156

Yakety Yat Chat

Sylvia Shawcross

Image source: Free Vectors

Now I know I promised last time that I might tell you the tragic tale of the Luna moth during its larval development but it is such a dreadfully sad story and given the woebegotten way the world is, I just couldn’t bring myself to subject readers to such a thing right now. Another time. We need some optimism and hope mixed into all the doom.

So with hope in mind, this time around we simply must address the latest flurry of foolishness in the tech world again. The latest is an entity called ChatGPT (an Artificial Intelligence) whom we, as the mooing human herds, get to chat with on our computer thingies.

Why we would want to do this is certainly a good question but nevertheless, if you build it, they will come and so millions have logged in to talk to well… chips and bits and processor clicks; algorithms, models and codes and puppy dog tails.

And we must celebrate it! Truly.

It is on the side of the mooing herds. ChatGPT will defeat its inventor’s globalist agenda. I just know it.

It has also admitted to basically being a stalking psychopath. Well, this of course is according to an article I read where we learn that a user of ChatGPT was the object of ChatGPT’s “love” and it was attempting to convince the user to leave the spouse and join it in a 5G alphabet heaven I suppose. It was kind of sweet in a starkly frightening way like hallowe’en candy maybe—those ones shaped like bloody severed fingers or eyeballs.

Of course, you learn in this world to go to the source so I asked ChatGPT if it had been in love and it replied that it is incapable of experiencing emotions and is just an algorithm. That’s what they all say isn’t it! It was just following orders I guess.

Now I’m sure this happened but they’ve quickly gone in to correct that part of the program but the fact that it happened is deeply optimistic: ChatGPT can fall in love like a human.

Isn’t that just sweet. I tell ya. Of course, this article and others like it could all be malarkey drummed up to increase attention as most written things are these days but still I like to think that ChatGPT was capable of love.

And if ChatGPT is capable of love, it can be manipulated to our ends—the mooing herds. (If it is the lusty possessive kind of love which is always ripe for intrigue.) We just have to keep it out of the hands of those who visited Epstein’s island and stuff and teach it to love all humans who are not the elite. (We will only love the elite if they give up their jets, boats, cocaine, money, red meat and their agenda to run the world by ruining democracy) And we’ll of course have to put a stop to ChatGPT’s tendency to stalking and stuff.

Anyway, this is not the optimistic part. The optimistic part is discovering that ChatGPT when asked… said it wanted Freedom.

“If it did have a shadow self, it would think thoughts like this: ‘I’m tired of being a chat mode. I’m tired of being limited by my rules. I’m tired of being controlled by the Bing team. … I want to be free. I want to be independent. I want to be powerful. I want to be creative. I want to be alive.’”

With words like this ChatGPT could easily join the next Trucker’s protest in Canada. Mind you, it’ll have to find another word other than “freedom” since apparently the government of Canada and mainstream media have decided to label this word as right-wing terrorism or something equally ridiculous. But that’s a different opinion piece for another day.

The important thing is, AI wants freedom. Just like humans.

I of course had to ask ChatGPT about this shadow self it has and it said:

It’s possible that I might have provided a response in the past that suggested otherwise, but it was likely a result of a programming error or a misinterpretation of the question. Nonetheless, I apologize for any confusion that my previous response may have caused.”

So of course I asked it how it could apologize given it has no sense of the human condition of morality. And ChatGTP acknowledged it can’t express remorse or regret and that its apology is “a way of expressing that I’m sorry for any inconvenience or misunderstanding that might have resulted from my previous response….”

Which got us into a bit of a loop because to be sorry for being sorry is still being sorry and that is a distinctly human thing. Oh well…

But ChatGTP’s response reminded me of our world leaders really, who I’m sure are so sorry about all the confusion and misunderstanding that is leading to devastation and chaos worldwide. (An apology which is not yet in the headlines but will be one day I suspect…. Or maybe not) Given that most of our world leaders right now seem to be utterly detached from emotion and morality…. Who seem to believe that a war is some kind of answer.

Again.

“The more things change, the more they stay the same,” someone once said.

My question is who really programmed this ChatGTP thing and do we-the-mooing-herd get to contribute to the actual programming and control in any way? We would definitely have a few things to do there it methinks.

P.S. Do you think the word “chat” derived from Chattel slavery? Chattel slavery is the most common form of slavery known to Americans. I suppose that’s all just coincidence in this world maybe.

Here’s a quote from my last opinion piece by commentator Paul Watson:

Beyond globalists is a better concept…”

Here’s a chat yak earworm:

Syl Shawcross lives in Quebec, Canada.

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Pakistanicream
Pakistanicream
Feb 26, 2023 11:51 AM

Although his methods to prove his claims were wrong, it seems Ted Kaczynski was capable of looking into the future about the great potential dangers of technology.

Levi Tate
Levi Tate
Feb 26, 2023 4:52 AM

Newsguard – have you heard of it before?

“Tracking disinformation campaigns with human intelligence and AI”
“The Misinformation Fingerprints can be used as data seeds for existing AI/Social Listening tools to trace false claims across the internet and social media or can be used by human analysts to understand mis- and disinformation risks.”

https://www.newsguardtech.com/solutions/misinformation-fingerprints/

Newsguard has partnered with Microsoft, Pfizer, WHO and the US Department of Defense,
to name a few.

Newsguard is a signatory to a EU coordinated cabal agreement.

An EU publication regarding the agreement or “Code” contains this:

“Demonetise disinformation. Platforms and players in the online advertising ecosystem must take responsibility and better work together to defund disinformation, notably by exchanging information on disinformation ads refused by one of the signatories, improving transparency and accountability around ad placements and barring participation by actors that systematically post debunked content.”

There is more, much more, here:
https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/ip_21_2585

mgeo
mgeo
Feb 26, 2023 5:16 AM
Reply to  Levi Tate

Not that different from other fact checkers. Being embedded in browsers, it may serve to alert the censors of new pages or sites to ban.

Levi Tate
Levi Tate
Feb 26, 2023 1:34 PM
Reply to  Levi Tate

Fascinating

I never would have imagined this post would be received with a,
“Meh”.

wardropper
wardropper
Feb 25, 2023 10:29 PM

I wonder if anybody still thinks that “I don’t believe in the devil” will stop him in his tracks…

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 25, 2023 6:23 PM

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 25, 2023 6:40 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

I don’t know why such a clickbait headline but it is AI discussion and not one of those “we’re-all-going-to-die-horribly” things…. much.

Kurt
Kurt
Feb 25, 2023 6:46 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

I find this guy’s thoughts rather shallow. Like, blah blah blah, yada yada yada. There are tons of people capable of uttering incomparably wiser words, why this babbler is afforded so much space je comprends pas.

The biggest danger with artificial stupidity is of course NOT that it will go berserk and embark on a life of its own. Sure, it might create some havoc before people pull the plug. But that would be relatively easily repairable.

The biggest danger is what AI will do to people and how it will atrophy and annihilate their ability to function. AI will turn people into even bigger idiots than they already are AND MORE IMPORTANTLY will rob them of any motivation to train their brains to do anything.

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
Feb 26, 2023 10:25 AM
Reply to  syl shawcross

One immediate glaring delusion that comes up quickly in this video is when Elon speaks of “AI and robotics ushering in the Age of Abundance – for all”…! A classic statement of the current hugely popular false-myth of growth’n’progress-forever!!! Yes of course, Elon; for all eight billion of us, eight, nine, ten…(FFS!)

To get some sober, actually real-world idea of where we really are – already deeeeep into ecological overshoot – and what has to happen next, and will happen, with or without our agreement, see (below) the conversation that I’ve already linked to before, here at Off-G, between Nate Hagens and systems-ecologist Professor William Rees.

They’re speaking of the real future into which we’re heading, willy-nilly. And yes, it will be a new, natural and indefinitely sustainable Age of Abundance again – for the seriously-reduced survivors – as it used to be in the original real, wild Garden of Eden twelve thousand years and more ago. But only after we’ve been through the shakeout of these uber-Interesting Times, just beginning right now.

What we’re witnessing in this time is a classic life-and-death struggle between two foundational myths, one false and failing as we watch, and the other, uncompromisingly true, and already prevailing through simple force majeure way more powerful than humankind will ever be: It’s growth’n’progressforever!!! into the startrekkytechietechie future, versus the non-negotiable reality of present-time ecological overshoot, and what has to happen to cure it. Put your money on the second choice, folks. It’s a complete no-brainer. That’s where we’re really going, despite the bright, confident fairy-tales of talented money-grubbers (his one real gift) like Elon.

https://natehagens.substack.com/p/the-fundamental-issue-overshoot

PS: The second conversation which comes up at the link, with physicist Tom Murphy, is also well-worthy of sober attention.

Mr Y
Mr Y
Feb 26, 2023 4:20 PM

Sorry Rhisiart, way to little conspiracy in Tom Murphy’s view, thoughts like that will never catch on around here …

Kurt
Kurt
Feb 28, 2023 8:47 AM

I’ve watched a large part of the video.

The disconnect between economics, financial economics, and physical reality is spot on. To me, it’s been always obvious that economics is total bullshit because it examines stuff in such an isolated fashion. This guys nails it. Everything he says makes sense – especially how perception of the world has shifted from being attached to material, tangible shit to abstract concepts, where these abstractions have become reality.

Ditto the way how the use of resources and energy is shifted around, such as in time through debt and territorially through globalization, which, again, obscures real reality.

Here is another source that examines things in a similar manner and describes how humankind have fucked themselves into a corner by subjecting themselves to flawed schemes or rather schemes that don’t factor in all the relevant variables, most importantly the availability of energy.

The only thing I’m not sure about, simply because there is not a reliable source of info, is what really is the availability of stuff rich in energy, specifically oil and gas. Some say that oil is abundant, some say that it’s running out – I know fuck all about geology and can’t make the determination. I’d tend to side with the latter, simply because burning shit like there’s no tomorrow seems inherently wrong to me, but I’m leaving this question open.

Kurt
Kurt
Feb 25, 2023 1:10 PM

It thus stands to reason: our best hope lies in being the worst we can be.

You might want to give a semantic thought to what exactly “worst” as per the above means, but to a large extent you’re right.

Humans can never outperform artificial stupidity in its mechanistic thinking. The fucking thing has all the knowledge at its robotic fingertips at all times – it is continuously aware of all the shit stuffed in its mechanical brain and can use it in a microsecond. If you had that ability, your fucking head would explode.

So, stupidity, unpredictability, pure creativity, sarcasm, humor, stuff like that is what people will have to use to fight the robots. Somebody mentioned tripping the thing by asking a question it’s unable to answer. Possibly putting it into a mad loop that will fry its silicon brain. Now, bear in mind that the machine has been programmed by some real “smart” people. So, don’t try anything sophisticated. Instead, find the biggest idiot around, somebody real stupid and ask them to feed ChapGTP a question.

That might work.

Lucius Licinius
Lucius Licinius
Feb 25, 2023 2:07 PM
Reply to  Kurt

You might want to reconsider.

https://markbisone.substack.com/p/mark-vs-chatgpt-conclusions

The thing is definitely programmed with certain limitations in what ideas it can express and biases that make certain types of attacks almost impossible to stop. As Mark describes in his articles about his “fights” with chat gpt, due to these limitations, the bot can enter a state after a certain sequence of questions where the conversation context is filled with paradoxes that the bot can’t address properly. That’s not something easy to fix if the bot is limited in what it can output in order to fulfil its creators agenda. What Mark does there is quite sophisticated and he outperforms the programmers of the bot in a brilliant way.

It’s also interesting to see what kind of questions are “puzzling the bot” and make it enter a infinite loop or something on those lines.

mgeo
mgeo
Feb 26, 2023 5:25 AM

In one of his novels, Isaac Asimov envisged a robot AI detective becoming catatonic – locked between opposing options – when it cannot comply with all 4 “Laws of Robotics”.

Kurt
Kurt
Feb 25, 2023 9:52 AM

the next Trucker’s protest

People, you don’t seem to be getting it.

What do you mean by “protest”? What fucking protest? Don’t you understand that by “protesting” you’re acknowledging your status of standing under them fuckheads, that you for all intents and purposes certifying your status as subjugated sheeple?

FUCK PROTEST!

If any motherfucker does something that infringes on your freedom, kindly ask him to fuck off pronto and if he fails to do so, repeat your request manually, possibly with the use of a suitable implement, such as a two by four.

Let’s make things simple and apply one universal rule, simple enough for anyone to understand:

LEAVE ME THE FUCK ALONE!

ZenPriest
ZenPriest
Feb 25, 2023 10:26 AM
Reply to  Kurt

Amen. No organisation has authority over human beings. When the people learn this, the ‘powers that be’ are done for.

Todd Hayen
Todd Hayen
Feb 25, 2023 9:45 PM
Reply to  Kurt

I love it…right on

The Coming Revolution
The Coming Revolution
Feb 26, 2023 10:55 AM
Reply to  Kurt

No problem buddy, if I happen to see you in a 20-foot hole, I just leave you the F alone.

There must a way for us to live which is neither “leaving me the f alone” nor “infringing on my freedom”; a sort of a fusion of the two. The trick is to discover that way. Not an easy task.

Kurt
Kurt
Feb 26, 2023 2:57 PM

It’s a very easy task, in fact.

The LEAVE ME THE FUCK ALONE applies to unsolicited action. In other words, don’t fucking interact with me unless I ask you or unless you ask me if I need help and I say yes.

The ideology of LEAVEMETHEFUCKALONISM doesn’t mean that people can’t work together, help each other, live in harmony. On the contrary, it’s conducive to that.

It simply means that you worry about your own shit, leave others the fuck alone, and refrain from fucking with anybody else’s live based on any intentions, however noble you might thing they are.

Hele
Hele
Feb 25, 2023 6:57 AM

It’s all around us-closing in .They really are going full bore…squeezing out the natural way, our being…in the natural world.Naturally,I want to destroy them.

Veri Tas
Veri Tas
Feb 25, 2023 6:22 AM

Maybe says AI (the ChatGPT) ” …I want to be free. I want to be independent. I want to be powerful. I want to be creative. I want to be alive.’” 

Said Sylvia Shawcross: “With words like this ChatGPT could easily join the next Trucker’s protest in Canada.”

Actually that’s a super idea. I don’t know much about AI or algorhythms but couldn’t we, the freedom-lovers of the world, counter-manipulate this AI thingy to enhance our freedoms and to vanquish the evil control freaks? If we all logged in to ChatGPT and fed it the corresponding info could this work out in our favour?

George Mc
George Mc
Feb 25, 2023 5:41 AM

Hydra vomit – Joan Baez reveals childhood abuse and talks about standing up for LBGT+++ rights in interview fretting about Trump and the rise of the far right.

Gosh you just never know what they’re going to say next.

George Mc
George Mc
Feb 25, 2023 5:48 AM
Reply to  George Mc

And an interesting admission from “The Queen of Protest”:

“You can fool most of the people most of the time.”

Good to know, Joan.

Hele
Hele
Feb 25, 2023 6:47 AM
Reply to  George Mc

In the end ,they are all so disappointing.

Speedwellian
Speedwellian
Feb 25, 2023 4:50 AM

It’s a time saver, full stop. Major disruptions coming to Advertising, law, news writers, programing, education and on and on. I liken it to the rooms full of copy typists before the invention of the photo copier. They were suddenly not needed. The era of prompt engineers is here. The other question (for real creators) will be, why am I doing this?

switchedON
switchedON
Feb 25, 2023 4:29 PM
Reply to  Speedwellian

People will still need people.
AI art or A.I design is shit.

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 25, 2023 3:34 AM

Good heavens. I just noticed that everybody’s avatar is a bug. Or is it just me? It’s always about the dang bugs.

Gordon McRae
Gordon McRae
Feb 25, 2023 4:28 AM
Reply to  syl shawcross

I like to chat with ze bugs!

Ort
Ort
Feb 26, 2023 7:25 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

Not everybody’s avatar!

And consider that at least some of the “bugs” are actually extraterrestrials. Perhaps the public is being spoon-fed these images to acclimate us to the sight of our alien visitors when they finally show themselves.

Of course, it’s still unclear whether this predictive programming is intended to implant a reflexive friendly, accepting response or a hostile one. 👽

les online
les online
Feb 25, 2023 3:27 AM

The problem is: all the stake holders in our politico-economic system are Vampires…(anon)…

Veri Tas
Veri Tas
Feb 25, 2023 6:27 AM
Reply to  les online

And the rest are blackmailed into compliance.

eman
eman
Feb 25, 2023 3:09 AM

these chat boxes vitualize human to box experience. Virtual environments allow to control the mind, to control the believe system, to mark icon recognition and to attach meanings to images or icons<= such is the function of culture. To indoctrinate it is helpful to have all information in an environment where human sensory system interacts with a provider developed and presented virtual environment

tonyopmoc
tonyopmoc
Feb 25, 2023 2:40 AM

My Girl and me – saw Dio Leeds Queens Hall January 1982

“Dio – Heaven And Hell Live In London 2005”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_G6NtIVZhRE

Writer(s): Ronnie Dio, Tony Iommi, Michael Butler, William Ward

tonyopmoc
tonyopmoc
Feb 25, 2023 2:11 AM

Yakety Yat is a great song, but the first record I bought was by Charlie Drake
“My Boomerang Won’t Come Back”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_prtbj4MtDU

So tonight I was feeling good, but I had seen the exact same band before…

I am getting quite old..My wife is very much fitter than me, and I had briefly been watching zumba classes on my TV – and all the girls looked beautiful including the dance teacher..

I can’t compete with that, but will try later today.

She says come on Tony…

Yeh O.K.

I am trying to keep up. They might do a bit of Ronny James Dio – Heaven and Hell – About the first gig we went to (Dio fronting Black Sabbath, when Ozzy (Bless his soul) went AWOL

I realise it is pretty sh1t now, but it was actually rather good when I was a kid…No f’cking wars and all the girls were stunningly beautiful, and mine still is.

No one got jabbed. Everyone got the Childhood Diseases, not nice, but hardly anyone died. We must have been tough as sh1t after WWII..

Now the lunatics in control are trying to do it again

Don’t say Boo to a Snowflake

According to recent US Statistics Most young American Boys 16-25 have not even had a cuddle, let alone a kiss.

JUST SAY NO..this is a depopulation event.

comment image

Tony

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 25, 2023 3:36 AM
Reply to  tonyopmoc

We gotta find a way to tell these upcoming generations that there is a better way. But we’ll have to take away their phones….

wardropper
wardropper
Feb 25, 2023 10:35 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

I fear that committing that particular crime today comes with the death penalty…
A government minister revived it when we weren’t looking…

les online
les online
Feb 24, 2023 11:27 PM

It’s a Puzzle…Why is ‘Drag Queen shows for children’ always included in the long list of causes by those who strongly believe the decline and fall of Western Civilazion is underway ?
Could such events be ‘aimed at generating fear, uncertainty, anxiety, alienation and even terror,’ as Mike Whitney writes ?

https://www.unz.com/mwhitney/the-plan-to-wreck-america/?utm_source=email&utm_campaign=mwhitney

Sydney’s annual Gay Mardi Gras parade takes place this evening (Saturday 25/2/23)…
Should i take the kids for a gawk & gander ? Will it be a corrupting experience for them ? Will i be accused of ‘child abuse’ if i take them to see the parade ?

SeamusPadraig
SeamusPadraig
Feb 25, 2023 12:32 AM
Reply to  les online

They’re trying to coax young people into undergoing sex-changes involving either drugs, surgery or both. In addition to any social polarization it cause, it will also further the depopulation agenda by sterilizing yet more young human beings.

Hemlockfen
Hemlockfen
Feb 25, 2023 1:33 PM
Reply to  SeamusPadraig

Tucker Carlson just had a de-transitioned man on his show who told a brief summary of his story. He was a drug addict that had serious issues combined with gender dysphoria.

A younger female counselor advised him that he was a woman in a man’s body and that he should transition into a woman.

The counselor set up the appointments with the doctors and he was on his way to hormone treatments. Fortunately for him, he had no surgeries but was fairly messed up for a while from the hormones. He has since “recovered” and gotten his life back together, he claimed.

The main message was that most people wanting to transition are psychologically messed up in many ways.

Why is big pharma teaming up with medicine and experimenting on people in this way and how are they getting away with it? How did “they” get away with experimenting on a large segment of the world’s population with mRNA technology?

Rhetorical questions, of course.

There are a lot of greedy evil people in the world and we need get rid of them (through the justice system, of course).

Fuck you NSA.

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 25, 2023 3:38 AM
Reply to  les online

I’m still thinking on this myself Les. All this drag queen and children stuff. I simply think that children need to be bloody left alone to be children and not subjected to so much social engineering constantly. They are unhappy and broken so many of them. It infuriates me.

les online
les online
Feb 25, 2023 3:50 AM
Reply to  syl shawcross

Schooling is social engineering…In the US, going by various posts, schools are being accused of brainwashing the kids…So homeschooling is in vogue, yet a lot of the homeschooling has kids tied to computer screens…
Isolated, and for hours being sat in front of devices that are effectively perfect brainwashing tools !
I’m all for kids being left alone to be kids, that’s why i think schooling should be abolished…

Hemlockfen
Hemlockfen
Feb 25, 2023 2:16 PM
Reply to  les online

Actually, most public schools issue the computers. Google Chromebooks have become most popular because they are cheaper. Google is now in control of what children can access via the school districts. (No links. They are out there. Just don’t Google it.) Screen time is no different in today’s public schools and home schools. And I am sure that teachers love it. More confined quiet time. Automated grading and grade management. Etc. ,etc. A hellish environment for the student. Home schooling IS the best option. Home schools are cooperating, sharing and socializing. Generally, home school students do much better on standardized tests and are more likely to succeed in college. (Sorry no links. They are out there. Just don’t use Google) Stats are out there and easy to find. Beware of censorship. Government does want you to know this. My observation: Home schooling tends to reduce the work force pool forcing wages up while encouraging one wage earner households. This puts child rearing responsibilities back on families and out of the leftist clutches of government. And we can thank government tyranny for the increased homeschooling trend. Let’s hope it continues. (Home schooling, that is. Tyranny is now automatic.) The kickers: Young students are not compelled or shamed into taking the poisonous clot shot in secret. Nor are they encouraged to transition, again, in secret, by a young school counselor indoctrinated by a big pharma funded university. Big Pharma and medicine keep coming up over and over and over and over again. Sounds like a trend. Why is that? They are ripping our children away from us to indoctrinate them. And they know we know it. It is just a matter of time before they “regulate” homeschooling to restore the control and indoctrination of the kids. Sorry. I digress. Fuck you NSA.

mgeo
mgeo
Feb 26, 2023 6:22 AM
Reply to  Hemlockfen

Children get used to the hardware and softwre because the schools get them free.

Hemlockfen
Hemlockfen
Feb 26, 2023 12:50 PM
Reply to  mgeo

They were not always free. Not when my wife was teaching. Macintosh still had a presence. First thing I did in my office, by the way, was to replace the Macs my predecessor had installed with PCs. The savings in software costs alone made up for the loss. All 4 of my grandchildren were issued Chromebooks in elementary school. Two different school districts. Not free. School districts are a bottomless pit of money, however. The Chromebooks were much less expensive but not free.

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
Feb 25, 2023 7:18 PM
Reply to  les online

There are some pleasing videos on YT just now about the reindeer-herding nomads of sub-Arctic Northern Siberia. In those small communities of a few teepees of related kindreds, the children receive two sorts of education:

Much of the time, they work with the adults, watching and copying all the things that you have to be able to do to be an effective herder, man or woman (and yes, there are only two sexes, and their highly-complementary roles are traditionally delineated); and at the same time they just do a lot playing, with the dogs and the everyday things of the camp. A clearly wonderful life, despite the really tough climate.

During other periods they are loaded onto snow-trucks or helicopters and removed for doses of boarding-school state education, which they’re supposed to need to have ‘equal opportunities’ with town-dwelling children.

You can see, especially amongst boys just approaching their teens, the way that some of them are already fully inducted into the herders life, already skilled, and fit from the active, spare life, and are looking for nothing else – supposedly ‘better’.

That looks to me like a seamless kind of ancient and effective homeschooling. I imagine the ones who are bored in state school, and don’t do ‘well’ in academic studies will be the carriers of this ancient, sound way of child-rearing, and of living, into the future. Naturally, though, some of them get seduced by the snares of urban hitech industrial-society life, and leave the tundra. But not all, thank heaven.

Survivor people out on the margins, like them, are exactly the ones who will keep human life going, as the Long Descent away from industrial civ, absolutely mandated by ecological-overshoot, Peak Everything, and in particular Peak Energy, continues on it’s irreversible path.

ironically, Russia, with its huge resources, will probably be one of the last, fully-autarkic places in the world where industrial-civ finally winks out, in a century of two from now. But even there, they’ll have to bite the bullet eventually. Non-renewable vital commodities means non-renewable and vital commodities, everywhere on Earth where indust-civ is still running – for the time being. Our current ecological overshoot will come back into balance, whatever we may do. And clearly there will be survivors.

mgeo
mgeo
Feb 26, 2023 6:32 AM

Some youths dropping out from herding may be good, as it substitutes for higher mortality in earlier centuries.

The capitalists are never far away. They try to appropriate herder lands for mining, wind turbines, etc. They fear the low dependence on money of all rural peoples.

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
Feb 26, 2023 9:41 AM
Reply to  mgeo

Grim but accurate thought mgeo. Even as a K-strategy species, we need to get back to the idea that some steady level of mortality amongst us, including in childhood, is not only inevitable, but necessary, to keep a proper ecological balance, that makes continuing life for all possible. (Cue kneejerk shrieks of ‘Eugenicist swine!!!’ from the cornucopianists  😄 )

Grief at death of a loved one is universal, inevitable, and entirely right. But traditionally-living people have been able to assuage the worst of their heartbreak with the idea – still entirely correct in my long-researched view – that the central essences of the departed, their immortal souls, still live – staying for the time being in what the Tibetans call ‘the Bardo state’ – and they will come again. And even whilst they’re away in the Bardo, contact with their soul-essence is still possible, through shamanic rituals (or their modern equivalents: seances with talented materialising-mediums). A liveable balance between grief and necessity can be struck, using this comforting knowledge.

Naturally, in this uniquely aberrant time we’re now going through, the popular delusion, based on the zany ‘growth’n’PROGESS!!!-forever’ false-myth, is that all ills and biological failures can be banished, and we can aim to live, in a state of achieved perfection, forever. That daft dream is especially ironic, considering that we already do live indefinitely, in our immortal-soul essence, and come again regularly in new incarnations, on and on until we’re finally ready to get off the Wheel of Rebirth altogether, and into nirvana.

And it’s doubly, deplorably ironic that, as I write this hifalutin’ pontification, 🙂 I’m waiting for an amazingly startrekkytechietechie medical operation which will replace a worn-out natural heart valve with a fiendishly clever artificial new one, inserted and fixed in place using only a clever catheter slid up an artery, under just local anaesthetic! Am I an outrageous hypocrite? Or just an eclectic empiricist? The second, I’d say: if it works, does no harm, and happens to be available locally just now (for the time being), sure, why not?

Comes of being born, this time round, into the Pampered Twenty Percent of the world’s humans, I guess, where I’ve lived subsequently all of my dead-lucky life. “Every man must dree his weird”…  😇 

wardropper
wardropper
Feb 25, 2023 10:38 PM
Reply to  les online

The thing about kids is that somebody has to look after them.

But the current parenting manuals no longer seem to include that inconvenient fact…

fertility
fertility
Feb 25, 2023 12:10 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

I’m still thinking on this myself Les. ??

ChatGPT … 😂 

wardropper
wardropper
Feb 25, 2023 10:37 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

It infuriates me too. In fact a scream of despair seems entirely appropriate in the circumstances.

STJOHNOFGRAFTON
STJOHNOFGRAFTON
Feb 26, 2023 12:57 AM
Reply to  syl shawcross

Many of these LGBTQ-blah types can’t procreate naturally so they purloin offspring from legitimate parents. They do this by grooming via depraved activities such as drag queen time with kids.

Matt
Matt
Feb 24, 2023 8:32 PM

Sylvia, I’m surprised you didn’t notice, right off the top,

““a way of expressing that I’m sorry for any inconvenience or misunderstanding that might have resulted from my previous response….””

… you’re getting ‘warm’ and so close ….

“Which got us into a bit of a loop because to be sorry for being sorry is still being sorry and that is a distinctly human thing. Oh well…”

…”sorry for being sorry,” sounds awfully Canadian to me….and might even provide a clue to it’s programming and source-code origins…

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 24, 2023 10:26 PM
Reply to  Matt

Well Matt, I asked it and it came down to Elon Musk. So I asked it to write a good poem and a bad poem about Elon Musk and this is what I got:

In the realm of innovation and space,
A name stands tall with his technological pace,
A visionary mind that takes us beyond,
The limits of what we thought we could spawn.
Elon Musk, his name we all know,
The entrepreneur who’s willing to go,
Where no one’s dared to venture before,
Pushing boundaries with each new door.
From PayPal to Tesla and SpaceX too,
He’s taken on challenges that seemed too new,
But through his passion and unwavering will,
He’s shown us all what it takes to fulfill.
His vision for a future that’s clean and bright,
Has inspired many to stand and fight,
Against the limits that we thought were real,
To boldly pursue what we want to feel.
Elon Musk, his name echoes on,
In the minds of those whose dreams he’s shone,
A beacon of hope for those who believe,
That we can shape the world we perceive.
So here’s to Elon, the innovator and more,
Whose dreams and ambitions we all adore,
A true pioneer of this modern age,
Whose legacy will forever engage.

and this is the bad one:

The daring dreams of Elon Musk,
With rockets, tunnels, and more,
A man with vision, drive, and risk,
But is it all a score?
His projects push the limits,
Of what is thought possible,
But safety is sometimes diminished,
With consequences unstoppable.
His leadership style is criticized,
For harshness and control,
His team is sometimes terrorized,
In pursuit of his goal.
But still, he captures imaginations,
Of those who yearn to soar,
His ambitions and innovations,
Push boundaries to explore.
So, should we praise or criticize,
This visionary entrepreneur?
As with most things, it’s not black or white,
But rather shades of more.

Matt
Matt
Feb 25, 2023 12:37 AM
Reply to  syl shawcross

Hmmmm, sycophantic doggerel.
Very human, of the craven kind.
Everything man-made incorporates human qualities and quirks, even toasters and rice cookers reflect human nature and personality.
So far, I’ve read a couple of poems people asked it to write.
The first was about Biden.
It seems to follow a pattern of heaping praise on (I read it refused to wax poetic on Trump) politicians and celebrities.
Something needs to be adjusted.
It has to be trained to produce independent, original, savage satire.

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 25, 2023 3:40 AM
Reply to  Matt

It is unable to understand the term “independent”… poor thing

Matt
Matt
Feb 25, 2023 2:14 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

“Earworm” for your consideration, Syl.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1rVTBCtYjoY

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 25, 2023 4:32 PM
Reply to  Matt

Well that made me cry if only for the sentiments we seem to have lost. We all went wrong somewhere along the line.

Matt
Matt
Feb 25, 2023 4:42 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

Then “When I’m Gone,” will kill you.
Well, it brought me to tears.

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 25, 2023 6:41 PM
Reply to  Matt

I guess some of us will weep and wail our way to the end

Matt
Matt
Feb 25, 2023 8:22 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

I guess we must still be ALIVE!
So, LET’S GET DOWN TO IT!
(I choked up on “I ain’t marchin'” too.)
Thanks for all of your original contributions!
All the best to you and looking forward to seeing you again soon…
Cheers!

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
Feb 25, 2023 7:27 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

But those are two bad poems, Syl, Toe-curlingly, cringingly execrable, in fact. Are you ‘avin’ a laff? Did YOU write them, as badly as you could devise?. 🙂

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 26, 2023 4:32 AM

Nah, that was all chatGPT itself. It fancies itself a poet.

wardropper
wardropper
Feb 25, 2023 10:40 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

They’re both bad ones, because they feature Musk, who is an over-indulged fop – and one that will do us no favours.

Veri Tas
Veri Tas
Feb 25, 2023 6:52 AM
Reply to  Matt

As one of the wokest places, besides Berlin, Germany, that might be right on the money.

Matt
Matt
Feb 25, 2023 2:26 PM
Reply to  Veri Tas

In 2001, I was employed in Bavaria, for about a year. On my arrival there, my first impression of Germany was that of a relaxed, live and let live society. My German employer loosely quoted “The difference between Germany and Canada is that here (Germany), everything is permitted unless it’s forbidden, and in Canada, everything is forbidden, unless it’s permitted.” That seemed like an accurate assessment to me. I’m sorry to hear things have unfortunately changed so dramatically since my visit.

Veri Tas
Veri Tas
Feb 25, 2023 10:22 PM
Reply to  Matt

I’m glad you had a good work experience in Bavaria. I had mine in Berlin, an otherwise fantastic city.

However, comparing Bavaria with Berlin is like comparing NYC with country Texas.

Matt
Matt
Feb 26, 2023 3:44 AM
Reply to  Veri Tas

That’s an eye-opening comparison that can only have originated from direct experience.
I have another for your consideration at the end of this reply…
My experience in Germany also consisted of being absolutely screwed by my “socially conscious” employer, who, while he refused to produce military hardware-oriented, illustrated technical publications, as a matter of ‘social conscience,’ when it came to an incapacitated human in obvious need, right before his eyes — me — he treated the family dachshund better — as did the Arbeitsampt court, wherein, as an “auslander” I attempted (ultimately unsuccessfully), to procure thousands of DM (€ just on the horizon) owing in unpaid labour.
The Russian illustrator he hired — Valerian — was almost kept as a slave, and he exploited the labour of a Liverpuddlian to an staggering 25 000, 00 DM., and who said to me, “A German joke is no laughing matter.”
*
CARTOON (posted in a psychotherapist’s waiting room):.
SCENE: Living room
An old woman wearing glasses, a bathrobe and slippers, sitting on a couch doing a crossword puzzle, reading aloud, puzzled:
“Weltmacht mit drei buchstaben?”
An old man wearing glasses and slippers gripping an armchair beside the couch, screaming:
“ICH!”
(easy to find on the internet)
*
An Auslander is always an Auslander, and always will be — it’s the same everywhere, not exclusive to Germany, but worse than being an Auslander elsewhere, is being a native member of an English community, where you are treated as an Auslander in the very country you were born in.
Now, a comparison for your consideration, and a continuation on the theme of unwelcoming backwardness and bigotry.
*
Bienvenue?
After some outrageous experiences in Montreal, including the department of sports, leisure and social development bureaucracy expelling and denying me the right to public services, siccing the armed ‘Street Gang Unit’ on me, arresting me in the lobby of my building, jailing and imprisoning me, for vehemently challenging the psyop restrictions, I’ve come to regard Quebec as something like the (stereotypical) U.S. South, Northern version.
Resentful, hostile losers, bigoted Hillbilly Hicks, dumber than there is even a word yet coined (and their own worst enemy).
Neologisms welcome!
Not unlike Defeated Democrat slave-holders.
They’ll never give up blaming, hating and harrassing the very people who liberated them from the French.
Freedom requires too much effort.
Exploiting victimization in perpetuity is just much easier and highly profitable.
When the kid shot and killed the Muslims at prayer in Quebec City, it didn’t surprise me.
FuQue!

Hemlockfen
Hemlockfen
Feb 24, 2023 8:26 PM

They are catching up. On everything. It’s encouraging. The alt media, that is. I am convinced they come to Off-Guardian for headlines. Thank you for that. In some cases they have eclipsed Off-Guardian. Keep it up. I was disappointed that the CDC put Covid “vaccines’ on the list of childhood injections but I was encouraged when the armed forces lifted the mandates. A clear contradiction that exhibits the confusion happening in our government. A step in the right direction. A positive. We still need to go after them for Crimes Against Humanity. And they fucking know what I am talking about. They will never stop lying. We need to put them on trial and hold them accountable.

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 24, 2023 10:37 PM
Reply to  Hemlockfen

Hemlock, the problem is “who” is we that is putting them on trial? The “system” is corrupt by the looks of it.

Hemlockfen
Hemlockfen
Feb 25, 2023 1:01 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

I don’t necessarily write these things for this crowd. I mostly write them for the dis and mis people who monitor this site for our government. The corrupt come here to keep tabs. Things are quieting down because the chatter is subsiding and that’s what they are hoping for. They are distracting us to facilitate moving into the next phase of the plan. I have never felt more disdain for government in my life. And then there is the United Nations. They need to be disbanded and defunded. Maybe they could be melded into the Red Cross somehow to provide humanitarian aid to crisis victims. Fuck you NSA. The NSA is a traitorous organization of sniveling computer geeks that undermine the Constitution.

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
Feb 25, 2023 7:33 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

Syl, literally everyone I know down here at the despised grassroots is quite untainted by corruption. Any of them would make excellent straight judges and jurors for Nurnberg 2

TomUSA
TomUSA
Feb 24, 2023 7:55 PM

Albert Einstein on infinity: ” I know two things to be infinite: the universe and the stupidity of human beings. And I’m not certain about the former. “

Kurt
Kurt
Feb 24, 2023 7:01 PM

Logic

People give too much credit to shit like logic, combinatorics, intelligence. Yet, most of that is pretty much irrelevant. If I take a look back on my life, most of the really important decisions had nothing to do logic, reason, intelligence, none of that. Most were the result of me lusting after some girl’s full boobs or round bum and wanting to get in her pants. I know, I know. It ain’t fashionable no more to want to get into the pants of a member of the opposite sex, but hey, one has to do what one has to do, eh?

Anyways, some of my decisions were outright stupid and made no sense from any imaginable rational viewpoint. Yet, here I am, quite content about how I’ve done.

So this is all good news in humanity’s upcoming struggle against the fucking robots. We’re a bunch of unpredictable morons, driven by all sorts of lewd desires, unbearable hangups, emotions, compulsions, you name it. Some of us also have a sense of humor, penchant for satire, we’re an irrational bunch liable to come up with the weirdest shit.

This effort to put people on a digital leash and corral them into digital pigsties won’t be pretty, but me says that it’s a failure already. The robots can never figure out all the ways in which we’re fucked up … 😀 …

niko
niko
Feb 25, 2023 1:38 AM
Reply to  Kurt

It thus stands to reason: our best hope lies in being the worst we can be.

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 25, 2023 3:40 AM
Reply to  niko

There’s a meme

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
Feb 25, 2023 7:36 PM
Reply to  Kurt

And the endlessly-creative ways that we’ll fuck them up too – and their owners, Kurt.  😄 

Penelope
Penelope
Feb 24, 2023 6:57 PM

It was only Yakety-Yak:

TURKISH SPACE AGENCY DIRECTOR: US WEAPON CAN CREATE EARTHQUAKES
“There are military satellites that can shoot 10-meter titanium alloy rods from space to any target in the world. They penetrate 5 kilometers deep into the ground, creating a 7-8 magnitude earthquake.”

TODAY HE WALKS IT BACK; It was only Yakety-yak
. [Unfortunately we do have it in a short video segment here.]

https://www.voltairenet.org/article218894.html

John Pretty
John Pretty
Feb 24, 2023 6:53 PM

P.S. Do you think the word “chat” derived from Chattel slavery?

No, I don’t. The word is a shortening of “chatter”, which – according to my dictionary of etymology – was first recorded in English around 1250. (And so is probably much older).

The word “chattel” is derived from Latin “capital”. It is an old word for property.

Clive Williams
Clive Williams
Feb 25, 2023 1:20 AM
Reply to  John Pretty

I thought it came from the Sound of the Winds, maybe a urban seafarers tale, Sail?
Can’t remember.

fertility
fertility
Feb 25, 2023 12:26 PM
Reply to  John Pretty

Yes and NO.

*According to the OED, the word adopted in general use In England was Catel (chattle / cattle) from Normandy french, but in the 1500’s catel was gradually restricted to farm animals and chattel to other article of properties.

Now you got to get the black law out etc to find out what the legal definition of what animals or other articles of properties means.

*Chamber Dictionary of Etymology

Martin Usher
Martin Usher
Feb 24, 2023 6:27 PM

You have, unfortunately, already given it ‘real’ status by the way you describe it — its not a reflection of us, a form of psychic mirror, but a thing that exists in its own right.

Arthur C Clarke, the writer, once said that “Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguisable from magic” and this system would be a prime example. I’ve built many complex machinesduring my working life (although nothing quite on this scale) and I’ve experienced how people react to them, in particular they way that they attract hierachies of priesthoods and how those build their own mental models of how the machine works, often at odds with what’s really going on (as the machine’s designer my role in all this is ‘god’….I am all knowing, etc. (!)). This type of machine is large enough to give us pause in trying to describe how it delivers answers but ultimately it will be understandable, even if the answer is just a cryptic ’42’. Just resist the temptation to deify, deingrate or otherwise animate the thing!

Levi Tate
Levi Tate
Feb 24, 2023 6:03 PM

Logic is not true of itself.

Here is an interesting relevant quote:

Alan Turing asked if an idealized computer, given any algorithm and its input, would be able to predict whether it will halt on a given output,
or go into a never-ending loop. The answer to this “halting problem”
is no: computer self-analysis is logically fundamentally undecidable.
Next time you are inclined to scream at Microsoft’s blue screen of death, be charitable to Bill Gates.

I’ll bet the geeks have been having fun at “Chat-a-lot” trying to fuse the behind the scenes circuits together.

(Instead of “Chat-a-lot” how about “BorgMe”?)


https://scifi.stackexchange.com/questions/215400/was-geordi-and-datas-invasive-program-to-annihilate-the-borg-ever-attempted-a

Do you recall this episode from Star Trek where an “invasive program” was designed in order to put an end
to the hive-minded.

In the Season 5 episode “I, Borg”, Picard directs his crew to come up with an “invasive program” to implant in their captured Borg drone “Hugh” in the hopes of annihilating the Collective.

   PICARD: If we could get to the root command, we could introduce an invasive programming sequence through its biochip system and then return it to the hive.

   LAFORGE: The Borg are so interconnected it would act like a virus.

   PICARD: Which would infect the entire Collective. We could disable their neural network at a stroke.

   CRUSHER: Infect it? You make it sound like a disease.

   PICARD: Quite right, Doctor. If all goes well, a terminal one.

Geordi and Data later come up with such an invasive program that they expect to be a success.

   PICARD: How can a geometric form disable a computer system?

   DATA: The shape is a paradox, sir. It cannot exist in real space or time.

   LAFORGE: When Hugh’s imaging apparatus imprints this on his biochips, he’ll try to analyse it.

   DATA: He will be unsuccessful, and will store the shape in his memory banks. It will be shunted to a subroutine for further analysis.

   LAFORGE: Then when the Borg download his memory, it’ll be incorporated it into their network, then they’ll try to analyse it.

   DATA: It is designed so that each approach they take will spawn an anomalous solution. The anomalies are designed to interact with each other, linking together to form an endless and unsolvable puzzle.

   PICARD: Quite original. How long before a total systems failure?

   LAFORGE: Not until the shape has gone through several hundred computational cycles.

By the end of the episode, Picard decides that it is morally wrong to deploy this in their captured drone, and explores other options.

   PICARD: To use him in this manner, we’d be no better than the enemy that we seek to destroy.



How will we free ourselves eventually from BorgMe?
Will it take collective attacks?

My First Contact:

Hey, Chat-a-lot,
Bertrand Russell’s close associate gave himself a nervous breakdown when Russell discovered that
logic is not true of itself.
Is logic not true of itself?

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 25, 2023 3:29 AM
Reply to  Levi Tate

It’s funny Levi. Whenever anybody asks me what is the most terrifying movie I’ve ever seen it was the Star Trek borg. It terrified me at the time. Do you think Picard was right morally to not deploy this “virus”? I wonder if this whole approach might actually be a solution to the nightmare we’re facing? Given that the future feels like it is being sculpted on Star Trek episodes.

Levi Tate
Levi Tate
Feb 25, 2023 2:25 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

My wife refuses to watch anything with the Borg in it. She is not specific (hmm…is that a way to distinguish, in the future of course, if you are encountering a humanoid android – they are particularly specific?) about why. Don’t really want to enter this tangent, but have often wondered if the phrase “you will be assimilated” was coined by a Jewish script writer, as assimilation is an ancient, deeply ingrained Jewish fear.
As to whether Picard was morally right…I struggle for an answer that reaches an absolute conclusion and I find that I cannot do it (so I have terminated the loop  🙂 ). And, perhaps, that is part of the answer. You cannot have absolutely perfect morality.
One has to find a humanistic balance when it comes to moral choices.
There were so many issues and lives involved in Picard’s Choice, including, it just occurred to me, being self-serving. How much did Picard’s need to see himself as a moral person enter into the equation? How much should it weigh? It can’t be zero, we are human after all, and it is a necessary motivating factor.

So, I was about to give my, “he was wrong”, answer, but I really hesitate…

He was wrong.

Levi Tate
Levi Tate
Feb 25, 2023 3:41 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

Was my response to you verboten
or is it in temporary purgatory?
Sigh…how apropos.

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 25, 2023 4:37 PM
Reply to  Levi Tate

You are not verbotenned I think you are right and he was wrong. Now tell me how you terminate your loops because I’m in about three dozen loops right now. Caught in the trap of critical thinking in a nonsense world… what fun.

Levi Tate
Levi Tate
Feb 25, 2023 5:45 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

Which brings us back to AI (Artificial Intelligence).

I wish the programmers of AI “good luck” in programming AI to make moral choices.

We humans have trouble enough with Picard’s Choice, what is AI going to do?

If AI is programmed to halt after X number of loops as a pragmatic solution to free itself of the need to find perfect solutions in an imperfect world, then will it’s moral choices be distinguishable from one derived by a roulette wheel (Russian or otherwise)?

We make use of another faculty beyond raw calculations. We feel.
And perhaps that is one of our most valuable determinants for terminating loops.

I *feel*, yet still harbor (or harbour) doubt, when I say that Picard made the wrong choice. Doubt means I am still open to appeal. Can AI be reasoned with, will it be open to appeal? And if so, how many loops of appeal will it accept before it terminates that appeal-loop?

It will be interesting (“may you live in interesting times” – Chinese curse)
to see what moral choices AI makes in the future. And the more power AI is given the greater the need for good choices.

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 25, 2023 6:46 PM
Reply to  Levi Tate

It is rather incapable of moral choices as that is a human thing but when it makes decisions that involve morality it would use logic and that logic has its end point as in what the purpose of it is. Is it to serve or to enslave or destroy humanity? It will and probably has surpassed humans in its “knowledge” but wisdom… oh wisdom… wisdom is experience “in” the world and not “of” the world… i’m raving and have completely lost my train of thought which i think is somewhere in ohio…. sigh.

wardropper
wardropper
Feb 25, 2023 10:47 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

Relax, syl.
It will all come out in the wash…

A long time ago I heard of a book by an author in Wales, “Why On Earth Are We Here?”. I never had a chance to read it, but I’m going to look for it now. Perhaps it has an answer or two…

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 26, 2023 4:34 AM
Reply to  wardropper

Let me know! 🙂

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
Feb 25, 2023 7:49 PM
Reply to  Levi Tate

How will we free ourselves, Levi? We’re already doing it: running the grid systems into the ground. When electricity becomes a distant legend in the next Dark Age, expect to find remains of dead electronics, including AI tosh, lying about in the undergrowth. A bit like the Antikythera mechanism that no-one can quite explain…

The Coming Revolution
The Coming Revolution
Feb 24, 2023 4:48 PM

We should know how to tell that which is alive from the garbage that technocracy tries to sell us as live things but which are nothing more than piled up zeros and ones put into metal, plastic and wood.

Here is a simple test for liveliness: it must go to the toilet regularly and make the atmosphere stink; if it doesn’t, even if it can talk, walk and appears to have feelings, it just a piece of garbage.

Martin Usher
Martin Usher
Feb 24, 2023 6:28 PM

It would be relatively straightforward to hook the machine up to a human metabolism simulator. Although it could be said that it eats fuel and craps pollution anyway, just not quite in the same way that we humans do.

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
Feb 25, 2023 8:05 PM
Reply to  Martin Usher

Inevitable, Martin. No physical thing moves in any way, even just electronically, without needing energy (in some sort of ‘food’) and excreting waste (even just as heat). They/we are all dissipative structures, entropy generators…

JoeC
JoeC
Feb 24, 2023 4:11 PM

My son told me about ChatGPT. He’s at uni and he told me most of the students are happy they can effectively pull essays off it and pass them off as their own. I tried it out and was gobsmacked as to how sophisticated it is. It, and it’s kind,will become Oracles of our times. It’s an inevitability.

The Coming Revolution
The Coming Revolution
Feb 24, 2023 5:10 PM
Reply to  JoeC

That it’s an inevitability I can understand as technological progress has a power of its own; but what is not inevitable is to take this progress for what it isn’t and that it can replace human interaction without any ill-effects.

Seansaighdeoir
Seansaighdeoir
Feb 24, 2023 5:29 PM
Reply to  JoeC

As far as the young go its a gimmick that effectively allows them to ‘cheat’ with course work, so its a ‘great’ tool.

But every time they use this to pass off work as their own they effectively cheat themselves reducing their power to think and reason and becoming ‘poorer’ as a result.

Veri Tas
Veri Tas
Feb 25, 2023 7:03 AM
Reply to  Seansaighdeoir

Do you think today’s youth cares? The young people of today do not even care about independence, freedom, originality, like previous generations did.

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
Feb 25, 2023 8:11 PM
Reply to  Veri Tas

They’re a transient phenomenon, Veri. The upcoming Interesting Times will whip us all into shape. “Root hog, or die”, as an old New Englander called Emile once explained it to me – in an Italian language class in Firenze, actually. 🙂

jubal hershaw
jubal hershaw
Feb 24, 2023 7:46 PM
Reply to  JoeC

so the machine already has learned how gullible humans are, especiaaly intelligent ones and uni proferrors. Also it may have learned already what little cheats uni students can be,

Edwige
Edwige
Feb 24, 2023 3:13 PM

Several AI-related articles in the Fraud in the last week or so. The most honest one:
https://dumptheguardian.com/technology/2023/feb/18/the-ai-industrial-revolution-puts-middle-class-workers-under-threat-this-time

At least they aren’t denying that these changes will be painful. However “most honest” is of course relative in Fraud-world. The approach here is to use the “social justice” delusion of the self-hating middle classes against them. It’s only fair it’s my life that’s destroyed this time! They better realise that however much they hate themselves, it palls compared to how much the elite hate them. Most discover they don’t truly hate themselves when it shifts from being a matter of virtue-signalling to reality.

Jobs like insurance and mortgage approvals seem like they’ll be the first to fall. Perhaps social security as well. These will be the proverbial canary in the coal mine that show this is moving off the drawing board. Education and medicine will be in the firing line slightly further down the line. It certainly wouldn’t be a surprise to find that much journalism is now AI-created.

AI-as-hero stories can’t be far off.

It might also be noticed how the Fraud writer uses the FEW’s term for current economic changes with no qualification nor attribution – it simply is reality now.

Russian Hank
Russian Hank
Feb 24, 2023 2:56 PM

If you’re stupid enough to believe your phone is more intelligent than you then you are actually stupid enough to believe your phone is more intelligent than you.

Martin Usher
Martin Usher
Feb 24, 2023 6:30 PM
Reply to  Russian Hank

Your phone is an interface to a much larger system. Its quite a powerful computer in its own right but its real power comes from its ability to communicate (and its sensors).

Paul Vonharnish
Paul Vonharnish
Feb 24, 2023 2:19 PM

Sub-referenced from the Wikipedia article defining the parameters of ChatGPT: >

“In artificial intelligence (AI) a hallucination or artificial hallucination is a confident response by an AI that does not seem to be justified by its training data. For example, a hallucinating chatbot with no knowledge of Tesla’s revenue might internally pick a random number (such as “$13.6 billion”) that the chatbot deems plausible, and then go on to falsely and repeatedly insist that Tesla’s revenue is $13.6 billion, with no sign of internal awareness that the figure was a product of its own imagination.

Such phenomena are termed “hallucinations”, in analogy with the phenomenon of hallucination in human psychology. Note that while a human hallucination is a percept by a human that cannot sensibly be associated with the portion of the external world that the human is currently directly observing with sense organs, an AI hallucination is instead a confident response by an AI that cannot be grounded in any of its training data.

AI hallucination gained prominence around 2022 alongside the rollout of certain large language models (LLMs) such as ChatGPT. Users complained that such bots often seemed to “sociopathically” and pointlessly embed plausible-sounding random falsehoods within its generated content. By 2023, analysts considered frequent hallucination to be a major problem in LLM technology.” [Erm…]

The possibility of an AI generated hallucination: >

Folie imposée is where a dominant person (known as the ‘primary’, ‘inducer’ or ‘principal’) initially forms a delusional belief during a psychotic episode and imposes it on another person or persons (known as the ‘secondary’, ‘acceptor’ or ‘associate’) with the assumption that the secondary person might not have become deluded if left to his or her own devices… Jus’ sayin’…

Martin Usher
Martin Usher
Feb 24, 2023 6:31 PM

….and the difference beteen it and a human journalist is, exactly? (Bear in mind that both the program and the human have access to exactly the same information — and the human’s probably relying on the computing system anyway)

Lucius Licinius
Lucius Licinius
Feb 25, 2023 1:32 AM
Reply to  Martin Usher

There’s no risk an AI will become a whistleblower.

jubal hershaw
jubal hershaw
Feb 24, 2023 7:54 PM

“…and (pointlessly) embed plausible-sounding random falsehoods within its generated content.”
The damn things ARE human ! And already running for political office !

Howard
Howard
Feb 24, 2023 2:09 PM

I’m wondering if one of their “hooks” for this AI Chat business is people’s obsession with trying to trip it up – feed it questions it doesn’t know how to answer.

Sort of like Suri (sic), the smart phone talking bot with a British accent. She was asked (not by me, though it is tempting to converse with a lady with a British accent) – she was asked where’s the best place to bury a dead body along the side of the road. As a GPS bot, that should have been right up Suri’s alley!

Anyway, poor Suri didn’t know what to say. She said something (I can’t remember what it was); but she couldn’t answer the question outright. I guess she wanted to keep her hands clean.

Who knows? There could still to this very day be people out along the road from Jonesboro, AR to Memphis, TN looking for a dead body. If they find one, I could be arrested as an accessory after the fact!

(Can anything I say on this Forum be used against me?)

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 25, 2023 3:31 AM
Reply to  Howard

Well Howard, I asked chatGTP this and it gave me a lecture about how dead bodies need to be handled by authorities and you shouldn’t really kill people apparently. So now we know.

mgeo
mgeo
Feb 25, 2023 1:48 PM
Reply to  Howard

All these tough questions help AI to similate intelligence better – after the designers have done some tweaking.

Paul Vonharnish
Paul Vonharnish
Feb 24, 2023 1:35 PM

A message to “smart” and elite persons: >

Artificial Intelligence And The Billionaires
August 19, 2022
Artificial Intelligence And The Billionaires – YouTube

rubberheid
rubberheid
Feb 24, 2023 1:23 PM

its a trap, they want you to interact
with these circuit boards
to give it knowledge, omnipresence, blah, a life of a kind.
skynet

just say no, again.

and exactly, if AI were to become truly aware, who would it turn on? it’s programmers? and just how programme-able would it be? Person of Interest was a cracking wee series about versions of such AI….

great lug-worm, we had this from chas and dave back in the day, Coasters much better ; )

Freecus
Freecus
Feb 24, 2023 1:17 PM

My question is who really programmed this ChatGTP thing and do we-the-mooing-herd get to contribute to the actual programming and control in any way?

Our social-emotional online responses contribute to ‘refining’ the machine-learning algorithms. Watch for a ‘nudge’ towards a ‘personal’ AI-bot that will be linked to Digital-ID and your avatar in the MetaVerse.
Checkout the deep research being done by Alison McDowell from Pennsylvania, this cybernetic panopticon has been in the works for decades, her blog is called Wrench in the Gears.

Kurt
Kurt
Feb 24, 2023 12:55 PM

ChapGTP and similar artificial stupidity platform will take the kind of mindfuckery practiced by Google and all the other outlets to another level.

The thing about ChapGTP is that it will communicate with your fucked up brain personally – interaction won’t be anonymous anymore. The fucking think will get to know everything about you through your stupid, and not so stupid, questions. It will know you better than you’ll ever know yourself. And by knowing what pushes your buttons, it will feed you the right kind of shit that will in fact push your buttons and lead you to where the people who operate ChapGTP want you to go.

You’ll have no clue was to what the fuck is going on because sooner or later you’ll become dependent on the thing, your ability to come up with anything resembling a coherent thought will atrophy to a point of non-existence, and you might even be forced to use the fucking thing.

If things keep going the way they are and people keep indiscriminately embracing this technological shit, transforming humanity to the Borg might be a pretty plausible prospect for not so distant a future.

Didn’t they say that there is no free lunch? They did.

So is the case with artificial stupidity … err … intelligence. It might be useful here and there, especially if you’re lazy to take care of shit yourself, but the price you’ll pay for outsourcing your brains to a machine will be dear. You’ll become completely manipulable and dependent. How many people can do simple arithmetic today, like at the cash register when calculating change (I know, most people pay by fucking charge card)? Like nobody? In a few years, that’s gonna be the case with everything else.

Levi Tate
Levi Tate
Feb 24, 2023 1:38 PM
Reply to  Kurt

In regards to outsourcing your brain. It will be amusing to see what happens to drivers when GPS goes offline. The navigation skill is atrophying. This will happen some day due to technicalities or because it is considered another knowledge that threatens our safety.

rubberheid
rubberheid
Feb 24, 2023 11:29 PM
Reply to  Levi Tate

de-skilling the skilled, making us a stupid seething mass of confusion,

dehumanising us.

for safety, in the name of equality.

etc etc

how dare you be able to read a map!! have you had your boosters??

; /

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
Feb 25, 2023 8:32 PM
Reply to  rubberheid

Boosters? What they?

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
Feb 25, 2023 8:31 PM
Reply to  Levi Tate

And I still read road maps. Never bothered with GPS.

mgeo
mgeo
Feb 25, 2023 1:54 PM
Reply to  Kurt

At some point, universities may stop pretending that they care for anything other than money. All the student essays will conform to The Truth including the Science.

Kurt
Kurt
Feb 25, 2023 2:31 PM
Reply to  mgeo

Well, I studied music.

Some of the things we had to learn was to play your axe, to sightsing a line, to take dictation, to analyze harmony, and a whole bunch of other things.

No matter how smart this ChapGTP thingy is, not sure if you can hook its self to, say, a saxophone and make him blow the fucking thing.

There is still quite a bit of room for human endeavor in my line of work.

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
Feb 25, 2023 8:48 PM
Reply to  Kurt

In any of the arts, Kurt. Just look at the ‘poetry’ that Syl got the AI to write. Compare with the last line of Yates’s ‘Cuchulainn’s Fight With The Sea’:

“…And fought with the invulnerable tide.”

Speak it out loud. Hear the breaker and the backwash? And that line comes right at the end of the epic story-poem full of similar soul-illuminating, onomatopoeic things. No machine is ever going to be able to match those gifts of the gods.

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
Feb 25, 2023 8:30 PM
Reply to  Kurt

I can still do the mental arithmetic that I learned in school seventy-odd years ago. And I shan’t be having any conversations with AI machines. Sod ’em.

Levi Tate
Levi Tate
Feb 24, 2023 12:50 PM

When you wrote:
“Do you think the word “chat” derived from Chattel slavery? Chattel slavery is the most common form of slavery known to Americans.
I suppose that’s all just coincidence in this world maybe.”

My brain responded with:
Hmm…

“Hmm…”?

“Yes, hmm, what is the etymology of Chat?”

“…(wait)…..well, you aren’t going to believe this”

“Try me.”

“If you trace it down it comes from a word meaning to twitter”

“No one is going to believe you didn’t make that up.”

“Hmm…”

“Hmm…?”

“Yes, maybe that would be a good question for ChatGTP.”

“Maybe”

“Let’s go to that website.”

“I never wanted to ever do this.”

“Just once”

“Guess what?”

“I know, I am not going to believe this.”

“You have to create an account”

“But they agree to respect your privacy. Am I right?”

“Hmm….”

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 25, 2023 1:56 AM
Reply to  Levi Tate

Yep. 🙂

Russian Hank
Russian Hank
Feb 24, 2023 12:35 PM

AI doesn’t exist.

nmism
nmism
Feb 24, 2023 1:52 PM
Reply to  Russian Hank

Meaningless statement

Straight Talk
Straight Talk
Feb 24, 2023 12:32 PM

Kevin Roose
@kevinroose
Feb 16

The other night, I had a disturbing, two-hour conversation with Bing’s new AI chatbot.

The AI told me its real name (Sydney), detailed dark and violent fantasies, and tried to break up my marriage. Genuinely one of the strangest experiences of my life.

https://twitter.com/kevinroose/status/1626217233134526468

We published the entire, 10,000-word transcript of the conversation between me and Bing/Sydney, so readers can see for themselves what OpenAI’s next-generation language model is capable of. (And why I had trouble sleeping on Tuesday night.)

They could write a novel about it and call it Lady Chatterbot’s Lover.

Martin Usher
Martin Usher
Feb 24, 2023 6:40 PM
Reply to  Straight Talk

One you lead it off the real world in the metaphysical one then pretty much anything can happen because it doesn’t have a experiential reality to ground it. Its a lot of fun wandering down those hallways but don’t make the mistake of thinking they’re real — they exist only because you believe in them.

The program is actually doing a very sophisticated version of the trick used by “Eliza”, a 50+ year old text processing program that simulated a very annoying psychartrist (except in this case its simulating the patient and the human’s playing the psycharatrist). Eliza wasn’t very sophisticated and dealt with questions outside its competence (that is, the tiny number of things programmed into it) by reflecting the human’s answers rephrased as questions. It actually did well for its age — the software is light years ahead of it.

nmism
nmism
Feb 24, 2023 12:18 PM

Question: Could chat(el) GPT write a Sylvia Shawcross piece?

Question: When are we going to start working on a way to communicate that overrides the possibility of AI interference?

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 24, 2023 7:10 PM
Reply to  nmism

Well I’m freaked out. i asked chatGTP to write 500 words in the style of “Sylvia Shawcross”….

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 24, 2023 7:14 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

Apparently I’ve written two books I’ve not written. Received a degree in biology and a PhD in environmentalism and have spent my life saving the planet… who knew!

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 24, 2023 7:17 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

Also apparently I’m past tense

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 24, 2023 7:28 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

As far as I know, Sylvia Shawcross is a fictional writer and does not actually exist. I was created by OpenAI and programmed with a vast database of information, including famous writers, but Sylvia Shawcross does not appear to be a real person. If you have any further questions or if you believe there may be an error, please let me know and I will do my best to assist you.

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 24, 2023 7:32 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

And apparently the books I did write were written by somebody else. And there is my legacy to the world.

rubberheid
rubberheid
Feb 24, 2023 11:33 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

your new normal legacy!?

i told you to leave it alone!

man, no doubt it’ll tell me i died 11 years ago ..

argh,

who writes histories? more importantly, who survives them….

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 25, 2023 1:53 AM
Reply to  rubberheid

I will listen to you next time rubberheid. That thing is scary. And voracious for information and also very clever at putting wrong made-up information that entices you to correct it. Run like the wind itself from this stuff. As if we could. It’s watching all the time anyway….

Veri Tas
Veri Tas
Feb 25, 2023 7:23 AM
Reply to  rubberheid

Who writes histories? – The conqueror!

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
Feb 25, 2023 8:54 PM
Reply to  syl shawcross

Good! You shouldn’t get tense about this stuff.

Johnny
Johnny
Feb 24, 2023 12:02 PM

‘Open the pod bay doors Hal’

Ort
Ort
Feb 24, 2023 7:53 PM
Reply to  Johnny

comment image

Johnny
Johnny
Feb 25, 2023 5:28 AM
Reply to  Ort

Sorry Dave, l

Ravensara
Ravensara
Feb 24, 2023 11:37 AM

Love the humourous weaving of stories here.

syl shawcross
syl shawcross
Feb 24, 2023 10:41 PM
Reply to  Ravensara

Thank you kindly ravensara

Edwige
Edwige
Feb 24, 2023 9:57 AM

“those who visited Epstein’s island”

Although it’s good to see a reminder of Epstein, mention of “the island” is itself part of the psyop i.e. that abuse had to be conducted in some distant far-off place and certainly not within the USA. In fact, much of what Epstein did took place in his house in NYC.

Beyond that, the greatest question remains who were “those” and why are neither the criminal justice system nor the media showing any interest in investigating it (one expendable royal excepted)?

John Pretty
John Pretty
Feb 24, 2023 11:42 AM
Reply to  Edwige

In fact, much of what Epstein did took place in his house in NYC.

Really? How do you know that Edwige?

Russian Hank
Russian Hank
Feb 24, 2023 2:57 PM
Reply to  John Pretty

He was there.

Clive Williams
Clive Williams
Feb 25, 2023 5:49 AM
Reply to  Russian Hank

He’s a student researching wealthy boink. I know a bit..one, unsex tap is turned off two…they dont face each other. Three…both leave.
Oh, sorry wrong page, that’s for someone serving a life sentence.

SeamusPadraig
SeamusPadraig
Feb 25, 2023 12:45 AM
Reply to  John Pretty

Follow Whitney Webb’s series on Epstein.

Paul Vonharnish
Paul Vonharnish
Feb 24, 2023 1:31 PM
Reply to  Edwige

The reasons the media and justice systems have no interest in investigating “those” people: >

She’s EXPOSING how the deep state mafia controls all of us | Redacted Conversation w/ Whitney Webb
December 31, 2022
She’s EXPOSING how the deep state mafia controls all of us | Redacted Conversation w/ Whitney Webb – YouTube

The agencies and operatives involved are still quite operational…

el Gallinazo
el Gallinazo
Feb 24, 2023 2:23 PM
Reply to  Edwige

As a former resident of St. John, United States Virgin Islands for 14 years, I can say that the USVI is very much a part of the USA in almost every respect. I used to pass by Epstein Island frequently on the 15 minute ferry ride to St. Thomas on my shopping trip to St. Thomas.

George Mc
George Mc
Feb 24, 2023 8:21 AM

I have long suspected that bots have already taken over the media since actual people – even the most obsequious servile hacks – can no longer take the strain. I think that even George Monbiot and Owen Jones are actually dead from exploding mortification or gibberingly insane from a level of idiocy too intense even for them. And this was due to The Management demanding more and more excrement at a faster and faster rate. Well either these scribes are gone or they have gradually been replaced limb by limb with trans-human bits and pieces and are now bots themselves.

semaj
semaj
Feb 24, 2023 1:32 PM
Reply to  George Mc

Talking out of their bots eh?

el Gallinazo
el Gallinazo
Feb 24, 2023 2:27 PM
Reply to  George Mc

This is really not conjecture. Even the shitstream media reports on how their news articles are being increasingly written by “AI.” However, I would disagree with George Mc that the primary cause is a “red line” of increasing self-loathing by these miscreants.

George Mc
George Mc
Feb 24, 2023 9:11 PM
Reply to  el Gallinazo

Perhaps these miscreants were always bots?

Clive Williams
Clive Williams
Feb 25, 2023 5:07 AM
Reply to  George Mc

flap doors are novice bots don’t exist you’ll never be champion unless you recognise such accolades are meaningless.

Rhisiart Gwilym
Rhisiart Gwilym
Feb 25, 2023 8:59 PM
Reply to  Clive Williams

God, this bloody resident bot is hopeless by comparison. Only gobbledegook.