726

An open letter from Philip Roddis to OffG Frequent OffGuardian contributor Philip Roddis offers some thoughts on our coverage of the covid19 pandemic

Dear Off-Guardian

This comment was made by a reader, below a recent post on my blogsite.

There’s just as much fear porn bandied about in regard to narratives pushing terms and concepts such as Police State, fascist takeover etc as there is about Covid-19. And it is just as legitimate to express scepticism towards those narratives as any others.

I’m one of your many fans. I support you by recommendation to friends and readers, links to your articles and a monthly s/o. Granted, that last is for a piddling amount but I am an OAP, and like to think every little helps.

I also write posts that give you good quality content, me a wider audience. This necessitates correspondence with the editors, in the course of which I’ve come to regard you all, though we haven’t met, as friends. Unusually intelligent ones at that.

Then along came Covid-19. On which you’ve posted good stuff, referenced in my own posts on the subject. It has, however, focused exclusively on one aspect of the pandemic: the real concern that our rulers are using it to remove hard won liberties. That’s an important aspect and, through articles questioning CV-19’s actual as opposed to claimed severity, I’ve learned much from the opinions of scientists like Bhakdi, Wittkowski and many other questioners of the mainstream narrative featured on Off-Guardian.

I do, however, give equal weight to a Left voice ignored by Off-Guardian. Whether or not the pandemic is overstated – and my view is it’s too early to call either way – it shines a torch as never before in my lifetime on the rottenness of capitalism, with its systemic inability to put people before profits.

It’s true this same Left has done the mirror opposite. Its focus on capitalism’s failures does not in logic require that it play up the severity of Covid-19, just as your libertarian instincts do not in logic require you to play down the same. Yet in practice – since we are as much psychological as logical animals – things don’t work that way. We decide what’s important and what’ s true – in that order – then go hunting for evidence to prove We are right; They are wrong.

As Dr John Lee said in a recent Spectator piece:

A theory from a group of scientists is just that: a theory. Believing the opinion of that group without critical verification is just that: belief.

As it happens the thrust of Dr Lee’s piece favours those who question CV-19’s severity, as well as social distancing and the science informing it. But it flags up a truth no camp – lockdowners, herd immunitists, ‘no-worse-than-flu’ pundits – may claim as their property. In reality scientific opinion, like the imperfect and highly confusing data from across the globe – here accused of overcounting CV-19 deaths, there of the precise opposite, is sharply divided, while tales from the frontline are worryingly rare and, again, give a mixed picture even within the UK.

A Barcelona friend whose thirty something daughter is a frontline carer at the city’s biggest hospital tells me no one there has experienced anything like the pressure all are under. There is of course a nationalist dimension since Madrid is widely believed to have diverted resource – for instance PPE donated by China, a long term friend of Catalunya – away from the city.

Such sharp divisions of relevant expert opinion, statistical data and the experiences of nurses, doctors and other frontline health carers raises epistemological questions but my concerns go beyond epistemology. History may show (or not) who is right and who wrong on the question of Covid-19’s severity, and on whether steps taken in the name of seeing it off will outlive the pandemic to hammer further nails in the coffin of liberty.

On such matters we may pick the wrong side. Which side that is we can’t yet know, however much we make assertions to the contrary.

Meanwhile, let’s none of us lose sight of the fact that those with whom we disagree may be wrong, but wrong in all good faith. Nor of the truth I flagged early on.

Whether or not the pandemic is overstated it shines a torch as never before on the rottenness of capitalism, with its systemic inability to put people before profits

Regards,

Philip Roddis

can you spare $1.00 a month to support independent media

Unlike the Guardian we are NOT funded by Bill & Melinda Gates, or any other NGO or government. So a few coins in our jar to help us keep going are always appreciated.

Our Bitcoin JTR code is: 1JR1whUa3G24wXpDyqMKpieckMGGW2u2VX

0 0 vote
Article Rating
Subscribe
Notify of
guest
726 Comments
newest
oldest most voted
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
Robbobbobin
Robbobbobin
May 5, 2020 4:48 PM

It’s difficult to find an article in the ocean of grotesquely self-indulgent libertarian bullshit currently engulfing the Off-Guardian under which to post this notice of a paper from the Netherlands, so I’ll post it here:

A human monoclonal antibody blocking SARS-CoV-2 infection

Robbobbobin
Robbobbobin
May 5, 2020 1:22 AM

Good article by Jonathan Cook in the weekend edition of Counterpunch. Seems not to be on his website yet. Even includes a health check on the Off-Guardian:

Those who ignore or instinctively defend these glaring failings of the modern corporate system are really in no position to sit smugly in judgment on those who wish to question the safety of 5G, or vaccines, or the truth of 9/11, or the reality of a climate catastrophe, or even of the presence of lizard overlords.

Because through their reflexive dismissal of doubt, of all critical thinking on anything that has not been pre-approved by our governments and by the state-corporate media, they have helped to disfigure the only yardsticks we have for measuring truth or falsehood. They have forced on us a terrible choice: to blindly follow those who have repeatedly demonstrated they are not worthy of being followed, or to trust nothing at all, to doubt everything. Neither position is one a healthy, balanced individual would want to adopt. But that is where we are today. [Emphasis added]

John
John
May 3, 2020 4:45 PM

There is no ‘systemic inability’ in capitalism, and the ‘rottenness’ is in humans themselves (their own choice of values), such statements are a matter of fanaticism, scapegoating of a system. Such statements are an indication of a severe lack of reflection and thoughtfulness. Actually, these are just political slogans, battle cries of anger, the unreflective always blaming the system.

It is even so that the desire to accumulate material wealth exists mostly among the upper lower classes and middle classes. As soon as that desire is satisfied, it is power which is the main motivator, and wealth may serve to indicate status. Even more, the higher you go up, power becomes the main motivator, and wealth even a burden (though it may still be required to signal status). A lot of these guys on top are workaholics.
The materialist craze, consumerism, is as such a matter of the lower and middle levels, a matter of values, materialist values. But also of showing off towards another. This materialism is aggressively pushed by various forces (among which international Zionism), and so the capitalist system is perverted. Any system can be perverted, because they all depend on cultural values.

Robbobbobin
Robbobbobin
May 5, 2020 1:49 AM
Reply to  John

“…and so the capitalist system is perverted.”

Not. The capitalist system is perverted by its inherent misappropriation of the ‘surplus’ value of labour. Aided by the wilful confusion of many of its aspirants between a market system–which has adopted many forms throughout history; capitalism being only the initially but not terminally logical manifestation of market systems in industrial societies, their colonies, territories and dependencies; and could as readily (if not peacefully: greed, whether open or closeted, being what it is) adopt any of many equally viable market systems in theory and in the future–and ‘the end of history’.

Robbobbobin
Robbobbobin
May 7, 2020 12:21 AM
Reply to  Robbobbobin

“The capitalist system is perverted by its inherent misappropriation of the ‘surplus’ value of labour.”

And by its exaltation of usury, rightly scorned since antiquity as a, or even the, quintesential societal scourge but now providing the basic underpinning of both globalized (Wall Sreet and the City of London) and state (primarily Beijing and vassals) capitalism in general and its rentier class in particular.

John
John
May 3, 2020 4:26 PM

I propose to add the quote, the fear based scheme of human caused climate change (as mentioned somewhere in the comments below). This scheme, of the same global proportions and ‘fantastic’ and ‘unreal’ in nature, also pushed by a priest class of ‘experts’, a technocratic scheme, also commercially exploited, accepted by incompetent and ignorant politicians, pushed by elites and fanatics, also leading to censorship and exclusion.

“There’s just as much fear porn bandied about in regard to narratives pushing terms and concepts such as Police State, fascist takeover etc as there is about Covid-19. And it is just as legitimate to express scepticism towards those narratives as any others.”

Howard
Howard
May 3, 2020 3:37 PM

At the risk of total immersion in cliche, I have no choice but to say “Follow The Money.” If, as many have reported, a Bill Gates here or an Anthony Fauci there stands to make a bundle off the virus – admittedly, because of their fortuitous investments in the pharmaceutical industry – then I am slightly less inclined to accept their sincere regard for humanity and slightly more inclined to accept their sincere regard for their investments. So while indeed, as Mr Roddis suggests, it is a bit soon to arrive at a definitive scenario regarding the many aspects of Covid-19, the weight is building more – I won’t say “far more” but more – on the anti-narrative then the official narrative side.

Robbobbobin
Robbobbobin
May 5, 2020 2:07 AM
Reply to  Howard

…it is a bit soon to arrive at a definitive scenario regarding the many aspects of Covid-19…

Many aspects of which most of the thickheads around here can accommodate, at most, one.

Ricsi
Ricsi
May 2, 2020 4:48 PM

Here is a thought, UK over 27000 dead and counting, population 65 million. Where I live, Hungary, less than 300 dead ( yes 300 !!! ) population 10 million. So thats almost a ratio of 100:1 .
Here closed borders since 2015 and no immigrants/refugees. Just a thought !
Also look at the numbers for Czech, Poland, Serbia ,Bulgaria etc… whilst its 28000 Italy, 24000 Spain, 24000 France .

Ken Kenn
Ken Kenn
May 3, 2020 12:00 AM
Reply to  Ricsi

So – despite all our guesses: What do we know?

Hannah Mor
Hannah Mor
May 2, 2020 1:12 PM

I have been so disappointed, if not shocked, by the response from so many prominent people on the Left over this coronavirus flimflam. OffGuardian has remained one of the few sites to keep its integrity and its head from the outset. So I am sorry to see a favourite writer of mine taking time to criticise OffG for what I consider one of its greatest strengths. I don’t recognise OffG in the general description mr Roddis uses, I haven’t seen them make any personal attacks on those supporting the lockdown, but I have seen them get a tremendous amount of abuse from the likes of Caitlin Johnstone (I will never waste time reading her nonsense again), George Galloway, Moon of Alabama and all. I think they have come through this with reputation considerably enhanced, and not many can say that.

Reg
Reg
May 2, 2020 2:51 PM
Reply to  Hannah Mor

Amen, Hannah

George Mc
George Mc
May 2, 2020 3:45 PM
Reply to  Hannah Mor

I know it may seem a facetious thing to say but I have found that recently a lot of those Left sites are being far too “nice”. They seem to think they are still living in that world where we had some kind of social democracy, the middle path, a contract between opposing sides. And even when accounting for the horrendous things going on, they are still too apologetic. Maybe it’s time to get angry? Maybe it’s time to fully face up to the fact that there is no democracy? And that this little bit of customary fist waving from the Left has now become part of the theatre of Western politics, something even encouraged because the rulers know full well it means nothing.

Kevin
Kevin
May 2, 2020 4:47 PM
Reply to  George Mc

The Western “Left” has always underestimated what it’s up against.

Yarkob
Yarkob
May 2, 2020 6:08 PM
Reply to  Hannah Mor

i didn’t read it as an explicit “criticism”per se, more of a call to pan-dimensionality of coverage. i’m not sure what other aspects there are to cover, though. i’m pretty sure we’re not going through a “public health crisis” myself.

but nobody is right, because who knows what “right” is?

personally i couldn’t do without off-g right now. it’s one of only two or three sites i can stomach now. i also find Philip’s pieces thought-provoking. that doesn’t mean i agree with everything he says, which is exactly how it should be.

Alpine Observer
Alpine Observer
May 2, 2020 6:50 PM
Reply to  Yarkob

Fully agree.

Alpine Observer
Alpine Observer
May 2, 2020 6:49 PM
Reply to  Hannah Mor

I don’t read this letter as critical at all, it’s just highlighting that our OffG has only gone down one rabbit hole. Are readers and contributors to OffG meant to all have identical views on everything?

If so, then we are not free thinking people, merely Party apparatchiks.

Robbobbobin
Robbobbobin
May 3, 2020 1:12 AM
Reply to  Hannah Mor

“…I am sorry to see a favourite writer of mine taking time to criticise OffG for what I consider one of its greatest strengths. I don’t recognise OffG in the general description mr Roddis uses, I haven’t seen them make any personal attacks on those supporting the lockdown…”

I think it’s called an “Open Letter” when a bit falls out of the envelope in transit.

http://steelcityscribblings.uk/wp/2020/04/17/an-open-letter-to-off-guardian/

Lost in a dark wood
Lost in a dark wood
May 3, 2020 2:31 AM
Reply to  Hannah Mor

The gate keepers and the judas goats are among the most difficult of the realisations to adjust to; and this is especially true if you’ve followed these people for some time. Once you get used to them, however, they become fairly easy to spot.

The link below is to a section from Barrie Zwicker’s Towers of Deception (2007), and there are related videos if you search the web. It’s a long time since I read the book, and I’ve only skimmed through the website, but you might find them helpful.

https://educate-yourself.org/cn/noamchomskygatekeepersofleft1part04oct07.shtml

Howard
Howard
May 5, 2020 3:20 PM

Thank you for this astute comment. Being essentially a “leftist,” I have had to abandon just about every left leaning site I normally frequent over their non-critical blanket acceptance of the lockdown as somehow the only possible approach to this crisis. If only they would acknowledge the lockdown’s only too obvious shortcomings, I could accept their studied acceptance of the lockdown even though I disagree with it. But I cannot and will not accept their uncritical acceptance of something never before done in human history as the “best of all possible worlds.” Barring a superhuman omniscience, they cannot possibly know a lockdown is the best way to handle this virus.

As an aside, I had read Barry Zwicker’s “Towers of Deception” when it came out; and found it extremely illuminating at a time when questioning the official narrative was as dangerous as it was heretical.

I’m done with gatekeepers, whose only real accomplishment is placing reams of paper over the people’s faces to soften the stomp of the boot heel.

kevin morris
kevin morris
May 2, 2020 12:08 PM

I was speaking with my postman yesterday about the Royal Mail’s abandoning of Saturday letter deliveries using the Corona panic as excuse. The union is considering strike action over the move because they know that job losses will be substantial. Frankly, I don’t fear Covid19 , but I do know that cynics will use the panic as an excuse to institute policies that under normal situations would have been deemed unacceptable.

The government’s policies are at least understandable given the criticism they were receiving and the levels of public panic, but we all know that our society will be left much worse after the dust has settled.

Mike Ellwood
Mike Ellwood
May 2, 2020 1:21 PM
Reply to  kevin morris

Royal mail has been chipping away at services for years. I remember them getting rid of Sunday collections (although that was years ago). Next thing to go will be Saturday collections (which had already got worse and worse), as well as Saturday deliveries.

When we had a proper weekend service, e.g. a firm could post a bill on Friday; the recipient could get it on Saturday, write a cheque and post it on Saturday or Sunday before collection time, and the firm could get the cheque on Monday. Now there is at least a two day delay added.

Alpine Observer
Alpine Observer
May 2, 2020 6:55 PM
Reply to  Mike Ellwood

Why does the UK need 6-7 day working? Market, produce, win sale, despatch, consume, market…rinse and repeat. The neoliberal dream. No thanks.

Nikoz Coleman
Nikoz Coleman
May 3, 2020 1:42 AM
Reply to  kevin morris

I disagree that the governments response was and is in any way understandable in terms of the welfare of society, because they enforced a social distancing policy and shutdowns of businesses AFTER they downgraded they risk of covid 19. It is understandable however if they are utterly selfish people, who know that the measures are not only unjustified but potentially harmful, but they believe they will have immunity from the harms, they are in for one hell of an almighty shock on judgement day, if they do not change their current direction, they don’t understand the laws of karma, the you will reap what you sow, knowing the horrific fate that awaits them I feel more pity for them than hate, I hope both for their sakes and the public they do repent from their thoroughly wicked ways

Robbobbobin
Robbobbobin
May 5, 2020 2:13 AM
Reply to  kevin morris

“The government’s policies are at least understandable given the criticism they were receiving and the levels of public panic, but we all know that our society will be left much worse after the dust has settled.”

Oh dear, poor little us 99.99%. Pity the 0.01% got all the agency and we got none. Booey hooey. What are parrots good for? Words and squawks.

John Pretty
John Pretty
May 2, 2020 10:36 AM

No, Mr Roddis. I disagree. We do know how lethal this virus is. It is not very lethal at all by the government’s own admission. (Need the link again?)

And where were talking heads like yourself when there was the last influenza epidemic? What was your learned view on that?

With respect, Mr Roddis, there are too many people like yourself who have not a clue what they are talking about who have suddenly become self appointed “expert” opinion writers and formers in epidemiology and virology.

A reasonable assessment of the “lethality” of this coronavirus might be obtained by looking at the German figures. Because they are relatively low.

The UK figures – we already know – are a downright lie. An open exaggeration of the true figure. Again, by the government’s own admission: “Covid19 related” is an appalling fudge! I cannot emphasise enough how dishonest and dangerous it is for the government to have done this.

As we have seen death certificates in the UK are being falsified, but this cannot be challenged.

It is now my intention to again self isolate from this virus fear porn. I live alone and work from home, so it is not too hard to achieve. It takes a bit of effort to tear oneself away from this virus fear porn – like all forms of pornography it can be addictive – but in my humble opinion it is worth the it for the sake of ones own sanity.

Mike Ellwood
Mike Ellwood
May 2, 2020 1:12 PM
Reply to  John Pretty

Good to see you back John Pretty. Some of us were getting worried about you. Hope you had some nice walks.

Not a bad idea to take a break. I should probably follow your example.

Mike Ellwood
Mike Ellwood
May 2, 2020 1:14 PM
Reply to  Mike Ellwood

…and straight into moderation – pourquoi? – Not even a link. Just a friendly enquiry after an old friend.

Sophie - Admin1
Admin
Sophie - Admin1
May 2, 2020 1:22 PM
Reply to  Mike Ellwood

Who knows? Sometimes it just happens. It just makes more work for us.

Rhys Jaggar
Rhys Jaggar
May 2, 2020 10:07 AM

Mr Roddis

I think the simplest way to evaluate the ‘people before profits’ issue is to look at supermarket policy toward home deliveries.

I can speak with authority on this as I have had to try and set up home deliveries for my 94 year old father and 86 year old mother, who are without transportation and are undoubtedly vulnerable due to the normal slow disappearance of mental faculties in very old age. Neither are internet savvy, my mother (who for 50 years ran the housekeeping budget) is completely internet-illiterate.

Having tried to engage with supermarket majors online the past two days, it is absolutely clear that they have zero interest in prioritising the truly elderly and vulnerable. What they are interested in prioritising are those with long-standing loyalty cards. They expect the truly old and vulnerable to have email accounts and mobile phones (since you have to list those to register them for online shopping), when the reality is that those are precisely the people least likely to have them.

Those people who set up Lasting Powers of Attorney to cater for the realities of old age are those who when the time comes, are actually relying on able bodied carers, younger relatives etc to manage their affairs. That is where we are at, but being able to manage bank accounts is not much use if home deliveries of food cannot be secured.

Now apparently, there is now a scheme whereby if a GP declares an old person as ‘especially vulnerable to CoVid19’, then their details will automatically be passed on to supermarkets to prioritise them. Do the supermarkets advertise this on page one of their shopping websites? Do pigs fly???? I heard about it solely by my sister (a consultant doctor) pointing me to gov.uk website where details of it can be found through searching (not through an article on page 1). Has it been on the front pages of every ‘caring newspaper’ (the Guardian, the Mail etc etc)? Do bears get constipated in the woods????

What we have is an unparalleled ‘everyone must pitch in’ propaganda push, allied to complete refusal to prioritise the information which needs to be top of every media channel.

It does not make anyone money doing that, so they do not do it.

Here is how things should have run:

1. Every news channel required for 21 days to run the story: ‘if your elderly relatives are vulnerable, get your GP to register this fact so they are automatically prioritised’. Newspapers on page 1, TV news at the top of the hour.
2 Every supermarket, upon pain of asset forfeiture, seizure and imprisonment of every executive earning over £100,000 a year, has a website section identifying vulnerable people and guiding people to contact GPs to get their elderly relatives registered thus.
3. All executive benefits and dividends forcibly furloughed until the entire population of elderly and vulnerable have been suitably prioritised and delivered to. Expenditure on extra drivers, packers etc etc becoming legally required before any discretionary payments to executives or shareholders becomes legal again.
4. All ICT consultants who claim that you cannot design software capable of confirming that younger relatives acting on behalf of older ones are not being fraudulent little cheats trying to jump the queue should accept that their role in supermarket business software is at an end. Either software improves food security or it has no value. End of discussion….
5. All politicians who cannot haul multimillionaires in front of them and, using Covid19 powers threaten to imprison them without trial if they do not answer each and every question to their satisfaction, need to resign immediately, admitting that they have no wish to serve the public, they have a desire to rip off the public by serving private lobby groups who bung them thousands for their betrayal.

This is not about socialism vs capitalism. It is about corruption vs honesty. You can have honest capitalism and you can have dishonest socialism. It is all about human fallibility.

The truth is that some people are driven by status and others by service. Arch capitalists solely equate ‘value’ with money. Arch socialists are equally stupid in the opposite direction.

I know from 55 years on this earth that winning a £25k contract, delivering it and seeing the measurable benefits it brought to my life in terms of new technology, clearance of debt, savings etc etc will never tolerate socialists telling me that my whole life must be driven by others telling me who to serve, how to serve and how to be rewarded. They believe in negotiating castration: completely divorcing people from participating in the parlays that are at the heart of human existence.

I have equally little time for capitalist psychopaths who expect everyone else to give them everything for nothing but charge £5000 a day for their own services. People like that get no respect nor fear from me, I just mark them down as human scum, detritus, venomous snakes. They are unfit to be parents, but they always think they should have more than two children. Having seen some of those children, they do not always make a very good job of it….

The discussion has to be around how economic systems need to evolve, adapt etc rather than fixating on artificial constructs.

It has to take into account what levels of emotional maturity exist in different populations, because the reality is that motivation is directly linked to emotional states of being.

There has been zero public forum discussion of such matters the past 40 years, merely 40 years of tired mantras being regurgitated like cows chewing the cud. Unlike cows, we humans are incapable of regurgitating constructively: we end up vomiting instead.

40 years of political constipation means a fairly extreme laxative is required.

Anyone written any learned treatises on curing political constipation? It is something which might be a good laugh to read…..

Alpine Observer
Alpine Observer
May 2, 2020 7:01 PM
Reply to  Rhys Jaggar

This is not about socialism vs capitalism. It is about corruption vs honesty. You can have honest capitalism and you can have dishonest socialism

Quote of the week!

Simon
Simon
May 3, 2020 7:06 AM
Reply to  Rhys Jaggar

Well said,,and here’s a big virtual hug to your parents

R Anand
R Anand
May 2, 2020 8:00 AM

I am from India and here the authoritarian religious extremist central government has extended the lockdown by another 14 days from May 3 to May 17 making it a 57-day lockdown period assuming that it won’t get extended further when we near May 17.
The impact on the non-affluent, poor citizens of my country has been severe. When the lockdown was announced on the evening of March 24, the people were given only a 4-hours notice. Daily wagers, migrant-workers and scores of other poor people have been stuck and the government support has been below average in some places, meagre in many other places and non-existent in some places.
From the information made available to us, I believe the Corona-19 virus is not any more fatal than the influenza or other recent viruses. But India’s government will use any opportunity to clamp down on its citizens. In recent months, there had been several street protests against the government’s amended citizenship laws and the creation of a national register of citizens which would make several Indian citizens into non-citizens. The intention was precisely to rack up the authoritarinism and control the country in a dictatorial manner.
But within a week of the WHO mischievously declaring corona-19 as a pandemic, the government of India grabbed the opportunity to brutally impose and enforce lockdown. In a country like mine, where majority of people live in small, cramped up homes, the effect of the lockdown has been very severe.

ChrisG
ChrisG
May 2, 2020 1:26 AM

Socialists do have problem with the current state of affairs, but must in my opinion put the material and spiritual health of the working class as priority. From that POV the rich must pay for all the fall out from the economic down turn. Whether or not lock down is suitable is surely a medical issue, the figures are indicating gross over reaction from almost all governments, but as medical tactics and strategy is as yet an indeterminant a medical solution has to be viewed separately from political tactics. The health of workers must come first.

mikael
mikael
May 2, 2020 12:25 AM

Yeah, arguments, and counter uh.. arguments, debunking and complying, lets be real, and to be frank, factual for maybe ones.
Mike More, or More Mike, I have knows this for decades, that AGW is just pseudo-science galore, nothing will change that, and again, attacking somebody without coming up with one f…. point of referances to what exactly one thinks is wrong, is as far I am conserned, f….. drivel, and I dont even care what you claim you are, from where and what, if you dont come up with arguments, you have an problem, and I am sorry we have this kind of Mofo all over the boards this days, are you from what, the 77 Brigade, or what, an idiot from Hardwierd, the Imperial dipshit colegeium of sniveling drivel in the Isle of the Brits, formerly known as the land of Angels.
Polution and ecologiacl catastrophes, yes, I can list issues miles long and I dont even exagerate that, witch some of you know, I have no benefit from this, is annon and will stay so, but my only weapon is truth, facts and shield is reasoning and thru years of working with quality systems learned to cut it to the core, simple and straight into the issue without to much words.

You, the anti-anti-vaxxers and anti-anti-semits, along with the belivers of the doom cult called AGW, dont impress me a bloody bit, and I have been up against this/you for years, longer than most, and knows every trick there is, and right now I am in doubt, do I even want to continue, do I really care, when the morons are going for them selfs straight into the Gates of Hell, I dont even have much sympathy, anymore, thinking for once I just sit back and watch the freak show continue, and only focus on my own family, make shure they understand without going to far and keep it backed by sanity, reason and logic.
The present is more like an world where the wall that separated the insane inside the compound called Asylum, is gone, and I dont see that wall anymore, maybe its over grown or pushed back beyond the horison, but I cant even diferentiate between the inmates and the so called normal ones, to whom is by now trully insane, the religious dogmas some claimed about the belivers in religion, as the militant atheists claimed anyone whom belived must be insane, while their belife system is even worse, they belive in miracles, something from abolutelly nothing, etc, and if we dont follow, their belife, we are heretics, and now, I cant differentiate the insane from what some define as sane people anymore, its become an world gone bonkers. The worst thing, and thats basically the only reason I stil bother to say something is for our children and animals, they, are the reason I do this, and belive my what grown ups do, I really dont care, but the victims of this present bonkers reality is the one I fight for, nobody else.

I was about to continue with the 5G, explaining further the damages that is done, to the most important creature I know of, beates everything else to pulp, human cells, within a time frame of two weeks to an month, every single cell in your body is new, regenerated from the cells that have surpased their life expextancy, and when the radiations we are living under, witch I know damaged cells, the time it take for something large to ocure, like Cancer to autoimune problems will take time, even years, since the cells, regenerate slowly. Do you understand, even DNA is made of things, like Amino acids, and Amino acids are again made up by moleculare bindings, and DNA is not what you think it is, its the information flow in one single cell that is vital, DNA is just a tool, and when this chains of “things” is altered, the problems accumulate, slowly slowly, and then we have the Vaccines, toxic enviroment, pestecides, etc, to chemicals in an range and scope that is mindboggling, and nobody is willing to debate that, because the “experts” dont, so its an realm of dead silence, and people just asumes, and like the saying, the road to hell is based upon assumptions, and we are there right now.
They have taken an ordinary flu, and twisted that to something new, nuevo craut, whatever, and their propaganda have been all encompasing, and people have stopped thinking.

I dont bother either to wade into the swamp of -isms, when the problem is corruption, ignorance and arrogance, we know whom they are, and what their tools are, central banking, etc to usury.
They are the ones whom rules, and they are the ones whom gives our Gov the premisses, to make shure they stay on the top of the scam chain.
That have been the norm for centurys, all wars are bankers wars, if you stil dont get that, well, yeah, we are indeed f….
WE have to excelent remedies to solve that problem with, touches and pitchforks.
Its an pitty that humainty went into the drak just because of lacking balls, that is the only thing that matters, do you have the balls or not, nothing else matters.

peace

John Pretty
John Pretty
May 2, 2020 12:08 AM

I have been self isolating for two weeks from virus fear porn. In all that time I have seen and read no news at all other than to get a weekly update on the UK numbers.

It is a considerable relief that I come back to see this site is still running strongly!

JudyJ
JudyJ
May 2, 2020 12:27 PM
Reply to  John Pretty

It is a considerable relief that I come back to see this site is still running strongly!

John,
It is a considerable relief that you are still running strongly! Your ‘absence’ was noted by another commenter on here a few days ago with the expressed hope that you were ok. Glad that it appears so. I know it’s not been a long absence but nice to have you back! 😀

Mike Ellwood
Mike Ellwood
May 2, 2020 1:24 PM
Reply to  JudyJ

Seconded.

Reg
Reg
May 2, 2020 2:54 PM
Reply to  John Pretty

Good to see you back, John (y)

RobG
RobG
May 1, 2020 11:39 PM

I’d also like to apologise to Rhisiart for being a bit hard on him. We are in unprecedented times at the moment and tempers are frayed, including mine.

Here’s the only Welsh language song that’s ever been featured in a Hollywood movie…

Oliver
Oliver
May 2, 2020 12:25 AM
Reply to  RobG

Hmmm. So many Welsh links to Japanese military activity starting well over 100 years ago. Welsh a language from Central Asia btw.

RobG
RobG
May 2, 2020 12:44 AM
Reply to  Oliver

This one is sung in Cornish (for those that don’t know, Cornwall is a county in the far south west of England)…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-rCeygWexyA

Gwenno is fluent in Cornish, Welsh, and of course English, and she also speaks a bit of French and Italian.

What have you done today..?

Oliver
Oliver
May 2, 2020 2:12 AM
Reply to  RobG

Err..strange question. Unless you already know.

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
May 2, 2020 11:18 PM
Reply to  RobG

Correction: Kernow is a small Celtic country in the South-West of the island of Britain.

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
May 2, 2020 11:17 PM
Reply to  Oliver

LOL!

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
May 2, 2020 9:58 AM
Reply to  RobG

Men of Harlech in Zulu?

Not Hollywood. Larfely a fictional history of course.

For some reason I always imagine the seven dwarves going hi-hoing off to work in Snow White as having something of the Welsh miners about them – probably to do with childhood images of Harry Secombe of the Goons.

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
May 2, 2020 11:16 PM
Reply to  RobG

Diolch yn fawr i ti, ffrind Rob! 🙂

RobG
RobG
May 3, 2020 12:10 AM

Rhis, you know I can’t speak Welsh (I have enough trouble speaking French!)

You might have just told me to ‘fuck off’ in Welsh.

We are going through very difficult times at the moment. I always enjoy reading your posts on various boards, and I respect your opinion enormously.

Again, we are going through quite unprecedented times. Hotheads like me have to speak out against it.

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
May 3, 2020 7:07 AM
Reply to  RobG

Please god you always continue to do so! The one-liner says: ‘Big thanks to you, friend Rob!’ 🙂

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
May 1, 2020 11:22 PM

On vaccines- don’t touch one with a barge pole for at least 2 years after it has been trialled successfully and proved ‘safe’. And only then if it is to reduce the risk massively if you are in a vulnerable group is my opinion.

But it will likely happen – the fastest a vaccine has been developed is 5 years for Ebola. New Scientist has more.

https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg24632804-000-why-itll-still-be-a-long-time-before-we-get-a-coronavirus-vaccine/
29/4/2020

‘More than 100 vaccines for the coronavirus are currently in various early stages of development. The more that are tested, the higher the chances of finding something that is both safe and effective.

Yet there is no guarantee that it is even possible to vaccinate against the coronavirus. There is a lot we don’t know yet about how our immune systems respond to the virus, and whether it is possible to induce long-lasting immunity to it.

But it could be years before we have a vaccine. Until then, we will need to deal with multiple waves of infection with measures such as extensive testing, contact tracing and quarantining.’
———
That’s even with the megalomaniac BillyWonkaGates Russian Roulette (with added sterilisation) chocolate factories to make them.

‘he is helping to build manufacturing capability for seven candidate vaccines – a strategy he said will lose billions of dollars but save time.’
———
If you say so Willy, now give us a song. 🤡

RobG
RobG
May 2, 2020 12:52 AM
Reply to  Dungroanin

Dungroanin, I can’t figure you out on this issue.

This is the biggest thing that’s ever happened in history.

You can’t sit on the fence with this sort of stuff.

You’re either for freedom or you’re against it.

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
May 2, 2020 1:51 AM
Reply to  RobG

I’m for survival of all and freedom for all.

I’m for end of the ancient Anglo imperial pathocracy and their slavery and warmongering robber baronery.

I’m for the lifting of the poorest and the lowering of the richest.

I’m for personal security for every single human being wherever they are born and where ever they live.

Only with that will all life on Earth be secured.
It needs to happen. It will happen. It is happening.

All we are seeing is the 5+1 eyed gollum monster pterodactyl trying to hang on to its perch and trying to fight of King Kong.

Meanwhile there is a new virus to deal with. It is being used as an excuse in that fight.

My money’s on Kong.

I ain’t sitting on a fence moaning
I done groaning and started doing.

Robbobbobin
Robbobbobin
May 5, 2020 4:00 PM
Reply to  RobG

“You’re either for freedom or you’re against it.”

What is dom? I’m for freebeer. Is dom as good as beer?

Loverat
Loverat
May 1, 2020 9:07 PM

The Slog is a great site. I think run by John Ward. Some OAP who lives in France.

His thinking is off the scale.

bob
bob
May 1, 2020 8:35 PM

Off topic too

Having had a quick look at Craig Murray’s site I was horrified by the comment below from one of his ‘hidden’ moderators. There had been lots of debate about the ‘virus’ and the data and a commenter called Bob Dee received this – I include his comment and the moderators comment for your interest:
************************************************
Bob DeeMay 1, 2020 at 16:20

as a pathologist I take exception to the claim below:

clark – “The extra deaths are recorded and categorised by countless health workers in hundreds of hospitals across scores of local authorities. Unless these are all “in on some scam”, and likewise in other countries all over the world, covid-19 is the most likely explanation. That’s what best explains the data.”

you are deliberately conflating a number of issues, the main one of which is that the ‘extra deaths’ as you call them may well be the result of the inhumane lockdown presided over the UK by an apparently ‘not-in-control’ regime – where people are not going to A&E, where services have been stopped, where there is little community support -additionally, it has been noted that too many deaths are being labelled as ‘covid’ when there is absolutely no evidence that that is the case – indeed Patrick Vallance (exGSK) has said that deaths can be labelled ‘covid’ without any test (which is useless and not specific) – you are not correct in your summation
Maybe also, you could tell us who exactly is running the country at the moment – a man of your intelligence ought to know that??


[ Mod: ‘Bob Dee’ also posted a comment last year, referring people to blog site hat4uk.wordpress.com – “The Slog”, which is hosting an array of CT articles about the Covid-19 lockdown.
This comment, and an exact duplicate, have been posted via blacklisted proxy servers formerly used by a small group of identities that were banned for xenophobia.
Strange behaviour for a pathologist, no? ]

*********************************************
It seems to me that this moderator is completely out of order
1) for involving a third party – the Slog
2) he/she doesn’t even address the comment
3) the comment about a pathologist is tantamount to trolling – something he/she is accusing the commenter of
4) the comment could just have been deleted – why make a public exibition of it?

Bob’s comment is actually very reasonable – having checked some things out it appears the commenter called ‘Clark’ is actually a supporter of Extinction Rebellion and has posted their stuff on Murray’s site – talk about hypocrisy – I don’t know who Bob Dee is by the way. Avoid the Murray site is my response

This surely highlights how well Off-G manages debate on here despite the vast numbers of people drawn here.

Arsebiscuits
Arsebiscuits
May 1, 2020 9:07 PM
Reply to  bob

Bob dee is on the money.
You don’t have to unlock incognito files to dig up that available information.

That pathologist is used to being around dead bodies too much to make any coherency.

Tony
Tony
May 1, 2020 9:24 PM
Reply to  bob

The moderators at Craig’s site are appalling. I stopped my subscription over their behaviour. Clark is a former moderator of the site, and a personal friend of Craig. He gets the cotton wool treatment by the mods. I took him to task over his rather ham-handed spamming of the comments with his XR advertorials. The mods were all over me like a rash with threats and deletions. I’ve also found Clark to be quite disingenuous with his reasoning and arguments. He comes across as a right smartarse.

The mods there are very protective of Craig, which is a good thing because he seems quite fragile in some respects. But I think he doesn’t realise the damage they do, driving posters away from his site with their often piss-poor moderation.

John Pretty
John Pretty
May 2, 2020 1:04 AM
Reply to  Tony

“The mods there are very protective of Craig, which is a good thing because he seems quite fragile in some respects.”

Craig Murray is an adult Tony and quite capable of looking after himself. He is open about his mental illness, but that does not stop him from turning up at courthouses and causing trouble.

Craig Murray is a hypocrite. He shouts loudly about freedom of speech, but wrecked my friendship with Tatyana whom I was very fond of. I started an off topic thread “Russian in world war two” under my old name at the end of August 2019 which was mostly composed of comments by myself and her.

RobG
RobG
May 2, 2020 1:09 AM
Reply to  Tony

Murray’s site is a GCHG/MI5 operation. Murray never, ever questions what’s really going on. We are now in unprecedented territory, but what does Murray say about it? Ziltch.

The trolls on Murray’s blog are a wonder to behold. You just need to ask yourself why these trolls are given free reign.

Tony
Tony
May 2, 2020 7:34 AM
Reply to  RobG

Craig has taken a cautious, middle ground-ish approach to the covid19 issue, a position with which I disagree. I disagree strongly with him on other issues, such as the EU. That doesn’t make him a gatekeeper or an Establishment shill.

The issues he has faced with the Establishment (of a scale exponentially worse than, I suspect, most of us here have faced, or are ever likely to face) nearly finished him off back when he was sacked from the FO. Most people would have gone away to a quiet life, but Craig has continued to be a thorn in the Establishment’s side. And now they are trying to put him in prison.

The notion that he us MI5 is utterly preposterous. He is one of us. And we have to accept that we are a broad church.

Tony
Tony
May 2, 2020 8:11 AM
Reply to  Tony

As an addendum, I would be surprised if Craig’s inner circle hasn’t been infiltrated by the security services. And Clark’s a prime candidate. Cut through his ‘rebel’ persona, and he’s pro-establishment with pretty-much all his political views, labelling everyone who takes an anti-estabshment stance on just about any issue as a conspiracy theory nut/idiot. He was on the last march in support of Julian Assange (as was I), but you will struggle to find anything substantial in his writing in support of Julian.

RobG
RobG
May 2, 2020 10:25 PM
Reply to  Tony

Tony, I agree that Craig is obviously an honorable man.

But if you look at his site, with its moderation policy and a plethora of security service trolls, it’s quite obvious what’s going on there.

My guess is that people like Craig are only allowed to operate within strict confines, and Craig knows this.

This in itself is very disturbing in what is supposed to be ‘a democracy’.

breweriana
breweriana
May 2, 2020 10:17 AM
Reply to  Tony

“He is one of us.”
Might be one of you…
Do not class the hypocrite with me.
He’d sell his own grandmother.

Tony
Tony
May 2, 2020 10:59 AM
Reply to  breweriana

Tell me breweriana, what have you done to further good causes? Pretty much the same as me, I expect. Post on alt media sites, go on the odd march, write to your MP, donate a bit of money. Craig has used his former status in the Establishment to put himself front and centre on many, many good causes, to the point that the Establishment is now trying to put him in prison. We are all hypocrites in some ways. Craig isn’t perfect. Neither are you or I. The regularity with which the alt media and it’s supporters turn on each other must be a joy to behold to the Establishment.

breweriana
breweriana
May 2, 2020 11:29 AM
Reply to  Tony

He is just a bully. I get it.

John Pretty
John Pretty
May 2, 2020 12:03 AM
Reply to  bob

Clark is a personal friend of Murray’s.

I have been a victim of Murray’s moderators. I have said before here that an anonymous moderator of his sent me a personal e-mail telling me (in July 2019) that I was not to comment to one of his other commenters, a Russian woman with whom I was friends.

I considered my relationship with her to be none of their business. I ignored the order and carried on until September 2019 at which point I was put on pre-moderation without any prior notice. I sent a number of very strongly worded e-mails both to Murray and the anonymous moderator by way of protest. These e-mails were ignored.

I then left of my own accord and returned briefly over Christmas and the New Year under my own name. This was until mid January when I answered one of the Russian lady’s comments and was again harrassed by Murray’s moderator who threatened me with a permanent ban.

I considered this attitude by them to be completely unacceptable and left of my own accord and will not return.

Now considering Murray to be a hypocrite I e-mailed him early in March to express concern over his courtroom antics at Julian Assange’s extradtion hearing and in particular his ranting against Vanessa Baraitser which I feared may alienate her and could be dangerous for Julian. He ignored my e-mail.

It came as no surprise at all to me that he now finds himself accused of Contempt of Court after similar antics at Alex Salmond’s trial. In my opinion Murray has only himself to blame.

Tony
Tony
May 2, 2020 7:15 AM
Reply to  John Pretty

Clark’s a prick. He labelled me a racist in a brexit debate, purely on the basis that I support brexit. I found this deeply offensive in view of the fact that my other half is Asian and my offspring mixed race, and we’ve been on the receiving end of real racism all through our family life. Something I doubt Clark has much, if any, experience of. Btw, he hates Off Guardian because they debunked his beloved XR and the climate change scam.

I totally disagree with your assessment of Craig, John. He couldn’t possibly make Baraitser more hostile to Julian because Baraitser has been as hostile as she can possibly be since the start. And it’s patently obvious that she’s been primed from higher up (probably by Arbuthnot) to take that position. Craig has done an outstanding job in getting this ongoing travesty of justice out to the public and the world-at-large, and has made it impossible for the Establishment to keep this under the radar, which they were trying to do with their msm blackout. Ditto the Alex Salmond case, which is why the Establishment is now going after him full on. He has my total support on this.

Tony
Tony
May 2, 2020 5:42 PM
Reply to  Tony

Just been reading the last page of comments for the latest OP on Craig’s site, between mowing the lawn and waiting for dinner (takeaway curry tonight). Clark is up to his usual hectoring and harrassing of anyone and everyone who has the slightest difference of opinion (I note that the astute John Goss now pointedly ignores him, even when addressed directly). Out of boredom, I decided to do a bit of counting. Of the, currently, 138 comments on the page, Clark has posted 24, over seventeen percent!!! If he were a mature adult (which he isn’t), he would know to reign himself in a little.

Robbobbobin
Robbobbobin
May 16, 2020 1:44 AM
Reply to  John Pretty

“I have been a victim of Murray’s moderators.”

“Victim” of a fucking moderator in an unincorporated, non-governmental individual’s website. Get fucking real. Anyone who claims that is primarily a “victim” of their own self-importance. Assange is the victim several nation states and international corporations. Multiple charred entities, some of them without uttering a contestable word, were mediaeval victims of state-sponsored organised religion. But anyone who thinks that a quarrelsome or haughty moderator’s comments, deletions or consignments to pre-moderation has a serious problem with the narcissistic overevaluation of their own self-aggrandizing opinions. Get real. There are thousands of totally unheard and unsung philosophers greater than Plato, Aristotle, Augustine, Machiavelli, Kant, Mill, Nietzsche, Russell, Wittgenstein, Foucault and Derrida, all put together, right over there in Thomas Gray’s copious churchyard. Go check it out.

breweriana
breweriana
May 2, 2020 10:11 AM
Reply to  bob

Finally people are catching on.
A site, where Murray’s goons.. er, ‘mods’ will insult commenters with impunity, remove any comments that do not fit with Murray’s views, etc.
He’s now in trouble with the law because of his arrogant overreach in his previous articles.
A self-centred ego-maniac, who’s site is best ignored: it’s just a bunch of hypocritical posturing.

Tony
Tony
May 2, 2020 11:17 AM
Reply to  breweriana

“He’s now in trouble with the law because of his arrogant overreach in his previous articles.”

You couldn’t have packed more complete and utter bullshit into one sentence if you’d spent a month trying. All the MSM covering the Alex Salmond trial have crossed, and continue to cross the legal line that’s being used against Craig wrt “jigsaw identity”, and most of them have been less careful about it than Craig. If this is the reason for his prosecution, every newspaper and TV station that covered the trial would also be under prosecution. He’s not being targeted because of “arrogant overreach”. He’s being targeted because he published the defence side of the trial that the MSM completely ignored, publication of which has put a spanner in the works of the Establishment’s continued pursuit of Alex Salmond.

breweriana
breweriana
May 2, 2020 11:33 AM
Reply to  Tony

Defending a bully does not get you far.

Robbobbobin
Robbobbobin
May 16, 2020 2:57 AM
Reply to  breweriana

“Defending a bully does not get you far.”

Craig Murray does not have any problem posting whatever he likes on your website.

Retired Dave
Retired Dave
May 1, 2020 8:30 PM

Philip – thank you for a sound and wise voice in these difficult times. You may well be right about capitalism – as Winston Churchill once said the problem with capitalism is that it doesn’t spread its benefits evenly through society. He did of course go on to suggest that socialism spread its misery to everyone.

In the last century or so, the left killed many more people than what most describe as the right. Usually assigning the Nazis as right wing, when they were of course The National Socialist Party. Even China has had to move to a form of capitalism to make the spectacular advances of the last 30 years.

For me the main lessons I have learned recently (and not just with C-19) is to recognise that the right are capitalists and the prominent left are mostly crony-capitalists.

Capitalism will come under immense pressure after it has been trashed by the very people who need it to pay our way. Good luck with taking the other fork in the road instead, as Einstein is reputed to have said –

“The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.”

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
May 1, 2020 11:41 PM
Reply to  Retired Dave

The usual sub-idiotic spewing of lies at scocialism. The equating of the Nazis with socialism is despicably ignorant.

wardropper
wardropper
May 1, 2020 11:50 PM
Reply to  Retired Dave

I would say that what you call the “prominent left” are simply not left at all. It’s actually very hard to find anything genuinely left in our modern society, and my solution to that problem is simply to think of all politicians, mainstream media and CEOs as “right”, and the rest of us as significantly to their left. As a belief, it may not be 100% correct, but, as a rule-of-thumb, I find that it works very well.
Despite the fact that the Nazis were, technically and by name, the National Socialist Party, their agenda and their actions were actually fascist and right wing – “If it walks like a duck”… We should also remember that, to Hitler, the Communists were an abomination, and, just as for today’s Washington there is no difference between a socialist and a communist, we should perhaps avoid euphemizing the gulf between good and evil into a meaningless Left vs. Right scenario.
We can’t just look at a label and automatically trust that it reflects the inner reality. A white coat doesn’t make an excellent doctor, a suit of tails doesn’t make you a great concert pianist, and calling yourself a National Socialist doesn’t make you one. Margaret Thatcher saying, “I DO care… I DO care” didn’t actually make her care, and I recently saw a comment about the US Federal Reserve which pointed out that it was neither federal, nor a reserve.

Willem
Willem
May 1, 2020 8:07 PM

Off topic.

I didn’t want to (given that the director is Michael Moore and Counterpunch finds it a good docu) but since it was recommended by so many, I watched this new docu from Michael Moore today. I didn’t like it at all. True, he exposes the scam of ‘green energy’, but this is nothing new. He also uses the word ‘we’ quite often, which makes me suspicious, like in ‘we all wanted green energy so much, etc’. – I mean, how does he know that ‘we’ wanted that and never raised any suspicion over the fact that wind mills and solar Panels had to be mined before they could become operational. And then he never explains if coal and gas are really bad for the climate or not, it is just unanswered in the doc.

But the worst part, IMO, is that he exchanges one lie (the green energy), with an even bigger one: that too many people live on this planet and destroy the ecosystem because they are so numerous. And I tried to find arguments in to why he said this, if he would come up with some evidence. But he doesn’t, it is just a talking point we have to believe, as in ‘>97% of all scientists say that man made climate change is real’ (which is also only a talking point). The docu doesn’t really say it, but the only logical conclusion is, is that our planet should lose some people if we want to survive. Enter Covid19 and the likely possibility lity that millions are going to starve in 3rd world countries because of lockdown. – This is good for the planet and for us, when one follows the logic of Moore’s docu. How humanistic from him, how convenient too.

Oh, and replacing one lie with an even bigger one is typical for Michael Moore. For, instance he also had this Fahrenheit 911, part II released lately where he first scrutinized the US democrats cronyism, after which he made it look like that the democrats changed from within with such wonderful people like AOC. One lie replaced with another lie.

So no, this docu was not a good docu and I can only recommend one to watch it in terms of seeing how one lie can be replaced with another lie.

Shaking My Head
Shaking My Head
May 1, 2020 10:13 PM
Reply to  Willem

There’s a lot of simple misanthropy rooted from traumatic upbringings and a toxic environment that’s confused as profundity among intellectuals. I can see the Moore/Gates ‘overpopulation’ canard stemming from that.

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
May 1, 2020 11:44 PM

The REAL problem is over-consumption, particularly by rich countries and rich individuals in particular. The ecological collapse is absolutely irrefutable.

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
May 1, 2020 11:43 PM
Reply to  Willem

Well, are you denying that every major life-sustaining system on Earth is either collapsing or near collapse, thanks to human destructiveness?

Willem
Willem
May 2, 2020 7:21 AM

It depends on how you define ‘human’

Don’t know if this copies and CO2 may be the wrong example, but I believe the idea is the same as always: some people are spoiling it for us all and want to hide their decadence in using the term ‘we’, ‘human’, ‘us’

comment image

lundiel
lundiel
May 1, 2020 7:58 PM

A comment from me to those BTL .
Poor people living in cities don’t have the option of growing their own food, nor were they able to prepare for the effects of the virus, nor did they have any say in their economic future, especially with so many of them now out of work and awaiting benefit payments with no savings, no garden to sit in enjoying the spring sunshine, no stocks of vitamin C, zinc and no vitamin D. Also, the disease is far more real to them than for middle class people living in relatively rural areas where they don’t even know anyone who’s got it, let alone died from it. Then there’s the added risk for ethnic minorities with some three times more likely to get it than white people. The people posting on on this site are sadly ignoring such people, come across as very insular and have become a denialist echo chamber that swings between total denial to it’s just seasonal flue.

sharon marlowe
sharon marlowe
May 1, 2020 10:57 PM
Reply to  lundiel

Thumbs down, lundiel. I’m poor, and as a poor person, I want the truth. I don’t want to be used for fake sympathy just so you can throw up about how scary this virus is so as to support the lock down, because it’s not scary. Relying on the U.S. regime to pay my bills and feed me through the lock down period is a million times more stressful than worrying about what amounts to a seasonal flu.

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
May 1, 2020 11:46 PM
Reply to  sharon marlowe

The US citizens ought to have a regime that will give them the security that us Brits get.

But the US voters need to vote for it. You have 6 months to make it a reality by using that great American get up and go and get people in power who will give it to you.

Us Brits had a choice to vote for even better, last December. But we chose to have a deal with the US to make it like yours instead!

Save us both!

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
May 1, 2020 11:36 PM
Reply to  lundiel

Lundiel my great pleasure to cheer you on, play it a few times and don’t let the buggers get at you. All best.

Reg
Reg
May 2, 2020 12:19 AM
Reply to  lundiel

Piss off with your emotional string-pulling. Hospitals are fucking empty. Nurses are dancing the tik-tok dance. When the seals start clapping, they’re out there with cups of latte laughing and chatting, About 30 million are jobless in the US and the number is growing. Are there no hospital workers among them? YOU are killing people by jailing them and isolating them from human interaction. And you are RIGGING the fucking numbers. You are RIGGING the fucking numbers by recording anything as a C19 death.

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
May 2, 2020 9:31 AM
Reply to  Reg

Rage Reg! Losers resort to abuse.
You have trolled into a post I directed towards another poster, raging and snivelling, like a demented bullshit BrexShitter zombie bully thug.

The song has nothing to do with the CV – it was released 2 years ago.

It was offered to the poster who had expressed some feeling towards the multicultural Londoners and the immense gaslighting and indeed barracking, the poster has realised is happening here.

It undermines your message?

TOUGH.

I responded to the second poster from another continent as well, who actually was the first to use emotional blackmail upon the o/p in this exchange and you are the second. My recommendation for the citizens of the US by their elected representatives is simple – DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!

You seem to think we in the UK should worry more about the US?
That we should feel PITY for them?

You have lost it Reg, and in your losing rage – you are flailing out.

Now go sit on the naughty step before gobbing off your losers rage Reg!

———

ADMINS – it seems the notification email for Regs comment that arrived last night has disappeared from my inbox.

Why and HOW have has it been retrieved from my device?

Sophie - Admin1
Admin
Sophie - Admin1
May 2, 2020 11:48 AM
Reply to  Dungroanin

ADMINS – it seems the notification email for Regs comment that arrived last night has disappeared from my inbox.

Why and HOW have has it been retrieved from my device?

I think you might need to take some downtime D. No one is retrieving things from your device.

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
May 2, 2020 12:05 PM

It was there – I read it and decided to respond this morning- at which point it was no longer in my Inbox, deleted or anywhere else!

It happened to me previously some years ago now in an exchange with the moderators from the Guardian- one of whom had reinstated my comment and sent an email saying so to confirm- the following morning my comment had been removed again and so had the email from that moderator.

Yesterday I identified you as having edited your post to me, which i know about because I obviously received your email with your original post.

A bit later I received an email with no sender, subject and dated 1970!

That too disappeared from my inbox when I checked later.

Now this email relating to Reg’s post from off-G has similarly vamooshed.

What’s up? Lol. Using NSA/GCHQ tools is what’s up.

Btw I’m still awaiting your answer for editing your post and using ad hominem against me – yet again.

👌

Sophie - Admin1
Admin
Sophie - Admin1
May 2, 2020 12:35 PM
Reply to  Dungroanin

We get hundreds of comments a day, D, so I’m afraid I don’t recall the one you’re mentioning, but I don’t think anything I have said to you could be described as ad hom. If you really think so, take it up with an editor.

I really doubt GCHQ is deleting your emails, but of course anything is possible. 🤷🏻‍♀️

JohnB
JohnB
May 2, 2020 1:03 PM

OK, game’s up, it was me. I am a bad man.

Reg
Reg
May 2, 2020 2:57 PM
Reply to  Dungroanin

Go play with some covid numbers, DG. And don’t forget to wear your dog muzzle.

ame
ame
May 2, 2020 12:30 PM
Reply to  lundiel

then there’s the added risk for ethnic minorities with some three times more likely to get it than white people
Iceland and swedan was always mentioned by the alt right funded by you no who.

Until very recently the alt right have stopped talking about sweden iceland et c
it had one of the highest according to them had thee most immigration population YET has the least CV19 cases.
now once we get beyond this we an see that here’s the added risk for ethnic minorities with some three times more likely to get it than white people. is horseeeeshit

this is exactly the same a MO with HIV Aids also Hep C diabetes Heroin addiction Crystal meth addiction etc etc etc
Heroin addiction Crystal meth addiction HIV Aids diabetes was a white carrier at the very beginning aimed at a demographics of people to demonize a certain group of people then they switched it.

Then according to them, Same MO, This deadly disease or non deadly could effected everyone.
but now they added a new twist to the story

You can still have it without having it

Mark Millward
Mark Millward
May 1, 2020 7:33 PM

Crispy is asking that all three angles to the Hegelian dialect are examined. He’s not wrong – all too easy for you guys to feel virtuous for recreating a 20 year old Guardian model. But that model was not all truth and goodness either, though it was so in part. And I’m speaking as a reformed Guardianista who flirted with its antithesis until I realised that we’re all being shafted by the evil synthesis. Time to leave the dream world of left / right, old / new, conservative/ liberal (etc, ad infinitum) behind or we’re all buggered.

Mark Millward
Mark Millward
May 1, 2020 7:34 PM
Reply to  Mark Millward

Dialectic

Sam - Admin2
Admin
Sam - Admin2
May 1, 2020 10:22 PM
Reply to  Mark Millward

I’m just wondering why you’re representing Crispy here, when he can clearly speak for himself and when you’ve previously accused him of being 77th Brigade?

Mark Millward
Mark Millward
May 1, 2020 11:05 PM
Reply to  Sam - Admin2

Tried to respond in the thread following his comment, but it came up “comments closed” so posted it up front instead. Are you serious? Is Crispy not a human being whose views are capable of coming into clearer focus? Am I not allowed to appreciate his comments in this context? Or are you just a bit sore because I don’t think offGuardian is perfect? Grow up.

Sophie - Admin1
Admin
Sophie - Admin1
May 2, 2020 3:48 AM
Reply to  Mark Millward

Don’t troll, and don’t abuse the mods. This thread is completely OT, and if you tried to pull stuff like this on any comparable site you and Crispy and several other serially abusive posters would be banned.

Have a little respect for the fact you aren’t and won’t be. And if you can’t do that feel invited to leave and try your luck posting stuff like this anywhere else.

Gary Weglarz
Gary Weglarz
May 1, 2020 7:09 PM

Whitney Webb on the illustrious Mr. Gates.

Moneycircus
Moneycircus
May 1, 2020 7:33 PM
Reply to  Gary Weglarz

Webb has just published an interview with Maria Farmer on Last American Vagabond. It’s a must-listen.

Moneycircus
Moneycircus
May 1, 2020 7:39 PM
Reply to  Gary Weglarz

According to Webb’s interview with Maria Farmer, Gates and Epstein go back at least to the 1990s, if not earlier. It was, she says, a business relationship. The question is what types of business.

Mike Foster
Mike Foster
May 1, 2020 6:48 PM

I do not agree with all of this article certainly as regards the UK . It is clear from the ONS mortality rate charts that the death rates in the under 50’s has hardly increased at all and in no way supports any mass imprisonment. The 50-70 mortality rate does suggest an average increase but again not to the levels that you would imagine the lockdown warrants. These are facts, quoted numbers and easy to assess.
Because these numbers do not present the governments actions in the best light, certainly in respect of 85% of the working population( under 70’s) they have resulted in relying on R0.
This is a calculation that has no transparency and apparently no accuracy so cannot be analysed proved or disproved.
The reality is that as this virus is only dangerous to the elderly and sick so why is the nationwide R0 number relevant at all.
Save lives, Save the NHS …… save, jobs, homes, businesses and the economy by releasing the lockdown of all those under 70!!!

wardropper
wardropper
May 2, 2020 12:12 AM
Reply to  Mike Foster

Regarding your last sentence: In fact I’m over 70 myself, yet I still think the lockdown should be terminated forthwith. As one of the wise alternative commenters on this CoVid issue stated (the gist paraphrased here from memory), “We are acting as if death was not a natural or inevitable part of existence. Something, some time, is definitely going to do us all in, usually one by one, but always inescapable, and disease is a part of that. We cannot live meaningful lives if we go into denial about death.”
I am living proof that Plato’s fourscore years and ten no longer apply to modern man (he stated that it was only good manners to die at 70…) but although I certainly wouldn’t advocate taking unnecessary risks with one’s life, I consider that to entertain the idea that there is something intrinsically unfair about death is laughable delusional psychopathy.

Cheezilla
Cheezilla
May 2, 2020 8:10 PM
Reply to  Mike Foster

I think the over 70s should be treated like the adults they are and allowed to make their own decision whether to quake indoors in fear, or to get on with living as full a life as their health permits.

tonyopmoc
tonyopmoc
May 1, 2020 5:34 PM

A poster below called “hope”, asked me about India, a place my wife and I have travelled to on 4 different occasions, often to very remote rural places, where hardly anyone spoke much English. We found all the people we met completely lovely, and we love the country – particularly Kerala. “hope” wanted to know where I had got my information from. Well it was from an interview with “Democracy Now” from Indian Author Arundhati Roy. This is part of the transcript.

Tony

“..on the 24th of March, with four hours’ notice, which ran between 8:00 at night and 12 midnight, Modi locked down this nation of 1.38 billion people without warning. ..You have a situation where you have millions of workers and migrant workers under a lockdown, which is supposed to enforce social distancing, but it only enforces physical compression. People are crammed together. People are separated from their families. In many places, they have no food. They have no access to money even. They’ve sold their phones. You have the sense that you’re sitting on some kind of explosive substance.

Well, as soon as the lockdown was announced, mass transport was stopped. It was the last week of March. People had not been paid their salaries, people who live virtually from day to day. The landlords in these little cramped, medieval tenements, into which five and 10 people are squashed into a room, said that they wanted their rent on time. So people just had to leave. And it was a surreal sight, you know, while there was no traffic on the streets, but suddenly the structural inequality and the horror, the shame of how our societies live, made themselves manifest.

the hunger is so urgent, it has to be addressed now. The granaries are full of food which is not being distributed. You know, people need cash transfers, but they don’t have bank accounts, or they don’t have access to their bank accounts. It’s a crisis which you feel you’re sitting on some kind of explosive substance right now. And, you know, as it deepens, once you distribute that grain, where will the next batch of food come from? Because right now is the harvest season, and, you know, people are — even those who have been able to harvest are not being able to sell.”

hope
hope
May 1, 2020 10:14 PM
Reply to  tonyopmoc

Thanks for the info. Im very worried about whats going on in India and there are so little info coming out. Saw some videos about the food riots. In the first place, I dont understand how Indians could accept the lockdown and why none from the scientific or academic community is speaking out. It shows how much foray fascism had already made: in fact the situation was already terrible. But that people accepted to actually be locked up in country where tragedies happen daily, where the numbers killed by pollution or malnutrition run in the millions…
Its very interesting that the other fascistic leader Bolsano in Brazil is against the lockdown.
India has lost its soul. Just a little poem, which frankly, applies to all countries, but was written for India by Tagore:

Where the mind is without fear and the head is held high;
Where knowledge is free;
Where the world has not been broken up into fragments by narrow domestic walls;
Where words come out from the depth of truth;
Where tireless striving stretches its arms towards perfection;
Where the clear stream of reason has not lost its way into the dreary desert sand of dead habit,
Where the mind is led forward by thee into ever-widening thought and action —
Into that heaven of freedom, my Father, let me country awake.

R Anand
R Anand
May 2, 2020 7:37 AM
Reply to  hope

I am from India and here the authoritarian religious extremist central government has extended the lockdown by another 14 days from May 3 to May 17 making it a 57-day lockdown period assuming that it won’t get extended further when we near May 17.
The impact on the non-affluent, poor citizens of my country has been severe. When the lockdown was announced on the evening of March 24, the people were given only a 4-hours notice. Daily wagers, migrant-workers and scores of other poor people have been stuck and the government support has been below average in some places, meagre in many other places and non-existent in some places.
From the information made available to us, I believe the Corona-19 virus is not any more fatal than the influenza or other recent viruses. But India’s government will use any opportunity to clamp down on its citizens. In recent months, there had been several street protests against the government’s amended citizenship laws and the creation of a national register of citizens which would make several Indian citizens into non-citizens. The intention was precisely to rack up the authoritarinism and control the country in a dictatorial manner.
But within a week of the WHO mischievously declaring corona-19 as a pandemic, the government of India grabbed the opportunity to brutally impose and enforce lockdown. In a country like mine, where majority of people live in small, cramped up homes, the effect of the lockdown has been very severe.

David Macilwain
David Macilwain
May 2, 2020 2:49 AM
Reply to  tonyopmoc

Roy exactly represents my feelings observing the way that a lock-down was imposed on the whole of India for the sake of protecting the middle classes in the cities – presumably. I had Zero confidence in Modi before this happened, but now believe he is totally corrupt, and likely acting on behalf of special interests.
But this also leads to another question, which is why it was that so many African countries, including two-bit states we barely heard of, almost simultaneously imposed lock-downs, even before they had half a dozen cases. It was almost as if the IMF or other body had put out a directive to governments that they must do this in order to receive any assistance following the pandemic.
But I also believe that the effect of CV19 on these countries will be minimal, and little compared with the other diseases they face every day, not to mention hunger and poverty. The median age is probably in the ’20s only, so “herd immunity” is necessary and desirable. At the same time the market for vaccines is huge, paid for by Western aid, or from IMF debt and penury. The CV fear campaign also makes a suitable business environment for countries wishing to sell ventilators and other hospital equipment, much as the IS campaign assisted with the marketing of jet fighters.. Or is this too long a bow?

It has long been evident that Africa is the US’ next big project, for resources and control. Against China and Russia.

bob
bob
May 1, 2020 4:55 PM
Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
May 1, 2020 11:48 PM
Reply to  bob

Spiked? The very bottom of the barrel.

Hector
Hector
May 1, 2020 4:07 PM

A lot of generally well-meaning, if irreversibly politicised, people seem to be coming to the grim realisation that the boot stamping on a human face forever won’t necessarily be fastened to a right foot. Even so, their overwhelming response is to mitigate their own sense of guilt / gullibility by trying to convince long-time sceptics of the state not to say ‘I told you so’ if we do in fact find ourselves living under Chinese-style conditions as a result of this pandemic hoax.

Jay
Jay
May 1, 2020 6:12 PM
Reply to  Hector

Yes, it seems ‘the other foot’ is cheering on what was thought to be a feared ‘right footed’ move we should avoid. But then it also seems the ‘other foot’ is very flexible in it’s core beliefs, even to the point of their being opposite from time to time. Not that the right is steed fast in theirs either.

Doctortrinate
Doctortrinate
May 1, 2020 6:35 PM
Reply to  Jay

the left and right paradigm – Imagine a one legged man wearing fake leg – forever.

Jay
Jay
May 1, 2020 7:44 PM
Reply to  Doctortrinate

Indeed. Bill Clinton’s Mentor Carroll Quigley Reveals Fraud of the ‘Two Party System’

“The argument of two parties should represent opposed ideas and policies, one perhaps, of the Right and the other of the Left, is a foolish idea acceptable only to doctrinate and academic thinkers. Instead, the two parties should be almost identical, so that the American people can “throw the rascals out” at any election without leading to any profound or extensive shifts in policy. The policies that are vital and necessary for America are no longer subjects of significant disagreement, but are disputable only in details of procedure, priority, or method.”

Carroll Quigely – “Tragedy and Hope” pp. 1247-1248

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
May 1, 2020 11:50 PM
Reply to  Hector

‘Chinese style conditions’? Growing wages. World’s best infrastructure. Technological and scientific boom. An ongoing cultural renaissance. And the Fort Detrick virus defeated after a massive effort. I wish.

Hector
Hector
May 2, 2020 3:14 PM

Several of my real-life friends seem happy to embrace an overarching surveillance state, so while I don’t understand this line of thinking at all, who am I to question your preferences?

My only experience of China has been a short trip to Shanghai, where, to me at least, the tension in the air was palpable. Also, for all the ultra-modern, ‘future is now’ appeal of the city centre, the surrounding areas appeared to be comprised of nothing but high-rise slums as far as the eye could see.

Reg
Reg
May 1, 2020 4:02 PM

Rappoport on the super-duper saviour of humanity, The Covid Vaccine!

https://blog.nomorefakenews.com/2020/05/01/the-covid-vaccine-simple-facts-staring-us-in-the-face/

bob
bob
May 1, 2020 3:58 PM

I’d be interested in comments about this article as it raises the issue of what matt hancock is doing to the nhs – given he was the digital minister not long ago –

https://vocal.media/theSwamp/the-epstein-associate-nobody-s-talking-about-the-idf-linked-bond-girl-infiltrating-the-uk-nhs

I think hancock is no more than a placeman (and gobshite) who is no longer in control of the nhs (that’s Simon Stevens’s job – outsourced in 2012)

Reg
Reg
May 1, 2020 4:30 PM
Reply to  bob

Chilling. The infiltration and takeover has been going on for some time. Corbyn might have become a threat but he was taken out with maximum prejudice. These are dark times.

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
May 1, 2020 11:52 PM
Reply to  Reg

Corbyn did not fight, so was probably controlled, like Boynie Sanders.

JohnB
JohnB
May 1, 2020 6:05 PM
Reply to  bob

Always good to meet others who think Hancock is a gobshite. 🙂

wardropper
wardropper
May 2, 2020 12:23 AM
Reply to  JohnB

Let’s just not forget the rest of them…

tonyopmoc
tonyopmoc
May 1, 2020 6:42 PM
Reply to  bob

That is some serious sh1t, even more terrifying than the phone interview posted below from an American Girl, who I currently have more respect for than anyone I know living on this planet. She is even more impressive than Vanessa Beeley and Eva Bartlett, and I was not expecting that from an American Woman (check out “The Guess Who”) Such courage and intelligence is awesome. Where are The Men? Whilst you work out who I am referring to (it’s not hard), I would suggest a relatively soft introduction, which is still my favourite book. I knew nothing about Susan Lindauer, nor her book. Talk about a page turner..and when it was all kicking off in Syria, I asked her a question through a blog, and she replied to me with the truth so far as she knew from women on the ground in Syria.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Extreme-Prejudice-Terrifying-Story-Patriot/dp/1453642757

As investigative journalists go this year, well she looks so young and so sweet, and her IQ is completely off the scale. I can’t see anyone beating her for my World Journalist of The Year. She is writing a book too. If you google Jimmy Dore show, she does not turn up, not even on Duckduckgo, and her interview was only last week. I think she lives half way up a mountain in Chile now. Sensible Girl.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGMkSNj_-7Q&feature=share&fbclid=IwAR1xh8ztYXzRVsrfymXy6gjX1u1Roh8P1AxOIGpbmDO2h9jGiQhJvrPpNXo

Tony

Cheezilla
Cheezilla
May 2, 2020 8:37 PM
Reply to  tonyopmoc

“she looks so young and so sweet” WTF???!

Tony
Tony
May 1, 2020 3:46 PM

This legal challenge to the government decree could possibly create some interesting publicity and subsequent debate. Let’s see how good the government is at stonewalling it:

https://wedlakebell.com/legal-challenge-over-lawfulness-of-government-lockdown-launched-by-entrepreneur/

Steve Hayes
Steve Hayes
May 1, 2020 4:24 PM
Reply to  Tony

I do not doubt that government’s actions have been (and continue to be) unlawful. The “lockdown” measures are clear and blatant violations of the Human Rights Act and the European Convention on Human Rights. However, I am not optimistic that judges will prefer the law to the virtually unanimous view of the establishment that this is an unprecedented crisis and the “lockdown” measures are essential.

Objective
Objective
May 1, 2020 4:50 PM
Reply to  Tony

That’s the second judicial review application i’ve heard about this week challenging the lockup.

I don’t hold much hope. Surely government has prepared for such a eventuality, it was almost inevitable eventually. I also worry that the judiciary is very much infiltrated with indoctrinated liberal (leftist) values .

As a side note i do wish everyone would not adopt the govs terminology of the wuflu panic-demic i don’t just do it out of facetious ridicule, its important we don’t legitimize their propaganda.

JudyJ
JudyJ
May 1, 2020 5:04 PM
Reply to  Objective

“Surely government has prepared for such an eventuality”

I doubt it very much, such is their arrogance and hubris. They will attempt to ignore it or sweep it away with a condescending wave of the hand.

Mike Ellwood
Mike Ellwood
May 1, 2020 5:14 PM
Reply to  Objective

I also worry that the judiciary is very much infiltrated with indoctrinated liberal (leftist) values

We are talking about the British judiciary here are we? They may be Remainers to a man|woman, but leftist?

You must be joking.

Objective
Objective
May 1, 2020 5:24 PM
Reply to  Mike Ellwood

You ask me that seriously? what was Sir Ikeas post before being carefully placed into the labour party to carry out his quiet coup? Head of the Crown Prosecution Service, & you think hes liberal centrist?

I dare say there’s a few crusty old conservatives left in the judiciary but i put money on them adopting the lunacy of leftist politics every other section of the establishment has. And what is the EU if its not leftist?

Mike Ellwood
Mike Ellwood
May 1, 2020 11:08 PM
Reply to  Objective

And what is the EU if its not leftist?

That old chestnut. I can’t remember your background, if you have previously explained it, but the old fashioned left in the UK were traditionally opposed to the EEC (which became the EU) because they identified it as a “Capitalist Club”. This was true, but in earlier times, the leading EEC countries had strong Social Democratic or nominally socialist parties, which tempered their capitalism with strong social policies, tended to promote full employment and a tendency towards more equality.

This meant that people on the right tended to mistrust the EEC (and then the EU) because they saw it (incorrectly) as “socialist”, because of this tempering attitude to wards capitalism.

However, times changed, and monetarism/neoliberalism became the new orthodoxy, and “Keynsian” economics was pronounced dead, or irrelevant.
The EU is a fully-paid up member of the neoliberal capitalist club. It certainly isn’t “leftist”.

Social Democratic and Socialist parties in EU countries are on their last legs, in case you hadn’t noticed. The Labour Party in GB would have gone the same way had it not been for Jeremy Corbyn. Now that Corbyn is no longer leader, the Parliamentary Labour Party, which is dominated by Blairite, pro-EU neoliberal MPs will continue with pro-EU neoliberal policies, although they will continue to mouth left-wing sounding platitudes for a month or two until people have forgotten the leadership campaign.

[STARMER]

you think hes liberal centrist?

I think he’s a Blairite, who temporarily assumed some left-wing affectations in order to try to win over the Corbyn supporters among the membership.

I’m not sure what “quiet coup” you are referring to, but the most important Blairite policy on his agenda is to rejoin the EU asap (before we have even left properly). He’s made little secret of this.

Janie doebuck
Janie doebuck
May 1, 2020 3:31 PM

The closer we get to the Gatesgasm of mandatory worldwide vaccination, the more we will hear any legitimate questioning of vaccine tyranny characterized as a ‘conspiracy theory’.
Let’s spend a minute to deconstruct this intellectually bankrupt cliche. First, the use of this label is a ‘contempt prior to investigation’ phenomenon. It is slapped on before any real investigation of the claims is made. If a person actually investigates a claim, they have no need for such a spurious label for the screamingly obvious reason that all they have to do is say “I think your theory or evidence is inaccurate here and here and here and here and this is why.” But with little to no real engagement with the topic they label something a ‘conspiracy theory’ which then in turn absolves them from any possible responsibility to grapple with ideas, investigate claims, provide evidence and risk a dialogue. Neat trick and about as intellectually lazy as it is possible to get.

Next off, the epithet is insulting and evinces a kind of ethical stuntedness, as do all terms which attempt to dismiss, shame or silence people who think in ways other than those that the arbiters of society deem appropriate. It is the use of language to patrol the parameters of what is approved thought.

Third, the term suggests a type of emotionally blunted response to the world. If something can be labeled a ‘conspiracy theory’ there is no need to acknowledge or attend to the suffering the label covers up. Thereby, one is absolved of moral responsibility.

Newsflash: no ‘conspiracy theory’ is necessary to explain much of what we see happening in the world today. All that is required is curiosity, a willingness to question, a moderate amount of intelligence, a basic knowledge of how systems work and power dynamics operate and an ability to connect the dots.

Shaking My Head
Shaking My Head
May 1, 2020 4:10 PM
Reply to  Janie doebuck

“When they have hundreds of billions of dollars to spend on their conspiracy it becomes so pervasive you can hardly say it’s a conspiracy — it’s an alternate reality they’re constructing.” Dr. Ray Peat.
Ray Peat has also given some very critical interviews on the response to covid-19.

Mike Ellwood
Mike Ellwood
May 1, 2020 5:17 PM

Oh good. I used to be a big fan of Ray’s. I eventually came to disagree with him about certain aspects of diet (he’s a big fan of sugar….and aspirin, for example), but I still have a lot of respect for him, especially his independence. He’s also very detailed and thorough.

Moneycircus
Moneycircus
May 1, 2020 3:28 PM

French coronavirus strain may be local and may not have come from China — Tests on samples from 97 French and three Algerians infected with Sars-CoV-2 suggest that the virus may have been around in France before the pandemic started. http://www.rfi.fr/en/france/20200429-french-coronavirus-strain-may-be-local-and-may-not-have-come-from-china

Mike Ellwood
Mike Ellwood
May 1, 2020 5:23 PM
Reply to  Moneycircus

As Jon Rappaport said some time ago, it’s not the same thing happening in all parts of the world, so it’s highly unlikely to be a pandemic in the way people normally think of pandemics. (The only pandemic is of fear, leading to panic, leading to hysteria).

Not that I think a virus (and certainly not a single virus) is the causative agent in the various illnesses around the world that are going on.

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
May 1, 2020 11:56 PM
Reply to  Mike Ellwood

It is very plainly a bio-weapon, a product of tens of billions in ‘research’, particularly into bat viruses, by the world-spanning archipelago of US bio-weapons labs, that the presstitutes never dare to mention.

Maxwell
Maxwell
May 1, 2020 3:24 PM

There should be investigations opened up, trials and those responsible need to be held accountable for this sham and the destroying of millions of lives.

UPMC doctor argues COVID-19 not as deadly as feared, says its hospitals will shift back to normal

https://www.pennlive.com/news/2020/04/umpc-argues-covid-19-not-as-deadly-as-feared-says-its-hospitals-will-shift-back-to-normal.html

Grafter
Grafter
May 1, 2020 3:48 PM
Reply to  Maxwell

Maxwell, couldn’t agree more but oh how the indoctrination levels are rising. I live near our city townhouse and this week have watched daily as two council employees wearing high viz jackets assiduously scrub an 8ft section of pavement at the entrance to the building with diluted bleach. Once finished they stand there admiring their handiwork before disappearing inside. Such is the insanity of the fear inspired by this government and their little helpers.

Maxwell
Maxwell
May 1, 2020 4:00 PM
Reply to  Grafter

I would rail on them for polluting the waterways- where that bleach residue ends up- and thusly our drinking water which then depresses the immune system upon consumption and therefore increases the likelihood of viral contagion. I have no patience for any of this.

JudyJ
JudyJ
May 1, 2020 5:08 PM
Reply to  Maxwell

You may have seen this already. Bleach sprayed all over Spanish beach.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-52471208

S Cooper
S Cooper
May 1, 2020 3:20 PM

Would appear that the announcement of THE FALL OF THE HOUSE OF PONZI is going to wait until after THE LOCKDOWN. None the less the cards have fallen.

Humpty Dumpty sat on a wall,
Humpty Dumpty had a great fall.
All the king’s horses and all the king’s men
Couldn’t put Humpty together again.

The longer THIS STUNT continues the harsher the repercussions for the corporate fascist oligarch mobsters are going to be. They are not going to be able to stop peaceful assembly, association, speech and discussion forever. Time for them to admit what they have done, return all they have stolen and account for their actions and crimes.

Paul Vonharnish
Paul Vonharnish
May 1, 2020 3:41 PM
Reply to  S Cooper

Alas, the mobsters will never fess up, and will never be held legally accountable. See: “Legal” BAR system, and the back drop of the First Express Trust. http://stopthepirates.blogspot.com/2014/03/history-of-trusts.html

The only way to get back what they have stolen, is to take it back by force…

BigB
BigB
May 1, 2020 3:19 PM

This is fascism: do we quibble and demur until the actual iron heel tears at bodily flesh?

To be fair: this is the mildest outbreak of historical fascism yet. A very Rixian, British Whitehall farcical pastiche of Mosleyan blackshirted ultranationalism. And far from continental fascism: and may it stay that way.

But do not be fooled by the milder, more oecumenical nature of our present, globalised, inverted economic totalitarianism. This is 21st century bio-medicalised fascism of the most pernicious kind: the kind we voted for and tacitly consented to all while the welfare blood money was right for our silence.

All through the military Keynesian ”Les Trente Glorieuses” of unionised, industrialised, welfarised, ethnocentric exceptionalist expansionism: the Left kept quiet. It was a clamouring silence, to be sure – always wanting an equalised share – but never actually demanding an end to capital accumulation. And while we reluctantly conceded actual colonialism as the sunset over the Empire – with working class boots on the frontline killing ground of exported imperialist autarchical fascism – we soon replaced that with financialised neo-colonialism. Which was an equally violent suppression of the peripherised, intentionally maldeveloped World System with working class – many soon to be floating middle class – capital collaborationism. Collaborate to accumulate for the soon-to-be corporatist billionaires? Let the union take care of the humanity betraying conflict share. And don’t mention ecology.

Still: we did not actually have to get our hands bloody anymore. We let finance do the job: and merely trained and equipped the compradore mercenaries for the millionaires …soon to-to-be corporatist billionaires. Empowered by the Left’s best collaborationist efforts. What ecology?

The truth is that the Left collaborated with capital all along. And even more so with industrialised civilisational capital expansionism – globalisation. And the natural environment never existed – except as disposable means – for either the Left or the Right of civilisational rational authoritarian logic.

And psychology and economy: are they two different things? Only in the overspecialised ‘expert’ eyes of bourgeois psychologists and economists. To the former: there is only objective Rational Analytical Thinking: which is contra cognitive neuroscience …but is still hegemonic (as cognitivism). To the latter: there is only Rational Actor Theory (RAT) …even after it has been disproved by Simon, Kahneman and Tversky et al. But is still hegemonic (as economic behaviourism). Two RATs for the economically determinate price of one, eh?

The pretence was finally up in the late 90s when Giddens and Blair made ”economic determinism” and ”methodolological holism” taboo entries in the * Index Librorum Prohibitorum* of capital neoliberal hyper-accumulation. Crises or no crises: cancerous capitalism continued to mutate in the last two decades: incorporating entire planetary species and resources as it mutated. And the Left did fuck all: whether in the actual driving seat with Falconer: or in actual opposition …with Falconer recently incorporated again.

And the people: this is a carnally capitalist country …and it always will be? There is not ‘Them’ and ‘Us’: there is only the ‘We’ of the commodification and consumerist bourgeoisie. But we are our own experts in crises and conflict mythological screening discourses, financialisation Charaktermasken, and falsification psychologism of imaginary victimologies.

Perhaps if we had looked at the next level down in the World System – to see how our pernicious commodification Fetishism of life is viewed from an imaginary Frantz Fanon POV …we might have seen this coming? The West – and the UK in particularly – is the product of what we pejoratively named the Third World. And now we are becoming it.

Capitalism is fascism: they only look different if you completely distort the reality field with collaborationist mentalities and false consciousness simperings of hollowed out identitarian crises. Well, the real crises were over there: where we exported them to be. And the reality field just shifted to reveal the truly mirrored face of the collaborationist monster that consensual and collective co-constitution has made. The Left is nowhere: exactly where it exiled itself to be. If they cannot see what is apparent, and call it by its true name, and honestly admit that it a political co-creation and Lib-Lab-Con collaboration…

The problem is: will anyone call it out? Being British: probably without demur – and with rolled up sleeves – we will clap and Wellcome the inverted image of totalitarianism into out hearts and into our minds: and make it Wellcome in our houses with a nice cuppa tea. And we will hush our breath and call it democracy and freedom: so as not to upset the corporatist despots we quietly consent to be. Rather than be autonomous and free.

And the Left will be nowhere: as per historical usual.

https://libcom.org/history/labouring-in-vain-critical-history-labour-party

Moneycircus
Moneycircus
May 1, 2020 3:21 PM
Reply to  BigB

Post-Fascism, as Gaspar Miklos Tamas called it.

Paul Vonharnish
Paul Vonharnish
May 1, 2020 3:55 PM
Reply to  BigB

BigB: Excellent, as usual. I rather disagree with the singular blame of “Capitalism”. Personal capitalism is fairly easy to contain. Corporate capitalism ruins peoples and Nations…

“A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and he carries his banners openly.
But the traitor moves among those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the galleys, heard in the very hall of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor – he speaks in the accents familiar to his victims, and wears their face and their garment, and he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation – he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of a city – he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to be feared.”
– Cicero, 42 B.C. –

Carrot not Stick
Carrot not Stick
May 1, 2020 4:13 PM
Reply to  BigB

Is this gibberish or am I simply not understanding it?

Objective
Objective
May 1, 2020 4:58 PM

Big B is a bit to intellectual for many of us, (including me) but give it another go, its enlightening.

Mike Ellwood
Mike Ellwood
May 1, 2020 5:31 PM
Reply to  Objective

This one is clearer than some. He’s still a bit of a show off though,

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
May 2, 2020 12:00 AM
Reply to  Mike Ellwood

If you’ve got it, flaunt it.

Cheezilla
Cheezilla
May 2, 2020 8:56 PM

Not actually gibberish, just uses a lot of esoteric jargon. What BigB says might be spot on but the message is diluted if the language is semi-opaque. Effectively, it’s not so much intellectual as patronising and arrogant.

Objective
Objective
May 1, 2020 4:57 PM
Reply to  BigB

I usually struggle to understand your writings, but this time i think i get it & yes i agree. As i said earlier to someone, the left always assert their freedom & how they detest capitalism, yet always play the game by capitalist rules! Why ? You just explained it.

George Mc
George Mc
May 1, 2020 5:18 PM
Reply to  Objective

In what way do the left “assert their freedom” and what does it mean to “play the game by the capitalist rules”?

Objective
Objective
May 1, 2020 5:39 PM
Reply to  George Mc

I’m guessing your on the left after your stoic defense of socialism so you tell me why you think socialism sets you free. I don’t believe it can in its current form

You complain capitalism is destructive & unfair yet you fight it how? You cant get elected to change the rules so you have no choice but to play them at their game (& lose) because you’re not empowered to do anything else & you don’t understand why capitalism always prevails over socialism.

Socialism = denial.

George Mc
George Mc
May 1, 2020 6:48 PM
Reply to  Objective

I never spoke about setting ourselves free – whatever that means. We all live necessarily in a society which cannot exist without mutual co-operation.

We fight capitalism all the time and have to since it would destroy us. It was indeed only opposition to capitalism that granted capitalism a “human face” – which it then laughably attributes to itself all by its own merit, even whilst the capitalist class continue to rip down that very face.

And why on earth do you still believe that elections are any more than showbiz charades?

Objective
Objective
May 1, 2020 7:12 PM
Reply to  George Mc

OK you seem to be drifting into some kind of drug induced parallel universe. Think i’ll leave it there, can’t see this going any where sensible.

Au revoir

Mark Millward
Mark Millward
May 1, 2020 7:17 PM
Reply to  BigB

Perhaps “Hegelian dialectic” would be a brief summation? Leftist thesis contra rightist antithesis, both shafted by the oligarchic synthesis. And we know who we mean by “oligarchs” don’t we boys and girls?

crispy
crispy
May 1, 2020 3:18 PM

What is OFF G afraid of???

I make a few statements of fact about a former ambassador and it all goes down the memory hole

Not that said ambassador has done anything illegal just acted as a lobbyist for some very nasty people

Now if i was a bitter and angry sort of person I’d go and create myself a blog called

This isn’t OFF G, and I’d publish all my censored comments,and I’m not talking about the deliberately silly ones,but the more serious ones which happen to challenge your ” narrative ” about Syria,or Putin,or 9/11,MH 17 and the compromised source of much of your alt media world as outlined by Mr Proyectn his blog

Somehow this seems to have got to you,you’d actually be screaming if i was censoring you like it,you’d go off and say,’ what rule did this comment break’ or words to that effect,and start an entire blog post all about it

Frankly whatever i say has no impact as you people have created a little echo chamber and safe plce for yourselves,so why indulge in the heavy handed censorship,which follows this pattern,

Publish one,allow the ad hom and insults,censor all my replies,clever,well no not really,i did say you could ban me altogether, but for some strange reason you haven’t got the guts to do so,instead you play your silly game

you know OFF g ban me,Fleet Street ain’t gonna make it front page news 😂

What do think will happen?

Maybe it’ll be front page news in the Guardian?

Maybe I’m a secret undercover journalist?

Who knows how the conspiracy mind works,ive turned to the medical profession for answers,however i think they need to do more research,if so they should study this website,its a rich vain of source material

I won’t expect to see this published as it’d be to embarrassing for you,as some of your more gullible readers think you don’t operate like the newspaper you hate

The facts should be sacred,you lot wouldn’t know about facts if it hit you with one of Assads barrel bombs

Sophie - Admin1
Admin
Sophie - Admin1
May 1, 2020 3:25 PM
Reply to  crispy

Every comment you have made is on the site save your abusive and content-free ad hom. If you are missing comments try refreshing your browser

crispy
crispy
May 1, 2020 3:40 PM

I beg your pardon but loads have gone,but that’s not what bothers me,its your totally one sided view of events,especially about Syria and Putin

Ive suggested you do some real journalism about those subjects but you won’t,the question is why?

Is Mr knightly positioning himself with RT ?

Because one thing is an absolute fact,nobody who does propaganda for the kremlin ever says a bad thing about Russia,do they!

Look at Assange,a classic case,or Pilger,he recently made a film about china,i think its called
The coming war on China, the pair of them promote this relentless anti American veiw,about how the Americans are creating a surveillance state

yet you go to a company called Journeyman about covid but totally ignore the films they’ve also made, Journeyman that is, about china and its totalitarian surveillance state and social credit system

So just for the sake of balance why don’t you promote those films ?

Loverat
Loverat
May 1, 2020 5:02 PM
Reply to  crispy

crispy

Kit Knightly and Catte Black are like typical villians from a James Bond film. Ive been saying this for ages. The clue in their names.

Did you see the cat dart over Knightly’s keyboard at the start of the Corbett interview other day? That slight sinister smirk when he was questioned over the massive inflow of new subscriber funds?
The voice of Peter Hitchens on the TV set in the background?

Have you checked out the other shadowy Off G editor?

The two admins. The bad cop, funny cop routine?

crispy
crispy
May 1, 2020 5:11 PM
Reply to  Loverat

…..nope they’re all the typical useful idiots, liked and appreciated for their anti western propaganda, by the kremlin,just like Assange ,poor St Julian of Assange!

Heres a bit of advice though,as i think they’re all a bit wet behind the ears,the Kremlin won’t help once plod and the British state decide to fuck them over

Bellmarsh may become their new home 😜

Objective
Objective
May 1, 2020 5:30 PM
Reply to  crispy

I’m afraid if you hold the key to the nuke button you have the power, sadly power always goes to peoples heads & corrupts. Censorship is everywhere if they don’t like what you say they will nuke you. Happened to me today after i retaliated to some childish name calling from a fellow comrade.

crispy
crispy
May 1, 2020 5:46 PM
Reply to  Objective

Censorship isn’t the problem, confirmation bias is though

OFF G can be as outraged as they like,but I’d suggest there’s plenty to be outraged about Assad,Putin, China and the mad mullahs,but for some strange reason the aforementioned seem to be a bit like the invisible man 😜

Tony
Tony
May 1, 2020 3:56 PM
Reply to  crispy

Instead of trolling this site, do as you say and go off to form your own website. You can call it whatever you want. See how you go on for an audience/following. Then you won’t have to wear your typing finger(s) out blaming Off Guardian and it’s “echo chamber” when your site gets hundreds of thousands of visits a week. Get back to us when you’re up, running and soaring.

crispy
crispy
May 1, 2020 4:11 PM
Reply to  Tony

Oh i see that’s what its all about, you’re playing the numbers game,yup i get it!

crispy
crispy
May 1, 2020 4:20 PM
Reply to  Tony

Tony why don’t you ask OFF g why they don’t show Journeyman films about the Chinese surveillance state,they have made them,and they wouldn’t be shown in China me thinks

Who know maybe OFF G will do the right thing,its up to them 😊

tonyopmoc
tonyopmoc
May 1, 2020 4:07 PM
Reply to  crispy

crispy,

Who is the former ambassador ?

What are your few statements of “fact” ?

If it is who I think you mean, I would like to point out a few facts, from my perspective.

1. I have been following this man’s blog for over 10 years, and wrote freely on his blog, for the vast majority of those 10 years.
2. I have never met him, nor seen him, but I have come very close to on numerous occasions.
3. He or his moderators, very rarely allow me to comment on his blog. Less than 1 in 10 comments ever appear. The last one was a few weeks ago, when I wrote I may send him some money again.
4. I disagree with most of his political views.
5. His books are totally brilliant.
6. I think he is an honest man of extremely high integrity.
7. I would still like to meet him, and think we would get on very well, especially after a few glasses of his favourite whisky.
8. His blog now looks very much like a closed cult, which however looks open to anyone, providing their identity – using such techniques as email address, name, handle, political views, and many other factors has not been put on the banned list, which I suspect is also at least occasionally controlled and intercepted by the security services, or other persons, currently drowning my wife’s PC with thousands of internet trackers.

If it’s Craig Murray, you have been slagging off, I am not surprised the moderators have deleted it.

Tony

crispy
crispy
May 1, 2020 4:23 PM
Reply to  tonyopmoc

No I’m not talking about that idiot,faux Scots man,I’m talking about the former ambassador to Syria who’s basically joined in the pro Assad propaganda to save Assad although Murray hasn’t been much better

When one considers his so called humanitarian credentials go AWOL as far as Syrians are concerned,or for that matter those living under a theocratic dictatorship in Iran,or the journalists and activists in Russia who’ve been murdered,jailed or generally harassed

No word for those is there,not a thing really from Murray, to busy talking BS with his mate Assange on kremlin propaganda channel RT International,you know thats the propaganda channel that former KGB officer Putin created,what a fucking joke!

Please spare me your nonsense

JudyJ
JudyJ
May 1, 2020 5:15 PM
Reply to  tonyopmoc

Tony

I may be wrong but based on recent comments from @crispy I think he is referring to (the honourable, in the true sense of the word) Peter Ford, former UK Ambassador in Syria, who has maintained and widely publicised, wherever he can, his support for the Assad Government and speaks regularly on the nationwide ‘Media on Trial’ events.

crispy
crispy
May 1, 2020 5:28 PM
Reply to  JudyJ

Hahahahahaha 😂😂. 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 😅😅😅😅😅😅

Oh, nice one, for fucks sake give me oxygen,i can’t breath for laughing 😜

crispy
crispy
May 1, 2020 5:55 PM
Reply to  crispy

….did you mean the Assad regime, a regime who’ve imposed punishing neo liberal reforms,which the IMF loved incidentally,and which was part of what Mr Ford was supporting before things went tits up,its called lobbying,nothing illegal about it,although I’d suggest in this case not very honourable either

Loverat
Loverat
May 1, 2020 6:15 PM
Reply to  tonyopmoc

Tony

You’re going to have do those points again.

Not the ex -ambassador for Uzbekistan who was into belly dancers and whisky.

Mind you, a few of those points still might hold.

Gwyn
Gwyn
May 1, 2020 4:43 PM
Reply to  crispy

Now if i was a bitter and angry sort of person I’d go and create myself a blog called

This isn’t OFF G…

Interesting use of the word if, there, crispy.

crispy
crispy
May 1, 2020 4:46 PM
Reply to  Gwyn

Its called sarcasm 😃

bob
bob
May 1, 2020 2:51 PM

News form BigBrotherWatch highlights a judicial review being brought against the regime regarding the CV Act

https://wedlakebell.com/content/uploads/Letter-to-The-Rt-Hon-Matt-Hancock-MP-Secretary-of-State-for-Health-and-Social-Care-30-April-2020.pdf

JudyJ
JudyJ
May 1, 2020 3:50 PM
Reply to  bob

Thanks, bob. Hooray! Excellent…just what is needed. A really significant step to be welcomed by OffG, Peter Hitchens et al. It covers and supports all the ground opposing the control measures that has been highlighted on this website. I know there is a long way to go in getting the draconian control measures overturned but it is a large leap in the right direction, if only to provide an opportunity to demonstrate legally that there are major flaws and ignominies in the Government’s actions.

To summarise (very briefly as it’s a 22 page letter couched in very legalistic terms with multiple cross-references) it is a solicitor’s letter on behalf of a reputable business client (details given in the intro to the letter) seeking that the Government rescind the Coronavirus Regulations or be subject to a judicial review. To see references that will be familiar to many on here I would draw attention to paras 50-61 and 68-69. It would also seem that Appendix 2 is critical material in terms of evidence supporting the contention that the measures are ill-considered and disproportionate. But Appendix 2 is a collection of documents which were submitted in support of this covering solicitor’s letter and as such it is not available from the solicitor’s website link above.

I think the Government will have difficulty in responding to this in their usual manner when challenged i.e. by completely ignoring it.

Reg
Reg
May 1, 2020 2:35 PM

Corbett on Dr Death

tonyopmoc
tonyopmoc
May 1, 2020 2:52 PM
Reply to  Reg

He doesn’t look very healthy to me. I’m older than him, and if I looked like that, I would be worried.

Moneycircus
Moneycircus
May 1, 2020 3:12 PM
Reply to  tonyopmoc

He’s probably transfused the wrong kind of blood. If you want to keep up with the latest on Bill’s friend Jeff Epstein there’s new evidence from Maria Farmer, interviewed by Whitney Webb, describing Les Wexner as “the head of the snake”.
https://www.thelastamericanvagabond.com/interviews/epstein-victim-maria-farmer-speaks-with-whitney-webb-full-phone-call-part-1/

Reg
Reg
May 1, 2020 3:45 PM
Reply to  tonyopmoc

Evil has a deathly pallor.

JohnB
JohnB
May 1, 2020 6:17 PM
Reply to  tonyopmoc

They’re probably having to renew his MK Ultra programming more and more frequently …

hope
hope
May 1, 2020 3:43 PM
Reply to  Reg

Seemingly he did not get his children be vaccinated… QED about what most vaccines are: why wouldnt he, who must know, otherwise prevent his children from partaking of something beneficial?

http://www.defenddemocracy.press/bill-gates-former-doctor-says-billionaire-refused-to-vaccinate-his-children/

Reg
Reg
May 1, 2020 4:03 PM
Reply to  hope

Bet they don’t eat GM foods either

bob
bob
May 1, 2020 1:55 PM

another exceptional UKColumn bulletin this afternoon – go watch it

MoH
MoH
May 1, 2020 2:19 PM
Reply to  bob

Why would anyone down vote such a comment?

What the guys from 77th Battalion dont seem to understand is that they will be thrown under the bus when their use has been exhausted

Moneycircus
Moneycircus
May 1, 2020 2:29 PM
Reply to  MoH

If they don’t die of thrombosis first. Not much of a career for a would-be soldier.

T Brites
T Brites
May 1, 2020 1:50 PM

Well… It’s CLEAR that MANY are still in the MORON level, unable to “critical verification“, I call it “Critical Thought”!

Now I’m just talking about the REALITY for my country.

This CAN NEVER be seen as a “pandemic” or anything out of the ordinary FLU SEASON (either with cattle distancing or without – yes, we are being treated like cattle)

We’ve had MANY past years WITH MANY MORE DEATHS due to INFLUENZA and this newly discovered piece of RNA “SARS-CoV-2 can’t even beat those years.

This is the REALITY for my country… No “pandemic” in 2020 comparing to ALL THE PAST YEARS.

To those with weak minds and always living in fear/panic, DO NOT WORRY, the miracle vaccine and/or drug will soon be available for you.

Reg
Reg
May 1, 2020 1:54 PM
Reply to  T Brites

And if anything goes wrong, you can’t sue them!

Carrot not Stick
Carrot not Stick
May 1, 2020 4:17 PM
Reply to  T Brites

Thank you to the point well put and I can understand you,which surely is the point of Off Guardian?

crank
crank
May 1, 2020 1:36 PM

An Exaggerated Exchange

Media : Someone has died.
People : Holy fucking shit ! Not another one !
Was it Covid ?
Media : Well, yes! …probably.
People : I will never go out of this house again.

George Mc
George Mc
May 1, 2020 2:18 PM
Reply to  crank

Was it Covid ?
Media : Well, yes! …probably.

Oh come on! We’re way past that now. The exchange should be:

Did he die?
Media : COVID!
Did they all die in that avalanche?
Media: COVID!
Did they …..
Media: COVID!
Hang on I hadn’t fini….
Media: COVID!
But….
Media: COVID! COVID!COVID!COVID!COVID!………………………….

Mike Ellwood
Mike Ellwood
May 1, 2020 5:38 PM
Reply to  George Mc

MASK! MASK! MASK!
CLAP! CLAP CLAP!

hope
hope
May 1, 2020 3:48 PM
Reply to  crank

This is no exaggeration. I called someone I vaguely know to see how she was doing: she is cowering in a small studio-flat because she knows someone who has died. When asked more details, she recognized this was someone old with health issues. Somehow it seems death is a new discovery: no one ever died before. Mind you, same person some years ago had told me to try and stay immersed in life after my mother’s death, saying that it was normal for the elderly to die…

JohnB
JohnB
May 1, 2020 6:20 PM
Reply to  hope

The enhanced awareness of mortality might be one of the biggest changes in society. Very powerful techniques, meditating on one’s death, living with death on one’s left shoulder, etc.

Willem
Willem
May 1, 2020 6:46 PM
Reply to  hope

‘ Mind you, same person some years ago had told me to try and stay immersed in life after my mother’s death, saying that it was normal for the elderly to die…’

Something similar here. When my wife was out of a job, friends said: ‘how nice must it be, to have all the time to spend with the kids!’

And now, they are self-isolating with their kids, and getting mad as hell. So perhaps I should tell them: ‘ how nice must it be, to have all the time to spend with the kids!’

Thing is: it is nice to have all the time to spend with the kids. But that these people who said it it would be so nice, are now having such a ‘hard time’, well that is amazing.

molloy
molloy
May 1, 2020 1:28 PM

To: Objective (below)… Is This Irony?

“It hasn’t got fuck all to do with capitalism. Don’t obfuscate neo-liberal (megalomaniac rule) as capitalism for your political opportunism. No socialist head of state would have acted any differently. None have, in fact many have gone much further.”

Sorry to have to ask..
…….so, are we saying that an extreme right wing unelected-puppet regime has been forced by elite-banker corruption to introduce pretend policies that are, allegedly, designed to help the neediest and most vulnerable in society???

Is it being implied, “objectively”…. that the UK puppet regime, in reality, cares; or has the intellectual wherewithal to care; or pauses to consider any of the ‘have-nots’? Or those less privileged than themselves?

Thank you.

gordon
gordon
May 1, 2020 1:11 PM

trust the killers of men
does the cull mass sacrifice for the crop harvests
not refresh you?
a bumper captured year indeed

protect the gates national illness service

stay in
mayday
fools
for summer is a cumin in
beltane passing
new old souls needed

make your date
with the wickerman

Oliver
Oliver
May 1, 2020 9:15 PM
Reply to  gordon

Yes. Rituals work, otherwise they wouldn’t be done. KLF.

tonyopmoc
tonyopmoc
May 1, 2020 1:06 PM

The first sensible video I have seen from the BBC in an extremely long time.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-52479215/we-ll-starve-to-death-if-this-continues

“‘We’ll starve to death if this continues’

Half of the world’s workers could lose their jobs because of this pandemic, the International Labour Organisation has said.

That’s 1.6 billion people but who are they?

The BBC’s population reporter Stephanie Hegarty heard from people in four countries who used to get by on a daily wage, but whose lives have been torn apart by the lockdown.”

We most certainly are not immune in The UK (we import half our food) nor the USA (they are killing and dumping millions of animals, because staff are afraid to go to work to process and distribute meat). The same is happening in India, where over 1 Billion people were fired with 4 hours notice, and have neither food nor money, and the harvest is being left to rot in the fields.

Whilst there are no signs of food shortage in the UK at the moment, I expect there to be very severe problems in the coming winter, especially if it is very cold. That is why as soon as I was aware of the implications in early March, I did everything I could think of to prepare to start growing a lot more food in my back garden. Almost everyone I know thinks I am daft, and I do hope that I am wrong, but digging up my garden is not causing me or anyone else any harm. In fact it is good exercise, takes my mind of the gloom, and boosts my vitamin D, due to exposure to the sun, and home grown potatoes taste a lot better.

Tony

Reg
Reg
May 1, 2020 1:46 PM
Reply to  tonyopmoc

I am glad, Tony, that you’ve been able to prepare yourself in these nasty times when curtain-twitching rats wait for an opportunity to screw other people’s lives up. Good show!

T Brites
T Brites
May 1, 2020 1:53 PM
Reply to  tonyopmoc

‘We’ll starve to death if this continues’

That’s ONE OF THE MAIN GOALS of OPERATION COVID, reduction of the size of the hUman Herd.

Best regards from the SRF & BILLIONAIRES & Jesters.

Objective
Objective
May 1, 2020 2:45 PM
Reply to  tonyopmoc

I’ve been preparing for an event like this for years, have 4 months food supply in the cupboard, 2 months in the freezer & a seasons worth growing in the garden, like you i saw this coming in January.

When it started in march i had no need to stock pile or panic buy or rely on the state, i had already quietly & slowly done all needed to survive the shit storm that’s about to happen. even had a years supply of vit C, D & zinc etc And paracetamol (which is nearly as rare as gold)

I don’t think people appreciate how vulnerable the supply lines are. The system is always at its limit takes very little to brake.

lundiel
lundiel
May 1, 2020 3:17 PM
Reply to  Objective

Brilliant. You don’t believe there’s a pandemic, but you prepared for one anyway.

Reg
Reg
May 1, 2020 3:46 PM
Reply to  lundiel

He prepared for the economic collapse

Objective
Objective
May 1, 2020 5:06 PM
Reply to  Reg

Actually I prepared for Tory policy, most people live from one paycheck to another & can only survive one month if something happens, so no i’m not a prepper in the US sense waiting for the “apocalypse”.

I’m just never going to be reliant on the state again. But the last few years i’ve sensed a real uncertainty for the future of society, civilization, supply lines are much more fragile than most people realize.

lundiel
lundiel
May 1, 2020 7:39 PM
Reply to  Objective

You’re very lucky then. Poor people living in cities don’t have such options especially with so many now out of work and awaiting benefit payments. Also the disease is far more real to them than for people living in rural areas where they don’t even know if anyone who’s got it, let alone died from it. Then there’s the added risk for ethnic minorities. This site is sadly ignoring such people.

Mike Ellwood
Mike Ellwood
May 1, 2020 5:46 PM
Reply to  Reg

Quite: there is a pandemic of fear, panic and hysteria.

And if anyone denies that mass hysteria can’t occur, especially in “phlegmatic” countries like the UK, they only need think back to the death of Diana, and the grief-stricken outpourings that went on for weeks.

Tony
Tony
May 1, 2020 4:04 PM
Reply to  lundiel

Er…..I think he’s preparing for the coming economic crash. Do you usually deliberately misinterpret posts?

hope
hope
May 1, 2020 3:51 PM
Reply to  tonyopmoc

Could you please give some reference about more than 1 billion fired in India. Thanks.

tonyopmoc
tonyopmoc
May 1, 2020 5:08 PM
Reply to  hope

hope,

I first was aware of it from an interview on Democracy Now, with Indian Author Arundhati Roy a few weeks ago. If you google it, you will probably find it the transcript. I posted some of it, maybe here.

Tony

Carrot not Stick
Carrot not Stick
May 1, 2020 4:24 PM
Reply to  tonyopmoc

I think you are very sensible and am trying to grow some food myself. Rather than fear my neighbors I intend to share my garden produce with them as I have always done.

Mike Ellwood
Mike Ellwood
May 1, 2020 5:43 PM
Reply to  tonyopmoc

I fear you are right, and we are all going to be going on involuntary diets sooner or later.

I unfortunately heard BBC Radio 4’s “World at One” for some minutes on the car radio. They were covering the anti-continue-lockdown protests in the USA, and of course making it out to be a far-right thing.

Richard Le Sarc
Richard Le Sarc
May 2, 2020 12:04 AM
Reply to  tonyopmoc

I’m sure that the Fort Detrick virus was carefully war-gamed.

kevin king
kevin king
May 1, 2020 1:02 PM

The reader is making politics out of science. Just as the people behind this entire fiasco did. There is clear cut scientific evidence that the virus does not exist and has not been isolated and proven to be infectious by stringently applying Koch’s postulates.
The original SARS papers in 2003 show no evidence of doing this. They use a technique called RT-PCR and the stretches of RNA they are amplifying have never been conclusively shown to belong to a new type of virus simply because the virus was never isolated in the first place.
If the virus doesn’t exist then clearly this is a frontal attack on the rights and freedoms of the people of the world. Basta. It’s not about whether capitalism is at the root of all evil. It is fundamentally about truth and how it is arrived at.

Petra Liverani
Petra Liverani
May 1, 2020 1:11 PM
Reply to  kevin king

Amen.

T Brites
T Brites
May 1, 2020 2:01 PM
Reply to  kevin king

RT-qPCR resume of the RNA “SARS-CoV-2” LOTTERY!

I stopped after those because wasting time with ALL the kits is pointless.

Enjoy

Too few know about that scientific fraud. Nowadays a simple piece of recently discovered RNA (either endogenous or exogenous) is immediately labelled as “virus”!

Funny and Crazy times…

instant_whip
instant_whip
May 1, 2020 12:41 PM

“rottenness of capitalism”
Tells me all I need to know. Right there.

George Mc
George Mc
May 1, 2020 2:22 PM
Reply to  instant_whip

Well let’s face it – it didn’t need saying.

Petra Liverani
Petra Liverani
May 1, 2020 12:28 PM

OffG’s slogan is “Because the facts really should be sacred.” Couldn’t agree more.

This alleged pandemic is clearly a Trauma-based Mind Control Psychological Operation and it is also a very clear case of Problem > Reaction > Solution aka Order out of Chaos (Ordo ab chao)

https://ethics.wikia.org/wiki/Problem_Reaction_Solution
Problem Reaction Solution (Latin: Ordo ab Chao) is a mass mind control system. It is used to make changes to the law that the citizens would not accept otherwise.

1. Create a problem – Terrorism, financial crisis, etc.

2. Manufacture a reaction – Let the mainstream media only broadcast/print the side of the problem you want to show

3. Provide a solution – wars, corporate tax-cuts, welfare budget cuts, etc

Philip wrote:

Whether or not the pandemic is overstated – and my view is it’s too early to call either way – it shines a torch as never before in my lifetime on the rottenness of capitalism, with its systemic inability to put people before profits.

This means that somehow the facts are not getting through to Philip because the fact is crystal clear that there is no pandemic and it’s so easy to prove because they always let us know when they’re psyopping us. Always. And it drives me utterly nuts that even when you point out the clear evidence that they bend over backwards to make available to us and are utterly “scrupulous” in never putting forward a single piece of faked evidence in such a way that someone who believes their story can use to defend it people still steadfastly refuse to see. Why oh why oh why?

When I learnt of the “revelation of the method” I was just so happy. It explained so many strange things: the second plane popping out of the South tower, the father of a 6 year old who’d died the day before walking up to the microphone with a big smile on his face and so very many other puzzling things.

I added “revelation of the method” to my toolkit with massive gratitude as it made events so much easier to analyse. Why oh why oh why do others not add this tool to their analytic toolkit too? What on earth is stopping them? Why ignore a useful tool that is simply there for the taking?

Simple evidence there is no pandemic
— Mortality figures are no greater than normal
— Great fraudulence in ascribing cause of death is admitted to
— Testing shown to be completely unreliable
— Every single media story about an alleged patient is either not convincing or is riddled with anomalies so great its veracity is completely undermined – typical of psyops
— We are shown people falling flat on their faces or laid out on the pavement or hospital floors in ludicrous fashion – typical of psyops
— We are told of empty buildings being converted into a hospital in 48 hours with zero evidence this amazing feat – typical of psyops
— We are shown medical staff performing dancing routines in hospitals that are very reminiscent of the routines performed by medical staff at the opening ceremony of the 2012 London Olympics – typical of psyops
… and so much more
https://occamsrazorterrorevents.weebly.com/blog/coronavirus-hoax-jan-2020

Philip, if you think there is a single skerrick of evidence of a pandemic please say what it is. I will be utterly gobsmacked if you produce one. And if you cannot find a single skerrick of evidence then please give your rationale for believing in the possibility of a pandemic or any pandemic-like situation. I would argue strenuously that if not a single skerrick of evidence can be produced by anyone then it is nonsensical to argue even for the possibility of a pandemic or pandemic-like situation.

Penny
Penny
May 1, 2020 12:50 PM
Reply to  Petra Liverani

I agree with your contention. There are many facets of trauma based mind control that are apparent through out this entire Covid “crisis”- The heavy handed excessive fear mongering media machine pretty much tells us- the powers that shouldn’t be want us afraid. Very afraid. And have succeeded in causing extreme levels of fear in the general population.
Fear breeds irrationality. Fear and Irrationality breeds stupidity. And you have a malleable populace. That’s apparent.