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DISCUSS: Trump pulling US forces out of Syria?

Kit Knightly

Donald Trump, the elected President of the United States of America, is going to keep a campaign promise. Maybe.

Three years after winning office, largely on his “no more pointless wars” platform, Trump is going to pull (the totally illegal occupying) US forces out of Syria. He’s finally keeping his word. Maybe.

It is, frankly, a dark sign of the dystopian times in which we live that this is somehow considered a shock.

Of course, it’s probably not actually going to happen.

This is not the first time Trump has announced: “we’re pulling out of Syria”.

Last December, just before Christmas, Trump announced the US military was leaving Syria, nothing much ever came of it. Except for a fresh surge of “liberal” media pundits claiming this was evidence Donald was a Putin puppet.

That was his second attempt.

The first time, in April 2018, there was a “chemical weapons attack” within a week. America was “forced”, not only to stay, but to escalate the conflict by striking at Assad’s airfields.

Look out for another Syrian “war crime” to pull Trump back in before Halloween (maybe on Halloween, the US Deep State love theatricality).

Whether the US stay or go, the situation on the ground is unlikely to change. While the US can “officially” pull out of Syria, it has many other avenues open to continue its (pointless and bloody) campaign.

First, there’s Turkey. Already active in Northern Syria, and a member of NATO. The US Deep State can easily (attempt to) strike a deal with Erdogan where he carries on America’s fine legacy in the Middle East. If they have to hang the Kurds out to dry to do this, well that’s life.

However, Turkey are not necessarily to be trusted. They have their own agenda, and Erdogan has never forgiven the US for the attempted military coup in 2016 (which is pretty understandable when you think about it).

The Kremlin has made many overtures to Turkey, most recently with the sale of the S400 air defence system. Erdogan is obviously aware of his leverage, and will doubtless be playing both sides (although given how that ended for Yanukovych, he’d best be careful).

No, Turkey isn’t reliable enough, which just leaves the second option – Stay.

Not “stay” as in be US army personnel fighting for US interests under a US flag. That kind of direct, overt action makes up only a fraction of the USA’s military interventions since WWII.

No, there are other ways of staying.

They can stay as “advisors” to the Kurds, or Israel in the Golan, or Turkey. “Advisors” are great because they’re vague enough to be almost meaningless…but nevertheless, confirms there ARE US citizens on the ground. This means Iran/Syria/Russia have to be VERY careful. One dead American and all hell could break loose.

Alternatively, they can stay as “mercenaries”. Blackwatch or Dark Water or whatever cheesy name some PR focus group thought sounded cool. They’ll be “sub-contracted” to Israeli or Turkish “private security firms” or “rebel militias”. That’s a trick as old as the hills. It maintains plausible deniability.

Failing that, they’ll just bring ISIS back into the picture.

When the media or ex-generals or politicians say “The US pulling out could lead to a resurgence of ISIS” they’re not lying. They’re telling an absolute truth, but they’re talking about diverting funding and recruitment drives, nothing more.

It’s not a warning, it’s a threat.

ISIS, the leaderless, rudderless bad guys who rove the desert chanting “death to America” and yet somehow only ever end up killing Syrian soldiers. (Unless they hit the IDF by accident, in which case they apologise).

They carry on the fine tradition of “Islamic extremists” who suddenly turn up whenever America needs a proxy war.

One way or another, the Powers that Be are not done with Assad or Syria. Not for any strategic value anymore. At this point it’s just psychopathic bloody-mindedness. (Assad was meant to have been Gaddafi-ed by now).

With the US embedded so deeply in Syria, and the general powerlessness of the POTUS in terms of foreign policy, this move makes far more sense as a domestic stunt than anything else.

The Ukraine/Biden/impeachment mess is a lifeless piece of political theatre, unlikely to go anywhere, but it’s also a sticky talking point for Trump who needs a win to up his numbers.

Domestically, with 2020 looming, this is a pretty canny move.

First, it’s a fairly transparent effort to win back a lot of his anti-war libertarian voters who have probably become disillusioned with Trump in his three years of barely-altered status quo. Having promised to “drain the swamp” Trump has shown he’s more than happy to just live in it, with all the other snakes.

He needs to win back his “underdog rebel” tag, and this is a step that could do that.

It paints the line-up of democratic candidates into a corner – they can’t criticise the move without endorsing illegal interventions and handing Trump the anti-war position. But if they endorse it, they’ve likewise handed Trump the anti-war position. (Incidentally, prepare for Tulsi Gabbard to praise this move, only to be attacked as “soft on Trump” by her fellow democrats).

Joe Biden has already released a statement which pretty much sets-out what the establishment line will be on this, here.

Note there’s no question of aggression or war. No discussion of obeying international law or respecting Syria’s sovereignty. These are words American politicians barely understand. No, the key phrase is here is “abandoning our allies”.

It’s a sentiment echoed by peerless war-hawk Lindsey Graham in his tweets on the matter:

The media (and collected punditry) will likely play the “poor little Kurds” card a lot in the next few days.

How much, and how hard, will determine how much of a genuine threat to the establishment agenda this “withdrawal” really is.

Questions arise:

  • Will this change anything in Syria?
  • Will there be another chemical attack (or similar) which “forces” the US to remain after all?
  • Will there be a resurgence of ISIS?
  • Will Turkey step into the void?
  • How will Biden/Warren et al react?
  • Will Trump’s anti-war base be suckered a second time?

As always, discuss below.

Kit Knightly is co-editor of OffGuardian. The Guardian banned him from commenting. Twice. He used to write for fun, but now he's forced to out of a near-permanent sense of outrage.

Filed under: empire watch, latest, Syria, United States

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Kit Knightly is co-editor of OffGuardian. The Guardian banned him from commenting. Twice. He used to write for fun, but now he's forced to out of a near-permanent sense of outrage.

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George Meyers
George Meyers

If Trump wants to pull out, and feels it is best for the USA to do so, then he should pull out. If Congress wants him there, then they should give him a Declaration of War.

vexarb
vexarb

Mailman here. Syrian update by SyrPer analyst Canthama:
#302711

As the Turkish regime continue to invade Syria pushing US stooge SDF away from the border, developments show signs that this event was pre-planned backstage by some countries:

1) Russia-Iran-Turkey met few weeks back to talk about Idlib.
2) Last Monday US declares leaving the border and Turkey announce invasion.
3) Turkish regime and its National-Syrian-Army stooges (2/3 are hard core ISIS) start air & ground attacks into Syria.
4) US/Israel stooge SDF did not demand the civilians to leave the area until the first bombs dropped, major chaos and 1st civilian casualties.
5) After a day of battle, SDF is massively retreating from the largest cities.
6) Many dozen US forces seen leaving Syria to Iraq thru Semalka crossing.
7) US declared NFZ in NE corner of Syria to protect its soldiers during the massive retreat that is expected in the next few days.
8) US/Zio stooge SDC continues to demand the impossible, full autonomy, SDF as separate army from SAA, control of Raqqa, Hasaka and Qamishili.
9) Russia starts to approach the Syrian Gov and the Turkish regime.
10) UNSC today, called by the France, totally blocked by Russia and US, the Europeans understood they will have to deal with Erdogan themselves.
11) A few NATO countries (Finland, Norway, Holland…) havesaid stopped selling weapons to Turkey.
12) Erdogan said if EU do not change language from invasion to anti terrorist move, he will release millions of refugees to the EU.
13) Israel has announced it will send “humanitarian” help to its SDF stooges in Syria. Israel seems to caught off guard with Trump’s announcement and is now very concerned with the potential loss of SDF-occupied Syrian ground to hit the Syrian Government from, as well as loss of US-occupied Syrian ground to hit the Iraqi Peoples Mobilization Units from former US bases in Hasaka.
14) Many Arab regimes have condemned the Turkish attack (though they expelled Syria from the Arab League) but Qatar [broke with KSA] approved.

15) _Putin is right now flying to Riyadh_ about to land in few hours. KSA [Rothschild oil company] is a strong financial and weapon supporter of SDF. Without KSA’s money there is no “autonomous kurdish region” in Syria’s oil-rich NE. _This meeting is vital_ for to pass control of this occupied Syrian territory back to the Syrian Army, as the US forces withdraw from it.

16) Turkey and [Rothschild oil company] KSA in a hot proxy war at the moment re land grabbing in this oil-rich part of Syria. Besides land grabbing there is the deployment of millions of Syrian refugees from Turkey back to Syria land [which KSA’s Kurdish stooges do not want]. Putin will mediate this proxy war toward the objective to stop further funds from KSA to SDC.

17) Iran has played the role of “concern”, it holds the best connection with all Kurdish communities, it is seen as the possible deal broker, together with Putin’s plan traveling to KSA today.

18) Watch the M4 highway, this is supposed to be as far as the turkish regime should go.

There is only one clear solution for Syria’s KSA-friendly oil stooges: deal with the Syrian Gov urgently, now their hand is at its weakest, in few days it may have shrunk to zero leverage. The Syrian Gov is patient.

More to come.

[Canthama’s full, unedited version is on today’s SyrPer BTL #302711] https://www.syrianperspective.com/2019/09/mileikowski-netanyahu-desperate-for-any-diversion.html#comments

vexarb
vexarb

Composite news / review on NE Border situation. Among the contributors I recognise Syrian Girl, Sarah Abed and Britain’s very own Vanessa Beeley.

https://www.syrianperspective.com/2019/09/mileikowski-netanyahu-desperate-for-any-diversion.html#comments

Tom
Tom

Well done, Trump. A President with the guts to stand up to the US military and the dark forces backing the ‘Kurds’.

Ben Trovata
Ben Trovata

Yanukovych wasn’t covert.He wanted to have agreements both West & East,but the neocon U.S. foreign policy wouldn’t have it any way except their way,and demanded that Yanukovych pick a side!He did,& they didn’t like it!State Department shifted-up,and the putsch in Kiev (2014) went ahead as prepared.G. Pratt,V. Nuland,a friendly Dutch broadcasting crew,being already in place.

Seamus Padraig
Seamus Padraig

I just hope Trump is serious this time. As Kit noted, he’s promised to pull out of Syria before, only to renege once the deep state gets a hold of him. I wonder: is that what this sudden emergence of ‘Ukrainegate’ is really all about? Is it just an attempt to punish Trump for threatening a Syrian pull-out? Inquiring minds want to know …

vexarb
vexarb

from Marwa Osman @Marwa__Osman
·
Syrian President Bashar Assad warned the #SDF many times

“The US will not protect you
The US will not safeguard you in their hearts or their laps,
The US will put you in their pockets so as to become a bartering tool along with their dollars
If you will not prepare yourselves to defend your country then you will become slaves for the Ottomans,
No one will protect you except your country,
No one will defend you except the Syrian Arab Army.”

Dungroanin
Dungroanin

Of course its all over bar the clearing of the battlefields.

Of course there will be no further attacks on Syria by the US (unless on a piece of waste ground like before) – the defence would be efficient and any actual damage or death would be retaliated swiftly.

Of course Fukus is in full retreat having been given their ultimatum months ago.

Of course the proxy army will be abandoned – i bet many are uighars, who will be re-educated back in their homelands.

Of course peace and prosperity encompassing the EU and the EAEU will prevail and all the Natzo forces will head home like so many failed crusaders – grateful for the mercy of their would be victims.

And no there will be no first use of WMD out of spite.

Trump like Gandhi may never get a Nobel Peace Prize – but his reputation will last equally.

vexarb
vexarb

Did the Terror War on the Syrian Economy Succeed?
Uncle $cam’s weak point: too much money, too much worship of money, too much financial blackmail, too much belief in Mammon, too little belief in humanity.

“Syrians are proud people and have managed to build up their economy despite hardship, challenges, sanctions, and threats from all around, to reach self-sufficiency in almost all basics: food, medicine, housing, power, clothing, education, among others. These were provided for free or at incredibly low costs [by Syria’s Socialist govt], especially when comparing to neighboring countries. Lebanon, for instance, was importing Syrian electricity and produce, Jordan was importing electricity, receiving free drinking water after Israel dumped its sewers into the Jordan River, and importing massive quantities of bread and produce from Syria. The cost of living in either these two countries was 5 times more of that than in Syria.”

https://www.syrianews.cc/did-syrian-economy-survive-us-led-war-of-terror/

Wartime Syria under Socialist Pres.Bashar Assad reminds me of wartime Britain under Socialist Coalition-PM Clem Attlee: Britain fought a major war yet Britain’s health and nutrition increased — the only time in the History of War.

Looking forward to postwar Syria under Dr.Assad, a true Socialist, making as good a recovery as postwar Britain under Attlee. And when it comes to re-election I expect Syrian voters will show more sense than British voters showed in 1950 (or at any time since 1979).

Mucho
Mucho

You won’t be reading about that in the Guardian!

Haltonbrat
Haltonbrat

Even Private Eye is anti Assad.

mark
mark

That nauseating little turd Heslop spends his time being oh-so-daring by attacking anti establishment figures like Galloway. It isn’t a shadow of what it was under Cook. Just more Faux Left controlled opposition, like Democracy Now/ Counterpunch/ Guardian.

Ben Trovata
Ben Trovata

[Britain’s nutritional health under Socialist-Coalition] was a terrific bit of historiography,I’d never heard! Thanks for this.

vexarb
vexarb

Reader’s Digest Bumper Book of British History (or something like that). A postwar souvenir, I came across it recently in a house near Hendon.

BobMarsden
BobMarsden

Might the Syrian Air Force (perhaps with ‘help’) bomb the invading Turkish military, with locations and movements supplied by the Kurds on the ground?

Dungroanin
Dungroanin

Turkey has changed sides and will be out of the racist natzo empire.

Caltrop
Caltrop

Syria does not have a Rothschild owned Central Bank

Why do the Rothschild’s want their Central Bank in every nation and even go so far as to organise a war on the nations which do not submit to their demands.
Prof. Werner brilliantly explains how the banking system and financial sector really work.

BANK’S DON’T LEND MONEY – EXPLAINED – they are parasites tricking you and your nation out of the wealth you produce as promissed in the securities or promissory notes they are given. They are out to own the world.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EC0G7pY4wRE

“…………This author has made the claim again and again that Soviet Marxism has nothing to do with labour, ethics, production or philosophy. It was merely a means to transfer the wealth of labour to the overwhelmingly Jewish members of the Communist Party. Since the party planned all economic production from Moscow, it implies that the party therefore owned all productive capital. What resulted was the most exploitative economic system ever devised, and it was largely accomplished with investment capital from the west……………”

https://russia-insider.com/en/christianity/russian-church-exile-strongly-and-rightly-supported-hitlers-invasion-russia-amazing

vexarb
vexarb

Caltrop many thanks for Link to Prof.Werner’s brilliant explanation in plain colloquial English. I particularly liked 2 points, both of them related to the baleful Witch of Westminster:

1. The disappearance of Small Banks for Small Loans. My Abbey National mortgage disappeared into Santander. Interesting that Germany never gave up its small banks.
2. The debt bluff (bluff as in cliff) with personal debt soaring up a steep, from ground level (zero% of GDP) to 200% of GDP, according to his graph near the end.

Rightly was she named Maggie Snatcher.

Savorywill
Savorywill

I think fundamentally Trump doesn’t believe in American involvement in endless wars to change unfavorable governments. As a practical, basically non-ideological, person, he sees that they are counter-productive, though, on the plus side, they do give America a chance to exercise its military might. However, the fact American might never seems to prevail in ending these conflicts sort of contradicts the idea that American military might even makes any sense. How is it possible that the Taliban cannot be defeated even after 18 years of effort by, in Trump’s words, ‘the most powerful military, by far, in the world!’.

It is a serious juggling act to keep everyone happy, something even the best juggler in the world couldn’t do, much less an oafish sort of character like Trump. But, we can all be thankful that Hillary didn’t win, seeing her psychopathy in her gleeful statement about Gaddafi’s horrible murder, ‘We came, we saw, he died!!’, followed by that dreadful chortle (she must regret that interview!).

Caltrop
Caltrop

The Jewish Declaration of War
on Germany
.
The Economic Boycott of 1933

.
Few people know the facts about the singular event that helped spark what ultimately became known as World War II – the international Jewish declaration of war on Germany shortly after Adolf Hitler came to power and well before any official German government sanctions or reprisals against Jews were carried out. The March 24, 1933 issue of The Daily Express of London (shown above) described how Jewish leaders, in combination with powerful international Jewish financial interests, had launched a boycott of Germany for the express purpose of crippling her already precarious economy in the hope of bringing down the new Hitler regime. It was only then that Germany struck back in response. Thus, if truth be told, it was the worldwide Jewish leadership – not the Third Reich – that effectively fired the first shot in the Second World War. Prominent New York attorney Samuel Untermyer (above right) was one of the leading agitators in the war against Germany, describing the Jewish campaign as nothing less than a “holy war.”
.
http://www.wintersonnenwende.com/scriptorium/english/archives/articles/jdecwar.html

vexarb
vexarb

Caltrop, I read that headline from the Daily Express of that period but do not see how it squares with what I read of Rothschild’s (JPMorgan) previous loan negotiations with Hitler, nor the Jewish head of BoE transferring Czech gold to Hitler in 1938, nor Hitler having a Jewish banker, nor the BIS doing business with Nazi Germany across the Swiss border during WW2. Nor the huge financial and industrial transfers from the Anglo Zio Capitalist world to build up the war machine of Nazi Germany.

“By their fruits shall ye know them” — New Testament

Caltrop
Caltrop

Hitler and the Banksters: The Abolition of Interest-Servitude
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By Dr. Ingrid R. Zundel on September 13, 2011
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This article was written for mature and thoughtful people who want to understand today in light of yesterday. It was not written for baboons who start to howl the moment they hear “Hitler” – the way the monkeys of my youth used to howl in front of my window in South America when they heard a thunderclap.
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Its author is a relatively young South African banker by the name of Stephen Goodson. I have his permission to post it.
.
Here goes:
.
[START]…………………..
.
“……………………………..Shortly thereafter Hitler joined this party and received a provisional certificate of membership numbered seven. His first act on assuming control of the party was to rename it the Nationalsozialistiche Deutsche Arbeiterpartei (National Socialist German Workers Party).
.
Feder, who was the principal drafter of the party’s 25 points, became the architect and theoretician of the program (5) until his unfortunate dismissal as Secretary of State for Economic Affairs in August 1934.
.
Approximately 40 percent of Feder’s ”The Program of the NSDAP” is devoted to economic and financial policies. Below are some of the highlights.
.
Adolf Hitler prints its two main points in leaded type:
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“THE COMMON INTEREST BEFORE SELF-THE SPIRIT OF THE PROGRAM ABOLITION OF THE THRALLDOM OF INTEREST – THE CORE OF NATIONAL SOCIALISM.” “Once these two points are achieved, it means a victory of their approaching universalist ordering of society in the true state over the present-day separation of state, nation and economics under the corrupting influence of the individualist theory of society as now constructed. The sham state of today, oppressing the working classes and protecting the pirated gains of bankers and stock exchange speculators, is the area for reckless private enrichment and for the lowest political profiteering; it gives no thought to its people, and provides no high moral bond of union. The power of money, most ruthless of all powers, holds absolute control, and exercises corrupting, destroying influence on state, nation, society, morals, drama, literature and on all matters of morality, less easy to estimate.(6)
.
“Break down the thralldom of interest” is our war cry.(7) What do we mean by thralldom of interest? The landowner is under this thralldom, who has to raise loans to finance his farming operations, loans at such high interest as almost to eat up the results of his labor, or who is forced to make debts and to drag the mortgages after him like so much weight of lead.
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So is the worker, producing in shops and factories for a pittance, whilst the shareholder draws dividends and bonuses which he has not worked for. So is the earning middle class, whose work goes almost entirely to pay the interest on bank overdrafts.(8)
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Thralldom of interest is the real expression for the antagonisms, capital versus labor, blood versus money, creative work versus exploitation. The necessity of breaking this thralldom is of such vast importance for our nation and our race, that on it alone depends our nation’s hope of rising up from its shame and slavery; in fact, the hope of recovering happiness, prosperity and civilization throughout the world. It is the pivot on which everything turns; it is far more than a mere necessity of financial policy. Whilst its principles and consequences bite deep into political and economic life, it is a leading question for economic study, and thus affects every single individual and demands a decision from each one: Service to the nation or unlimited private enrichment. It means a solution of the Social Question.(9)
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Our financial principle: Finance shall exist for the benefit of the state; the financial magnates shall not form a state within the state. Hence our aim to break the thralldom of interest.
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Relief of the state, and hence of the nation, from its indebtedness to the great financial houses, which lend on interest.
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Nationalization of the Reichsbank and the issuing houses, which lend on interest.
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Provision of money for all great public objects (waterpower, railroads etc), not by means of loans, but by granting non-interest bearing state bonds or without using ready money.
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Introduction of a fixed standard of currency on a secured basis.
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Creation of a national bank of business development (currency reform) for granting non-interest bearing loans.
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Fundamental remodeling of the system of taxation on social-economic principles. Relief of the consumer from the burden of indirect taxation, and of the producer from crippling taxation (fiscal reform and relief from taxation).(10)
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Wanton printing of bank notes, without creating new values, means inflation. We all lived through it. But the correct conclusion is that an issue of non-interest bearing bonds by the state cannot produce inflation if new values are at the same time created.
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The fact that today great economic enterprises cannot be set on foot without recourse to loans is sheer lunacy. Here is where reasonable use of the state’s right to produce money which might produce most beneficial results.”(11)……………..”
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http://www.veteranstoday.com/2011/09/13/hitler-and-the-banksters-the-abolition-of-interest-servitude/

vexarb
vexarb

Caltrop, I thank you and my fellow South African, Stephen Goodson, for this interesting information. So it was Hitler himself who renamed his party as Socialist; and Feder who put forward some excellent Socialist principles, with which I fully agree. Pity that Hitler’s innate love of treachery induced him to dismiss Feder, and allow himself to be used by Anglo-French Capitalists as their “Bulwark against Communism”, and turn the German Army into a Capitalist battering ram for the takeover of East Europe and the invasion of Communist Russia. If Hitler had stuck to those Socialist principles which he “printed in Leaded Type” (above), and if he had sincerely joined Soviet Russia in the struggle against Capitalism, Hitler would have avoided the death of 4 Million Germans (including his own shameful end) and the world might have been a better place today.

“Who would the sword of Justice wear
Should be as holy as severe”. — Measure for Measure

Caltrop
Caltrop
Caltrop

Did Germany attack France and England?
.
By GPD on June 8, 2016
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The misinterpretation of not only Russian, but also world history by Russian liberals has broken all boundaries of reasonable. Not that long ago, a frequent guest at Echo of Moscow radio station, Konstantin Remchukov, posted a tweet about the lies of Joseph Stalin and the Pravda newspaper.
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“Stalin to Pravda editors, 11.30.1939: “It was not Germany that attacked France and England, but it was France and England that attacked Germany,” Remchukov tweeted.
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In his tweet, Mr. Remchukov puts emphasis on the extent of lies of both the Pravda newspaper and Joseph Stalin. It appears, though, that the question of lies in this case is nothing but a question of faith. Some believe in God, others believe in the transmigration of souls, and someone else – in liberal values.
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In order to understand this, shall we look into the WWII chronology (we understand here that a war becomes global when there are several countries participating in it.
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To start with, on 31 August, the German press reported: “… on Thursday, at about 8:00 p.m., the radio room in Gleiwitz was captured by Poles.”
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On September 1, at 4:45, the German battleship Schleswig-Holstein arrived in Danzig and opened fire on Polish fortifications on the Westerplatte.
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The Poles killed several thousands of Germans living in the city of Bromberg. The city was subsequently taken away from Germany and delivered to Poland under the Treaty of Versailles.
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Hitler, wearing a military uniform, made a speech at the Reichstag. To justify the invasion of Poland, Hitler referred to the incident in Gleiwitz. Hitler did not use the word “war” fearing that France and England might join the conflict as the two countries had previously given adequate guarantees to Poland. Hitler spoke about “active defense” against Polish aggression.
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The same day, Britain and France, under the threat of declaration of war, demanded the immediate withdrawal of German troops from Poland. Mussolini offered to convene a conference for the peaceful solution of the Polish crisis, but Hitler refused.
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On September 3 at 9:00 a.m., England declared war on Germany. The same day, at 12:20, France did the same along with Australia, India and New Zealand.
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On September 4, 24 bomber planes were downed during a British air raid on Wilhelmshaven.
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The US and Japan announced their neutrality on 5 September.
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On September 6, South Africa declared war on Germany.
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On September 7th, French troops crossed the border with Saar, thus attacking Germany.
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US ambassador to Britain Joseph Kennedy stated that France and Britain would have never made Poland the reason for a world war, if it was not for Washington’s incitement. Interestingly, Chamberlain’s notes from 1938-1939 (stored at the University of Manchester) are closed for access before 2037.
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The chronological events thus show the following: Germany triggered the war with Poland, but Poland was escalating the war as well having killed several thousands of Germans in Bromberg and Danzig.
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Hitler was trying to return the German territories that had been given to Poland in accordance with the Treaty of Versailles. Under the treaty, Poland received territories of the Russian empire as well: here is where the root causes of the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact lie.
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Did Stalin and the Pravda newspaper lie when they said that it was not Germany that attacked France and England, but vice versa?
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The raid of the British Air Force on Wilhelmshaven on September 4, 1939 and the French attack on Saar on September 7 – was it not an attack on Germany?
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Therefore, the notes from Mr. Remchukov, editor-in-chief of the Nezavisimaya Gazeta, show his poor knowledge of history.
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As we can see, history does repeat itself. Nowadays, we have Ukraine instead of Poland. In the Donbass, Ukraine is doing what the Poles did in Danzig and Bromberg. Similarly, Washington is pushing European countries to sanctions against Russia. Hitler is missing, but we can the Western media creating one from the image of the Russian president.
.
http://www.veteranstoday.com/2016/06/08/did-germany-attack-france-and-england/

Caltrop
Caltrop

Irving on Churchill

Dismantling Churchillian Mythology

“…..Hitler is still hoping that this madman in England will see reason or that he will be outvoted by his cabinet colleagues. So he’s not doing Churchill the favor of bombing any English towns. Churchill is frantic because he thinks he’s being outsmarted by Hitler. On July the 20th he sends for Sir Charles Portal, the Chief of Bomber Command, and he says to Sir Charles Portal, as we know from records from Command to the Air Ministry, “When is the earliest that you could launch a vicious air attack on Berlin?” Sir Charles Portal replies to Winston, “I’m afraid we can’t do it now, not until September because the nights aren’t long enough to fly from England to Berlin and back in the hours of darkness. September, perhaps, and in September we will have the first hundred of the new Sterling bombers …” But he also says, “I warn you, if you do that, the Germans will retaliate. At present they’re not bombing English targets, they’re not bombing civilian targets at all and you know why. And if you bomb Berlin, then Hitler will retaliate against English civilian targets.” And Churchill just twinkles when he gets this reply, because he knows what he wants.

We know what he wants because he’s told Joe Kennedy, the American Ambassador – Joseph P. Kennedy, father of the late President – “I want the Germans to start bombing London as early as possible because this will bring the Americans into the war when they see the Nazis’ frightfulness, and above all it will put an end to this awkward and inconvenient peace movement that’s afoot in my own Cabinet and among the British population.” I’ve opened Kennedy’s diary. I’ve also read Kennedy’s telegrams back to the State Department in Washington. They’re buried among the files. You can’t find them easily, but they are worth reading, and you see in detail what Churchill was telling him. What cynicism. Churchill deliberately provoking the bombing of his own capital in order to kill the peace movement. He’s been warned this would be the consequence, but he needs it. And still Hitler doesn’t do him the favour……”

http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v07/v07p498_Okeefe.html

http://www.renegadetribune.com/adolf-hitlers-struggle-peace/

Caltrop
Caltrop

ENGLAND INITIATED TERROR BOMBING

J.M Spaight, CB, CBE, Principal Secretary to the Air Ministry (RAF) conceded that “Hitler only undertook the bombing of British civilian targets reluctantly three months after the RAF had commenced bombing German civilian targets. Hitler would have been willing at any time to stop the slaughter. Hitler was genuinely anxious to reach with Britain an agreement confining the action of aircraft to battle zones.” (6)

The first breach of international law occurred very early on in England’s war against the German nation. As the noted jurist, F.J.P Veale surmised. “This raid on the night of May 11th 1940, although in itself trivial, was an epoch-marking event since it was the first deliberate breach of the fundamental rule of civilized warfare that hostilities must only be waged against the enemy’s combatant forces, Their flight marked the end of an epoch which had lasted for two and one-half centuries.” (7)

Again the first ‘area air attack’ of the war was carried out by 134 British bombers on the German city of Mannheim on the 16th December 1940. The object of this attack, as Air Chief Marshall Peirse later explained, was, ‘to concentrate the maximum amount of damage in the center of the town.'” (8).

http://www.whale.to/b/walsh1.html
.

vexarb
vexarb

Caltrop, thank you for all that interesting information, so rarely seen in Anglo-French circles. Especially the quote from David Irving, for whose knowledge of WW2 German-related sources I have great respect. I regard the unjust imprisonment of Irving for his research on the Nazi concentration camps a blot on European civilization. But this does not change the fact that Hitler abandoned National Socialism for National Racism, thereby making Nazi a dirty word, turning the German Army into a crazy Capitalist tool for the invasion of Soviet Russia, and thus leading himself and millions of Germans to disgrace, destruction and death.

And much as I admire Irving the meticulous sifter of historical documents, the man himself is a casual British racist of the type that was only too common before the war. Which is no reason to lock the man up for publishing non-Kosher results from scholarly research.

Antonym
Antonym

Too bad Churchill brought the Americans into WWII: the EU would be either NAZI or Soviet run -so much better than the present .
But the biggest boon for Irving & co: Israel would have never came into being. It would have been Islamic state no. xx. Jews would have been 100% eradicated from East + Western Europe and the ME.

mark
mark

No, they’d be sunning themselves and picking coconuts in sunny Madagascar.

mark
mark

Poland had a population of 35 million in 1939.
About 21 million Poles.
3 million Polish Jews who had a lot of discrimination.
1 million Germans.
10 million White Russians and Ukrainians in the eastern part of the country, seized from Russia in 1920. There were very few Poles there.
This is the territory re occupied by Stalin in 1939.
The Poles were prone to wild statements about invading Germany and seizing Berlin etc.

Caltrop
Caltrop

How Hitler defied the bankers

Article from: http ://www. wakeupfromyourslumber. com/node/6720

Many people take joy in saying Wall Street and Jewish bankers “financed Hitler.” There
is plenty of documented evidence that Wall Street and Jewish bankers did indeed help
finance Hitler at first, partly because it allowed the bankers to get rich (as I will describe
below) and partly in order to control Stalin. However, when Germany broke free from the
bankers, the bankers declared a world war against Germany.

When we look at all the facts, the charge that “Jews financed Hitler” becomes irrelevant.
Los Angeles Attorney Ellen Brown discusses this topic in her book Web Of Debt. . .

When Hitler came to power, Germany was hopelessly broke. The Treaty of Versailles
had imposed crushing reparations on the German people, demanding that Germans repay
every nation’s costs of the war. These costs totaled three times the value of all the
property in Germany. …………………..”

https://archive.org/stream/HowHitlerDefiedTheInternationalBankers/HowHitlerDefiedTheBankers_djvu.txt

Carmpat
Carmpat

Wasn’t the discussion about Trump pulling forces out of northern Syria…. Does Caltrop the Hitler sympathiser ever think about anything else but his/her anti-semiti rants?

Savorywill
Savorywill

Yes, I understand that it is off topic, but it is interesting to think about WWII from a different perspective. Actually, it seems to me (especially from watching the information videos by James Corbett about WWI) that WWII was very well just an extension of WWI, something Hitler probably didn’t want at all, but was forced into it. I suspect that he wanted to reunite Germany and bring all the disparate parts back together again, something all Germans probably wanted, but the powers that orchestrated WWI wanted a reprise. It all sounds very nefarious, but perhaps it was as bad as that!

Carmpat
Carmpat

If it’s a question of thinking “about WWII from a different perspective” and that perspective is James Corbett’s, well… thanks but no thanks.

different frank
different frank

It collapsed because the Zionists opposed it.

Carmpat
Carmpat

This is a link to something out of The Barnes Review – a virulent anti-semitic website and denier of the Holocaust. Why are these commentators even given space?

Seamus Padraig
Seamus Padraig

Why do you assume the Pentagon wants these conflicts to end? The longer they last, the longer the Pentagon has an excuse to stay. Afghanistan, for example, is in a strategic location: nestled between Iran, Pakistan, China and the Central Asian ‘Stans’. It’s the perfect entry point onto the Eurasian chessboard.

wardropper
wardropper

It would be typical Washington “shrewdness” to facilitate pulling out of Syria, then let Turkey do its worst against the Kurds (and Turkey’s worst is very bad…) until pictures start emerging of Turkey going over the top and tremendous western outrage ensues.
When that outrage is passionate enough, the US will move right back into Syria, quite oblivious of the fact that Syria and its national leaders don’t want it there, and Erdogan might even find himself in a similar position to Hussein and Gadhafi – on the receiving end of the fact that Washington has got bored with him…
Today’s USA is an utter farce.
At least with a poisonous snake you know that it is an actual snake, and give it all due respect as such.
But the USA’s foreign policy pretends to be something which it is not: A paragon of virtue; when it is, in fact, just another poisonous snake.

George Cornell
George Cornell

But a very big farcical venomous snake. It may start to collapse from within. The cracks in their system are getting larger. They hate each other in a way which is hopeful.

Caltrop
Caltrop

The Protocols of Zion

Notes II – The Symbolic Snake of Judaism.
Protocol III opens with a reference to the Symbolic Snake of Judaism. In his Epilogue to the 1905 Edition of the Protocols, Nilus gives the following interesting account of this symbol:

“According to the records of secret Jewish Zionism, Solomon and other Jewish learned men already, in 929 B.C., thought out a scheme in theory for a peaceful conquest of the whole universe by Zion. As history developed, this scheme was worked out in detail and completed by men who were subsequently initiated in this question. These learned men decided by peaceful means to conquer the world for Zion with the slyness of the Symbolic Snake, whose head was to represent those who have been initiated into the plans of the Jewish administration, and the body of the Snake to represent the Jewish people – the administration was always kept secret, EVEN FROM THE JEWISH NATION ITSELF. As this Snake penetrated into the hearts of the nations which it encountered it undermined and devoured all the non-Jewish power of these States. It is foretold that the Snake has still to finish its work, strictly adhering to the designed plan, until the course which it has to run is closed by the return of its head to Zion and until, by this means, the Snake has completed its round of Europe and has encircled it – and until, by dint of enchaining Europe, it has encompassed the whole world. This it is to accomplish by using every endeavor to subdue the other countriesby an ECONOMICAL CONQUEST. The return of the head of the Snake to Zion can only be accomplished after the power of all the Sovereign of Europe has been laid low, that is to say, when by means of economic crises and wholesale destruction effected everywhere, there shall have been brought about a spiritual demoralization and a moral corruption, chiefly with the assistance of Jewish women masquerading as French, Italians, etc.. These are the surest spreaders of licentiousness into the lives of the leading men at the heads of nations. A map of the course of the Symbolic Snake is shown as follows: – Its first stage in Europe was in 429 B.C. in Greece, where, about the time of Pericles, the Snake first started eating into the power of that country. The second stage was in Rome in the time of Augustus, about 69 B.C.. The third in Madrid in the time of Charles V, in A.D. 1552. The fourth in Paris about 1790, in the time of Louis XVI. The fifth in London from 1814 onwards (after the downfall of Napoleon). The sixth in Berlin in 1871 after the Franco-Prussian war. The seventh in St. Petersburg, over which is drawn the head of the Snake under the date of 1881. [This “Snake” is now being drawn through the Americas and in the United States of America, it is been partially identified as the “Counsel on Foreign Relations” (C.F.R.) and the “Tri-Lateral Commission”]. All these States which the Snake traversed have had the foundations of their constitutions shaken, Germany, with its apparent power, forming no exception to the rule. In economic conditions, England and Germany are spared, but only till the conquest of Russia is accomplished by the Snake, on which at present [i.e., 1905] all its efforts are concentrated. The further course of the Snake is not shown on this map, but arrows indicate its next movement towards Moscow, Kieft and Odessa. It is now well known to us to what extent the latter cities form the centuries of the militant Jewish race. Constantinople is shown as the last stage of the Snake’s course before it reaches Jerusalem. (This map was drawn years before the occurrence of the “Young Turk” – i.e., Jewish – Revolution in Turkey). den.

vexarb
vexarb

Caltrop, since you take the Protocols seriously (which I do not) I consulted WikiPedia:

“Sergei Aleksandrovich Nilus b. 1862 in Moscow – 14 January 1929 was a Russian religious writer and self-described mystic. He was responsible for publishing for the first time “in full” The Protocols of the Elders of Zion in Russia in 1905. It appeared as the final chapter of his book (The Great within the Small and Antichrist. Notes of an Orthodox Believer).”

So let’s compare what he predicted ca.1905-1929 to what we know today:

“As this Snake penetrated into the hearts of the nations which it encountered it undermined and devoured all the non-Jewish power of these States. It is foretold that the Snake has still to finish its work until it has encompassed the whole world. This it is to accomplish by using every endeavor to subdue the other countries by an ECONOMICAL CONQUEST.”

I would say that the Snake has made considerable progress toward Economic Conquest since 1905 but has a long way to go before it encircles the world to make Jewish power completely undermine Gentile power. Most world Leaders are Gentiles, and there are only three ways in which Gentiles can be persuaded to support the undermining of their own nation: bribery (as in the case of BLiar, the Clintons and Trump) or religious mania (Bush, BLiar and Trump via his daughter) or financial blackmail via a run on the currency (U$ Pres.Wilson, RSA Pres.deKlerk). But these tactics have become so obvious that Gentiles could easily stop them by Law. However, replacing Jewish Capitalists by Gentile Capitalists will not alter the self-destructive tendencies of Capitalism. The criminals Bush, Cheney, Blair, Brown, Cameron, Sarkozy, Kennedy, Clinton, Trump are all Gentiles: either already rich or “intensely relaxed about becoming filthy rich”.

The Protocols – though they contain some fact — are typical Anti-Jewish propaganda, the sort I read in Dostoievsky’s Journal and in other European writers before WW2 revealed the real horror of that sort of prejudice.

mark
mark

The Protocols are true in the sense that Shakespeare’s plays or 1984 are true.
None of these represent actual historical events.
There were no actual historical figures like Romeo, Juliet, Prospero, Caliban, Winston Smith, or Big Brother.
But the authors create a world from their own imagination to explore different issues and reveal a greater truth.
Like 1984, The Protocols are a warning, showing us a dystopian future which is on the cards if we do not work to prevent it.

Caltrop
Caltrop

Without researching the others, Trump and Cameron are definitely Jews.

The Protocols
.
But, what are the facts?
.
“We rejoice to learn that on May 14, 1935, the Cantonal Court of Berne, Switzerland, openly denounced the so-called ‘Protocols of the Elders of Zion’ as forgeries, obvious plagiarism, immoral, and manifestly prepared for the purpose of inciting popular passion against the Jews”. Thus said the “New York Evening Post”, May 14, 1935.
.
SILENCE FOR FACTS
.
This has been repeated endlessly ever since.
.
BUT when the Swiss Court of Appeals on Nov. 1, 1937 not only acquitted the principal defendant, Sylvio Schnell, and assessed the entire cost of the trial, 30,000 francs, against the state and reversed the verdict, Jewry kept SILENCE! The decision cited the fact that the Marxist-Judge Meyer had heard not one witness for the defense; had kept no Court record of the proceedings; and detailed other irregularities of the trial.
.
The defendants had been arrested on complaint of the Federation of Jewish Communities of Switzerland on the charge that they had violated Article 14 of the Swiss law against distributing obscene literature, at a public meeting – the Protocols. The Appeals Court ruled that the “experts” for the Jews, C. A. Loosi and Prof. A. Baumgarten, appointed by Judge Meyer, not only were biased on the Jewish question, but, moreover, the authenticity of the Protocols had no bearing on the case since they are of a political nature and do not belong in the category of obscene literature.
.
The Appeals Court also denounced “the prejudice and gross irregularities” which had been committed in the trial. Not a single one of the 40 witnesses for the defense had been permitted to testify, while all sixteen of the witnesses for the Jewish Community which brought the suit had been heard. . .”
.
“The proceedings were accordingly carried on solely upon the testimony of the Jewish plaintiffs. And further, although Swiss law demands that in the case of every law suit, shorthand minutes of the proceedings be taken by an official of the court, the Judge did not adhere to this condition, but permitted the Jewish plaintiffs to appoint two private stenographers to keep the register of the official proceedings during the hearing of their own witnesses. As, therefore, no legal record of the proceedings was kept, it follows that the whole procedure, and the verdict itself, are both null and void”.
.
One is tempted to say the same for the pompous “Report of the Senate Committee (Benny Mandel’s) concerning the Protocols”. [END]
.
http://www.iahushua.com/BeWise/dilling.html
.
http://www.takeourworldback.com/protocolsconfirmed.htm
.
Validity of “The Protocols”
A Huge Compendium of Arguments
by Willie Martin
.
http://www.jewwatch.com/jew-references-protocols-answering-critics.html

Caltrop
Caltrop

All Roads Lead To Tel Aviv.

Sharon to Peres: We Control America

https://www.mediamonitors.net/sharon-to-peres-we-control-america/

Jerry Alatalo

The last time Donald Trump fooled the world into believing “We’re leaving Syria!” was on December 19, 2018, – within 24 hours of a United Nations (December 20, 2018) meeting outlining the horrific mercenary terrorist-supportive crimes of the White Helmets.

nottheonly1
nottheonly1

Fully aware that this is a sentiment shared by many here, I like to refer to an interview with Cindy Sheehan on MintPress in which the core message is to end the unlimited spending of the war machine. The accompanying movement ‘Rage Against The War Machine‘ will kick off on October 11th, 2019.
(From MintPress)

In another revealing confirmation, the U.S. regime is already trying to back-pedal on the troop withdrawal, that has been nothing else but a removal of 50 (!) troops from the immediate area of the announced Turkey incursion.
(From MadhouseNews)

Last but not least, Kurdish forces might just do what some of us hinted at earlier. PressTV reports on Kurdish forces considering joining with Syrian forces to counter the announced Turkish incursion. The question is now, what will become of the fake troop withdrawal by illegally present U.S. regime forces?

RobG

None of this really matters, because we’re looking at a USUKIS empire that is rapidly collapsing before our eyes, with the China – Russia axis coming to the forefront.

The only real question is if USUKIS will start using unprovoked nuclear weapon attacks as they sink below the waves.

Believe me, these people are mad enough to use nuclear weapons.

George Cornell
George Cornell

They are the only ones who have. I do think there is good from within but how to unlock it?

vexarb
vexarb

@RobG: “these people are mad enough to use nuclear weapons.”

Until they learn the other side have those as well.

Have you seen the new Russian hypersonic missiles? Nothing in the U$ can touch them.

And the small fry — Israel, UK, France — can no longer count on a Houthi or some other fuzzy wuzzy woggy not going to the souk and buying a bargain surplus nuclear warhead for his cheap homemade missile.

MASTER OF UNIVE
MASTER OF UNIVE

The Duck changes the page every day in order to maintain attention. If anyone detracts from his attention getting he interlopes into their topical subject matter as well.

Vote Trump for prison.

Lock him up!

MOU

wardropper
wardropper

He may be an attention-craving buffoon, but in fact he is a distraction.
It’s very easy to forget, or ignore, all sorts of important things while he flits around, wondering what game-changing cosmic thoughts might enter his head during the next hour or two.

MASTER OF UNIVE
MASTER OF UNIVE

The Duck has no game changing ideas or thoughts in his atrophied dementia riddled central nervous system. He wants a wall & Greenland plus more attention. What he needs is a rubber room & medication.

MOU

Seamus Padraig
Seamus Padraig

All of Washington needs a rubber room & medication.

Tutisicecream

The problems the US has is the price of oil. They’ve given up on controlling the flow, but in order to push the price higher they need further conflict. War is off the menu until after the election of the next president. The flip from Russia to Ukraine indicates a foreign policy on flux – with lots of loose cards in play.

But hey what about Trump’s shock and daw??

Well the Guys and Gals at the Graun are spinning in ever decreasing circles about whether it’s the weather or war. In this conundrum we have an unanswered pitch. What is causing devastation of the planet? Normal human activity or war? so you might think more of the latter might be advisable.

Answers on a postcard or a more surveillance friendly tweet to Cathy Viner the Head Hitter in Chief of the Gaslighter.

Peter
Peter

Well the Guys and Gals at the Graun are spinning in ever decreasing circles about whether it’s the weather or war. In this conundrum we have an unanswered pitch. What is causing devastation of the planet? Normal human activity or war? so you might think more of the latter might be advisable.

I suppose it as nothing to do with the worlds population going from 4 billion to 9 billion. They all want energy CO2 they all want meat CO2 + Methane. They all want drinking water Food energy + water = a lot of P##s + Crap do i need to go on.

The west as done its bit it’s cut both population growth and emissions, its now down to the developing world. Or it will be up to nature to sort things out and it won’t be pretty.

vexarb
vexarb

Mailman here. From Pat Buchanan, the first I have read that source; it justifies his high reputation among Truthers:

https://buchanan.org/blog/is-trump-at-last-ending-our-endless-wars-137583

Seamus Padraig
Seamus Padraig

Unless he’s changed his tune recently, Uncle Buck is no Truther.