there is a reservoir of self-help in tough little countries like Iceland, Yemen and others of that ilk in Africa and Asia. Likewise, I guess, in some of the “Flyover States” of the U$A. Israel will be OK because Zio Capitalists will shield her from great financial recession as they did in 2008. It is the great “fiat-money” civilizations that will feel the shock, like last time: the ones centred around the big bright city lights. On a final optimistic note, PollyAnna wishes to see more Communist / Socialist governments arising from… Read more »
Iceland declared bankruptcy Chapter 11 and then reconstituted the banking system nationally so that the people of Iceland owned the banks. They sent numbers of bankers to prison and avoided being labelled terrorists by Gordon Brown & his Oligarchs in the EU.
KPMG set Iceland up to be the patsy and I’m sure the Finance minds of Iceland have figured this out so that they could launch counterclaims against KPMG Accountants & Lawyers that sold them a bill of goods pre-GFC so that KPMG could rake in the profits by using Icelandic people as Greater Fools for their ruse of global asset theft.
MOU
Thanks, MOU. Icelanders are an interesting and rather tough ethnic group, who have been selected by an arduous journey to a land which grants rewards to those who respect its special environment. I read a book once which compares the Icelanders to the Jews in this respect. Apparently, at the time this book was written, Icelanders had the same percentage of Nobel Prizes as Jews had. Looking at these two groups today shows what different uses people can make of their abilities.
I don’t stand in judgement and throw stones lest stones be thrown at me as I am judged. Iceland is a very cool place indeed. Geothermal is mind-blowing and the wealth of resources in also pretty stupefying too. Your PM married a Canadian woman from a small town near to where I now live. The First Lady of Iceland is a CANUCK, eh.
🙂
MOU
Whenever I manage to have longer exchanges with them, it somehow feels the same as when I am confronting religious fanatics in the Middle East. Perhaps, it should not even be surprising, as both are products of the Western propagandists and their allies. Your feelings are well developed. The same feeling is prevalent when looking at the Three Towers, Libya, Vietnam, John Fitzgerald, Robert F., Colin Powell, Tonkin, Guaido, Ukraine, Brexit – there is no end to it. This feeling has become the predominant feeling of any awakened person on the planet. How many are there? A few hundred? A few thousand? How many are there that get the exact same feeling whenever the Western fascist regimes dish out their fascist propaganda and let lose their fascist Schäferhunde? No, actually these young criminals in Hong Kong are not Schäferhunde. Schäferhunde are disciplined. These are undisciplined dogs. They will bite the… Read more »
Should be added for clarity:
China vows to retaliate as Hong Kong bill advances in U.S.
Every downvote is a badge of honor. And it shows how many fascist stooges are around. Keep it up pathetic peddlers and regime installers. You really suck.
It’ll be the fake lefties who think you’re supporting “oppression” of some vague kind they can’t describe
It’ll be people devoid of reason and critical thinking. Fake lefties – fake anything. Just fake. Fake humans, for a true human being does not accept any collateral damages for profits. Not one human life is ever ‘worth it’ to be extinguished for the profits of the owner class. Not a single one.
There, NTO1, you have more upvotes than downvotes. This is OffG, a Truther site.
NTO1, it’s hard to boycott oneself. I think we must Remain & Reform from within.
When thinking it through, it may exactly what is necessary. The “hard to boycott oneself” part. But that’s what it might take and it wouldn’t be depending on ulterior inspiration. Just boycotting ourselves in regards to what we would deem boycottable (sic) in others – aw we are all one in the first place. We will feel/fare better if we boycott unhealthy food – without prejudice. When we boycott what makes us ill, or causes us to suffer, will that not target those who make us ill and cause our suffering for a handful of dollars? Nowadays pennies to the dollar will suffice to through people under the bus. What are we to do about the arms industry’s share holders losses when there will be no new war? What will happen to the poor shareholders of Bayer/Monsanto if glyphosate would be banned because it is carcinogenic to the highest order?… Read more »
“throw people under the bus” and a few other typos. Apologies, but at least these are my typos – after I turned all ‘auto-dismember’ off.
@NTO1: “Just boycotting ourselves in regards to what we would deem boycottable (sic) in others”.
Interesting counter to the old complaint “It’s hard to boycott oneself”. Of course! one’s country is _not_ oneself. One can select things in one’s country that one does not like, and avoid them. One can go even further along this path of selective internal BDS: one can select traits in oneself that one does not like and avoid them.
Trojan Horse can take many shapes.
When Egyptian territory was returned from israeli occupation, we heard that the land was left infested with large rats. Hong Kong seems the same.
“What is truly scary now, is that families here in HK are deeply divided. Father does not talk to his son. Silence reigns inside the families. Colleagues do not touch the subject of riots. The situation is thoroughly ruining our city, our society, our families.”
Like Western families re 911. Wise Solon of Athens who invented democracy (one of The Seven Sages) made it a crime to hide one’s political opinions. Democracy is “the best form of bad government”; hidden agendas turn Democracy into the worst form of bad government — as we in the West are seeing.
This is the guy who wrote, a few weeks ago, that extradition from Hong Kong to China would be no different than between different US states or European countries. Laughable and an insult to his readers’ intelligence. So treat his meanderings with suspicion.
Mr Vltchek, why are you doing Beijing’s dirty work?
I think you meant to write “extradition from Hong Kong to mainland China”. Hong Kong is not a country.
And just what is your business with China, that you are getting so exited, don’t tell me you love and care for Chinese people!
Currently, a person from Hong Kong who committed a crime in Shanghai cannot be extradited back to Shanghai for prosecution if already returned to HK.
Is there any other country where someone is able to commit crimes and becomes immune from prosecution simply by living in another city?
The British version of hasbara has arrived! Hello 77th brigade scumbag!
Admin:Any further content-free abuse spamming will be deleted
Fuck you Admin go on be like the guardian and censor away then we will know you’re just corralling us!
Hong Kong is Scared….of the Rioters Andre Vltchek
Andre into humor, surprise!!
No worries, uncle Xi is not scared of anybody and will deal with any Party line dissident voices. The Taiwanese are anguishly watching his moves here and will vote accordingly.
If the CPC would allow freedom of expression followed by free elections no Chinese would have to look outside. The Bogey is not in Washington but in Beijing once again after the Great Leap Forward and the Cultural Revolution.
Democracy is messy but a good safety valve and keeps minds and hearts happy, not only stomachs and hands.
Yes, China has a millennia long tradition of totalitarian rule but once this could change step by step…
you’re really not fooling anybody, hasbara troll.
https://electronicintifada.net/content/inside-israels-million-dollar-troll-army/27566
What, Israel is behind me and the Hong Kong protesters?
Sorry I forgot, Israel is behind EVERYTHING bad, it is the Devil.
Than it could also be behind Milosovic, check your dreams…
Milo, may I suggest also the descriptive term ‘hasbarollockser’: One who pretends to be ‘explaining’ but is in fact talking bollocks – wilfully. Seems that Off-G’s work has established rapidly a reputation for such good quality reality-mining that it’s been marked and assigned it’s own hasbarollocksers by Tel Aviv Central Troll-Farms, Inc.
Having to make up paper-thin tendentious shite, to attempt – ineffectually – to counter the density of good sense and reality-awareness that’s – mostly – on show here, must be a distinctly uninspiring career choice. Poor hasbarollockser! 🙂 But it does give the odd good laugh to those who aren’t fooled.
I’d be pretty sure that Andy is nothing to do with Hasbara whatsoever, based upon his postings for a long time.
I agree with that comment Andy, but China, for all its bad side, has lifted hundreds of millions of people out of abject poverty.
Western style democracy is broken and it will not come to China, and conversely, Chinese communism is a special and unique hybrid and won’t spring up in the west.
The left is so desperate to believe in the sanctity of China that they perform daily contortions on the situation in Hong Kong and ignore reports of prison camps in Eastern Turkestan and genocide in Tibet. Nearer to home the China Commission sits in London and hears reports from defecting Chinese doctors appalled at the forced organ donations from prisoners of conscience, a trade claimed to have led to a million deaths. I view that as willful ignorance. There is no civil society or rule of law in China and those lawyers who try to defend people whose homes have been taken from them by a rapacious Communist Party find that the ‘social credit’ system set up with the help from western companies such as Cisco Systems and Microsoft, has just denied them the ability to use their telephones or to travel. Despiteanti corruption campaigns from Xi Jinping Communist Party… Read more »
Genocide in Tibet!? Hahahahahahaha oh god. And the left hate China!? it’s a small handful of Marxist Leninists and a few others who like China! The mainstream left like the entirety of the right hate China because they’re told to. Puppet! Go on YouTube and type Michael Parenti Tibet Dalai Lama and see what you hear! Sheep
Funny how when my pal went to China with his Chinese wife and children he loved it! And here’s the Michael Parenti Video seeing as you’ll be too scared to finding the truth! https://youtu.be/SRJdqkjmiKI Funny how Tibet’s was always Chinese under the fascist Chang Kai shek but was magically an independent nation when the communists kicked the child raping Buddhists out! Weird that ain’t it?! But you A) probably won’t watch the 6 minute video and B) will just claim it’s made up because it’ll hurt your emotional little brain
The United States of America did the same thing to Ukraine during Obama’s term of office where John McCain was visiting Ukraine and fomenting the regional strife just as the USA is doing today with Honk Kong protestors turned USA Fascists with weaponized help in the form of CIA propagandists visiting and working with leadership of the protests.
The Hong Kong protests are all about Trump and nothing more than that. The people of Hong Kong are not afraid of the protestors whatsoever. The Hong Kong Police do not fear them and neither does governance. It is a Show Trial of propaganda designed solely by the CIA & Pentagon.
Trump is the biggest asshole in the world and the protestors feigning pleas for Trump to support them are paid actors.
MOU
”The United States of America did the same thing to Ukraine during Obama’s term of office …” Yes, that also occurred to me. The Maidan events which took place in 2014 had been meticulously prepared and stage managed for a number of years prior to these events. NATOs soft invasion was spearheaded by various NGOs backed up by western governments, viz, the US and the EU. Also being groomed by their western instructors were the neo-nazi paramilitaries – Praviy Sektor, Svoboda, and the Azov Battalion which was formed form various nut-case factions during the course of the coup. These preparations were taking place as early as 2010. I remember my wife and I were travelling on a train from Donetsk in the east to Chelmenitsky in the west, when a large group of 20-something young men boarded the train at Dnepropetrovsk. I thought that they were a football team. They… Read more »
Re Ukrain. It should be pointed out that the Right Sector, Svoboda and Azov who you mentioned, would march through the streets of Kiev covered in Nazi regalia, right arms raised in the Nazi salute shouting “Death to the Jews”. Most of the media in the west called them “ultra nationalists”. Not Nazis or even neo-Nazis but ultra nationalists! Last week, in fact, I read an article describing them as “extreme nationalits”.
And these are the same journalists who accuse Jeremy Corbyn, a principled man who has fought racism all his life, antisemitic!
They were extreme terrorists and not nationalists at all. Just text book garden variety Psychopaths.
MOU
The text book Psychopaths & Fascists that were recruited for Maiden were infinitely much more violent & bloodthirsty than the protestors in Hong Kong are capable of being. It is not possible that the protestors in Hong Kong are anywhere near as truly violent as Maiden became in the final autopsy.
And I’m a Remote Viewer that actually viewed that incident you mention where you were on that train. I fully believe you know because I remember Remote Viewing you in that situation on that train.
I kid you not, Francis.
I also Remote Viewed Maiden later on interrogating a guy & threatening his life in a room where they used a nail gun to staple him hands to a wooden floor. Those Maiden goons were extremely viciously violent people. Perhaps the most violent beings the USA has ever employed to create regime change anywhere IMHO.
Cheers, MOU
EDIT:….’know’ should read ‘now’ instead, sorry.
MOU
US Secretary of State Mike Pompeo visited Hong Kong in May 2019 where he met one of the “pro-democracy” leaders Martin Lee.
Another “pro-democracy” leader and supporter, the media magnate Jimmy Lai, met Pompeo and US Vice-President Mike Pence in Washington DC in July 2019, and also later met the then US National Security Advisor. As the State Department reporter for Bloomberg noted at the time, that level of access to three senior US government officials by an overseas non-government visitor was quite unusual.
Did Trump know about these meetings? It’s quite possible he did and also possible that he didn’t, given that just two months later Trump walked Yosemite Sam Bolton off the plank.
Yosemite Sam went out guns blazing like all deep state actors do. Yosemite Sam was booted because of his trigger happy personality which is not exactly something that America wants to get branded with if they ever do go kinetic war because sovereign litigators would end up blaming America for installing such a trigger happy psychopath like Yosemite Sam to begin with. Yosemite Sam was just an actor in a power play that the State Department runs to intimidate their adversaries. Realizing that they have taken the threats of trade war too far the administration of America has opted to turf Yosemite Sam so that they look more conciliatory in trade negotiation tactics. If Sam is onboard everyone can ascertain an obvious stance by the State Department that they will take America to war with China & Russia if they don’t get a trade deal. Now that the admin realizes… Read more »
For a start, Beijing could do with them what it already does in Xinjiang province with radicalised Uyghur terrorists: separate them by sending them into other parts of China, put them all into re-education camps, teach them Mandarin and provide them with vocational skills.
And how would you feel if your government forcibly moved you to another part of the country and forcibly “re-educated” you?
As Andre Vltchek details in his article, these protesters are ignorant of Chinese and even HK history, and are estranged from their families. Somehow they have been brainwashed by the HK education system. One way to deal with them would be to separate them from the toxic environments that have made them what they are, give them opportunities to acquire vocational skills and learn Mandarin so they can get work (Vltchek has mentioned their English is poor and I know from other online sources that their knowledge of Mandarin is also poor: this means their work prospects are limited to HK, and if HK continues the way it is going now with all its problems, it is looking at an impoverished Third World future) and interact with Chinese people so they can see for themselves what China is really like.
You got any better ideas than this?
Not too sure myself about this and difficult for the average punter to get a handle on who these people are and what exactly motivates them. Of course the evidence shows US and UK interference. One thing that has surprised me is the restraint of HK police and China – a good thing if they can show restraint and keep a lid on things. An informative article which helps my learning but as Andre may be suggesting, solutions (including dealing with foreign meddling) may require study and separation of the trouble-making from the genuine issues. The good thing is the world is wising up to ‘regime change’ and seen the disastrous consequences on the lives of people. The violence from these protesters and waving US/UK colonial flags leads me to think the incentives on offer from foreign parties may outweigh any consideration for the lives and futures of fellow HK… Read more »
If you’ve ever been to Hong Kong, you’ll have seen that it’s extremely high density, there’s no escape for the HK police, I would expect that everyone knows where they and their families live. That’s a very strong incentive to not beat up your neighbours.
Of course everyone knows where the HK police and their families live, that is why the “pro-democracy” protesters are targeting and threatening them.
The Chinese irony being that it is little more than 100 years since the Boxer (anti-foreigner) Rebellion was brutally ended, and western missionaries were hiding in fear; Mandarins in Szechuan & Yunnan were beheading rebellious Buddhists, Muslims, & hooligans, fathers were selling their children into slavery for a sack of rice or a box of opium, etc..
The ebbs and flows of recent Chinese history…
Multi-Cultural good for the West or India, bad for China and the Muslim countries: Lefty hypocrisy.
Close the border to China.
Close air routes except for freight traffic.
Close the sea routes excep for freight traffic.
Turn off all communications with the rest of the world.
Let them get on with their internal fight, thereafter no external influence from anywhere allowed, including China.
…those are ideas for a discussion, not all necessarily what I would do if it was my choice.
An open-air concentration camp where the general public of some 7 million as well as the police are at the mercy of gangs of young brainwashed thugs barricading the streets to disrupt traffic and throwing poles onto railway lines to derail trains is not my idea of a better idea. Far better to arrest the hardcore gangs committing violence and sabotage and put them in prison, and then separate the youth from the systems that have made them what they are and taught them what to believe. The HK education system needs examining and reform; and the HK govt should also require that charities and NGOs show transparency in their funding and register as foreign organisations if over 50% of their funding comes from overseas (the US and Israel have similar laws), and expel any groups that refuse to obey the law. A lot of churches and foreign religious organisations… Read more »
I agree with your sentiment, but Guangzhou (Canton) Province and the southern regions have always been Cantonese speakers; quite distinct from Mandarin.
As long as China continues to be a wall-to-wall restaurant, there will always be a job for these hooligans, whatever language they speak..
My Uyghur neighbors, and the 23 other ethnic minorities who constitute my neighborhood, do quite well running their own shops and businesses, and they speak their own languages; neither Cantonese or Mandarin..
I don’t know, why not ask some of the many people who were forcibly moved to the midlands and the north from London during the last 9 years?
Good point
Will you advise the same re-education camps for Western XR protesters? Or for non-integrating minorities in the West like some Muslims or Central American gangs?
Maybe they could just be corralled into a Gaza type concentration camp and gunned down by thugs with British sniper rifles and dum dum bullets.