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WATCH: Perspectives on the Pandemic #2 “Social distancing and lockdown is the absolutely worst way to deal with an airborne respiratory virus”

Journeyman Pictures sits down with Prof Knut Wittkowski to discuss lockdowns, social-distancing and the best way to handle the spread of a new disease.

The Interviewer: John Kirby is the director of FOUR DIED TRYING, a feature documentary and series on the major assassinations of the 1960’s and their calamitous impact on the country. To join the struggle for justice for Dr. King, Malcolm X, and John and Robert Kennedy.

The Interviewee: Professor Knut Wittkowski was head of The Rockefeller University’s Department of Biostatistics, Epidemiology, and Research Design for 20 years.

Follow Journeyman Pictures on youtube or visit their website for more of their award-winning factual content.

UPDATE: YouTube removed the original version of this video, for as yet unexplained reasons, after it had acquired over 1.3 million views. The embedded version is now hosted on BitChute.

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john toron
john toron
Apr 24, 2020 4:37 AM

Every new virus brings a new Dussenberg.

Hail
Hail
Apr 11, 2020 9:29 AM

Note: This video is actively being censored and de-listed by Google, Youtube, and Facebook; probably Twitter, too.

Gmoney
Gmoney
Apr 11, 2020 2:05 PM
Reply to  Hail

Good thing I downloaded it then.

Gmoney
Gmoney
Apr 10, 2020 4:51 PM

I really found this testimonial from Robert F. Kennedy Jr. powerful, especially given our current circumstances: https://youtu.be/5CfLDXpC324

TFS
TFS
Apr 9, 2020 4:04 PM
TFS
TFS
Apr 9, 2020 11:54 AM
Rachel Wild
Rachel Wild
Apr 9, 2020 10:57 AM

Brilliant! Thank you. I just added this fantastic video interview to We Are Being Played & Vaccines Will Be Our Reward as a rebuttal for Bill Gates’ determined stance around lockdown and vaccines…

Offlands
Offlands
Apr 9, 2020 10:54 AM

Could the current treatment regime be making things worse?

Offlands
Offlands
Apr 9, 2020 10:54 AM
Reply to  Offlands
Jay Khaye
Jay Khaye
Apr 9, 2020 4:05 AM

I would draw peoples attention to recent article from the New England Journal of Medicine.
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMe2002387
See for yourself what Dr Fauci has concluded about the Virus.
Akin to the seasonal Flu!!! WTF

Rachel
Rachel
Apr 9, 2020 1:47 AM

Yes, but it’s the best way to deal with a financial meltdown…! It’s a lot harder to start a riot when we are under house arrest…. More here :: Our Economy Is Way More Sick Than Us
https://www.wilddigital.co.uk/our-economy-is-way-more-sick-than-us/

Mucho
Mucho
Apr 8, 2020 11:30 PM

So it’s like this.

Option 1 – let nature take it’s course. Shield the most vulnerable and inform the public of how to do this and assist those in need financially, medically and morally. There is a period of 4 weeks when the disease spreads and some may die, but the amount of people who become ill and die is not remarkable, something akin to a bad flu season. Coronavirus is nothing new, there are already about four or five in circulation. After 4 weeks, herd immunity is achieved and the disease ceases to be a problem forever. No need for panic, these are what we refer to as the trials of life. The vulnerable can come out of hiding and everyone is naturally immunised to the new pathogen after the 4 week period, because God/Mother Nature has designed humans to be able to deal with these pandemics, which occur each and every year.

Option 2 – create a “NEW NORMAL!”, enforce social distancing, maximum disturbance to life and isolation to prevent herd immunity being achieved, to guarantee that the virus remains in the community for a longer period of time, achieve a slower death rate initially but a higher and potentially much higher death rate overall, crash the economy and cause an almost endless barrage of problems resulting from this including increased death rates, create a tidal wave of mental health problems and anxiety in the community, make people feel as if they could kill people such as colleagues and their own family just by going about their daily routine, make the public feel like everyone they know and encounter could be a carrier so they could get ill through any social contact thus creating huge divisions, introduce extremely draconian/Orwellian legislation, put out rolling 24/7 news coverage of the virus which never actually focuses on the truth of the virus but is only concerned with spreading fear, disinformation and propaganda for the pharmaceutical industry, spread lies about how people are dying in order to justify the reckless and dangerous option route being taken by the government, tell families they cannot go to their own child’s funeral or be with their child as they lie dying in hospital, abuse the goodwill and cherished reputation of the NHS and its workers by emotionally manipulating the public to accept the draconian and reckless measures in other words if you don;t agree with what we are doing then you are insulting the NHS, make a potentially far more lethal second wave of the virus almost inevitable, then use the fear of this engineered crime as leverage to coerce/blackmail the population into accepting toxic, rushed vaccinations in to their body.

They went for option 2. We need to get rid of these people and fast. They are a danger to all of us. There must be legal channels which can be persued and they need to be accessed.

Mucho
Mucho
Apr 9, 2020 12:02 AM
Reply to  Mucho

Don’t forget that in the UK they intially went for Option 1, to achieve herd immunity, and they announced this decision in public. This was their instinctive, correct, science-based decision. We pay them vast sums of money to act responsibly in these situations, and to act in the interests of the public. This desision was however overturned, and they took a U-turn and persued Option 2. So this begs the question, how did we end up going for Option 2? Who made this decision? Who was putting the pressure on behind the scenes to go for Option 2? We have a right to know EXACTLY who chose Option 2 and how that decision was reached.

wardropper
wardropper
Apr 9, 2020 12:48 AM
Reply to  Mucho

Well said, Mucho. The crucial question is exactly that:
Who overturned the decision? What is their name, and what kind of science did they use to back up their reasoning?
Let’s find out.

wardropper
wardropper
Apr 9, 2020 1:00 AM
Reply to  wardropper

As for getting rid of these people – and fast – that’s where it gets tricky…
Let’s say that Rupert Murdoch, or Bill Gates, or the current chief of the Rothschilds is the sole motivator behind this, or at least one of maybe six people convinced that their divine view of what must happen to the world must never be opposed…
How many of the countless thousands of their lackeys, enablers and mouthpieces should share their guilt?
How many are “these people”?
Awkward questions like this are, of course, exactly what they realize they can hide behind. Once we are faced with the sheer number of their accomplices, they know we are going to find it very difficult even to begin to take action.
I’m only being devil’s advocate here because I am hoping that somebody who has considered this problem might be able to point to a solution.

Mike Ellwood
Mike Ellwood
Apr 9, 2020 1:45 AM
Reply to  wardropper

They panicked didn’t they? Not helped by the Imperial College Report.

wardropper
wardropper
Apr 9, 2020 2:05 AM
Reply to  Mike Ellwood

Indeed they panicked. Precisely the thing our government is NOT supposed to do.

Hmad
Hmad
Apr 11, 2020 10:15 AM
Reply to  Mike Ellwood

Yes exactly – pressure from WHO and initial Imperial College report!

atomician
atomician
Apr 9, 2020 5:54 AM
Reply to  Mucho

That’s public knowledge, I think. The team at Imperial College headed up by Neal Ferguson did “modelling” to persuade the UK and US to follow path 2.

Gmoney
Gmoney
Apr 10, 2020 3:03 PM
Reply to  Mucho

Option 2 was chosen because it will crash the global economy, and bring about the instantiation of a centralized digital currency that will be tied to social credit scores (ie., observing self-isolation rules, accepting a vaccine) as part of totalitarian aspirations.

Gmoney
Gmoney
Apr 10, 2020 3:08 PM
Reply to  Gmoney

Links to support my statement above:

The Greatest Depression: https://youtu.be/ZlTHjAuqRHs
The Bitcoin Psyop: https://youtu.be/FkhUn7nh33Q

Louise
Louise
Apr 13, 2020 10:39 AM
Reply to  Mucho

Wow you hit the nail on the head! The first option is the route that any knowledgeable system would/should follow. But many of us are afraid to do what is our natural instinct through fear of upsetting the family, friend or neighbour. We need to get the word out and reassurance that the second option is the better option. I’m a fairly positive being and am making use of this time but many will be going Stir crazy and beginning to feel contempt towards their own families. What shall we do?

1of7billion
1of7billion
Apr 8, 2020 10:19 PM

I found this a very interesting and somewhat informative video.

I did have the feeling Prof Wittkowski was sincere and mnew his subject matter, but the question I would have liked to ask him, which wasn’t asked (I did watch the entire video) that I noticed was:

why as you are obviously a very experienced and highly qualified expert scientist in the field, do nearly all the scientific advisers to government round the world apparently disagree with you and advise almost the direct opposite of what you are saying? – i.e. lockdowns, shutting down schools, etc.

I am sad to say that while I don’t want to depress readers here anymore than probably most of them (including myself) are already, the view expressed by the professor (it’s easier to type that way) that we are due to the lockdown failing to develop herd immunity is almost guaranteed to cause a second wave of infections and deaths once the lockdown finishes, makes me suspicious that these lunatics in authority, when seeing that infections and deaths rise again after lifting the lockdown, are likely to want to impose it again, as if doing the same stupid thing twice was going to next time produce a different outcome – i.e. continued failure to develop herd immunity.

The thought of that outcome – i.e. the mad authorities let us out for a while and then decide to lock us back up again, brings ideas to mind on how to deal with this problem, which even on this relatively enlightened publication it would not be wise to put into print.

I mean clearly it’s not just the good professor W here, who is a “dissident”, we’ve heard from quite a lot of other scientists who think this response is also madness. But it just appears the real lockdown going on is in the heads of those in power who make decisions, and as the professor also says, he’s not a psychiatrist, which seems to be what is needed in this case to end this mass insanity.

But what do you do when the lunatics take over the asylum?

Again, I’m only coming up with solutions that cannot be put into print.

Let’s put it like this – when the public have finally had enough of this mass imprisonment and they start to look at the broken pieces of their former lives, a fury is in my view likely to break out, and possibly even globally, which may be rather less about merely “talking” to our politicians as professor W here recommends.

Personally I think the main party to blame is the good old MSM.

For everyone has heard of “life imitating art.”

e.g. when the British police watched the allegedly realistic late 70s cop drama, “The Sweeney”, were the police actually really like that before the series, or a lot more like it afterwards, all going round saying “You’re nicked sunshine” and talking about “shooters” and “blags” and “blaggers” and vill-aynes” etc…

I mean, I think the prof is only half right when he blames the Internet for the overreaction, I think the real “vill-aynes” in this case who should get “nicked” (let’s not bring “shooters” into it however tempting that might be), need pointing the finger at very specifically, and for my money, they are mostly the Guardian and the BBC.

So when we’ve had most of the media daily reporting what the prof here (and many other experts) say is no more dangerous than at worst a nasty outbreak of seasonal flu, as if it were some science fiction blockbuster disaster movie, and we were all caught up in it going through all these wild and extreme emotions, like weeping profusely in tears when a heroic nurse dies, or passes out in exhaustion overwhelmed by the flood of the wailing and dying, with dead bodies piled up all around her, like some apocalyptic scene out of an Hieronymus Bosch painting, I think we are entitled to put the blame where it belongs.

Did Boris Johnson want to do a lockdown all along, as some sinister prelude to the fabled “New World Order”?

I don’t know.

But when the BBC and Guardian etc, screamed at him “Mr Johnson, you murderer, protect our lives and children and grannies soon with lockdowns, face masks and shutting down the pubs (it was at that point I lost patience with all the media and authorities) or else you will go down in terms of mass murder in the same league as Hitler and Stalin!”, whether or not he wanted to do a lockdown or not, my feeling was he had little choice in the face of all that in my view mainly PC inspired (i.e. the BBC and Guardian) super-hysteria.

And quite frankly – and I’m no great fan of Boris Johnson, but he might well have been the best choice available under these circumstances – I think there is a strong case to say that the terrible and totally unfair and unreasonable pressure that the PC forces have piled on Mr Johnson might be nearly literally killing him, I wouldn’t be a bit surprised if he has deteriorated and had to be hospitalised, just because he can’t take it any more.

And I think there is quite possibly an element of the PC left (I mean there is another left which isn’t PC that I think needs to carefully to he distinguished from it, as in the differences between Jeremy Corbyn and Tony Blair for example) that is in the most disgusting and shameless manner opportunistically using this situation to try to remove Boris Johnson from office and stop Brexit.

Even if it results in the total destruction of life as we formerly knew it – an economy in tatters, millions having lost jobs and business, and us possibly coming out of this like a (what they used to call) 3rd world economy – you know, compare the salaries of say doctors in Poland or South America, and they aren’t even our national average wage (meaning 3 weeks ago, that is, who knows what they will be 3 weeks hence).

I therefore look forward to a book or TV documentary called “Boris Speaks.”

Such that in the possibly nearly post-nuclear holocaust aftermath of this disaster, Boris Johnson confesses he never wanted to do the lockdown and explains how “They made me do it!”

Pointing his finger quite legitimately in my view at the totally irresponsible journalists in the Guardian and BBC who have produced a “mass propaganda” of such an intensity I think has never been seen in world history before – probably wasn’t even possible before without the Internet and modern 24 hrs TV – that even a Hitler was not capable of equaling in terms of the *lightning speed* with which it spread across the entire population.

But I think you have to blame the scientific community too. Why have so few spoken out against this, why is not the majority of the scientific community expressing great doubts about this, instead of just the relatively small number we who seek “the alternative” point of view know about?

It could be there are many, but they know that nobody hardly is going to listen to them.

But I think that’s not good enough – where are the petitions with hundreds of famous names from all areas of society, being sent to The Times or Downing Street or wherever protesting against the greater dangers of this policy to our whole way of life?

I think only time will give us the answers to those questions.

As I don’t want to depress anyone (including myself) further than they probably already are, I would honestly say while continuing to do what little we can to support and promote what we feel is the truth, like the little boy in the Emperor’s New Clothes story who points out the king is naked, what we really need to do is focus on taking care of ourselves, looking after ourselves, and anybody else we can who is around us.

This will end, it is just a question of when, and we will survive, it is just a question of how long it is going to take before these people in power see that has already been trumpeted from very high towers indeed already, including by President Trump himself, that the “cure” if it continues will be much more deadly than the disease, which is what will determine the form of our lives post-crisis.

The other thing I would say that I think is reassuring is this.

The real economy is not money. The real economy is the crops in the fields, the fruit on the trees, the rivers full of fresh water, the oil in the ground, and the fish in the sea, and all those things are going to be still there whatever happens with this virus disaster.

And the human skill and ingenuity to produce all the things we want and need.

So the positive is that this may finally be a “coming to face with reality” such that we start to build a sustainable and real economy, which concentrates on providing what everybody really needs instead of a wild out of control never ending frenzy of buying and selling for its own sake, of things we may well want, but mostly don’t need.

I mean I’m not talking about going back to the Middle Ages, I’m just saying e.g. we can all survive with 3 or 4 pairs or shoes at a time and not 50, and an Iphone 3 or 4 does most of what an Iphone 29 or whatever it currently is can do.

And there’s a much bigger killer than COVID-19, and it’s called starvation, which apparently kills somebody every 4 seconds – that’s about 11 thousand deaths a day, or more than have died of COVID-19 altogether every 5 days! – but the Guardian and the BBC aren’t obsessed with it somehow, presumably because they can’t use it to get rid of Boris Johnson and stop Brexit. Or President Trump.

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
Apr 8, 2020 10:50 PM
Reply to  1of7billion

That’s NOT ‘starvation’. That’s capitalism. The world produces enough food for all, at great ecological cost (also the fault of capitalism)but enough. ‘The Market’ determines that profit comes before human life.

Jerry Todd
Jerry Todd
Apr 22, 2020 5:12 AM

Great ecological cost? It is the communist and other despotically ruled countries whose food production is ecologically destructive. The Russians even drained the Aral Sea into a useless puddle. American farmers are very technologically savvy and good stewards of the land, even improving grazing lands where if left untended as many want, just become wastelands and fire hazards. It would be nice if differing views could be aired without the protesting side seeking retribution for imagined offenses.

thankful reader
thankful reader
Apr 8, 2020 10:57 PM
Reply to  1of7billion

Very insightful comment imo, thank you. And i think the same goes for a lot of the PC-brigade in the US who are so blinded by their hate for Trump that they’d rather destroy the whole world than to see him reelected (in all fairness not an alluring prospect, but neither is the alternative). A lot of them are actually convinced the MSM are *downplaying* the danger of covid!

Hmad
Hmad
Apr 11, 2020 10:24 AM

What a relief it is to come on here and read such sane views and commentary. Another thankful reader.

Mucho
Mucho
Apr 9, 2020 12:15 AM
Reply to  1of7billion

We cannot rule out the possibility that the Boris in hospital story is yet another lie. Boris is a dependable member of “The Club”, he will take one for the team, whatever it takes. That’s what all those pig fucking initiation rituals for the Bullingdon Boys are all about, to make sure they are prepared to do anything when required of them. That and to use the evidence of these vile acts as leverage to make sure they don’t step put of line.

All your dreams of a better world are sadly misguided. We are ruled by a bunch of lower than low, amoral, war criminal, genocidal scumbags. That’s the problem. You can imagine all the good things that may come of this that you want, but all you are doing is ignoring the elephant in the room. The problem is the scum that rules over us, that’s the problem, and until that is addressed, nothing will ever change for the better. This is a “continuation of agenda”, which has been running in modern times since the JFK hit. Rule by the most ruthless criminals in our world. We all live in their world, these lowlifes are leeching all the resources and money like the poisonous maggots they are, and our world is a result of their vile behaviour and the fact they have far too much power.

wardropper
wardropper
Apr 9, 2020 1:48 AM
Reply to  Mucho

I couldn’t help feeling that “the elephant in the room” should have been a less noble creature… To borrow from your own text, perhaps a ten-foot tall poisonous maggot would be more appropriate?
Otherwise, your comment could not be more accurate.

atomician
atomician
Apr 9, 2020 5:59 AM
Reply to  Mucho

I think raising the possibility of Boris not being in hospital should be accompanied by some evidence.

Fewer words would be written if guided by that principle. You’re wasting our time.

1of7billion
1of7billion
Apr 10, 2020 12:27 AM
Reply to  Mucho

Muchos gracias for the reply Mucho:

You wrote:

“All your dreams of a better world are sadly misguided.”

I don’t think you quite got my point which as my comment was very long anyway I didn’t probably express in enough detail.

What I meant was that before 2 weeks ago, an awful lot of people had a lot of spare money to buy on luxuries, so that they frankly spent half their lives doing “retail therapy” buying more stuff than they could wear and buying replacement upgrades for everything you could imagine, including endless DIY, updating perfectly well decorated homes over and over with an incredible amount of perfectly good stuff – furniture, clothes, expensive technology that mostly even still works – going to the rubbish dumps in some mass demented feeding and wastemaking frenzy.

e.g. it was reported a few years back that the nation’s women where spending about £330 billion a year on fashion alone, which is roughly half the entire public services budget!

And people wonder why there’s no money for the NHS or other public services.

So I’m not suggesting these out of control and environmentally irresponsible citizens are suddenly going to all become like Buddhist monks in the simplicity of their needs, I’m just saying that if this economic collapse is as bad as many think it may be, all these millions of people who at present have really an awful lot of money to chuck around on what they don’t really need so far, are simply not going to have it any more.

So you might say “environmentalism” and “sustainable” production is going to be forced on them whether they like it or not, which I’m sure most people won’t, especially at first.

Likewise, a food rationing system, which also most people will hate, might actually do some good by helping dealing with the absolutely massive overweight problem.

There’s also some signs that this kind of crisis, like a genuine war, does make communities and nations pull together more, whether or not that is temporary is hard to say.

And there’s also at present talk of things like a Universal Basic Income, which nobody was really taking seriously before, which again, may actually be forced on the government against their wishes; as it appears at the moment they are going to have to provide for people by the millions who may not have jobs or businesses to go back to.

It might also somewhat sort out the punitive benefits system, because for the next while at least, there will be so many on benefits, claiming benefits will not only largely lose its stigma, but the authorities will be obliged to step down their persecution of the unemployed and too ill to work, because there will be just too many to be taking those steps, too many dependent on benefits, who they know work cannot be found for.

So in fact, I’m not for a moment disagreeing with you about the not very benevolent people in charge, since the Thatcher era anyway; but I’m saying that this situation is quite possibly forcing government and the people likewise to do things that neither currently much wants to do, but might on balance in the final analysis be good for them.

Like for example, production is being turned to medical needs, and that also needs to be done a lot more, generally speaking, and likewise, the need for more support for the NHS is being more clearly exposed.

I mean, I still wish none of this had happened, don’t get me wrong. All I’m saying is that sometimes disasters do produce good results, because change is needed, and it often does take a crisis to change things, such as it was only after WWII that the NHS and welfare state and pensions and free university education for all were brought in.

Ordinary citizens never had any of those things before, in the history of our life on planet Earth really, so you’ve got to see how big that was, and also to realise that those changes themselves, only came due to an election, after only about 30 or 40 years earlier getting universal suffrage, also for the first time in our history.

Which brings me to your other remark:

” We are ruled by a bunch of lower than low, amoral, war criminal, genocidal scumbags. That’s the problem. You can imagine all the good things that may come of this that you want, but all you are doing is ignoring the elephant in the room. The problem is the scum that rules over us, that’s the problem, and until that is addressed, nothing will ever change for the better.”

So absolutely yes, and I’ve been saying exactly that in many or most of my other comments here.

And that logically can only be done by either violent revolution or changing the electoral system, so I keep banging on about electoral reform, though I don’t think people are buying into it too much as they can’t really see beyond the present situation.

So I have suggested two changes are needed – full PR (which they have already in Germany and elsewhere) and getting public control over electoral candidate lists, so people have candidates to vote for who represent them, instead of the sort we get now, who are almost always put there and answerable only to some special interest group, including of course the rich elite.

So apparently over 300,000 people agree with me who have signed this petition for full PR on change.org, and the counter is going up very fast – I suspect the penny is finally beginning to drop that we need to find a way to get these unaccountable lunatics out of power, while we’ve still got the chance, assuming we get out of this current crisis, sooner or later, or otherwise it will have to be mass protest, and if it comes to it, non-electoral revolution will be the only possible way out.

https://www.change.org/p/the-2019-election-did-not-represent-voters-fix-britain-s-broken-democracy?source_location=petitions_browse

So let’s hope it doesn’t come to that, but we didn’t get a let’s say 50% free society by accident, it was fought for, and as human nature hasn’t fundamentally changed, it will be fought for again if necessary.

wardropper
wardropper
Apr 9, 2020 1:09 AM
Reply to  1of7billion

Well here’s my short answer to your very long question:

Professor Knut Wittkowski was head of The Rockefeller University’s Department of Biostatistics, Epidemiology, and Research Design for 20 years.

Notice the little word, “was”…
Attention has been drawn here before to the fact that the experts in this field who are not afraid to speak out are those few who have now retired and do not therefore risk losing their livelihood.
The fear of opposing the vast majority of your peers while you are still employed by a prestigious university is a tremendously powerful disincentive to speak out. All one needs to do is mentally put oneself in the shoes of a promising, ambitious young academic to feel the full force of that disincentive.

wardropper
wardropper
Apr 9, 2020 1:19 AM
Reply to  wardropper

And of course the vast majority of your peers does not possess the courage to protest “received government/media dogma”, even when the science behind it is wretched and incompetent.

Germs Bond
Germs Bond
Apr 9, 2020 1:11 AM
Reply to  1of7billion

How do you get from an overblown if not outright fake pandemic to the idea a new sustainable economy? There seems no natural connection although the MSM have pushed the same agenda from the beginning. You have also hinted at a connection between fake anthropogenic global warming and the fake pandemic.

Why?

paul
paul
Apr 8, 2020 7:56 PM

What can you say about the utterly contemptible, low life, no hoper, incompetent subhuman scum who are lording it over us?
They could walk under a snake’s belly wearing a top hat.
Totally incompetent, whether it’s the Orange Baboon in the White House, the corrupt clueless filth in Brussels, or the Westminster vermin in the UK.
Stealing basic medical supplies from one another like common thieves.
Frantically casting around for scapegoats to cover their arses, whether it’s China, Russia, or the WHO.
Lying through their teeth as usual and trying to throw up a smokescreen.
Poland blocked Russian relief flights to Italy.
Czechoslovakia stole Chinese relief supplies in transit to Italy.
The Exceptional Folk stole anything they could from Canada, Germany, and just about everybody else.
Trying to buy up new vaccines for their exclusive use and profit.
Doing absolutely nothing to help hard pressed Spain and Italy.
They were just left to fend for themselves.
The only countries who have tried to help are China, Russia, and Cuba.
China sent medical teams and supplies to 89 countries, the poorest on earth among them, while still suffering from its own outbreak.
Russia did the same on a smaller scale, even while facing its own imminent outbreak, the only people to come to the aid of New York.
Tiny, impoverished, sanctioned Cuba sent medical teams all over the world, including northern Italy, one of the most prosperous parts of Europe.
Trump showed his gratitude in typical fashion, spitting in their faces.
Imposing further sanctions on Iran and Venezuela, and threatening an invasion of the latter.
One can only hope that Americans and Europeans learn a salutary lesson from their experience.

Arsebiscuits
Arsebiscuits
Apr 8, 2020 11:00 PM
Reply to  paul

China are donating to fix their image.

wardropper
wardropper
Apr 9, 2020 1:51 AM
Reply to  Arsebiscuits

Well at least “we don’t want people to think we’re cold and ruthless” resembles a conscience and a desire to make good.

paul
paul
Apr 9, 2020 5:29 PM
Reply to  Arsebiscuits

It’s called soft power, goodwill, and basic humanity.
As opposed to bombing and starving people.

RobG
RobG
Apr 8, 2020 7:45 PM

Trump has just ordered tens of thousands of military troops onto the streets of America (because the psychopaths who rule us know what’s coming).

In the last week alone, nearly six million Americans have been made unemployed. These are already historic levels, and they are expected to get even worse over the coming weeks.

Likewise in the UK, and many other European countries.

Likewise the German economy has now tanked to levels never seen before (including the Weimar Republic).

This isn’t just an economic crash; we’re looking at a total explosion of western society.

And all the psychopaths can do is bring out the Frankenstein flu in a vain attempt to cover their total incompetence and criminality.

*cough* *cough*

John Pretty
John Pretty
Apr 8, 2020 8:26 PM
Reply to  RobG

Thanks for the fear porn Rob. I’ll go and take a shit now. (If I can find any loo roll).

tfs
tfs
Apr 8, 2020 8:49 PM
Reply to  John Pretty

I’ll let you into an alternative secret supply.

It may not be quilted but you’ll have a smile as you wipe ur arse on the face off some unlikeable characters.

Look to the Sun, Daily mail and the like……

RobG
RobG
Apr 8, 2020 9:59 PM
Reply to  John Pretty

It’s not fear porn, John (you need the presstitutes for that, who have been pumping it out non-stop 24/7 for weeks now). I am actually trying to be responsible, in that I don’t shy away from the reality of what’s going on (everyone knows a major economic collapse is happening), but at the same time I’m not talking Mad Max stuff.

jay
jay
Apr 8, 2020 8:52 PM
Reply to  RobG

It is still about greed, not idiology for now.
A bankster hiest…

lod
lod
Apr 8, 2020 9:09 PM
Reply to  RobG

So two days ago our loveable rogue of a PM is rushed into the ICU. Anyone who has ever been in an ICU will tell you that the poor sods in there are one step away from the end game.
Low and behold two days later and BoJo is now sitting up having a good old chin wag with everyone!
What utter horse s**t. But like everything else concerning this modern day plague the great British public will swallow it whole.

RobG
RobG
Apr 8, 2020 10:10 PM
Reply to  lod

Iod, in my own little sphere I find it amazing how so many people, from all sides of politics, see through the Boris bullshit.

The most important question is, perhaps: who’s running the country? The answer to that seems to be Sir Mark Sedwill, and a bunch of other unelected, shadowy characters.

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
Apr 8, 2020 10:52 PM
Reply to  RobG

More an implosion than an explosion.

Seamus Padraig
Seamus Padraig
Apr 8, 2020 7:30 PM

SWEDISH UPDATE

RT–yes, that RT!–has just published a very alarmist and deceptive article: Sweden using ice rinks and shipping containers as morgues overflow due to Covid-19 deaths.

“Sweden opted to forego a total lockdown, imposing only minor restrictions on public life and movement. It has seen more cases than its Scandinavian counterparts Norway, 6,086 with 89 deaths, and Denmark 5,266 with 203 deaths …

“Sweden currently has 7,693 confirmed cases of coronavirus infection, while the country’s death toll stands at 591.”

Did you all catch that? Sweden has more cases in absolute terms than than the other Scandanavian countries. But nowhere does the article bother to mention that Sweden has a larger population–in fact, Sweden is nearly is big as Norway and Denmark put together! So what would the statistics be in relative terms? Well, drawing from Wikipedia as a source, here are the populations of the three countries:

Sweden 10,333,456
Denmark 5,822,763
Norway 5,367,580

So what would the number of cases per capita and number of deaths per capita be?

Sweden 0.0007 0.00005
Denmark 0.0009 0.00003
Norway 0.0011 0.00002

Well, it doesn’t look all that alarming now, does it! Not much difference at all, really … certainly not by any order of magnitude. Strangely enough, Sweden even seems to be ‘beating’ the other two countries in terms of cases per capita, which is nowhere mentioned in the article.

So what are we supposed to surmise here? That Sweden has a shortage of funeral morgues and mortuaries? Is this just more fake news, like that story about New York City burying dead people in Central Park?

Oh, later in the article, RT does eventually let this little tidbit drop: “However, even authorities in the Finnish capital Helsinki have taken similar extreme measures, renting out refrigerated shipping containers, despite Finland having far fewer coronavirus deaths than its neighbors.”

So are these ice rinks in Sweden even being used as morgues right now at all? Or is the government just renting them as a precaution as in neighboring Finland? This article is so misleading and convoluted, it’s hard to say.

Why do Normies still think that RT is ‘our’ source? They’re really not much better than CNN or the NY Times.

Seamus Padraig
Seamus Padraig
Apr 8, 2020 7:33 PM
Reply to  Seamus Padraig

I’m sorry if the numbers are hard to read, but the spacing got lost when I hit the ‘Post Comment’ button.

clickkid
clickkid
Apr 8, 2020 8:01 PM
Reply to  Seamus Padraig

Oue ‘source’ is the real physical world.

That’s good enough for me.

Portonchok
Portonchok
Apr 8, 2020 9:28 PM
Reply to  Seamus Padraig

RT has gone downhill in the past year or two. They used to be objective but now are the Russian propaganda equivalent of CNN…almost. Sadly.

Berlin Beerman
Berlin Beerman
Apr 8, 2020 10:03 PM
Reply to  Seamus Padraig

Now that the gas pipelines are built, the constitution is being re-written , don’t think Mr,Putin won’t play the game a little differently , especially if your “partners” across the pond want to snuggle up with you a bit more. Fuck, CNN may even play a positive piece on Mr.Putin.

I’m not suggesting that’s a bad thing, but eventually, everyone needs to play the game to get what they want. RT is a tool. Its always been, no different than CBC, BBC, etc. To think otherwise would be folly.

Shit, I what am I saying? Could it be as simple as the fact that Russia still looks at Sweden’s political operatives as vermin – to be decimated at any chance presented? Even if they did get the pandemic hoax right….. fuck em.

George Mc
George Mc
Apr 8, 2020 10:58 PM
Reply to  Seamus Padraig

As soon as you see “RT” you know it’s not worth reading.

Grafter
Grafter
Apr 9, 2020 1:54 AM
Reply to  Seamus Padraig

RT has become like Sky News. Avoid it.

paul
paul
Apr 9, 2020 5:31 PM
Reply to  Grafter

RT is streets ahead of any major channel.
That doesn’t mean you have to swallow its content whole.

wardropper
wardropper
Apr 9, 2020 2:01 AM
Reply to  Seamus Padraig

I have to admit it’s only a couple of weeks since I read a decent article in RT which gave most of our western governments a pretty good shagging on all sorts of political issues.
We should keep a perspective on this though. Time passes, and awareness evolves. If you go back 10 – 15 years, even the Huffington Post and the Groan seemed to be interested in revealing controversial truths. Not any more, of course.
So RT sinking into the same mire wouldn’t be a big surprise for me either, sadly.

Roberto
Roberto
Apr 9, 2020 2:17 PM
Reply to  Seamus Padraig

RT definitely tend to be more strident than they were even a short time ago. But I’ve just assumed that it’s been necessary in view of the non-stop Russia bashing by the Western MSM for the last many years.
BTW, Siberian Times is fun; no politics, very informative, uplifting, and interesting articles about a wide range of topics – history, social, amusing, etc.

Harry Stotle
Harry Stotle
Apr 8, 2020 6:48 PM

Leaving aside the fact we all want Julian Assange out of Belmarsh (for obvious reasons) I suppose the logic of the arguments of many here is that COVID-19 does not provide any leverage for temporary release?

Waldorf
Waldorf
Apr 8, 2020 7:22 PM
Reply to  Harry Stotle

Some countries have released many prisoners, and others are talking about doing so. They should release Assange but they probably won’t.

Harry Stotle
Harry Stotle
Apr 8, 2020 7:53 PM
Reply to  Waldorf

Personally I agree but such a position would not be consistent with several Off-G articles that argue that there is nothing exceptional about this pathogen – in other words prisoners are not usually deemed at risk from the common cold, or other corona viruses that are circulating.

bob
bob
Apr 8, 2020 8:19 PM
Reply to  Waldorf

the ‘official’ reason for his non-release is that he’s not a remand prisoner – hohum

Harry Stotle
Harry Stotle
Apr 8, 2020 8:52 PM
Reply to  bob

Yes, I saw that – but the point raised here is that corona presents no special threat to prisoners (according to the recent Off-G narrative) and therefore cannot be used as an argument to get him out.

I assume their logic would be that prisoners die in jail every day from respiratory pathogens and there is no extra danger to those in Belmarsh?

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
Apr 8, 2020 10:54 PM
Reply to  Waldorf

They CERTAINLY won’t. I fully expect him to die in Belmarsh.

Mike Ellwood
Mike Ellwood
Apr 9, 2020 1:52 AM
Reply to  Waldorf

And yet some countries (maybe even the same countries) are talking about jailing lockdown-refuseniks. Logic isn’t the strong point of psychopathic government.

harry stotle
harry stotle
Apr 9, 2020 9:51 AM
Reply to  Mike Ellwood

I was asking about the logic of Off-G’s position, or indeed the vast majority of commentators who see virtually no threat from this pathogen.

To restate a simple question: do they accept legal arguments that COVID-19 provides a potentially serious threat to incarcerated communities therefore justifying arguments about the need for temporary release (taking Julian Assange as an exemplar)?

So far nobody has addressed this point instead giving other reasons why he should be out (which I fully agree with, of course) or shifting focus to the way governments behave.

Playing Devil’s advocate I assume it would be inconsistent for Off-G to support release on these grounds because of the epidemiological data they have linked to, not to mention some of the more arcane theories about altitude sickness or psychosomatic causes of lung hyperinflammation?

Admin2
Admin
Admin2
Apr 9, 2020 1:54 PM
Reply to  harry stotle

I think there’s always a danger of legitimising a phoney narrative if you buy into it self-servingly. This could be extremely damaging moving forward, yes. EDIT: the authorities have made it clear they are not releasing prisoners who are a ‘national security concern’. Arguing for his release could only be on the grounds of increased danger to his life, which would probably play into the current narrative. Yes.

Arsebiscuits
Arsebiscuits
Apr 8, 2020 6:23 PM

How long was he with Rockefeller for and what capacity?

Mucho
Mucho
Apr 8, 2020 10:15 PM
Reply to  Arsebiscuits

From the Journeyman Pictures Original YT Broadcast:
“Perspectives on the Pandemic Episode 2: In this explosive second edition of Perspectives on the Pandemic, Professor Knut Wittkowski, for twenty years head of The Rockefeller University’s Department of Biostatistics, Epidemiology, and Research Design, says that social distancing and lockdown is the absolutely worst way to deal with an airborne respiratory virus. “

Mucho
Mucho
Apr 8, 2020 10:31 PM
Reply to  Mucho

In other words, he’s far more qualified than any of the scum the British Establishment have wheeled out to sell this outright assault to our health on the British public and the wider world. These criminals are bang to rights, they are the lowest of the low, they have no ethics, no credibility, they have deliberately engineered this situation to ensure a second wave of illness and to guarantee we do not reach herd immunity so the vultures behind the vaccines can feed on the corpse which has been left for them and to fuche through the Satanic ID2020 scheme https://id2020.org/.
They will be using the limited timeframe ie the potential for this to return in the Autumn, as the leverage to ramp up the fear and hysteria to the point where folk are queueing up for their toxic, poisonous, nano-technology ridden, DNA altering vaccine.
There is a lot more to it than that, but all the crimes which are taking place as a result of this, lockdowns, loss of rights, extra rights to the police, crashing of the economy, businesses being flushed down the toilet, maxed out anxiety and fear levels in the community, cancer patients being denied vital treatment, racketeering by the banks, Matt Hancock being given lots of airtime, really vile crimes, are all taking place because the scum who rule over us have decided they have the right to play God with our health, in the most dangerous way possible. This is sick beyond words. This is not an accident. This is what happens when a bunch of odious, good for nothing, disgusting war criminals control your world

Willem
Willem
Apr 8, 2020 6:14 PM
jack(jim)
jack(jim)
Apr 8, 2020 7:25 PM
Reply to  Willem

The democratic party elite and most of it;s members would rather have Trump than Bernie.

bob
bob
Apr 8, 2020 7:25 PM
Reply to  Willem

believing anything Tyler Durden writes is equivalent to believing anything the current labour party, under the leadership of Keir Starmer, says. He is a fraud.

milosevic
milosevic
Apr 8, 2020 11:10 PM
Reply to  bob
paul
paul
Apr 8, 2020 6:14 PM

Boynie Sanders has just thrown in the towel.
So it’s Creepy Joe v. The Orange Baboon.

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
Apr 8, 2020 10:56 PM
Reply to  paul

Boynie really put up a fight, didn’t he?

paul
paul
Apr 9, 2020 5:34 PM

Boynie couldn’t fight his way out of a paper bag. Like Jezza.

Loverat
Loverat
Apr 8, 2020 5:57 PM

Superb coverage. Off G – what an act to follow. Peter Hitchens (it’sMr Hitchens to you) is still slightly behind the curve, catching up. This is the place to read the real news.

Mike Mos
Mike Mos
Apr 8, 2020 8:00 PM
Reply to  Loverat

Peter Hitchens is stuck in 1968. Saying bold things might run in the family, charisma clearly doesn’t.

Mike Mos
Mike Mos
Apr 8, 2020 5:08 PM

As for Wittkowski: some valid points, but when he says he has no idea why governments are trying to flatten the curve, it sounds as if he has an agenda, or that he is simply missing what this is all about: It’s about not overloading the health care system.

And for all you pseudo-rebellious gullible souls here who think that’s all a lie… you did know the peak in hospitals is expected at the end of May, right? So yeah, #filmyourhospital all you want, but it would be good to first understand some basics here.

Other than that, the interviewer still has a lot to learn. You just don’t say “….that’s fantastic!” after your subject answers a question. It shows how biased you are.

non dimenticare
non dimenticare
Apr 8, 2020 5:33 PM
Reply to  Mike Mos

I don’t quite understand the down votes, because if you look on various health sites (not newspaper or television sites) for a definition of flattening the curve, they will state that it is a suppression of the peak of the curve by “squishing” it so that the “tail” extends into the future for the purpose of not overburdening health facilities.

Willem
Willem
Apr 8, 2020 5:47 PM

‘ And for all you pseudo-rebellious gullible souls here who think that’s all a lie… you did know the peak in hospitals is expected at the end of May, right’

Wrong

The peak in hospital admission was predicted (by yours truly) when temps got because that is what you saw in Wuhan and also see now (although it may be to early to call) in Italy and NL

After all common cold viruses, like corona viruses are winter viruses.

So get outside and enjoy the sun

Willem
Willem
Apr 8, 2020 5:48 PM
Reply to  Willem
Rhys Jaggar
Rhys Jaggar
Apr 8, 2020 7:03 PM
Reply to  Willem

We are having similar in the UK. Next three days more like August during the day, obviously much cooler at night. No rain here to speak of now for four and a half weeks and very little on the horizon either.

Mike Mos
Mike Mos
Apr 8, 2020 6:14 PM
Reply to  Willem

Wrong…? You send me links of the RIVM but seem to be too lazy to look up this graph: https://www.rivm.nl/coronavirus-covid-19/wat-doen-we-in-nederland/hoe-berekeningen-bijdragen-aan-bestrijding-van-virus (I just love that red line, we could call it the Wittkowski line) Hospital admission is only half the story.

Are you interested in facts or just facts that support your ‘expert’ gut feelings?

Willem
Willem
Apr 8, 2020 6:22 PM
Reply to  Mike Mos

Look at the link I gave you, figure : ‘In ziekenhuis opgenomen patiënten’

Meaning: ‘no of people admitted to hospital’ (due to Covid19), which clearly show a trend downwards.

Tell me what I see wrongly in that graph

Willem
Willem
Apr 8, 2020 6:27 PM
Reply to  Willem

Or look at page 1-8 of this document

https://www.rivm.nl/sites/default/files/2020-04/COVID-19_WebSite_rapport_20200408_1036%20%281%29.pdf

It’s all going down. Covid19 is getting burned by the sun and the good weather in NL, and the experts are ‘baffled’

It may be too early to call, but the trend is definitely there.

Enjoy

Waldorf
Waldorf
Apr 8, 2020 7:25 PM
Reply to  Willem

Hope so. There has been speculation warmer weather may mitigate this thing, but some experts reject it or at least say there is no evidence. Flu does however become less virulent in warmer weather. I have personally never had flu in the warmer months of the year.

Mike Mos
Mike Mos
Apr 8, 2020 6:32 PM
Reply to  Willem

You see it correctly. But look at the graph I sent you and try to understand what a decline in the number of admissions actually means. It doesn’t mean the peak has passed. It doesn’t mean we can all just go out. The peak of people in hospital is yet to come. And that’s what matters most, not how many admissions there are. The number of admissions lowering is a good sign though!

clickkid
clickkid
Apr 8, 2020 8:06 PM
Reply to  Mike Mos

“It doesn’t mean we can all just go out. ”

Well, I’m fucking well going out – so there!

Mike Mos
Mike Mos
Apr 8, 2020 8:25 PM
Reply to  clickkid

Oh, rebel you!

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
Apr 9, 2020 9:17 AM
Reply to  Mike Mos

More ‘Fuck you Jack-I’m OK’. Until he’s not.

Admin2
Admin
Admin2
Apr 9, 2020 12:56 PM

So, you think the panic is justified, and the danger ever-present and real, and flouting these measures could lead to serious harm? Aren’t you taking more of a leap here, imagining there’s anything fishy going on, with potentially very little evidence? Some soldiers stayed in a Wuhan hotel. Engineered corona viruses exist, we guess?

But the fear narrative is what is making ALL of this possible. And the chances of anyone awakening are that much smaller, the more justification they have for those fears. If we entirely lose perspective of the, at present, humdrum aspects of this ‘disease’, I argue that fewer and fewer people will ever cotton on to what is potentially happening here.

Could this not be potentially extremely counterproductive moving forward?

Tony
Tony
Apr 9, 2020 2:32 PM
Reply to  Admin2

Admin 2,

It is potentially extremely counterproductive moving forward, the problem is the only people that appear to be moving forward at the present juncture are not of the general population but the controllers in their onward march towards the so-called ‘New World Order’ and ‘One World Government’ etc., etc. that’s been on the cards for years now.

The $65, 000 dollar question is what is their next move, could it be in connection with the dollar itself to either dump, strengthen or switch to a digital something else?

Willem
Willem
Apr 8, 2020 6:32 PM
Reply to  Mike Mos

Dude, I just looked up your rivm reference, showing me the famous flattening of the curve ‘model’. I repeat: flattening of the curve m o d e l

Well, the model doesn’t work since it doesn’t include temperature.

If you don’t believe me, look at the links I gave and see for yourself that there is a clear correlation between good weather and less Covid19 hospitalizations, etc

Mike Mos
Mike Mos
Apr 8, 2020 7:18 PM
Reply to  Willem

I’ll just assume you understand the difference between correlation and causation. I believe the scientific consensus is that we don’t know yet whether this virus is seasonal. Could be, but SARS and MERS didn’t seem to be. MERS supposedly started in Saudi-Arabia. Not exactly the coldest place. Maybe that’s why seasonality isn’t included in the model? Because the scientists just don’t know yet?

But you seem to know more than the model makers. Because you’re an expert right? Because you look at the RIVM graph, you see the number go down and that confirms what you already knew in your gut: that this is just like the flu and it will be gone in summer. Who needs experts when you can have a random guy on an internet forum?

But just a question…. how do you explain that the number of hospitalizations peaked on the 2nd of April, while the average temperatures in the Netherlands only rose after the 5th of April?

https://www.knmi.nl/nederland-nu/weer/waarnemingen

Is that what you call ‘clear correlation’?

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
Apr 9, 2020 9:19 AM
Reply to  Mike Mos

We know next to nothing about this mysterious micro-organism. Better get ready for some unpleasant surprises.

[on what are you basing this observation? They have apparently isolated an undiscovered corona virus, and it’s behaviour seems to be pretty typical of previous flu outbreaks, despite massively inefficient medical services on emergency lockdown and potentially extremely inflated statistics -ed)

Admin2
Admin
Admin2
Apr 9, 2020 1:12 PM

PLEASE, could you refrain from making generalised foreboding remarks. By all means bring up any reservations you have, but against the current backdrop of constant fear being pumped at everyone from all direction, these disconcerting comments really achieve nothing except make any sort of objective discussion BTL more difficult.

Mike Mos
Mike Mos
Apr 8, 2020 5:58 PM

I do understand the downvotes. That which threatens the pack needs to be downvoted. Such rebel.

snow
snow
Apr 8, 2020 6:21 PM
Reply to  Mike Mos

I think you’re missing the point. Basically if there had been no confinement, what the data known so far tells us is that there would not have been any noticeable overcrowding of hospitals, not any more than at worst a bad year. Possibly you’re not familiar with hospitals. I unfortunately am because Ive looked after for someone very close for nearly 10 years until recently. So you would know about overcrowding at hospitals, of the total disarray of hospital staff who cannot cope, year in and year out.
Also my experience is mine and one should not extrapolate from one experience. So just look up data about admissions to emergency and reanimation over the last 15 years say. That cuts, underfunding, and the lack of staff are an issue is nothing new.
If they are worse this year, its because the panic has created a rush to hospital of multiple patients who would not go there otherwise: where I am if you had high temperature and felt worried today you would have little choice but go to hospital, and if you somehow manage to see a doctor in town, he’d be likely to send you there out of fright, where in any other year, you would be given possibly some antibiotics, possibly only told to take paracetamol and stay at home.
That too many people with all sorts of infections from all sorts of viruses are therefore rushing to the same place, a hospital, obviously then they are likely to make one other worse, given each is in a weak state to begin with, and so on and so forth…
Also staff testing positive but have no symptom are made to stay home; in a usual year this does not happen. Also many foreign staff have left for their home countries. So you have ended up with less staff than usual on top of everything else.

Mike Mos
Mike Mos
Apr 8, 2020 6:50 PM
Reply to  snow

You put all of this down to panic with people overflowing hospitals because they *think* they might have something. I think that is too simplistic.

I just read in this thread that NYT reported that people who think they might have a heart attack are seemingly staying away from hospitals. The number of people with symptoms of heart attacks are down from normal. This might be an indication that actually people are staying away from hospitals.

Berlin Beerman
Berlin Beerman
Apr 8, 2020 10:27 PM
Reply to  Mike Mos

You know Mike, your a lost cause. I have read your threads and tried to keep an open mind reading your notes.

First of all, the Health Care System are a mess and they needed to be overhauled a long while ago. That is not happening today , even with this outbreak – which does threaten the them.

All I see is reactive measures. Nothing was learned from SAR’s or MER’s or even the H1N1 outbreaks buy these neanderthals. Instead we purged ahead same old. Now its going to cost much much more to out a bandage on, never mind cure the system of its internal disease.

So frankly when society is made to “flatten a curve” that is manipulated to begin with, to hide away based on flawed data, misrepresented data , misinterpreted data, to say the least, its not going to work. Scare them as much as you can, nature works in other ways.

Go ahead, whats the end game – vaccinations? Against what? a mutated virus – did you not learn anything from the germ theory , from how vaccinations impede natural cycles.

We are not dealing with Ebola here Mike. This version of corona needs to pass through the populace, people need to build a natural immunity to it, its that simple. People will die and there is no accurate data that at this time indicates this virus is any more dangerous than a flu virus that kills just as effectively through secondary infections and conditions like pneumonia.

That data is there. The ICU’s projections are dramatically overstated – they need to be to hold this absurd agenda.

When we do get a proper viral outbreak that threatens humanity, I will be sure to let you know. In the meantime , distance yourself, stay inside and wear a diaper over your head for safe measure.

Mike Mos
Mike Mos
Apr 8, 2020 11:19 PM
Reply to  Berlin Beerman

Dear Berlin Beerman. Thanks for keeping an open mind and spending so many words on a lost cause. I tried my best, but unfortunately your English is not the best. So it’s hard to tell whether things are lost in translation (English is hopefully not your first language) or that you simply have no clue whatsoever. Take care!

Tim Drayton
Tim Drayton
Apr 9, 2020 3:28 PM
Reply to  Mike Mos

Sorry, but if that post was made by someone with English as a second language, it is excellently written and makes perfect sense.

Mike Mos
Mike Mos
Apr 9, 2020 3:39 PM
Reply to  Tim Drayton

Ah, thanks for letting me know it’s excellently written. That leads us to conclude the guy has no clue whatsoever then.

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
Apr 9, 2020 9:33 AM
Reply to  Berlin Beerman

The latest news from the vaccine front includes claims that a vaccine will be impossible, as with SARS, or dangerous, or will be ineffective (Like ‘flu vaccines) or, best of all for BigPharma, will need to be given every year like the ‘flu vaccine. This is why the MSM sewer is so viciously against Hydroxychloroquine etc-it threatens BigPharma dreams of mega-profits, with a medication that is out of patent, therefore not a goldmine. And the presstitute scum join in, as well, simply out of their deranged hatred of EVERYTHING Trump says or does. Some Guardian pos was whining that Hydroxychloroquine is ‘dangerous’ yet it is prescribed everywhere for travelers to malarial regions. The dispensing doctor takes a history, and if you have cardiac problems, try something else. ALL medications are dangerous if misused. How low will the Guardian vermin go, and how much blood will be on their paws?

Frank Speaker
Frank Speaker
Apr 8, 2020 7:31 PM
Reply to  Mike Mos

😀👏🏻👍🏻

Nimrod
Nimrod
Apr 8, 2020 6:11 PM
Reply to  Mike Mos

A very suspicious point about Prof. Wittkowski’s comments is that he’s from The Rockefeller University. We know the doctrine of this university rather related to eugenic ideas.

Frank Speaker
Frank Speaker
Apr 8, 2020 7:35 PM
Reply to  Nimrod

He’s a knut too!

Roberto
Roberto
Apr 8, 2020 8:09 PM
Reply to  Nimrod

Eugenic ideas, 100 years ago, when it was all the socialist rage.

nondimenticare
nondimenticare
Apr 8, 2020 7:08 PM
Reply to  Mike Mos

I am by no means implying that flattening the curve has been a good idea, only that that is what has been done and that that is the official definition. In my opinion, this stretching of the timeline has disastrous negative implications for every aspect of our lives.

jay
jay
Apr 8, 2020 7:14 PM
Reply to  Mike Mos

“The saving the Health Service” meme is not supported by the numbers when compared with say a winter season in 2017 when there where 60000 excess winter deaths.
We have passed winter now so, we are comparing 6000 death with 60000 deaths…
The need to save the NHS was not required to save 10 times the numbers???????
Really???
But, it gets better, since
total deaths = died with covid + died because of covid.
The Itallian Healthe service pointed out that actual covid deaths were only 10%.
Sorry, the numbers do not support the “Saving the NHS.” tory strap line…

bob
bob
Apr 8, 2020 7:22 PM
Reply to  jay

saving the NHS when it’s doing its best to kill people by refusing on-going treatments, cancelling operations that they think are ‘not essential’ is as much a war crime as blowing up a wedding party in Syria

clickkid
clickkid
Apr 8, 2020 8:11 PM
Reply to  bob

Oh I don’t believe it. You criticised our ‘fantastic’ NHS.

You will have to clap extra hard next time.

jay
jay
Apr 8, 2020 8:18 PM
Reply to  bob

My friends wife will probably die as her op has been cancelled…

Mike Mos
Mike Mos
Apr 8, 2020 7:26 PM
Reply to  jay

As you seem to be good with numbers, could you please look up for me how many flu victims per year typically need to spend between 1o and 23 days on ICU? It doesn’t really matter whether they die of flu or with flu.

jay
jay
Apr 8, 2020 8:02 PM
Reply to  Mike Mos

I do not need to look it up thanks.
It is YOU who does not know what a person in difficulties from ‘flu requires.
My friends exe’s son ended up in a coma for 3 weeks when He nearly dies from ‘flu.
So, cleary you do not.
Thanks.

Mike Mos
Mike Mos
Apr 8, 2020 8:17 PM
Reply to  jay

Love your reasoning.

jay
jay
Apr 8, 2020 8:26 PM
Reply to  Mike Mos

Yeah, you should…but you won’t coz you are an idiot.

clickkid
clickkid
Apr 8, 2020 8:15 PM
Reply to  Mike Mos

About 6 inches below your post I mention the number of pneumonia deaths per year in the UK – example was 2012.

I should think quite a few of them spent some time in the old ICU – plus many of those who survived.

That’s your starting point.

Mike Mos
Mike Mos
Apr 8, 2020 8:57 PM
Reply to  clickkid

Well, no. The scientific consensus is that this is not just like any year. So if you want to claim otherwise, the onus is on you.

There’s just too many holes in your story to draw conclusions. You make too many assumptions, all in your favor. You are reasoning towards a conclusion. For instance, you can’t just assume “I should think quite a few of them spent some time in the old ICU”. Because that is one of the important points. Here in Holland the authorities worked with models that assumed people would stay in ICU for 10 days. At some point they changed that to 23 days, probably because the reality worked differently than their model.

So please look up how many people were in ICU in 2012 and how long they spent there. And if it’s the same now. And if you can’t find the answer, accept that you’re just not an expert, and that you don’t really have to say anything valuable on the subject beyond conjecture. You’re curious and can think for yourself, right? Or do you just want an easy narrative so you fit in with the pack here?

Frank Speaker
Frank Speaker
Apr 8, 2020 7:30 PM
Reply to  Mike Mos

Well said Mike, finally getting more balance in the discussions here as opposed to the rather paranoid foaming at the mouth by some commenters.

Sure, there’s lots to query and discuss, but lunacy and paranoia are not my cup of tea, except where there’s clear expert evidence of conspiracy existing such as JFK and 911 for example.

jay
jay
Apr 8, 2020 8:12 PM
Reply to  Frank Speaker

But, your cup of tea is plenty of ad hominem attacks.
I do not see many people here agreeing with you Frank you only seem to find support in couple of obvious sock puppets.

clickkid
clickkid
Apr 8, 2020 10:36 PM
Reply to  Mike Mos

“And for all you pseudo-rebellious gullible souls here who think that’s all a lie…”

If you can’t jeep the cheap insults out of it, then shut the fuck up.

Mike Mos
Mike Mos
Apr 8, 2020 10:57 PM
Reply to  clickkid

So after all your posts here you finally have someone questioning what you say and this is your reaction? I can picture you going through my posts, just to see if there’s anything you can brush me off with easily. Be my guest, it’s your loss. Did you already try to figure out the ICU numbers from 2012 beyond mere guesses?

clickkid
clickkid
Apr 8, 2020 11:31 PM
Reply to  Mike Mos

Nothing wrong with questioning.

I called you out on the insults – “you pseudo-rebellious gullible souls ”

I should think that of the near 30000 who died from pneumonia in the UK in 2012 plenty went to the ICU plus a few survivors.

Why do I think that?

Because, it’s quite common when somebody in hospital is on the point of death from a respiratory disease, to put that person in an ICU in an attempt to save their life.

Mike Mos
Mike Mos
Apr 9, 2020 12:39 AM
Reply to  clickkid

It was not intended as an insult, but rather as a description of most here. You included. “Well, I’m fucking well going out – so there!”, you said. What’s the worst that can happen to you? A fine? I would love to see how rebellious you are if there’s real danger involved. Like you (or a loved one near you) belonging to a vulnerable demographic in times of a virus. So that’s the ‘pseudo rebellious’ part.

And as for gullible… Anybody who uses phrases in a forum to show that they understand the mores is gullible in my book. Fitting in becomes more important than following the facts (or admitting that you don’t have the facts). What is “…covid-19 narrative puveyors [sic]…” even supposed to mean? Were you just trying to fit in?

Please tell me what you are trying to prove with your 28952 pneumonia deaths in 2012. Are you trying to say that if the medical system could handle that, it should also be able to handle the current situation? I hope not.

Hmad
Hmad
Apr 11, 2020 10:48 AM
Reply to  Mike Mos

Lots of valid points and maybe some not so valid. Everything he said may not have been completely ‘watertight’ but that doesn’t mean that everyone watching is a ‘gullible soul’.

Mike Mos
Mike Mos
Apr 11, 2020 4:51 PM
Reply to  Hmad

Well, as far as I can see, you’re only the second one here to say Wittkowski’s story might not be watertight. The rest is busy propping up their stories with anything that remotely seems to confirm their preconceived notions.

bob
bob
Apr 8, 2020 5:03 PM

“We must urgently return to the Rule of Law”

https://www.conservativelawyers.com/

a review of the current law relating to the ‘problematic’ lockdown where there appears no legal basis for how the lockdown is being implemented – there’s a downloadable pdf

Sgt Oddball
Sgt Oddball
Apr 8, 2020 5:19 PM
Reply to  bob

… and by the very rhetoric of your quote: – what does it mean to you when your own leaders *admit* they must ‘urgently *return* to the *rule of law*’?!…

*not having a pop, bob just playing to the gallery*… 😉

Sgt Oddball
Sgt Oddball
Apr 8, 2020 5:22 PM
Reply to  Sgt Oddball

… – debate below… – legalities/lawyers on the run?… – discuss:…

bob
bob
Apr 8, 2020 7:09 PM
Reply to  Sgt Oddball

surprisingly, conservative lawyers are NOT my leaders – playing to what gallery??

clickkid
clickkid
Apr 8, 2020 4:56 PM

You sometimes hear the covid-19 narrative puveyors talking about middle-aged People in ICUS etc to try and make their Point. There was a 40 years old in The Telegraph yesterday.

What does the data tell us for pneumonia in the UK?

———————————————–

How old were the people who died from pneumonia in the UK in 2012?

In 2012, of the 28,952 deaths from pneumonia:
▶58 were among those aged 0–14 years of age;
▶1,374 were among those aged 15–64; and
▶27,520 were among those aged 65 and above.
———————————————–

https://statistics.blf.org.uk/pneumonia

So, if 1374 people in the UK between the ages of 15 and 64 died of pneumonia in 2012, then we can assume that some multiple of that figure – say several thousand – needed breathing assistance at some Point – ventilator or ICU, since a good proportion would have survived.

jack(jim)
jack(jim)
Apr 8, 2020 5:17 PM
Reply to  clickkid

The UK is clearly in the grip of one of their many media generated hysteria moments, when only lies are pushed, we saw it in the Brexit operation.

Sgt Oddball
Sgt Oddball
Apr 8, 2020 5:32 PM
Reply to  clickkid

like the 21 year old lass who died in high wycombe?…

“I didn’t know that about your mother!!…”

Jane
Jane
Apr 8, 2020 4:54 PM

For those interested in the relationship between flu vaccinations for seasonal flu and so-called “pandemic” flu,” here is a link to a study performed after the H1N1 “pandemic” in 2009. https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2010/04/new-canadian-studies-suggest-seasonal-flu-shot-increased-h1n1-risk
“In a lengthy article published today in Public Library of Science Medicine (PLoSMed), researchers detail the results of four supplementary studies that were launched after an April 2009 school outbreak provided the first signal of an association between seasonal flu shots and pandemic flu illness. The studies, which took in about 2,700 people, found overall that the likelihood of needing medical attention for pandemic flu was 1.4 to 2.5 times greater among people who were vaccinated the previous fall… All four studies, the authors say, show that the seasonal flu vaccine was effective in that season, reducing cases of flu needing medical attention. But all four also show an increased risk of illness from pandemic flu among the vaccinated. The risks shown in the studies ranged from 1.19 to 3.20 times greater for those who received the seasonal vaccine than for those who did not.

RobG
RobG
Apr 8, 2020 7:12 PM
Reply to  Jane

Jane, I have two elderly aunts in the UK and France who have had very bad reactions to flu shots. My Mother, who now lives in France, refuses to take a flu shot, despite the present scare.

None of what I’m saying is scientific. It’s just personal experience, and that’s about all you can really relate.

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
Apr 8, 2020 11:40 PM
Reply to  RobG

Perhaps they’re allergic to aluminium.

Tony
Tony
Apr 8, 2020 4:31 PM

According to Professor Wittkowski then,

“Social distancing and lockdown is the absolutely worst way to deal with an airborne respiratory virus”

That’s one of the few things I agree with in what he states.

Unfortunately, we are back in the revolving door AGAIN, the only way to prove that this alleged virus is ‘infectious’ and that it is the sole cause ‘Covid-19’ symptoms is to isolate it and separate it from all other particles that may look like viruses but are not, take an electron micrograph of the pure particles, determine their size and shape and then prove that the particles are infectious using the necessary controls.

Only then can the virus be used as a gold standard of comparison for testing any stretches of RNA obtained from alleged Covid-19 patients that are claimed to come from the alleged genome of this coronavirus . This chap should know that too well if he was at Rockefeller University but he’ll probably never discuss that, and you’ll never receive a reference to any scientific paper by any scientist claiming to have isolated this ‘pathogenic virus’ by the proper methods and criteria required that I have specified on other threads. Remember, the same thing happened with Nobel Prizewinner Kary Mullis when he requested the original scientific paper claiming to have isolated the HIV (AIDS virus) he got fobbed off too.

What all this boils down to is a cover-up – public meetings are banned not because this alleged virus is infectious or contagious, on the contrary, how can it be – given what is required and what is never forthcoming in order to prove it? For example, a public meeting arranged with the authorities for example, would challenge them to produce concrete scientific evidence that the alleged virus really does cause Covid -19 which they CANNOT DO and sparks would start to fly. Other public meetings where the issue can be debated are also banned just in case people get to know too much about the scam.

Hence, divide and rule by social distancing and confinement.

In fact the only things that are being isolated at the present juncture in this fiasco are people and not pure ‘pathogenic’ coronavirus particles!!!

Tony
Tony
Apr 8, 2020 4:55 PM
Reply to  Tony

I would just like to add that when I said that I agreed with the Professor I meant that social distancing and lockdown were the absolutely the worst way to deal with the current problem from a public point of view. He is implying that the airborne respiratory problem is caused by virus I do NOT agree, he just ASSUMES that along with nearly everybody else.

Also, debating the issue on the internet is not the same as debating or discussing the issues face-to-face in a public meeting there are still issues that cannot be raised on the web for obvious reasons.

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
Apr 8, 2020 5:04 PM
Reply to  Tony

Are you a medical professional, Tony, or a professional epidemiologist? How do you conclude that this epidemic isn’t caused by a virus?

Tony
Tony
Apr 8, 2020 8:20 PM

I have a science and research background for all that’s worth. You will need to read all
my other posts and watch the videos I have posted on all the other threads on this website for the full details. Then make up your own mind.

Suffice to say, so far there are no scientists who are willing to put their names to any original scientific paper or papers that claim to have isolated pure virus particles and proved that this alleged coronavirus is the cause of Covid-19 syndrome. Everything else is absolutely dependent on that, and failure on the part of the authorities to make that information and proof available for scientific scrutiny means that there is a cover-up and the public are being deceived.

Epidemiology insofar as it involves official statistics and alternative statistics is unreliable if what I have stated is correct as there is no way of determining who has contracted Covid -19 per se, or the numbers that have died from it if the virus itself has never been physically isolated and used as the gold standard for tests. If that’s the case, then it is pure speculation to attribute Covid -19 to an unidentifiable alleged coronavirus is it not?

non dimenticare
non dimenticare
Apr 8, 2020 5:49 PM
Reply to  Tony

Descriptions of the disease tend inexplicably to go back and forth between droplet and air (aerosol) transmission. Can it be both?

Tony
Tony
Apr 8, 2020 8:50 PM

Non,

It goes back an forth based on their observation of patients with different symptoms that resemble those of what they have designated as Covid-19.

So-called ‘droplet infection’ and ‘aerosol’ transmission are similar in that if you sneeze or cough the alleged virus particles go into the air! That is how they imagine the alleged virus spreads and is contagious without proof that the virus actually exists or that the patient ever contracted their symptoms that way from any virus in the first place! Even if there is some other antigenic material in the droplets or being produced from inside the body itself due to other factors they will ignore that and still say its the virus.

JudyJ
JudyJ
Apr 8, 2020 11:16 PM
Reply to  Tony

Research now says that 6ft not nearly effective enough! I have seen different distances suggested (one up to 39 feet) but this article suggests a minimum of 20 feet outdoors. Fine in the US but not sure how workable in the UK. 😀

Anyone else see a total lockdown coming?

https://www.oregonlive.com/coronavirus/2020/04/6-feet-of-social-distancing-not-nearly-enough-cdcs-recommendation-driving-some-experts-nuts.html

Tony
Tony
Apr 9, 2020 12:51 PM
Reply to  JudyJ

Hi Judy,

Excuse the language but now I really think they are taking the piss to measure our compliance/obedience to this lockdown. Everybody is so overwhelmed with the virus propaganda they forget that it could be an airborne toxin that has nothing to do with an alleged virus or as many others are suggesting it could just be the usual seasonal colds and flu-like symptoms dressed up as Covid-19 including cases of pneumonia -especially in the elderly.

Diseases can also be spread by the use of new EM energy weapons nobody would at first notice the difference. I also forgot to mention that climatic changes are also linked with electromagnetic changes. The chemistry that constitutes our physical body is electromagnetic and chemistry at base level is all about electrical charges and charge distributions. If that’s disrupted in a deleterious way either from the inside or from outside we can become ill.

But, whatever it is there’s still no concrete scientific proof that its down to coronavirus. It does however, coincide with big changes in the global economy and financial system that are underway and is a brilliant distraction and will fit the frame nicely for an excuse for implementing those changes.

Willem
Willem
Apr 8, 2020 6:00 PM
Reply to  Tony

If you look at this report, last page, you see that the pcr + rate of ‘Covid19’ has gone up. That at least assumes to me that we are witnessing some sort of infection.

https://www.rivm.nl/sites/default/files/2020-04/COVID-19_WebSite_rapport_20200408_1036%20%281%29.pdf

I agree that the measures imposed to prevent infection are draconian

Roberto
Roberto
Apr 8, 2020 5:18 PM
Reply to  Tony

Newspeak: Social Distancing.
Correctspeak: Public Distancing.
Object: Distrust and fear strangers and neighbours.

Sgt Oddball
Sgt Oddball
Apr 8, 2020 6:29 PM
Reply to  Roberto

wind yourself up in plastic sheet,… *DO NOT* approach *within 6 feet* of another prole… *LAY DOWN* in your grave…. – (be a good little citizen, yeah?…)

Tony
Tony
Apr 8, 2020 8:32 PM
Reply to  Roberto

Yes Roberto,

Paranoia is beginning to manifest in some people along with agoraphobia, the longer this scam goes on, other forms of psychopathology will surface too such as depression. Fear of the known and the unknown can add to the problem and increase any stress and anxiety that may arise from the isolation, frustration and confinement regime.

Rhys Jaggar
Rhys Jaggar
Apr 8, 2020 7:06 PM
Reply to  Tony

I think you need to give them some slack. When you have a new infectious agent, of course they cannot prove everything straight away. That is just cold hard medical and scientific reality.

So think like a parent for a moment: if you could not quantify how dangerous something might be for your kid, would you say Yes or No?

Frank Speaker
Frank Speaker
Apr 8, 2020 7:39 PM
Reply to  Rhys Jaggar

Well said Rhys, nice to see a voice of reason.

Roberto
Roberto
Apr 8, 2020 8:25 PM
Reply to  Rhys Jaggar

It’s not new, it’s just a variation. And kids aren’t at any risk out of the ordinary, i.e. near zero, and they have a major role in developing herd immunity. That’s one of the themes of the interviewee, and many others who know about such things but aren’t listened to.
Also, ‘flattening the curve’ is a euphemism for making the outbreak last longer, yet having as many fatalities, delaying immunity, and virtually ensuring a secondary outbreak occurs later in the year.
Meanwhile, we have bureaucrats and minor local politicians deciding which businesses and services are essential or non-essential, ostensibly without bias. /S.

Tony
Tony
Apr 8, 2020 10:56 PM
Reply to  Rhys Jaggar

Hi Rhys,

I think that you know by now full-well where I’m coming from on this issue. The problem is Rhys, with a matter as serious as the one that has been foisted upon us and which we now have to face, there is not much time left for diplomacy and cutting slack.

People whether they like it or not have to be told the truth and then make up their own minds while they still can. Unfortunately, the odds are stacked against them from doing just that in the face of the outrageous propaganda and ‘contagion’ idiocy which they keep associating or correlating with an alleged deadly ‘coronavirus’, without any concrete scientific proof of that. All other potential causes are being deliberately and blatantly EXCLUDED by the authorities.

I notice that you cautiously used the term ‘infectious agent’. Well, I can go along with you on that one, except that it is extremely doubtful that an alleged ‘pathogenic virus’ is the cause, they have had more than ample time to publish the paper on that one proving the virus, and as I have stated more times than I can remember it will never see the light of day because a ‘pathogenic coronavirus’ hasn’t been proven to physically exist, or should I say it exists in name only. That original paper is absolutely necessary to put this whole issue to rest, but unfortunately my bet is WE WILL NEVER SEE IT short of a miracle!

By the way, ‘infections’ can now be spread by forms of electromagnetic energy – that would also qualify as an “infectious agent” – the Russian Vlail Kasnecheyev proved that in thousands of experiments on the cytopathogenic effect.

(Vlail P. Kaznachev and LP Mikhalova, Ultraweak Radiations in Intercellular Interactions [in Russian], Novosibirsk, 1981).

Charlotte Russe
Charlotte Russe
Apr 8, 2020 4:24 PM

A former Colorado State Patrol trooper, was handcuffed in front of his 6-year old daughter on a near-empty softball field Sunday near Brighton Beach in Brooklyn NY. Police officers were enforcing social distancing rules. The department was forced to apologize on Tuesday afternoon, calling the incident an overreach by our police officers.

“Matt Mooney, on Sunday walked with his wife and daughter from their home to a nearby park to play softball. ‘We’re just having a good time, not near anybody else. The next closest person is at least 15 feet away from me and my daughter at this point.” Police arrived soon after, and told him and others in the area to leave because the park is closed.

Mooney, said he told the officers he was familiar with the posted rules and believed he and his family were in compliance and practicing proper social distancing. He said he refused to provide his identification when officers asked for it because he had not broken any law.

Well, they didn’t like that idea and proceeded to threaten him by saying, ‘If you don’t give us your identification, if you don’t identify yourself, we’re going to put you in handcuffs in front of your 6-year-old daughter.”

A virus, is giving authoritarian mindless bullies legitimacy. When ignorant bullies carry lethal weapons they’re capable of committing insane and horrific acts. The consequences of COVID-panic can be more deadly than the actual disease. For how many weeks or months will families in densely populated cities be willing to stay cooped-up in tiny apartments like herded animals waiting to be slaughtered.

With increasingly warm weather it’s only natural that many want to be outdoors enjoying the fresh air and sunshine, even if they’re not as fortunate as Queen Elizabeth and Prince Charles who are surrounded by the lush and beautiful countryside at Windsor Castle. It doesn’t take and expert in immunology or infectious diseases to know that it’s healthier to be outdoors in the fresh air than stuffed into a germ infested apartment.

The bottom line–unless we change our entire way of life humans must COEXIST with viruses causing upper-respiratory infections.

In Iceland, testing is revealing that 50% of all those positive for COVID-19 are “asymptomatic.” And many scientists are saying 80% of those who contract the virus develop only minor cold-like symptoms.

Sweden, is not practicing “draconian social distancing.” Its first case of the coronavirus (COVID-19) was confirmed on February 4, 2020. The number of cases as of April 7 has since risen to a total of 7,693. That’s two months later–it should be noted, that Sweden has a population of about 10.23 million. There’s been some recent hysteria about the rise in cases, but who knows if this sudden panic has more to do with politics or with science.

“Flattening the curve” and PROTRACTING the ability to develop “herd immunity” is not benefitting massive populations, but is merely serving the interests of governments who have devastated healthcare systems by practicing austerity.

As Prof. Knut Wittkowski points out if someone is sick, but lacks health insurance or the ability to pay out-of-pocket for medical care there’s a very good chance they won’t seek medical attention until the disease reaches a stage where it’s critical or fatal.

That actually says more about the existing social systems and the way tax dollars are “misappropriated.”

Annually, in the US great fanfare is given to political events such as the State of the Union where
Presidents boast about the hundreds of billions allocated to the military budget. The Capitol, is packed to the rafters with with rapacious grubby politicians who clap enthusiastically as funds are being stolen by their campaign backers. For decades, the corrupt political duopoly
(Republicans and Democrats) have unanimously voted to allocate trillions to numerous war profiteers using the pretext to pursue endless needless military misadventures. Trillions, which should be dedicated to ensuring free healthcare, improving and modernizing medical facilities, and the rebuilding of a decaying 20th Century US infrastructure. But of course, none of this can ever happen “anywhere” when political systems are run by crooks protecting gangsters.

That being said, there’s some interesting data revealing that in some cases COVID-19 seems to be attacking the “hemoglobin.” This would explain why patients are gasping for air. Just a thought — I’m not a doctor, and I don’t even play one on TV; but it just seems logical that if low-doses of oral chloroquine are used for porphyria it also might be the reason why chloroquine or Hydroxychloroquine is working for COVID-19 patients. It could be that some victims of COVID-19 are developing an unusual form of porphyria–specifically affecting their respiratory system.

Grafter
Grafter
Apr 8, 2020 4:34 PM

Excellent post Charlotte. Thankyou.

Willem
Willem
Apr 8, 2020 4:49 PM
Reply to  Grafter

“ Sweden, is not practicing “draconian social distancing”

Sweden remains the country that one can be jealous of not to live there.

jack(jim)
jack(jim)
Apr 8, 2020 7:16 PM
Reply to  Willem

Sweden was getting a lot of attention from the US far right media over the past few years, to make them hate their immigrants. I assumed it was the US trying to drive them to the far-right, so they could be made to join nato or become part of an extended 5 eyes program, given their important position on the Baltic.

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
Apr 8, 2020 11:44 PM
Reply to  jack(jim)

Sweden is already far Right, and the ‘socialists’ have been reduced to a rump of Identity Politics feminazi man-haters, with the lynching of Julian Assange the perfect illustration of the nexus between the two tendencies.

Charlotte Ruse
Charlotte Ruse
Apr 8, 2020 5:23 PM
Reply to  Grafter

Thanks

Alan Tench
Alan Tench
Apr 8, 2020 5:07 PM

Yes, this panicdemic is certainly bring out the little Hitlers. On the Grun bat flu live feed there’s a picture of park benches on Clapham Common being taped up by Lambeth Council. Their reasoning: “to encourage exercise use and to discourage loitering”. Scumbags!

Charlotte Ruse
Charlotte Ruse
Apr 8, 2020 5:27 PM
Reply to  Alan Tench

Every disgruntled frustrated bureaucrat is seizing the moment to flex their muscles.

mcdonagh4
mcdonagh4
Apr 8, 2020 11:01 PM
Reply to  Charlotte Ruse

Along with the legions of blue haired old shoppers lining up at the still open markets screaming at the more apathetic also on line to stay out of her “safe space”. My mind boggles at the thought of an old woman’s safe space?

Rhys Jaggar
Rhys Jaggar
Apr 8, 2020 7:09 PM
Reply to  Alan Tench

Perhaps they are also encouraging heart attacks of pensioners who need a little sit down during their walking exercise?

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
Apr 8, 2020 11:45 PM
Reply to  Rhys Jaggar

Culling the herd, the ‘common herd’.

mcdonagh4
mcdonagh4
Apr 8, 2020 5:30 PM

Excellent post , unfortunately it will get a lot worse as people begin to realise they have been conned yet again and begin to react adversely to these armed thugs in uniform. Suicide by cop rates will skyrocket .

Charlotte Ruse
Charlotte Ruse
Apr 8, 2020 7:01 PM
Reply to  mcdonagh4

When the dust settles a panic pandemic resulting in unnecessary lockdowns could lead to mass pandemonium……

Hamilton
Hamilton
Apr 8, 2020 4:21 PM

Soooo the oil companies need $50 a barrel to cover running costs, it is getting $20 now due to the Covid 19 Pandemic. Step up, an expert who is funded by the Rockafella conglomerate, who says contrary to all available evidence (South Korea vs USA for example) that we need to get up close and personal, sharing our air Born, highly contagious and deadly viral infection now, not limit deaths until a vaccine can be secured. Here in the UK that herd immunity approach would claim 250,000 lives. He can go out and about if he wishes, lick a few bus stops if it pleases him to become a statistic 🙂

John Milton
John Milton
Apr 8, 2020 7:52 PM
Reply to  Hamilton

So, he is currently funded by the Rokefellers? How do you know this?

Who are you funded by?

Here in the UK that herd immunity approach would claim 250,000 lives

Really? The approach he suggested wherein old and vulnerable people should be isolated whilst the rest of the healthy population carry on as normal ?

Hamilton
Hamilton
Apr 8, 2020 8:00 PM
Reply to  John Milton

Look up the institute on the link.

John Milton
John Milton
Apr 8, 2020 8:08 PM
Reply to  Hamilton

Last time I checked, the word ‘was’ denotes something that occurred in the past.

Professor Knut Wittkowski was head of The Rockefeller University’s Department of Biostatistics, Epidemiology, and Research Design for 20 years.

He is currently currently the CEO of ASDERA LLC, which is a company discovering novel treatments for complex diseases from data of genome-wide association studies.

I can not seem to find any details of where this company gets its funding.

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
Apr 8, 2020 11:46 PM
Reply to  Hamilton

What’s more important? A few million ‘useless eaters’ or billions in profits?

Sgt Oddball
Sgt Oddball
Apr 8, 2020 4:16 PM

hey guys an gals, don’chall know?!: – biotech is godzilla

Sgt Oddball
Sgt Oddball
Apr 8, 2020 4:26 PM
Reply to  Sgt Oddball

before you downvote my ass, understand: – the mighty sep’ wrote this in response to the rio earth summit ’92 – shit’s been going on for *a long while* – go read up… – and ‘coz i’m currently *pissed* and can’t resist:…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiwqRSCWw2g

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_6IjeprfEs

…best switch on adblock, tho’….

😉

clickkid
clickkid
Apr 8, 2020 3:33 PM

Perhaps the most ludicrous aspect of the mainstream narrative is the assumption that the government would close down a large part of the economy to save the lives of people, who in the future will overwhelmingly be net recipients of resouces rather than contributors.

Sgt Oddball
Sgt Oddball
Apr 8, 2020 4:30 PM
Reply to  clickkid

… – not unless they wanted a wholesale reset for the *gambling class*…

Sgt Oddball
Sgt Oddball
Apr 8, 2020 4:32 PM
Reply to  Sgt Oddball

… – yeah i know, it *is* ludicrous, but seriously, click, you just have to *believe*…

😉

Alan Tench
Alan Tench
Apr 8, 2020 3:16 PM

This really is getting beyond a joke now. Headline in The Telegraph:

Cardboard coffins and bodies line streets of Ecuador in ominous warning to rest of Latin America

(In Ecuador there are just under 4000 cases (but 6000 suspected!) and 220 deaths).

And this from the BBC:

Coronavirus: NHS heroes ‘are like WW2 Spitfire pilots’

I don’t bloody think so!

Sgt Oddball
Sgt Oddball
Apr 8, 2020 4:38 PM
Reply to  Alan Tench

… – less than a fortnight ago, spain tells citizens to *’hibernate’* (- what’re we ,*squirrels*, now?… – i shit you *not*…)

https://english.elpais.com/politics/2020-03-29/cabinet-agrees-to-hibernate-spanish-economy-in-bid-to-avoid-overload-of-hospitals.html

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
Apr 8, 2020 11:48 PM
Reply to  Sgt Oddball

Aestivate, surely.

Grafter
Grafter
Apr 8, 2020 4:38 PM
Reply to  Alan Tench

Alan insanity takes many forms. The BBC are filth and anyone who gives them money needs to see a “health expert”.

Willem
Willem
Apr 8, 2020 4:54 PM
Reply to  Alan Tench

What is an ‘NHS hero’
A person who is doing his or her job. Why call that heroic? – because otherwise it would become obviously clear that the politicians, the journalists and the muckymuck experts are not doing their job?

lundiel
lundiel
Apr 8, 2020 5:08 PM
Reply to  Willem

I think it’s been carefully formulated to prevent noncompliance. They say “stay in to protect the NHS”. The narrative is all about a much loved institution not government legislation. So we can expect the narrative to be often reinforced with a mix of threats of overloading the NHS and tales of heroism.

beer
beer
Apr 8, 2020 5:28 PM
Reply to  lundiel

This.

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
Apr 8, 2020 5:15 PM
Reply to  Willem

Listening to the eye-witness reports of frontline doctors, nurses and support staff – and considering the number who’ve already died or had bad bouts of flu, I’d say heroes is a good description.

Would you volunteer to do what they’re doing, out of courage and principle, without adequate protection because of the crimes of the damned gangster-capitalists and their political stooges? Would you?

Whatever’s really going on with the hidden agendas of the gics – the gangsters-in-charge – the behaviour of the medics and support workers deserves our profound gratitude and respect. Heroes is right.

Willem
Willem
Apr 8, 2020 5:56 PM

It is not a question if you want to know.

I do it.

But I do not consider it as heroism, because the chances of getting severe infection due to COVID19 for a young and healthy person is close to 0

mcdonagh4
mcdonagh4
Apr 8, 2020 5:33 PM
Reply to  Willem

A person obeying his masters orders is patted on the head and called a hero these days a necessary step in perpetuating the panic-demic.

Alan Tench
Alan Tench
Apr 8, 2020 6:13 PM
Reply to  mcdonagh4

The word ‘hero’ has been hijacked by a large number of causes, campaigns and the MSM to describe just about anybody doing something a little out of the ordinary, and in many cases nothing out of the ordinary. The Spitfire pilots were heros. Anything less than that and it’s not a hero.

lundiel
lundiel
Apr 8, 2020 7:08 PM
Reply to  Alan Tench

If anyone’s a hero, it’s care home staff who earn so little that self isolating on 80% wages is not an option.

Rhys Jaggar
Rhys Jaggar
Apr 8, 2020 7:11 PM
Reply to  Alan Tench

The media really is going overboard on the WWII analogies. They had Monty Don calling Daily Mail readers to ‘Dig for Victory’ ffs.

It really is pathetically stage managed.

atomician
atomician
Apr 8, 2020 3:07 PM

Sweden’s 2016-17 seasonal flu death number was 713 ,whereas its coronavirus death number is currently 591, with almost no lockdown. Same ballpark, though this remains could change. See table 17 on p44 at https://www.folkhalsomyndigheten.se/contentassets/b5f8b9e9e0654de38d557b4a55d19496/influenza-in-sweden-2016-2017.pdf

There 2016-17 Case Fatality Rate was 713/12,417 = 5.7%. Though this doesn’t mean much as the data on the number of infected needs to be estimated.

Rhys Jaggar
Rhys Jaggar
Apr 8, 2020 7:12 PM
Reply to  atomician

Out of interest, what is seasonal flu deaths + Coronavirus deaths?

And what is total deaths from all causes??

atomician
atomician
Apr 9, 2020 5:24 AM
Reply to  Rhys Jaggar

These were the 2016-17 figures, so did not have any coronavirus component (presumably). So the total figure of 713 deaths would have been from all Influenza Like Illnesses (ILI). They say that the predominant virus in that season was influenza A.

Jack(jim)
Jack(jim)
Apr 8, 2020 2:59 PM

Great video. After exposing the scam that has been pulled on us by the US/UK controlled media, and our own puppet governments, I doubt that the press will recover any credibility in the minds of many important people any time soon. The media by being such a tool of the liars have given another victory to the far-right, who have been at war with what remains of the genuine press for a decade.

Croach
Croach
Apr 8, 2020 2:12 PM

If we recorded and reported ‘rhinovirus deaths’ the way we are recording and reporting ‘corona deaths’ what proportion of overall deaths would be reported as ‘rhinovirus deaths’?

Louis N. Proyect
Louis N. Proyect
Apr 8, 2020 2:03 PM

Endorsed by Richard Epstein of the Hoover Institute:

“Adding those two elements into the mix led me to suggest that the estimates generated by the standard model would turn out to be far too high, perhaps by an order of magnitude. I have recently come across this extraordinary interview by Professor Knut Wittkowski, an epidemiologist which states in powerful form why the current policies of social distancing will prolong but not eliminate the disease.”

https://www.hoover.org/research/coronavirus-perspective-revised

Epstein, an ultra-rightist, became a laughing-stock after being twisted into a pretzel in a New Yorker Magazine interview:

https://www.newyorker.com/news/q-and-a/the-contrarian-coronavirus-theory-that-informed-the-trump-administration

Basically, he, like the Off-Guardian editors, is anxious to see the capitalist system functioning at full capacity right now, whatever the consequences to our well-being.

Admin1
Admin
Admin1
Apr 8, 2020 2:12 PM

You are so out of touch Louis, it’s tragic.

Why do you and certain other Leftists seem to think this naked fascist rollout, compromised of the biggest destruction of civil liberties in modern times, is some kind of prelude to world socialism?

Why do you think Mr Gates is going to lock us all in our homes and then hand over his power and wealth to some sort of autonomous collective of the housebound?

And why are you so constipated by dogma you think everything, including basic science, is superseded by the perceived political beliefs of those uttering the words?

Do you even think at all anymore, or just respond like Pavlov’s salivating dogs to a series of stimuli that no longer have any meaning?

If our well-being truly concerns you then worry about the millions facing real deprivation in ‘response’ to a virus that the official sources admit to be mostly harmless.

As genuine Leftists, not faux champagne-socialists/Liberal-fascists, we are appalled at the torrent of human suffering being unleashed as well as the total destruction of human liberty.

Anyone who isn’t, and who is prepared to sign off on this is either a massive fool or a shill.

It’s not 1975 any more. It’s the “new normal”. And if you think that means an age of equality and freedom, prepare to be massively disappointed.

Cicatriz
Cicatriz
Apr 8, 2020 2:31 PM
Reply to  Admin1

I find it very odd that the faux liberals, who have been complaining of a fascist takeover by the likes of Trump and Johnson, suddenly accept soft martial law and believe these policies are for the best in the long run.

Gezzah Potts
Gezzah Potts
Apr 8, 2020 2:47 PM
Reply to  Cicatriz

Because they’re all lobotomised by identity politics and are as fake as a Hong Kong rolex.
All running round screeching about fecken Trump, yet a number of people I know have welcomed this blatant fascism literally with open arms.
Its stomach churning… the blindness and subservience and hypocrisy of these alleged ‘anti establishment’ idiots.
I went and had a look at Amy Goodmans little project Democracy Now yesterday morning and it was worse than the fecken MSM.
The sort of site Mr Proyect would feel most at home at. Fakes everywhere.

Capricornia Man
Capricornia Man
Apr 8, 2020 3:13 PM
Reply to  Gezzah Potts

Sections of the socialist left in Australia are demanding that the country move from a ‘mitigation’ model to a ‘suppression’ model, i.e., everything shut down apart from absolutely essential activities such as medical services, food provision and a few other things. Wouldn’t that hand more power to the capitalist state?

Sgt Oddball
Sgt Oddball
Apr 8, 2020 4:54 PM

la gauche est morte – join les gilets, dude…

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
Apr 8, 2020 5:29 PM
Reply to  Sgt Oddball

Ah non, mon brave! La vraie gauche est sou terre.
Il ressuscitera. Il n’est pas possible de la tuer.

Sgt Oddball
Sgt Oddball
Apr 8, 2020 6:03 PM

… – better throw on a yellow vest, then…

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
Apr 8, 2020 11:54 PM

They are as stupid as is imaginable. The Bosses are going to use this crisis to destroy workplace conditions, superannuation, environmental regulation etc, and funnel money to the rich, while inflicting vicious austerity on the plebs to pay off the debt. Meanwhile, unnoticed, the Great Barrier Reef has bleached for the third time in the last five years, and the most widespread such event recorded. The entire global human system is collapsing, and it’s NOT some ‘cycle’. This is a one-way trip for millennia.

Capricornia Man
Capricornia Man
Apr 10, 2020 9:55 AM

Indeed, the people will finish up paying the bill (economically and in terms of loss of civil liberties) unless they unite and resist.

Capricornia Man
Capricornia Man
Apr 10, 2020 10:00 AM

…and the environment will lose, of course, unless…

Gezzah Potts
Gezzah Potts
Apr 9, 2020 12:13 AM

It’s ridiculous, it’s absurd, it’s like everything is back to front – some right wing conservatives calling this out for what it is, and large chunks of the purported ‘socialist left’ jumping up and down like a 4 year old having a tantrum yelling ‘lock us up, lock us up, keep a safe distance’!!
As I mentioned to you, maybe 2 weeks ago (so many comments and articles and video clips recently, I barely know what week this is!)…. that what we are witnessing is to a very large degree the result of anti class, narcissistic identity politics. Me. Me. Me.
Have a good day CM😁

Capricornia Man
Capricornia Man
Apr 10, 2020 9:45 AM
Reply to  Gezzah Potts

Identity politics indeed, GP. For some on the left, it almost obliterates thought about three million in poverty, the huge rise in casualised employment, reductions in working conditions, loss of entire industries (motor vehicles), non-payment of tax by 600-700 corporations, the decline in membership and power of (often poorly-led) unions….all these issues are linked.
PS: There’s a petition advocating full access to social security for Kiwis
doing the rounds.
Take care. CM.

Gezzah Potts
Gezzah Potts
Apr 10, 2020 10:06 AM

Thanks CM.., you too… enjoy your evening. Currently listening to some instrumental music by a band called Ulaan Passerine. Very moody.
Was going to take a break from commenting for 4-5 days, and just chill out for a bit.
I’ve seen up close from my personal experience how a lot of these young Left hipster types treat those they deem inferior – with complete contempt.
I’ve seen them walk past homeless people on the way to their trendy cafes, and not even blink, they pretend those homeless people aren’t even there.
Yet they screech about pronouns. Or marriage. Or anything that Doesn’t challenge such an unjust exploitative system.
Its so warped, and many times has left me swearing under my breath at the sheer hypocrisy.
I had a look at ABC headlines on my phone earlier, and just turned it off.
Have a good Easter mate✌️

Capricornia Man
Capricornia Man
Apr 10, 2020 10:44 AM
Reply to  Gezzah Potts

GP, in my inner suburb’s shopping area, there are always people begging. I give them something more often than not (you learn to distinguish between the genuinely needy (a big majority) and the few who may be ‘trying it on’). You simply can’t turn away from someone who claims to be a domestic violence victim and looks like it.

Sgt Oddball
Sgt Oddball
Apr 8, 2020 4:46 PM
Reply to  Gezzah Potts

“…fake as a Hong Kong rolex…”

… – this is why i *insist* on *nothing less* than a patek phillipe… – if i’m getting bribed for my consent in a psyop i wanna know what i’m worth, dammit!…

Sgt Oddball
Sgt Oddball
Apr 8, 2020 4:48 PM
Reply to  Sgt Oddball

… – rolex?!… – fucking pikers…

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
Apr 8, 2020 11:55 PM
Reply to  Sgt Oddball

Mines a Patek philipino’.

Berlin Beerman
Berlin Beerman
Apr 8, 2020 3:08 PM
Reply to  Cicatriz

Its quite simple. These faux liberals as you describe them really are not liberal, its rather their reflection of an illusion of being one. They have no idea what they truly are.
Perhaps they will find themselves in this decade. Perhaps not.

When your rather poorly educated, perhaps that’s a bit strong, lets say poorly read, been lied to and made believe that your in a democracy of a two party system, well what did you expect these tree huger’s to act like? They will believe almost anything they are fed because they can not think or reason anything out for themselves. Perhaps they may start now. This pandemic is a good false trait to bet against.

By the time they even come close it will be too late. I know this is a bit far off but when we were growing up we rode our bikes with out helmets and stayed out late till midnight playing in the creeks and woods – I was 10 or so. We skied without helmets too. We rode our bikes to school or walked. No SUV’s. When it was time for vaccinations we avoided them like the plague even though our parents suggested it. We had balls. We lived life, not played it on a screen.

Does this exist much today ? I would like to think its making a comeback slowly. Give it another two generations and lets see if we dig ourselves out of this mess. We can not continue to blame anyone but ourselves for allowing this to happen.

There is no left, no right, no democracy, only the illusion of one, we live in republics and we need to take them back. Back from ourselves. Easy said. Most of these so called democracies were never meant to be one, they were always meant to be a republic for the business men to make business.

Mr.Trump, if he gets through this and aligns his republic with Russia and China, we stand a chance of changing the world.

Perhaps this flu will have a positive after all. It can be the spark. So far its a fucking disaster but it will take the few leaders with real balls, the ones that need wheel barrows behind them to cart them in, like Mr.Trump, Mr.Putin and Mr.Xi. Imbeciles like Mr.Trudeau, Mr.Macron, Mr. Johnson will all falter – problem is who replaces them – the real problem is there – this is what these so called faux liberals need to get through their heads…. and turn off their state and corporate sponsored news organizations.

Sgt Oddball
Sgt Oddball
Apr 8, 2020 5:00 PM
Reply to  Berlin Beerman

“…Imbeciles like Mr.Trudeau, Mr.Macron, Mr. Johnson…”

uhh… bankster… bankster… and… *yep*!…. um, bankster…

… – is *the pattern* becoming clear to you *yet*?…

non dimenticare
non dimenticare
Apr 8, 2020 5:59 PM
Reply to  Sgt Oddball

Justin Trudeau was not a banker but a substitute secondary-school drama teacher born into the right family, with the right looks.

Sgt Oddball
Sgt Oddball
Apr 8, 2020 6:06 PM

justin trudeau = goldman sachs

… – *oh yeah*… 😉

Berlin Beerman
Berlin Beerman
Apr 8, 2020 9:20 PM
Reply to  Sgt Oddball

I doubt Mr,Trudeau is one but hes starting to figure out what one is. Perhaps there is some hope in this one, the others definitely not.

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
Apr 8, 2020 5:20 PM
Reply to  Cicatriz

Sign of what terror for personal safety can do to the invertebrates amongst us, Cic. Run to mummy and demand that everyone be told to sit still and shut up.

Portonchok
Portonchok
Apr 8, 2020 7:50 PM
Reply to  Cicatriz

The faux liberals are in fact neo-Bolsheviks. They’ve been busy working on the new totalitarian global state for years.

Objective
Objective
Apr 8, 2020 2:42 PM
Reply to  Admin1

God damn i hate agreeing with the fuzz (authorities) but your right admin, this is opening the doors to a shit storm of neo-liberal pseudo-socialism, the kind that sees the corporate elite getting even richer and everyone else even poorer, more laws, rules & regulations for us & more freedoms for them to exploit & oppress us facilitated by the mentally deranged liberal leftists.

This isn’t going to end well for anyone that isn’t already a billionaire. There’s going to be more mechanization, more AI, more surveillance, more controls over digital money etc etc. If this wasn’t a conspiracy to introduce the aforementioned they will certainly exp0loit the situation as the perfect opportunity to do introduce them.

Sgt Oddball
Sgt Oddball
Apr 8, 2020 6:14 PM
Reply to  Objective

^- concern troll…

🙂

Objective
Objective
Apr 9, 2020 4:39 AM
Reply to  Sgt Oddball

Yes i’ve noticed all your posts! Pot, kettle!

George Mc
George Mc
Apr 8, 2020 2:44 PM
Reply to  Admin1

It”s enough for Louis to show that A was quoted by B whose father C once went boozing with a fascist, to completely sink A.

Sgt Oddball
Sgt Oddball
Apr 8, 2020 5:08 PM
Reply to  George Mc

george, i’d be fascinated to compile a compendium of louis proyect’s logical fallacies,… – maybe they could sit on a bookstand in ‘wh smith’s at paddington to puzzle travellers on long distance journeys?… – *personally* i’d like to steal the patent to his weird brainwaves and, like that lab tec, with the *really hot* cup of tea, in another galaxy, long, long, ago… – posit the creation of the *infinite improbability* drive… – then we might at least have something *useful* out of the damn bastard…

Gezzah Potts
Gezzah Potts
Apr 8, 2020 2:55 PM
Reply to  Admin1

Thank you for this. I second every single word you say. When I was out selling the mag, I found out just how genuine the identity politics addled ‘leftists’ really were in regards to the poor or homeless. Zero. Nada. Nix.
Complete fakes. Like Louis.

Sgt Oddball
Sgt Oddball
Apr 8, 2020 5:12 PM
Reply to  Gezzah Potts

… – gezzah, don’t give up the fight, and *most importantly*:…