231

Lockdown Regime Deaths: The True Cost of LOKIN-20

Iain Davis

The Lockdown regime, ushered in by the UK government on March 23rd and enacted into Law on March 25th, appears to have led to the premature deaths of tens of thousands of people in the UK. In my previous post LOKIN-20 The Lockdown Regime Causes Increasing Health Concerns we discussed the likelihood that the Lockdown would cause significant excess mortality.

With the release of the latest report on non COVID 19 related deaths from the Office of National Statistics we can now start to see the scale of those deaths.

The ONS reveal that between March 7th and May 1st (ONS Week 11–18) there were 46,380 excess death, over and above the statistical 5 year average, registered in England and Wales. Figures for Scotland and Northern Ireland are not included.

Of the 46,380 excess deaths 12,900 (27.8% of additional excess deaths) were not attributable to COVID 19. This suggests that 33,480 (72.2% of additional excess deaths) were attributable to COVID 19.

However, as we discussed in COVID 19 is a Statistical Nonsense it is by no means clear how many of those deaths were as a direct or even indirect result of COVID 19. The problem is that the UK State has created a system for registering COVID 19 deaths which is unusually vague, for the UK, and wide open both to error and misinterpretation.

All nations have their own registration processes and data collection systems, but the situation in the UK is not dissimilar to that in Italy. The Italian government imposed their severe lockdown on March 9th.

On March 20th, as significant numbers of assumed COVID 19 deaths mounted, Italy’s National Institute of Health (ISS) issued a report into the characteristics of the decedents.

Citing the research, which found no clear COVID 19 cause of death in 88% of deaths attributed to coronavirus, the scientific adviser to Italy’s minister of health, Professor Walter Ricciardi, said:

The way in which we code deaths in our country is very generous in the sense that all the people who die in hospitals with the coronavirus are deemed to be dying of the coronavirus……On re-evaluation by the National Institute of Health, only 12 per cent of death certificates have shown a direct causality from coronavirus.”

We might consider this in light of the statement made by Professor Ricciardi’s UK counterpart. Speaking on April 16th the UK’s Chief Scientific Officer, Sir Patrick Vallance, stated:

It is worth remembering again that the ONS rates are people who’ve got COVID on their death certificates. It doesn’t mean they were necessarily infected because many of them haven’t been tested. So we just need to understand the difference.”

The UK State instructed the ONS to record any and all mentions of COVID 19 on the death certificate (MCCD) as COVID 19 mortality. Furthermore, the ONS were told to accept suggested COVID 19 mortality figures from the Care Quality Commission (CQC) even if COVID 19 was not mentioned on the MCCD.

This has left the collection and reporting of COVID 19 mortality in England and Wales in total disarray. Certainly the MSM’s reporting of those statistics, which has overwhelmingly been in support of the Lockdown regime, is as close to meaningless as it is possible to get without simply making them up.

Between March 7th and May 1st figures from the CQC played no part in the ONS mortality analysis. The CQC didn’t start submitting their data to the ONS until April 29th. I mention it here, not only to highlight how absurd the COVID 19 mortality statistics have become, but also because CQC figures will be important as we attempt to assess the true scale of LOKIN-20 deaths in the UK.

Undiagnosed COVID 19

The ONS state:

It is possible that symptoms may not be apparent or that COVID-19 could be mistaken for illnesses with similar symptoms. Some death certificates state that more information will be provided later, and some of these have since been updated to mention COVID-19. This supports the theory that COVID-19 is under-diagnosed at present on death certificates.”

This is an illogical statement from the ONS. It does not support their claim that COVID 19 has been under-diagnosed.

If symptoms are not apparent there is no reason to suspect that COVID19 was the cause of death. Presumably, nor were there any symptoms of rabies or malaria. You wouldn’t suspect they were a cause of death either, though you might if you followed ONS logic.

The ONS doesn’t tell us why MCCD’s have been updated later to mention COVID 19. Nor do we know how many of the non-COVID19 deaths were later changed to COVID 19 deaths. The most reasonable explanation for this change is that the decedent passed away before test results were available or where a subsequent case note reviews indicated the presence of COVID19. We will discuss positive test results later, but suffice to say they are a reason to reduce not increase claimed COVID19 mortality.

As previously discussed a case note review is by no means a reliable way to identify COVID 19. Not least of all for the fact that that the reviewing doctor may have never met the decedent. Elsewhere, in their report, the ONS state:

It is possible the conditions ‘other acute lower respiratory infections’ and ‘influenza and pneumonia’ could exhibit similar symptoms to COVID-19 and therefore be mistakenly recorded in place of COVID-19….it is possible that symptoms may not be apparent or that COVID-19 could be mistaken for illnesses with similar symptoms…”

This is an astute observation from the ONS. The symptoms of influenza, pneumonia and other acute respiratory infections are virtually indistinguishable from the most dangerous respiratory symptoms of COVID 19. While the ONS seem intent to suggest this means COVID 19 has been under-diagnosed, considerable over-diagnosis is far more plausible.

Prof Karol Sikora, former director of the World Health Organisation (WHO) cancer program, highlighted this concern recently. He stated that doctors appeared to be putting COVID 19 on to MCCD’s injudiciously with “any hint” of it’s presence being sufficient to record it as cause of death. While he estimated that approximately half of the ONS reported COVID 19 deaths were attributable to COVID 19, it is perhaps a little unfair to blame the medical profession for this potentially excessive misdiagnosis.

Following the Coronavirus Act, the State, the NHS, the Royal College of Pathology and the ONS were among the many influential institutions who were compelled by the legislation to issue COVID 19 guidance to MCCD signing medical professionals. It practically guaranteed attribution of COVID 19 mortality on the flimsiest of evidence. For example, the ONS stated:

If before death the patient had symptoms typical of COVID 19 infection…it would be satisfactory to give ‘COVID-19’ as the cause of death.”

As the ONS acknowledges, these symptoms could have been caused by a range of respiratory illnesses. The obvious consequence of the guidance they issued is over, not under, diagnosis of COVID 19. Doctors have to follow policy like anyone else. They are not to blame for this problem. State legislators and policymakers are.

Seeing as COVID 19 is supposed to be a pandemic, if under diagnosis is an issue, we should see an unseasonable increase in pneumonia deaths within the non COVID19 mortality figures. Flu, COVID 19 and other similar respiratory illness often resolve as pneumonia in end stage palliative care.

Yet the ONS contradict this notion in their own report:

It unlikely that symptoms of COVID-19 have been mistaken for pneumonia since Week 14 (week ending 3 April 2020). It is possible this contributed to non-COVID-19 excess deaths observed before that time.”

The ONS report that the numbers of non COVID 19 deaths have been recalculated in order to provide the most up to date figures. The stated 12,900 figure is not evident in their released data sets for the Week 11–18 period.

There were no non COVID 19 excess death initially reported in week 11. It appears, of the additional 2,061 deaths added later, 220 were eventually noted in week 11. We will focus on the initial released data sets here.

Between Week 12 to Week 18 there were 10,839 additional non COVID 19 deaths originally reported. Of these 421 (3.9%) occurred before Week 14. With misdiagnosed pneumonia being an unlikely reason for more than 96% of the reported non COVID 19 deaths, we must ask why the ONS would bother to suggest this may account for them.

Clearly, according to their own reported data analysis, it doesn’t. There is no basis for them to make such a claim.

[Click to enlarge]

ONS Strawmen

This theme of under diagnosed COVID 19 persist throughout their report without justification. The ONS note the significant increase in deaths from a range of conditions, recording significant spikes in deaths from asthma and diabetes within the non-COVID19 mortality statistics. While they acknowledge that delayed care could be the cause, they also persist with their pet notion that COVID19 still might account for these deaths.

This could indicate that some people suffering from these conditions are not receiving care fast enough to prevent death occurring. It is also plausible that some of these deaths are because undiagnosed COVID-19 had exacerbated the pre-existing condition.”

For some reason the ONS also make a couple of strawman arguments to try to explain the non COVID 19 mortality. The first is reduced hospital capacity.

During the Lockdown regime hospital capacity increased. There was no reduction. While the ONS recognise that deaths have increasingly occurred at home and in care settings, rather than hospitals, their rationale to explain this seems odd.

They state both that the NHS has been adapted to deal with COVID 19 cases and that healthcare for non-COVID19 illness may have been reduced which may have increased mortality. With regard to reduced access to hospital treatment, the ONS state:

[This] could indicate that people who are very ill with these conditions are remaining at home when previously they may have been admitted to hospital or a hospice for near end-of-life care.”

This is true. However, their report is supposed to be an analysis of the 12,900 additional excess deaths that occurred in a 7 week period in England and Wales. Not only have the ONS framed this within the context of strawman argument, they appear to be suggesting that patients not being treated in hospital just happened. People simply remained at home, as if this were their choice.

ONS statistics – Graphics from Christopher Bowyer [click to enlarge]

If that analysis seems odd, the ONS strawman explanation of death registration changes is downright bizarre. The argument they present is that the Coronavirus Act improved the efficiency of the registration process.

The ONS are in the business of reporting mortality statistics. For them, an improvement in the speed of the registration process is one measure of improved efficiency. However, if those registered death certificates provide increasingly meaningless causes of death, haste has significantly reduced efficiency.

Deaths are referred to coroners where the cause of death is not clear. This reduces the speed of registration but also improves accuracy, from a statistical perspective. The Coronavirus Act 2020 more or less ruled out any referral to a coroner. The UK’s chief coroner issued the following advice to coroners:

The aim of the system should be that every death from COVID-19 which does not in law require referral to the coroner should be dealt with via the MCCD process.”

Doctors were instructed to assume symptoms of respiratory illness indicated COVID 19. If they were uncertain, referral to a coroner was certainly a waste of time and the Coronavirus Act removed access to the second opinion of a Medical Examiner.

For some unfathomable reason, the ONS appear to agree that COVID 19 is a uniquely clear cause of death. Despite the fact that they recognise COVID 19 symptoms are more or less the same as those of numerous other infections, a diagnosis of COVID 19 somehow removes any doubt. The Coronavirus Act has made sure of this and the ONS believe this is more efficient:

This would increase efficiency in registering cases that would have typically gone to inquest.”

Troubling inquests and corroborating medical opinions, to ensure the stated cause of death is accurate, are unnecessary for all COVID 19 deaths. Though what this has to do with non-COVID19 deaths is anyone’s guess. Not much, according to the ONS, who state:

This suggests that despite observing efficiency improvements in registrations, these improvements themselves are unlikely to be driving much of the increase in death registrations observed in recent weeks.”

Not only does this raise significant concerns about the accuracy of the ONS reported statistics, it begs the question why they felt the need to include a suggested explanation, in their written analysis of non COVID 19 deaths, if they had already ruled it out. This appears to have been included to promote the idea that the Coronavirus Act improved registration efficiency.

Yet, within their own report, the ONS provide more than sufficient reason to seriously question that claimed efficiency gain. The Coronavirus Act reduced the accuracy and reliability of mortality statistics in England and Wales. That this doesn’t seem to matter to the ONS is worrying.

Evidence of Lockdown Regime Deaths

It is apparent that the Lockdown regime has caused significant loss of life. There is no doubt that delayed treatment for serious conditions increases the mortality risk considerably.

At the time of writing (10/06/2020) COVID 19 is said to have affected 0.4% of the UK populations and 0.06% have reportedly died as a result.

Cancer alone kills 0.24% of the population every year in the UK. Even if you accept that all claimed deaths from COVID 19 were as a result of the syndrome, cancer kills at least four times as many people.

In 2018 541,589 people died in England and Wales. This represents 0.92% of the population which means approximately 0.15% of the population die every two months. The top 5 leading causes of death account for more than 40% of those deaths.

On average these five causes kill 0.37% of the population every year, equating to approximately 0.06% every two months. Roughly the same figure as reported COVID 19 deaths. Yet for these people, during the Lockdown regime, treatment and essential screening has effectively been withheld.

During the same period hospital bed occupancy has been at an all time low. Additional capacity was added in the form of the various Nightingale hospitals, though these have not been required to treat COVID 19 patents.

During the Lockdown regime, cancer screening and treatment was put on hold. Cancer Research UK estimate that 290,000 people have missed cancer follow ups, indicating that around 20,000 current cancer sufferers, who would otherwise have been detected, remain without a diagnosis in the UK. They state that 2.1 million people have missed screening appointment, potentially at the cost of another 3,800 lives. The impact upon cancer survival rates alone has been devastating.

In London the mean ambulance response time increased by 43 minutes. Nationally the average ambulance response times for the most serious category 1 emergencies rose to 8 minutes 7 seconds, 1 minute and 7 seconds above the recommended maximum.

Jason Oke from the Nuffield Department of Primary Care Health Sciences at the Oxford University reported that in May both general A&E presentations and those for heart attacks were down by half. Cardiovascular disease kills nearly 170,000 people every year in the UK. With an average mortality of 460 deaths per day, a 50% drop in presentations, over the nearly three months long Lockdown regime period, has and will significantly increase mortality from cardiovascular disease.

Crucial surgery and diagnostic tests, for a range of other serious conditions, have been delayed in huge numbers. As the NHS confederation warns that waiting lists will exceed 10 million, the mainstream media insist that you believe this is due to coronavirus.

The best you can say about this claim is that it is doubtful. We should not discard the possibility that it is intentionally deceptive.

With more than enough capacity to treat both the seriously ill non-COVID19 and COVID19 patients, there is no doubt that the Lockdown regime has resulted in the unnecessary deaths of at least 12,900 people. Unfortunately, further analysis of the COVID19 statistics suggests the figure is much higher.

ONS statistics – Graphics from Christopher Bowyer

The Real Scale of LOKIN 20 Mortality.

If the unnecessary delay and denial of healthcare were an identifiable syndrome we could perhaps call it LOKIN 20. In order to assess the impact of LOKIN-20 we need to consider the excess mortality that we would not otherwise expect to observe.

It is this additional excess mortality the MSM commonly report in their daily coronavirus updates. They consistently attribute it either to COVID 19 or the “collateral damage” of the coronavirus crisis. The Lockdown regime itself appears to be largely immune from criticism as far as the mainstream media are concerned.

The BBC reported mortality figures for the entire UK combining data from the ONS, Northern Ireland Statistics and Research Agency (NISRA) and National Records Scotland (NRS). On the May 9th 2020 the BBC stated that these excess deaths stood at 63,708.

Via the ONS, this reported mortality included notifications of suspected COVID 19 deaths from the Care Quality Commission (CQC). An unknown number of these may not even record COVID 19 on the MCCD.

Public Health England did not not record any statistically significant excess mortality in England until Week 13 (week ending 1st April). Therefore the reported 63,708 excess deaths have occurred entirely during the Lockdown regime period, up to June 9th.

Using ONS data for England and Wales we can calculate an estimate of the likely percentage of deaths that were genuinely attributable to COVID 19. We can then apply these percentages to the figures reported by the BBC to extrapolate estimates for the UK.

ONS statistics – Graphics from Christopher Bowyer

Unless there is some unknown pathogen ravaging the nation, what remains are excess deaths which correspond precisely with the Lockdown regime period. We don’t have any other explanation for this loss of life, but all deaths occurred during the Lockdown. We will call this LOKIN 20 mortality.

With 50,107 deaths allegedly attributed to COVID 19, the BBC report 13,601 LOKIN 20 deaths. Of the 50,107 COVID 19 deaths 9,510 were identified by symptoms alone. As previously discussed, it is not clear how many of these deaths can legitimately be attributed to COVID 19.

Approximately 95% of COVID 19 decedents have at least one other serious comorbidity. While this brings into question all of these claimed COVID 19 deaths, where diagnosis is by observation alone and both pneumonia & influenza are also mentioned on the death certificate, it is not reasonable to claim these deaths were from COVID 19.

For weeks 14 to 22 the ONS report that 37.3% of all COVID 19 deaths also mentioned both pneumonia and influenza. While we don’t know the distribution of these deaths between those identified by test results and those identified merely by symptom, we can reasonably state that at least 3,547 of the 9,510 symptom diagnosis were inconclusive. This leaves us with a potential LOKIN 20 mortality figure of 17,148.

The BBC state that 40,597 COVID 19 deaths were confirmed following positive tests results. There is a significant problem with claiming that a positive test result for SARS-CoV-2 proves that the patient was suffering from COVID 19.

A considerable number of people who test positive for SARS-CoV-2 are asymptomatic. This means they have the virus, not necessarily the resultant syndrome of COVID 19.

Without COVID 19 they don’t have a disease that will impact their health. Just because someone is critically ill with a heart condition, testing positive for SARS-CoV-2 doesn’t mean that COVID 19 is making their condition worse. Without the symptoms it almost certainly isn’t.

A study of asymptomatic SARS-CoV-2 patients in China found that the presence of the virus alone had little to no impact on their presenting conditions. Nearly 80% of the studied patients did not develop COVID 19, although CT scans possibly indicated signs of the disease.

The British Medical Journal report that Australian researchers thoroughly tested all the passengers on a quarantined cruise ship. Cruise ships are almost the perfect incubator for a viral infection. Studying COVID 19 in such an isolated population is of particular value.

Approximately 59% of the 217 passengers tested positive for SARS-CoV-2. This is in keeping with the estimates of the UK government’s chief scientific adviser, Sir Patrick Valance, who stated that COVID 19 herd immunity would be achieved with a 60% infection rate. Again, 81% of those infected were asymptomatic. Asymptomatic rates on two quarantined aircraft carriers, the USS Theodore Roosevelt and the French Charles de Gaulle, were 58% and 48% respectively.

A similar figure of 78% asymptomatic infection was found in a study by Chinese researchers who tested overseas arrivals into their country. They showed no symptoms and therefore there was no evidence they were suffering the ill effects of COVID 19.

Another study of an isolated community of approximately 3000 people in the northern Italian village of Vo’Euganeo found similar results. Sergio Romagnani, professor of clinical immunology at the University of Florence, stated that between 50%-75% of positive test cases were asymptomatic.

Depending upon which study you look at this asymptomatic rate varies between 5% up to 80%. For our purpose, estimating the likely impact of the Lockdown regime, we’ll use the asymptomatic median of 42.5% of positive test cases.

This is lower than most study estimates but many of them are based on data models. We’ll stick to this conservative estimate in light of the empirical data measured in isolated communities.

This means that 17,211 of the claimed 40,497 COVID 19 deaths identified by SARS-CoV-2 positive test results are unlikely to have had COVID 19. Added to the potential 17,148 LOKIN 20 deaths already noted, it appears LOKIN 20 accounts for at least 34,359 of the 63,708 deaths reported by the BBC.

Graphics from Christopher Bowyer


[click to enlarge]

Apparently the Lockdown regime has already led to the premature deaths of at least 54% of the people the State and the MSM report as dying from the direct or indirect impacts of coronavirus. This is slightly more than the 50% estimate of Professor Karol Sikora.

Critics will rightly point out that I have made some assumptions to arrive at this figure. For example, we don’t know how many of those diagnosed by symptoms alone actually had COVID 19, nor how many positive tests for SARS-CoV-2 were either accurate or led to the patient developing COVID 19. In truth, we may never know.

However the UK State’s Lockdown Regime, despite claims of being led by the science, is based upon the computer models of Imperial College. These were not only wildly speculative, they were also demonstrably wrong.

The calculation presented here is based upon the cited empirical scientific evidence. Given that the Italian National Institute of Health (ISS) found that only 12% of claimed COVID 19 deaths could be clearly attributed to the disease, I have erred on the side of caution. 34,359 LOKIN 20 deaths is a conservative estimate.

Sadly, it appears the UK State are intent upon continuing with their Lockdown regime. In all likelihood this policy has already led to the premature deaths of more than 34,000 British people. Unfortunately that figure is set to increase.

The NHS are already faced with a staggering backlog of cases for critical health conditions other than COVID 19. It is difficult to see how further considerable mortality can be avoided. Worse still, the economic impact of the Lockdown regime is disastrous. Every day that it continues the situation deteriorates.

The UK Gross Domestic Product (GDP) fell by a jaw dropping 20.4% in April. To put this into context, the sharpest monthly drop of GDP following the 2008 financial crisis was 1%. April 2020’s decline is more than nine times greater the pre-Lockdown regime record of 2.2%, set in June 2002.

Whereas COVID19 has no statistically significant impact upon child mortality, the poverty wrought by the Lockdown regime certainly will.

The words of George Batchelor, a co-founder of Edge Health, who provide data analysis to the NHS, are disquieting.

Predicting that health services will be overwhelmed by the backlog, and the other impacts of the Lockdown regime, he stated:

If projected forwards, these numbers get so large it is hard to relate to them on a personal level.”

We can only hope that Edge Health’s warnings are overly pessimistic. However, it is clear that any large second or third wave of mortality will be blamed upon coronavirus, either directly or as a suggested consequence, by the State and the mainstream media. That will be a deception. The Lockdown regime is the cause and the health costs of LOKIN 20 are the result.

I hope those of you who read this, who find the logic presented reasonable, will reject those claims when they arrive. More importantly, please tell others why.

You can read more of Iain Davis’ work at his blog In This Together

can you spare $1.00 a month to support independent media

Unlike the Guardian we are NOT funded by Bill & Melinda Gates, or any other NGO or government. So a few coins in our jar to help us keep going are always appreciated.

Our Bitcoin JTR code is: 1JR1whUa3G24wXpDyqMKpieckMGGW2u2VX

4.7 12 votes
Article Rating
Subscribe
Notify of
guest
231 Comments
newest
oldest most voted
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
Peter
Peter
Jun 23, 2020 11:22 PM

 Vanessa Beely on the Patreon.com website shows that in all countries where Lock-down has been instigated – there is a huge surge in the death rate following the date of introduction of a Lock-down – suggesting that the Lock-down is reponsible for many more detahs than the Civid-19 Flue. :

https://www.patreon.com/posts/questions-for-19-38460446
 
 

Lost in a dark wood
Lost in a dark wood
Jun 25, 2020 8:21 AM
Reply to  Peter

This deserves much wider attention. I’d suggest posting it again, but to a current article.
 

Lost in a dark wood
Lost in a dark wood
Jun 17, 2020 12:22 PM

Hopefully, this will lead to a serious investigation.

 
Steve Scalise demands answers from Democratic governors on forcing COVID-19 patients into nursing homes
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/steve-scalise-demands-answers-from-democratic-governors-on-forcing-covid-19-patients-into-nursing-homes

 
Steve Scalise
Just sent letters to the Democrat governors of NY, NJ, CA, PA, and MI demanding they explain why they ignored protocols and forced COVID-19 patients into nursing homes.
The outcome was devastating.
Families who lost loved ones deserve answers. This tragedy was avoidable.
 
11:45 pm · 15 Jun 2020
https://twitter.com/SteveScalise/status/1272661471382700032
 

LuckyLui
LuckyLui
Jun 16, 2020 3:35 AM

And all this sits on top of the gross assumptions of the testing. In my view, given all the layers of obfuscation and elementary contradictions point to excess deaths, regardless of cause, being the objective not unintended collateral consequences.

rachel
rachel
Jun 16, 2020 1:13 PM
Reply to  LuckyLui

pasteur falsified his research. it is all built on a false premise providing a decoy to draw attention aw whilst the insides are blown out with hotdogs n molton icecream.

Denis Rancourt
Denis Rancourt
Jun 15, 2020 6:31 PM

Check out my article “All-cause mortality during COVID-19: No plague and a likely signature of mass homicide by government response”, presently on ResearchGate. https://www.researchgate.net/publication/341832637_All-cause_mortality_during_COVID-19_No_plague_and_a_likely_signature_of_mass_homicide_by_government_response

Ann Leyshon
Ann Leyshon
Jun 20, 2020 5:14 PM
Reply to  Denis Rancourt

fantastic article/ Thank you

Bykanarkist
Bykanarkist
Jun 15, 2020 6:06 PM

I have been looking for articles on hydroxyquinone trials, both here and in Swiss Prop Research. On both sites, the search reveals nothing. What happened to them?

Iain
Iain
Jun 16, 2020 4:56 PM
Reply to  Bykanarkist

I have written extensively on hydroxychloroquine here: https://in-this-together.com/?s=hydroxychloroquine

Lost in a dark wood
Lost in a dark wood
Jun 17, 2020 7:02 AM
Reply to  Bykanarkist

I haven’t looked at this in detail, but the following appears to be a fairly comprehensive discussion of hydroxychloroquine trials. Is that what you’re referring to?
 
https://www.ageofautism.com/2020/06/who-solidarity-and-uk-recovery-clinical-trials-of-hydroxychloroquine-using-potentially-fatal-doses.html
 

Arby
Arby
Jun 15, 2020 6:52 AM

The report is appreciated. I can’t do much with graphs and statistics. I lack the ability to do math and usually have no idea what graphs are showing me, unless they are very clear. There’s enough in the above report that I can grasp. And with more eyeballs on Off Guardian all the time, which I ‘can’ help with, I’m sure that there are those out there who will find this report very illuminating and helpful.
 
I do not watch CNN. I don’t even own a tv set. But this article was shown on The Highwire:
 
“Coronavirus spread by asymptomatic people ‘appears to be rare,’ WHO official says” by Jacqueline Howard / https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2020/06/08/health/coronavirus-asymptomatic-spread-who-bn/index.html?__twitter_impression=true 
Something that I find amusing, but infuriating and frightening, is the way that facts tend to just burst forth even in corporate media and are then followed by furious backtracking or attacks by the same media and even the same organization from which a factual report (think Rockefeller University and it’s smear of Knut Wittkowski) issued. That’s what I like about the (imperfect, but useful) Highwire. They do a good job of tracking such shenanigans.
 

Jack
Jack
Jun 15, 2020 12:21 AM

 
There is the intriguing possibility that exposure to the Euro-American strain of Covid-19 may endow resistance to the more dangerous Wuhan strain. That this may indeed be the case is suggested by the large number of people that appear to be naturally resistant to the virus. These people being resistant due to their previous exposure to the Euro-American strain.
 
Quote from: http://www.preearth.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=1184

rachel
rachel
Jun 15, 2020 1:22 AM
Reply to  Jack

a string of crazy nonsense. wtf r you on?

Basher
Basher
Jun 15, 2020 6:31 PM
Reply to  rachel

Did you read the Jack’s link before calling him crazy? I have and the science is super complicated. I’d need an expert I trust to assess it

rachel
rachel
Jun 16, 2020 1:01 PM
Reply to  Basher

no i did not waste my time. it is not super complicated but gobbledigook.

Jura Calling
Jura Calling
Jun 14, 2020 11:44 PM

Drawing on my earlier post and condensing the sea of numbers and science i have a couple of additions ..
 
1-It’s clear that Bill Gates has never been so high profile in his life.He’s gone mainstream.It’s he with the vision of a future that has us wirelessly connected to a computer that can read us via the chip he wants governments to enforce upon us.

2- Gates is the most high profile eugenicist in the world.His father just behind him.Grandfather just behind his father.Eugenics has been outed as quackery for a long time.So Gates has decided to call it ‘population control'( that word ‘control’ again). His record of accidental genocide in the third world is frightening.Eugenics may be a thing of the past.It’s ideology certainly isn’t if we examine those particular numbers of black lives that only mattered to experimenters.
 
3-Germany, through the Nazi system and ideology favoured eugenics.They didn’t think Jews were inferior, They just wanted to kill Jews for financial reasons. But they believed the poor, lower classes and elderly were useless(Herr Kissinger still does),as were the handicapped.They had nothing to offer the fatherland.The grandfather of Monsanto provided Zyklon B to poison the Jews.Monsanto we know about..as does Bill gates, who put millions into it..
 
4-As the most famous eugenicist hijacks the global threat to our health, he and his people have contrived to imprison( control) us. They have paid to have statistics faked( see my earlier post) as in Bill’s favourite book.The object is to raise the levels of fear to heights we daren’t imagine.
 
5- We are hearing from places as far apart as the UK and the US that the free healthcare are lying.That they are lying on death certificates. They are turning away the sick or the old or the frail.They are failing by design.As though told to.To maintain the myth and the agenda.Some are making blanket decisions through age( nobody over 60..nobody over 70..nobody handicapped).The people unable to pay private.It’s class apartheid.The pre-cursor to a caste system as seen in Huxley’s Brave New World.As Gates and Co prepare our ‘soma’..to keep us placated and compliant to their madness..
 
It dawned on me that since the days of Hitler, and the holocaust we read about each day somewhere, that countries have seen many changes and had many leaders and had many different parties at their head. The one thing that hasn’t changed is the ideology that really makes the world turn and navigates our precarious ship through space.That ideology of the elite.Call them Zionist or the Illuminati or the Sabbateans. But the ideology is unmistakable even if their ID is open to debate. These current events prove it. They prove that governments are the puppet show and are there only to project the illusion of choice for the people.But illusory it remains.There’s always only ever been one real governance.
 
I offer 2 links.Both don’t even require a full reading.
 
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/coronavirus-do-not-resuscitate-dnr-learning-disabilities-turning-point-a9561201.html
 
https://www.ushmm.org/collections/bibliography/people-with-disabilities
 
 
 
 

sam
sam
Jun 14, 2020 11:37 PM

https://freedomplatform.londonreal.tv/dr-rashid-buttar-hosts-a-doctors-covid-19-roundtable-1000-voices-strong/
Dr. Rashid Buttar Hosts A Doctor’s Covid-19 Roundtable with 150 doctors

  • May 21, 2020

The Most Controversial Voices In The WorldDr. Rashid Buttar is the osteopathic physician and author best known for his views on Coronavirus and its management.

Charlotte Russe
Charlotte Russe
Jun 14, 2020 9:01 PM

THE COVID-19 GUISE
 
The effects from the COVID-19 lockdowns are not just confined to undiagnosed medical conditions left to fester indefinitely. The lockdowns intensified the inequitable economic system which perpetually thrives on creating extreme wealth and income inequality. The George Floyd demonstrations are about much more than police brutality. These protests represent four decades of exploitative neoliberalism, repressive governments, sadistic austerity, imperialist wars, and crooked elections. All the outrage we witnessed BEFORE COVID-19 in the unceasing protest movements in France, Chile, Germany, India, Lebanon, Sudan, Egypt, Bolivia, etc…is now being seen in the US. 
 
 The reactionary apathetic US population needed a catalyst to trigger the outrage seen worldwide in 2019. Three months of social isolation and mandatory lockdowns followed by mass unemployment, increased debt, the shutting down of schools, and another series of rigged Democratic primaries resulted in the pent up rage which exploded following George Floyd’s horrific murder.  
 
What’s worth analyzing is why did the security state promote the COVID-19 crisis resulting in shutdowns inevitably leading to social unrest. Forty million lost their jobs leaving most indigent. Poverty gives rise to desperation.  Despair and hopelessness result in not only social unrest but increased crime.  The only reason to create mayhem is if the ruling class is deliberately instigating conditions leading to heightened surveillance and increased social repression. It’s obvious the uber-wealthy were worried after seeing worldwide demonstrations throughout 2019. They’re also aware that millions supported Bernie’s social justice platform. Increased repression is the only option given that the ruling class has no intention of implementing reforms, or any economic concessions.
 
If Biden is elected, the security state won’t hesitate to use the guise of COVID-19 to heighten surveillance. Whitney Webb says as much in her April 21st article entitled: How the US National Security State is using the Coronavirus to fulfill an Orwellian Vision: “The U.S. will follow China’s lead and even surpass them in many aspects related to AI-driven technologies, particularly their use of mass surveillance. This perspective clearly clashes with the public rhetoric of prominent U.S. government officials and politicians on China, who have labeled the Chinese government’s technology investments and export of its surveillance systems and other technologies as a major “threat” to Americans’ “way of life.”  So in effect, the security state’s intention is to create a US surveillance state which mirrors China. This is what the kente clothed smiling Dems are cooking-up via brain dead Biden. 
 
 

A leaf
A leaf
Jun 14, 2020 6:20 PM

And people in my country now started screaming “second wave started!!!!!! loook beijing !!!!!!!we told you ” as if they are almost happy .
when told them they look like they almost wanted this so they will be right in their presumptions, they say “this is for your own safety for you or your loved ones to not die in an hospital room suffocating(exact words) (insert insults)..
they advocated for the full blown curfews in my country and actively called the police if someone was out..
all their data and based on science is wrong, the ones who can speak english consider bbc,nytimes,ft, daily mail etc as reliable sources because over there turkish sources are ludacrist..

the ceo of the main flag carrier airline told on the tv that because dusts on the shoes carry corona virus we now introduced shoe cleaning at the entrance of the airport..he really said the shoe dust covid thing..an insult aded to the insults, we have to be at the airport how many hours before for god sake ???

Nobody is seeing the infection rates might be going up but death rate goes down or stays same eg..iran.. this means herd immunity, what we wanted all along..they already managed to kill everybody who were to be death because of the virus with the full lockdown, reduced services and wrong tratments..
People in my country believe the usa uk’s over inflated death numbers, i am telling them, that some countries over inflate some under report, it all depends on the politics so please look at the real info, ifr percentage and it is %0.3 , please stop this maddness but to no avail…i am then insulted..i stopped altogether, fff with them..they can live their lifes miserable in hypocondric ocd state.
i don’t care anymore but the sad part is their freight is the reason goverments pushing this idiotic covid preventation bull craps, so in a way they still effect my life and turn it into as miserable as theirs..

rachel
rachel
Jun 14, 2020 8:41 PM
Reply to  A leaf

there is no such thing as a pandemic virus. stefan lanka explains germany is the only country where there is a law on this. dr morse has videos explaining how cold and flu like symptoms are detox symptoms beneficial to health. a few days on fruit clears it no problem at all. john rose says personal experience on fruit is all that is needed to disspell the myths. it is time get excited about the levels of health we will reach.

A leaf
A leaf
Jun 15, 2020 1:25 AM
Reply to  rachel

politely disagree, i belive viruses and bacteria and their roles in illnesses

rachel
rachel
Jun 16, 2020 1:24 PM
Reply to  A leaf

you made your bed then. why complain when the germ theory reaches its destination?

sabelmouse
sabelmouse
Jun 14, 2020 4:33 PM

no emails, again!

timfrom
timfrom
Jun 17, 2020 10:01 AM
Reply to  sabelmouse

Yep, same here. Is Off-G aware of this?

ted
ted
Jun 14, 2020 4:28 PM

Great analysis Iain. The same is undoubtedly true in the US, where guidance on recording Covid19 deaths is the same as the UK. Interesting that all these governments came up with the same policy to inflate Covid19 labeled deaths to the maximum possible. As if they had received guidance from a single source.

Anyway, the study of the cruise ship to Antarctica is a fascinating mini version of planet lockdown. For those looking for scientific reports that show the futility of masking and self isolating, note the following, on day 8 after fever appeared in one passenger,

“Isolation protocols were immediately commenced, with all passengers confined to cabins and surgical masks issued to all. Full personal protective equipment was used for any contact with any febrile patients, and N95 masks were worn for any contact with passengers in their cabins. The crew still performed duties, including meal services to the cabin doors three times a day, but rooms were not serviced. Expedition staff helped with crew duties at meal service.”

On day 20 (12 days later), rt PCR swabs are collection, and the following results obtained,

“ Despite 128 (59%) of the population testing positive, fever and mild symptoms were present in only 16 of 128 COVID-19-positive patients (12.5%), with another 8 medically evacuated (6.2%) and 4 requiring intubation and ventilation (3.1%). There has unfortunately been one death to date (0.8%). There were therefore a total of 24 COVID-19-positive patients who were symptomatic (19%), with the majority being asymptomatic (104 patients or 81%).”

So …. masks, isolation, & PPE and we still have 60% positive tests and only 12.5% with symptoms. Note that 10 passengers shared a room where one tested positive and the other negative, showing existing immunity likely. 1 passenger died, possibly because the ship was denied entry into port and access to medical care.

Conclusion: Lockdown does not work, and denial of care or use of improper care kills.

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 14, 2020 7:05 PM
Reply to  ted

Lock down worked in China – when they cancelled their usual new year travel.

FACT.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30421-9/fulltext

What is it with you people and a desire to rush like fools where angels fear to tread?

Is the answer the longest river in Africa?

rachel
rachel
Jun 14, 2020 8:07 PM
Reply to  Dungroanin

worked? compared with what? what you allege would of happened? get out of here.

rachel
rachel
Jun 14, 2020 8:17 PM
Reply to  rachel

some interesting citations. the measures worked in 1918 compared with err what they allege would of happened.

ted
ted
Jun 14, 2020 8:42 PM
Reply to  Dungroanin

Magical thinking runs strong in this one. If the Lancet publishes it, it must be true! Hmmm ….

rachel
rachel
Jun 15, 2020 1:43 AM
Reply to  ted

jennifer daniels has video on her channel where she says it is standard to put the most profitable comorbdity down. the govt wouldnt need to say anything or even be aware the hospitals act that way. she is interesting having trained for this.

ariel
ariel
Jun 14, 2020 2:19 PM

Mr aaDavis, (Zeppo Marx accent) why don’t you call a spade a spade? The implications are ‘The Great Reset’ and possibly….ummm ‘quite likely’ what is chiselled into the ‘Georgia Guidstones’ or at least the preliminaries…..

polistra
polistra
Jun 14, 2020 2:16 PM

The detailed numbers are good, but won’t win the argument. Governments will never admit they’re wrong. They’ve been using fake numbers for economics and “global warming” and every other issue for many decades now.
 
What matters is plain facts about viruses and immunity.
 
This virus is a virus.
 
That’s the only fact we need. We know how viruses work. Our immune systems have a billion years of experience in fighting viruses, and have been handling this one just as expertly as ever.
 
The lockdowns SPECIFICALLY RUINED every single aspect of immunity and public health. Diet, sleep, sunlight, exercise, daily routine, socializing, work, sanitation, normal medical care. All ruined, all specifically targeted. Therefore we KNOW that the lockdowns are intentional genocide.

Objective
Objective
Jun 14, 2020 2:57 PM
Reply to  polistra

Nail – Hammer – Head.
 
Conspiracy facts are so often, way more simple than theories.

John Ervin
John Ervin
Jun 14, 2020 5:09 PM
Reply to  Objective

The simple facts conspire naturally to produce Conspiracy Realism. But when they are incessantly muted by mass media, they lead to Conspiracy SURrealism.

Exhibit 0: the last 3 months.

Iain
Iain
Jun 14, 2020 8:30 PM
Reply to  polistra

Well said. Couldn’t agree with you more about the numbers and the denial of the State. I don’t expect the State to pay attention to them, but I hope more of us will be able to use evidence based rationales to challenge their proclamations.

Elroy
Elroy
Jun 14, 2020 2:05 PM

Yes, but it turns out there is a hidden cost to the World War C’ists themselves. They’ve been hoist on their own petard. Their precious stormtroopers have fallen to the inchoate rage of the previously house arrested lemmings. The future is always hard to predict.

Jasper
Jasper
Jun 14, 2020 1:58 PM

The official deaths register for England and Wales lists all authorities and the place of death, ie Hospital, home, care home etc. There are two categories of death, ‘All Causes’ and specifically ‘COVID 19’. Between 29th February and 8th May, there were ZERO deaths recorded under the ‘COVID 19’ category.

Jasper
Jasper
Jun 14, 2020 1:53 PM

I am aware of the case of a lady of 94, who died in an Ipswich care home. She had suffered a stroke some years before which left her bedridden with only her sight and use of her right arm. The death certificate which stated that she had died of Parkinsons with Coronavirus, was signed by a doctor who had never seen her, or her medical records. She had never been diagnosed with either disease. This is criminal behaviour of a type which Harold Shipman would be proud.

John Goss
John Goss
Jun 14, 2020 11:51 AM

Thank you Iain Davis and OffGuardian for the sterling work you are doing.
 
We need, if possible, to get out into the fresh air. To be honest I have never stopped. We need shake hands, make physical contact with each other, spread the truth against the nonsense. By defying the measures being imposed on us we demonstrate that we still have some kind of freedom. When everybody sees this happening they will realise there is nothing to fear. The fear factor is what is driving so many into following government guidelines when they are the very guidelines that are killing people.

Steve Hayes
Steve Hayes
Jun 14, 2020 11:12 AM

Matt Hancock, the Health Secretary, admitted on 10 April 2020 that the government had not made any attempt to assess how many people would die as a result of the government’s “lockdown” measures.
 
The published minutes of the SAGE show that the scientific advisory group did not recommend the lockdown.
 
These two facts show that the government was not following “the science” when it introduced the lockdown measures. They show that the government had adopted an irrational, irresponsible and incompetent approach to policy-making (judged by the claimed criterion of saving lives).
 
It was obvious before the government introduced the lockdown measures that they would cause more harm than the virus ever could. This fact means either the government’s policy-making was driven by hysterical fear and panic or it was driven by a motive other than the claimed desire to Protect the NHS [in order to] Save Lives. Regardless of which of these possibilities is right, the government has unnecessarily inflicted massive harm on the people; harm, not just in the present, but harm that will be felt for decades to come.

John Ervin
John Ervin
Jun 14, 2020 5:13 PM
Reply to  Steve Hayes

I doubt if it was fear and panic that drove govt’s to lockdown.

There is too much evidence of “calculating”.

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 14, 2020 7:19 PM
Reply to  Steve Hayes

You have come round to admitting there was a political motive behind the government’s decision not to follow the upto date scientific advise. They had their head honcho on the sage panel – unprecedentedly. We have not been allowed to see the full minutes of its meetings.

You admit all that then irrationally state

“ It was obvious before the government introduced the lockdown measures that they would cause more harm than the virus ever could..“

I mean WTF? How and why was it obvious? What information and science was available THEN that allows YOU to be so definite?

You have been stalking me all over the board denying that the government has been complicit in the scale of the excess deaths and now you are almost saying they have, then twisting it with that continued lie!

Tony
Tony
Jun 14, 2020 7:39 PM
Reply to  Dungroanin

It was obvious because elective clinics, surgeries and treatments were going to shut down. which they did. There were no excess deaths prior to lockdown, despite this virus having been around for several months prior to it. It was easy to predict lockdown creating excess deaths. What couldn’t have been predicted was the excess deaths being increased massively by deliberately seeding nursing homes with discharged elderly patients suffering from an assortment of respiratory diseases. That was nothing short of a massacre.

Steve Hayes
Steve Hayes
Jun 15, 2020 8:43 AM
Reply to  Dungroanin

It was obvious that the lockdown measures would cause more harm than the virus ever could as I pointed out on 20 March 2020. https://viewsandstories.blogspot.com/2020/03/coronavirus-mortality-and-fear-mongering.html
If I could predict it so could anyone who was paying attention and was sufficiently educated and historically informed. Just consider the number of people the government’s austerity policies, which were introduced in response to the financial crisis of 2007/8, resulted in, for example.
 
Your claim that I admit the government had a political motive for not following the scientific advice is both false and disingenuous. It is false because I did not say that, and it is disingenuous because you are implying that the government deviated from the scientific advice by not locking down sooner, when the case is in fact the opposite: SAGE did not advise lockdown. I do not know why the government introduced the lockdown, but my judgement is that it was a case of collective madness.
 
You also falsely state that the minutes SAGE have not been published. They are on the government’s website: https://www.gov.uk/government/news/government-publishes-sage-minutes Your repeated resort to falsehoods only serves to undermine your credibility.
 
You accuse me of stalking you. This playing the victim is unfortunately all too fashionable.

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 16, 2020 5:16 PM
Reply to  Steve Hayes

Thankyou for the link ti the Sage minutes – i’ll read them as soon as I can.
 
Thanks also for the link to your blogs, i’ll give them all a reading too.
 
I find your logic a bit contradictory, perhaps you can see if I quote from your own article
 
The substantial margin for error in these estimated figures stands in marked contrast to the number of registered deaths, which is a completely reliable figure. Yet, there is no discussion of that figure in the mainstream.
 
Which as you know is what I too have been saying! The FT as a mainstream paper has said it.
 
So your ‘commonsense’ tells you because there were no above average deaths the weeks before lockdown so there was no need for lockdown? And your same common sense tells you that all the excess death spike, that happened during lockdown, are totally because of the ‘lockdown’ and NOT caused by the CV?
 
Do you really believe the claimed deaths by CV happen within days and couple of weeks of infection and hospitalisation?
 
From all the various reports from hospitals across the world and the analysis of the patients – it is a fact that only a minirity of CV deaths hapoen within the first two weeks – most happen in a hospital environment (except these thousands of old folk sent and left to die in the community as has become clearer by the day).
 
Most deaths appear nearer to month or more after hospitalisation .
 
You fail to see that by the time the pathetic lockdown was belatedly applied the hospitals and the government knew that hospitalisations were exponential and would transpire in the peaking of deaths several weeks down the line – thats why there were no excess deaths already logged early March . That is the OBVIOUS logic failure in your common nonsense.
 
I can understand that you don’t want to accept that error, which ANYONE with a bit of functional logic would . Which would also meet your quoted criteria of Excess Deaths being a unarguable measure of the CV deaths .
 
I’ll get back to you about the sage minutes .

Steve Hayes
Steve Hayes
Jun 17, 2020 10:52 AM
Reply to  Dungroanin

You quote accurately from my blog post, but what you leave out is that I wrote those words on 20 March 2020. When I wrote them, neither you nor the Financial Times were focusing on all cause mortality figures. Both you and the corporate media were focusing exclusively on coronavirus related death figures, and you were doing so because fewer people were dying each week than the five yearly average for the corresponding weeks. You only became interested in the all cause mortality figures after they exceeded the five yearly average, which was after the implementation of the lockdown measures. All valid explanations rely on accurate chronology, which is something you are rather cavalier about.
 
Frankly, I find your characterisation of my thinking as common sense and illogical amusing.

Mike Hall
Mike Hall
Jun 14, 2020 10:53 AM

“.. The Lockdown regime is the cause and the health costs of LOKIN 20 are the result… ”
 
No, it most certainly is not. Correlation is not necessarily causation.
 
Had there been no lockdown, healthcare services would have been further overwhelmed, causing even more premature non Covid deaths from lack of services. Other facts, from all countries clearly show that lockdown has greatly reduced the nos. of severe Covid cases presenting.
 
The proper conclusion from this piece is that chronic under resourcing of healthcare services generally, combined with chronic lack of preparation for a pandemic everyone knew would happen some time, are the real cause of ALL the excess deaths.
 
The claim also that increased mortality from ‘poverty’ is somehow inevitable ‘because lockdown’ is also pathetically wrong. There is no difficulty in providing the continuation of necessary basic life essentials during lockdown, and any choice not to do so is 100% political choice.
 
The data presented in this piece is reasonably valid, but the conclusions reached are pathetic dog whistling of right wing and far right political tropes, and utter rubbish bearing no relation to the data analysis.
 
In the light of the real cause of excess deaths, lockdown has clearly prevented far more deaths, and should continue until healthcare services can demonstrate their capacity to avoid being overwhelmed.

Objective
Objective
Jun 14, 2020 11:22 AM
Reply to  Mike Hall

Had there been no lockdown, healthcare services would have been further overwhelmed, causing even more premature non Covid deaths from lack of services.

 
Evidence to support your claim?

JudyJ
JudyJ
Jun 14, 2020 12:29 PM
Reply to  Objective

And even if we accept the argument that healthcare services might have been overwhelmed, that would have been because the media were telling everyone that if they had any cold or flu-like symptoms they should be very afraid as it would likely be the deadly, non-discriminatory virus (you know, the one that actually didn’t exist) requiring immediate medical intervention. Any overwhelming demands would have been completely contrived by those warning of the risk of overwhelming demands.

Mike Hall
Mike Hall
Jun 14, 2020 12:40 PM
Reply to  JudyJ

See my reply to ‘Objective’ (lol) above. For your comment to have any validity you would have to be suggesting a global conspiracy of epidemiological related science AND the global medical profession. Hilarious, frankly.

JudyJ
JudyJ
Jun 14, 2020 2:27 PM
Reply to  Mike Hall

…suggesting a global conspiracy of epidemiological related science AND the global medical profession.

 
I can only take from this that you have not taken the time to look at the mass of evidence from a significant number of global epidemiological and medical professionals who do not agree that the global reaction to the coronavirus is proportionate and scientifically defensible.
 

rachel
rachel
Jun 14, 2020 6:44 PM
Reply to  Mike Hall

its like claiming the footsoldiers were the generals. pretending a regimented hierarcy debated and came to a concensus after careful deliberation.

rachel
rachel
Jun 14, 2020 7:01 PM
Reply to  rachel

what really happened was a memo was sent. anyone who questioned the orders was silenced. thats how you can get the same thing happening around the world. they were already well practiced in receiving n following orders. dr daniels explains this in a video called too cozy of a job. jennifer daniels.

Mike Hall
Mike Hall
Jun 14, 2020 12:38 PM
Reply to  Objective

Really? Are you denying the existence, extent and prognosis of Covid, as reported by scientists globally? Or the healthcare professionals, globally, concerned that the ‘peak’ of the curve would overwhelm services?
 
There’s nothing ‘Objective’ lol about your reply. Looks to me like O-G is another outlet for ‘conspiracy’ misinformation, of the kind funded by the far right ‘Libertarian’ billionaires behind the global resurgence of fascism.

Objective
Objective
Jun 14, 2020 12:42 PM
Reply to  Mike Hall

You got all that from my one short question?

Evidence to support your claim?

What you been smoking, give me some please.

Jack Cooper
Jack Cooper
Jun 14, 2020 1:32 PM
Reply to  Mike Hall

I love how you call it ‘conspiricy misinformation’. Baa baa. Well done sheep, you know how to repeat the BS that comes out of MSM. Funny how you call us far right fascists without the brain capacity to ever comprehend that maybe your government doesn’t have your best interest at heart and that there could ever be an elite. I don’t like being rude but you have shown zero respect.

John Ervin
John Ervin
Jun 14, 2020 5:20 PM
Reply to  Mike Hall

What shows your slip, a giveaway, is that you call out OG as a Libertarian billionaire boondoggle of renascent global fascism, as if that’s quite specifically the only available option.

You see how that betrays your false flag.

kevin
kevin
Jun 14, 2020 8:27 PM
Reply to  Mike Hall

“‘conspiracy’ misinformation, of the kind funded by the far right ‘Libertarian’ billionaires behind the global resurgence of fascism.”
 
Be careful, your political agenda is exposing your feigned concern for public health.

snuffleupagus
snuffleupagus
Jun 14, 2020 3:28 PM
Reply to  Objective
Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 14, 2020 7:22 PM
Reply to  Objective

Germany

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 14, 2020 7:22 PM
Reply to  Objective

Denmark

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 14, 2020 7:23 PM
Reply to  Objective

Etc etc etc …

Steve Hayes
Steve Hayes
Jun 14, 2020 11:47 AM
Reply to  Mike Hall

Mike, back in 2016 the NHS conducted Exercise Cygnus. It was designed to assess how the NHS would cope with a pandemic. The conclusion was that the NHS would be overwhelmed. The government decided, not to increase NHS capacity, but to draft emergency legislation, which became the Coronavirus Act 2020 and the associated regulations. And even in the light of these facts you expect us to believe that the government that chose not to prepare for a predictable pandemic by increasing NHS capacity, but to prepare for legislation that would give it the power to do anything for ever (Part 2 Section 90) introduced the lockdown measures to save lives. And to persuade of this, instead of presenting facts, you call any scepticism far right.
 
By the way, the word “trope” means figurative language.

Mike Hall
Mike Hall
Jun 14, 2020 12:48 PM
Reply to  Steve Hayes

So, given the large numbers already of BOTH Covid and lockdown related deaths (thru’ overwhelmed health services), even with a lockdown (albeit 7 to 14 days late), you think the Gov were unconcerned about their poll ratings when they panicked and realised Covid was more than the mere ‘Flu’ Johnson earlier peddled it as?
 
Again, this site seems 100% about promoting conspiracy theories favoured by far right Libertarians and their ‘useful idiots’.

Steve Hayes
Steve Hayes
Jun 14, 2020 1:12 PM
Reply to  Mike Hall

The NHS was never overwhelmed. Just making up facts only serves to discredit you.
 
I note that you completely ignored the substantive point about Exercise Cygnus.
 
By the way, you do know that the term “conspiracy theory” was weaponised by the CIA in order to protect official narratives from criticism?

snuffleupagus
snuffleupagus
Jun 14, 2020 3:32 PM
Reply to  Steve Hayes

everybody knows that there’s no such organisation as “the CIA”; that’s just a crazy right-wing conspiracy theory.

Steve Hayes
Steve Hayes
Jun 14, 2020 3:36 PM
Reply to  snuffleupagus

Yeah, that’s why they had to create the National Endowment for Democracy.

rachel
rachel
Jun 14, 2020 6:21 PM
Reply to  Steve Hayes

stefan lanka explains why a pandemic could be predicted since pantos need to be planned. who was involved?

rachel
rachel
Jun 14, 2020 5:59 PM
Reply to  Mike Hall

vaccines r poison not healthcare services. go directly to jail.

Jane
Jane
Jun 14, 2020 7:08 PM
Reply to  Mike Hall

Belgium, which imposed a strict lockdown and has an excellent health service, has a worse death rate per million than the UK. Belgium also has more ICU beds than Sweden yet again, far worse results. Shutting everybody up together and depriving people of sun and exercise is not a good idea.

Iain
Iain
Jun 14, 2020 8:41 PM
Reply to  Mike Hall

Thanks for the comment Mike. As far as I am aware the purpose of lockdown was to “flatten the curve.” As you say, to limit overloading health services. There never was any suggestion that it would reduce overall COVID 19 mortality. So I am interested to understand why you think it has or why, without it, overall COVID 19 deaths would have been higher.
 
You suggest that lockdown prevented non COVID 19 deaths. However, one of the primary impacts of the lockdown has been the effective withholding of treatment for non COVID cases across the country. I don’t see how this reduced non COVID deaths.
 
Nor is there any evidence that the NHS would have been “overwhelmed” with COVID 19 cases. That belief only stands if you also accept that the Imperial College models were remotely plausible, which they weren’t. There were plenty of scientists pointing that out, at the time.
 
Hot spots such as London or Birmingham may have struggled but overall there has been more than enough capacity to deal with both COVID and non COVID patients. However, as I said, treatment for non COVID patients is notable primarily by it’s absence during the lockdown. How you can imagine this hasn’t caused additional mortality is difficult to understand.
 
You claim that it is pathetic to suggest that increased mortality from poverty is inevitable. If you can cite any study which doesn’t link poverty to increased mortality rates I’d be interested to read it.
 
I agree that deaths from poverty are largely a political choice and you might hope that some redistribution of wealth will be evident as the staggering economic impact of the lockdown unfolds, which it will.
 
Unfortunately, during the lockdown, that transfer of wealth has been in the opposite direction as effective bailout money covers the losses of the banks and multinational corporation in greatest measure.Unless we see a shift in the priorities of the ruling class, and there is no reason to imagine we will, further deaths from increased poverty are “inevitable” I suggest.
 
You round off with accusations that I am echoing the sentiments of the alt-right and right-wing commentators. As a former left wing activist and unionist, I remain primarily concerned with inequality of opportunity.
 
I am neither right nor left wing these days. These are merely labels to maintain the divide and rule paradigm in my view. I am not interested in perpetuating these divisions.
 

Mike Hall
Mike Hall
Jun 14, 2020 10:43 AM

“.. The Lockdown regime is the cause and the health costs of LOKIN 20 are the result… ”
 
No, it most certainly is not. Correlation is not necessarily causation.
 
Had there been no lockdown, healthcare services would have been further overwhelmed, causing even more premature non Covid deaths from lack of services. Other facts, from all countries clearly show that lockdown has greatly reduced the nos. of severe Covid cases presenting.
 
The proper conclusion from this piece is that chronic under resourcing of healcare services generally, combined with chronic lack of preparation for a pandemic everyone knew would happen some time, are the real cause of ALL the excess deaths.
 
The claim also that increased mortality from ‘poverty’ is somehow inevitable ‘because lockdown’ is also pathetically wrong. There is no difficulty in providing the continuation of necessary basic life essentials during lockdown, and any choice not to do so is 100% political choice.
 
The data presented in this piece is reasonably valid, but the conclusions reached are pathetic dog whistling of right wing and far right political tropes, and utter crap bearing no relation to the data analysis.
 
In the light of the real cause of excess deaths, lockdown has clearly prevented far more deaths, and should continue until healthcare services can demonstrate their capacity to avoid being overwhelmed.

Kalen
Kalen
Jun 14, 2020 3:45 PM
Reply to  Mike Hall

You ate talking nonsense. Did poverty started mid March generating excess mortality? No. Poverty was there before and is continuing while excess mortality disappeared. Did poor state of public health of population, preexisting conditions, comorbidities, chronic diseases exploded suddenly in Mid March producing excess mortality? No. Poor public health continues and in fact got worse because of lockdown. It was refusal to treat those people with those conditions that actually caused it.

Did NHS collapse from mid March on because of COVID? No, it did not collapsed was shut down purposefully for anything but COVID leaving hospitals away from hot spots mostly empty while COVID mortality was known via Chinese studies by mid March to be much lower (0.3% for under 65) than other major diseases and comparable to bad flu and that most of all COVID is concentrated in oldest 10% of population with 1% of severe cases with patients averaging 80-90 y.o.

NHS could have easily handle 1% of severe and 10% of mostly mild to moderate symptoms of those exposed while continuing regular medical services.

It was criminal policy refusing to heed hard empirical scientific data and murderous behavior of doctors who followed the mindless orders and protocols that killed up to 90% percent of officially reported dead, COVID or not.

But unfortunately best evidence, that dismantles official,COVID narrative and repudiates claim of COVID as being dangerous extremely infectious viral disease is not emphasized in this post , namely the fact acknowledged by government authorities in EU and US that SC2 virus already infected population and spread among community as indicated by full sequencing genomic studies in early January 2020 or even in a December 2019.

That means that over two and half months COVID did not produce any excess clinical cases , hospitalizations or mortality at all in any category of diseases COVID Could have been misclassified as.

In fact COVID with similar symptoms that would have been likely misdiagnosed with no test for Influenza among mild to moderate respiratory infection cases before mid March , was not. In fact ILI numbers were seasonally declining and in mid March suddenly almost ceased to be reported in mid March while 90% of ILI seasonal infections typically end late May two and half months later.

WorldParole
WorldParole
Jun 14, 2020 7:23 PM
Reply to  Mike Hall

*Has google running autonomously on smart phone to plug in full name with profile pic from social media fingerprint.

Basher
Basher
Jun 14, 2020 7:35 PM
Reply to  Mike Hall

“the conclusions reached are pathetic dog whistling of right wing and far right political tropes, and utter crap bearing no relation to the data analysis”
 
How is this ‘right wing’? I have found every piece written by Iain Davis very, very insightful. I’m a leftist. I left Labour the day Kier Starmer became leader. Covid-19 doesn’t care about right/left. But those trying to use it to change the very essence of human society on Earth will push this left/right, black/white nonsense to divide us, in our fight against them
 
Great stuff Iain……again!!

breweriana
breweriana
Jun 14, 2020 9:47 AM

And yet another article promoting the non-existent fake ‘covid19’ or whatever they’re calling this bull now.
 
Hopeless.
 
There will be a ‘2nd wave’ in December, however.
 
What to do about that?

Evoluon
Evoluon
Jun 14, 2020 12:53 PM
Reply to  breweriana

The second wave in December will probably be the normal colds and flu which usually occurs around then and will be reclassified as covd-19. We`ll never get out of this. So depressing.

Paul too
Paul too
Jun 14, 2020 1:56 PM
Reply to  Evoluon

Exactly. That is the only thing to be worried about. Lies upon lies.

John Ervin
John Ervin
Jun 14, 2020 5:30 PM
Reply to  Paul too

What does Swiss Policy Research have posted as its epigraph to its 25 pt. list on Covid: a 1947 Camus quote from his “La Peste”: “The only means to fight the plague is honesty.”

That’s becoming more ironic as we go.

A leaf
A leaf
Jun 14, 2020 6:35 PM
Reply to  Evoluon

This scares mt the most and at least %80 percent of the population whole heartedly accept this over inflated numbers and very very scared so they will happily willingly welcome the second wave story and what comes after

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 14, 2020 7:38 PM
Reply to  Evoluon

That will be there as usual.
The second one wave will possibly coincide.

A double whammy!

The nhs normally at capacity in the winter looks likely to be overwhelmed as even more EU medics are banished.

Better make sure some of these 3 million Hong Kongese are ready to step in.

Paul too
Paul too
Jun 14, 2020 1:54 PM
Reply to  breweriana

A second wave of nothingness. How very scary.

breweriana
breweriana
Jun 14, 2020 6:22 PM
Reply to  Paul too

nothingness.”
It will most certainly not be that, you can be sure.
Prepare.

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 14, 2020 7:34 PM
Reply to  breweriana

Changed you tune.

Not the only one.

New script???

Basher
Basher
Jun 14, 2020 7:37 PM
Reply to  breweriana

“And yet another article promoting the non-existent fake ‘covid19’ or whatever they’re calling this bull now.”
 
You have totally misunderstood his angle

Lockdownrefuser
Lockdownrefuser
Jun 14, 2020 9:40 AM
77 Brigade - Retired
77 Brigade - Retired
Jun 14, 2020 12:47 PM

Off topic … but the situation in S. Africa continues to deteriorate for the whites (even though I am not “white”) I used to have an apartment in Cape Town – sold it last year and glad to escape as what was once the richest country in the southern hemisphere quickly becomes one of the poorest and most violent.
 
Sad, we have many happy memories as have many (but not all) black people!

Kalen
Kalen
Jun 14, 2020 4:40 AM

Not entirely off the subject.

A curious case of Zero Hedge permanent removal from Tweeter because of critical COVID coverage in January and recent miraculous reinstatement unprecedentedly WITH APOLOGY, that coincides with ZH recently allowing blatant MSM COVID propaganda to be proliferated from their website.

From ZH:

133 days after Twitter “permanently” banned Zero Hedge on January 31, the social network has reinstated us after admitting it made an error.

As a reminder, what happened in late January was confusing. Shortly after we asked if “This [Is] The Man Behind The Global Coronavirus Pandemic”, referring to Wuhan Institute Of Virology scientist Peng Zhou (who three months later was being investigated by western spy agencies for his role in creating Covid) and some low-grade “reporter” from Buzzfeed decided to report us to Twitter for “doxxing” Zhou using publicly available information..
.. at the same time, Twitter fabricated an entirely different explanation for its decision when speaking to outside media, telling them the suspension was due to “platform manipulation” – whatever that means.

As they outed enemy of CIA and NSA it can only be “good” and ZH got rewarded for it by CIA section called Tweeter.

BDBinc
BDBinc
Jun 14, 2020 3:19 AM

Hey Iain why do you talk like there is a new disease ” COVID19″ caused by a virus called “sars corona 2 ” ?
There is no logic and reason to your belief from Media and Govt both known pathological liars in the pockets of central banksters.
 
Its all propaganda.
Mind control.
Its a pysop called COVID19.
 

Kalen
Kalen
Jun 14, 2020 5:04 AM
Reply to  BDBinc

It is surely COVID psychological warfare as lethality of SC2 is negligible among broader population of healthy people but casualties of such warfare are real and so far count half a million dead worldwide. And therefore madness of such war must stop best by overthrowing abhorrent regimes that peddle it.

Basher
Basher
Jun 14, 2020 7:40 PM
Reply to  BDBinc

Hey Iain why do you talk like there is a new disease ” COVID19″ caused by a virus called “sars corona 2 ” ?
 
Read his earlier pieces. You’ve completely misunderstood. He is using THEIR language, the language of those pushing the Covid-19 agenda, to disprove their lies.

John Ervin
John Ervin
Jun 14, 2020 2:55 AM

A STUNNING COMPARISON & SHOCKING STATS:

(*My apologies if this has appeared elsewhere, but I’ve yet to see it.)

CHINA is the world’s most populous country, with 1.4 BILLION citizens.

INDIA is right behind and gaining, with 1.3 BILLION citizens.

Together, in a country where social distance is a luxury, at most, and an anomaly, at least, they have reported 13,800 deaths, rounding off. 4600 and 9200 respectively.

ROUGHLY FOURTEEN THOUSAND DEATHS OUT OF 2.7 BILLION.

Negligible stat, a nano-pandemic.

USA & GB by comparson 330 million and 70 million, 400 million collective citizens. .4 billion to the two heavy hitters’ 2.7

Yet they report about 158,000 deaths.

A little over 10 times as many deaths, with almost ten times fewer citizens, or about a little over 15% the pop.

Which works out to about 100 TIMES as many deaths, per capita?

Proportionally….

HMMMMMMMMM……….

I don’t want to hear about India and China being broken systems, or not being able to count. Pound for pound, the Chinese and Indians I know –many–are at the head of the class, best counters on earth.

~~~~~~~~~~£4£&$4$

John Ervin
John Ervin
Jun 14, 2020 3:43 AM
Reply to  John Ervin

Although we have a lot of math whizzes frequenting this, this puts it in even better perspective: if you boiled off China and India to the reduction of a Sweden, that percentile would translate, in a country of 10 million, to about FIFTY DEATHS there.

50 DEATHS TOTAL IN SWEDEN, CALLED A “PANDEMIC”. IF SWEDEN WERE CHINA+INDIA. WHICH IT IS NOT…

Compared to USA & GB 150,000.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm…..(…!!!!..)

“Where have all the flowers gone, long time passing?” –The Kingston Trio

~~~~~~~£4£&$4$+my2¢~~~~~~~~~~~~

Rahul G
Rahul G
Jun 14, 2020 12:22 PM
Reply to  John Ervin

Dear John, with ref India the real worry should be what Iain Davis has described, the ‘lock down’ toll. We in India cannot guess what it must be because neither our central government authorities in the Ministry of Health, and in the Indian Council of Medical Research, nor the media, have bothered to find out.
Instead, ever since 24 March when our national ‘lock down’ was announced, the central and state governments have doled out a daily barrage of scary models and fear-inducing scenarios, each of which has been amplified by the media, whose abysmal reporting standards make it impossible for any contra or even neutral view to be heard.
Because we have such a large population, and the numbers of migrant labour are large in each major state, the ‘collateral’ toll has probably been much larger than all those who suspect with good reason that there is such a toll. A major portion of this toll is undoubtedly those who needed care for an existing medical condition or chronic ailment (dialysis, or a monthly consultation for a pulmonary condition, or physio after a stroke) but who decided not to risk going to their clinic or hospital. Again, fuelled by fear of contagion, clinics and hospitals have actually been turning away those who come to them seeking medical help.

John Ervin
John Ervin
Jun 14, 2020 1:58 PM
Reply to  Rahul G

Thanks very much for the input, Rahul G. Very interesting.

In a word, a “variation” on a theme: unreliable reporting, accounting. Same in US and GB but for very different reasons. I think the connection is that each lockdown country seems to be using the virus as a political football. “Results-driven”. And there is collusion between our various media: I read a long piece at CNN about your low count, but very misleading.

Results-driven. For any and every reason. Whatever suits their interests. Whatever “fits the bill”.

Lockdown = Propaganda Vehicle.

It reminds me of what Swiss Policy Research has as its tagline, an epigraph quote by Camus from “La Peste”: “The only means of fighting the Plague is honesty.”

The meaning of that is snowballing.

Unlike Camus’ Plague, though, this is a global snowball. Interesting. All the best in India.

David Ferguson
David Ferguson
Jun 14, 2020 2:23 AM

This article by Malcolm Kendrick, a Doctor working in a care home, provides a very informative insight into what has been happening on the ground, and how “helpful” NHS admnistration has been. I found this particular quote very interesting:
 

Then came the problem of death certification. What should I write? COVID, or not COVID? Who knew, because still no-one was being tested in nursing homes. Not patients, not staff. Pure guesswork. By this point, even the national news was recognising that Care Homes were the new front line of COVID. Further edicts rained down, four or five new protocols a day

 

rachel
rachel
Jun 14, 2020 9:29 AM
Reply to  David Ferguson

dr greenberg testified before congress about how statistics were manipulated during the polio operation. before the vaccine everything was polio.

Cheezilla
Cheezilla
Jun 14, 2020 12:42 PM
Reply to  David Ferguson

Kendrick is awesome!

sam
sam
Jun 14, 2020 1:31 AM

Hmm wonder if this lot have anything to do wiht whats going on??
https://www.demandprotest.com/?fbclid=IwAR1m3rdRhNYuMtkuep57jFB_aOx32SdnZHdzZRctynSeGkCvedBkR3hnyj4
We Assemble MovementsFrom grassroots organizations to advocacy groups, we seed the narratives and gather the audience you desire. When your strategy demands paid protest, we organize and bring it to life.
Learn More

Harvey
Harvey
Jun 14, 2020 1:13 AM

Another murder at the hands of US police in Atlanta today. People are fighting for their lives rather than being arrested by US police. The system no longer functions, it is falling apart. Who in their right mind is going to allow police to take them into custardy now?
 
There is a total loss of trust in the whole police system of the USA. I don’t see how the civil unrest is going to end. The CIA may be orchestrating this, but this is going to get out of hand and not going to end well for them.

John Ervin
John Ervin
Jun 14, 2020 1:31 AM
Reply to  Harvey

Well, yes, nothing “ends well” for the CIA, or so it seems. But whom do they answer to, for it all?

aspnaz
aspnaz
Jun 14, 2020 1:31 AM
Reply to  Harvey

Custody or custardy? I am holding an apple crumble in custardy.

S Cooper
S Cooper
Jun 14, 2020 1:35 AM
Reply to  Harvey

“The police”? They are THE GESTAPO. They are the enforcers and protection (musclemen) for the corporate fascist oligarch mobster psychopaths that have been stealing from WE THE PEOPLE for many, many years.
 
Long overdue for the oligarch mobster psychopaths to be held to account for their innumerable crimes against humanity.
 

John Ervin
John Ervin
Jun 14, 2020 3:16 AM
Reply to  S Cooper

No, the police are mostly prolos themselves. The great filmmaker Pasolini (and martyr it seems) pointed that out, although they also seem as a demographic to be the *political* equivalent, in ideology and outlook, to the animals in charge of the Farm, in Orwell’s “eponymous” allegory, as Pasolini also “copped” to. Not a few other social critics have, as well. My big sis married one, and as an oft-times guard I’ve worked around many. At some posts I’ve regularly relieved them at the end of their shift, when they were moonlighting, as George Floyd maybe relieved Chauvin?

It really ain’t the cops who are Gestapo. That word is from Statz Polizei, State’s Police, and that would translate into CIA and FBI, or MI6 + 5.
Basic. And also basic is that cops are kind of caught in the middle, socially?

——–

“I would have never agreed to the formulation of Central Intelligence Agency back in ’47, if I had known then they would become the American GESTAPO.”

—President Harry S. Truman

John Ervin
John Ervin
Jun 14, 2020 3:55 AM
Reply to  John Ervin

That quote was from memory, then my memory rebuked itself, as in: “…if I had known then IT would becone thevAmerican GESTAPO.”

Small change, one word, but to emphasize that Truman was more correct, CIA was, and is, definitely an an IT. And a pretty cumbersome one. Really. Hope they all find new work.

Moneycircus
Moneycircus
Jun 14, 2020 4:06 AM
Reply to  John Ervin

OSS lifted the SS out of Germany after the war and merged it into the nascent CIA, which was a tool of the same bankers and industrialists who put AH in power

John Ervin
John Ervin
Jun 14, 2020 4:56 AM
Reply to  Moneycircus

Yes, of course. I’ve been studying all that fascist rigamarole between the two countries for about ten years or so. The late Steve Kangas, a great analyst who was pretty clearly suicided, at 39, is an icon of mine, and he wrote a great summary which his friends have kept up online,”Timeline of CIA Atrocities” and his links are a really solid introduction to all this. I’ll look it up and post it below. Also John Smpkins wrutes a great site at Spartacus Educational. For a great screen dramatization, we have George Clooney and Kate Blanchett as the roinymous “The Good German” about 15 years ago. In Black and White no less. A good period piece on Operation Paperclip. I was touting the Wikipedia entry of that name, because it had links at the very bottom after aeronautics scientist acquisitions from Nazi Germany and Atomic bombers, you had “Intelligence” with only Reinhard Gehlen, who really founded CIA, de facto, but only Otto von Bolschwing, the notorious mass murderer eho played out his last 40 yeard in Sacramento!!!

I was complaining a coipke years back about the paucity of “de-nazified” names, then one day ALL intel references were deleted from the Operation Paperclip article at Wikipedia, and no trace thereafter.

Fascinating. I was a part-time guard in 2009 at a recycling bin behind a local supermarket in Dana Point, and a Dulles era character overheard me talking to a lad about Gehlen and introduced himself to me as Gehlen’s US Army liaison after the War. What a segué. I had only been reading about Gehlen for several months then.

Right out of a movie. Hell, he looked like a Dulles clone, a bit, same style, glasses, pipe. He said the one thing he admired about Teddy Kennedy was that he was a serial philanderer, which sounds like Dulles. Dulles’ sister said he had at least 100 mistresses. Really sick, a true “exceptionalist”.

If he wasn’t absolutely pulling my leg, that’s about a one in a billion “Coincidence Theory”. Ridiculous. He wanted to know if I would proofread his memoirs of his months with Gehlen in Europe! He was about that era, an older fellow. He said he was a fairly raw youth at the time when he was assigned to Gehlen in his twenties. He came off as totally credible, very sincere and fact-filled and engaging. He seemed the part?

Even as relatively dumber as I was ten years ago, I politely declined, but he kept after me for a year.

Now that’s a Mel Brooks script, maybe, but reality, even in Southern California? But then, Von Bolschwing lived up north here. Crazy as a soup sandwich, says Harlan Ellison.

John Ervin
John Ervin
Jun 14, 2020 5:15 AM
Reply to  John Ervin

THESE LINKS BELOW ARE ALL REALLY FABULOUS TROVES OF INFO THAT CUT TO THE BONE OF OUR TIMES, DEEP ENOUGH POLITICS TO CONNECT THE DOTS OF THE WORLD IN AN INCISIVE AND “TELLING” WAY. ALL HIGHLY RECOMMENDED. WITH THEM I FEEL I CAN “TRIANGULATE” SOME OF THE TRUTH? (SORRY ABOUT THE TYPOS IN THE PREVIOUS POST, BUT THEY CAN BE INTUITED, AS A TEST OF CRYPTOGRAPHY SKILL. TRIANGULATED. LOL.)

“TIMELINE OF CIA ATROCITIES”:

http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/CIAtimeline.html

“SPARTACUS EDUCATIONAL” (“DEEP POLITICS ENCYCLOPEDIA”):

https://spartacus-educational.com

WIKISPOOKS:

https://wikispooks.com/wiki/

John Ervin
John Ervin
Jun 14, 2020 2:39 PM
Reply to  John Ervin

The first link by Kangas is strictly historical, but very good up to ’97 when it ends abruptly, as he appears to have been rubbed out in ’99, pretty clearly. (That is a cautionary tale and gripping story.)

And the last link, Wikispooks, I find more and more valuable, as it is “open source” and claims, at least, to address the huge problem with Wikipedia: its control by Intel and all that Deep State.

It reports a lot more and more credibl all the things Wikipedia fudges so often. The latter is great for encyclopedic entries that are not hotly contested, and Wikispooks seems to do much better with those, which makes it valuable indeed.

The middle link, Spartacus, is a big question. He (Simkins) has a current article which has a lot of reportage on NHS, but it looks murky in motive, a minefield. CAVEAT LECTOR. His older stuff, like assassinations, is very interesting and encyclopedic.

In any case, I need to triangulate all the time.

Don’t we all?

snuffleupagus
snuffleupagus
Jun 14, 2020 3:49 PM
Reply to  John Ervin
Objective
Objective
Jun 14, 2020 11:31 AM
Reply to  S Cooper

Unfortunately i think you’re misreading this situation entirely, this is the next phase in the globalist agenda!

Objective
Objective
Jun 14, 2020 11:30 AM
Reply to  Harvey

I fear it will end just as they (neo-liberals) intend, a true police state & one nation police FORCE more brutal than anything you’ve ever seen.
 
The poor & black communities are going to come out of this the biggest losers. Its a shame they haven’t the sense to realize they are being manipulated & exploited by privileged middle class liberals who in turn don’t appreciate the globalist neo-liberal elite don’t care about them either!
 
None of it is going to end well for anyone other than the 1%.

Lockdownrefuser
Lockdownrefuser
Jun 14, 2020 12:28 AM

Rise of insanity

Lockdownrefuser
Lockdownrefuser
Jun 14, 2020 6:10 AM

You have to forgive the strong thirst of Mr. Janich, he has
been living in the tropical Philippines for several years.

mikael
mikael
Jun 14, 2020 12:22 AM

Yeah, hehe, you nailed them to the wall, and there is little to add, since most of the mumbojumbo is been exposed.
So, to the real deal OffG, and I am aware of certain issues where we have to tread lightly, but my instingts goes in to the same lane as one wrote it belove, aka Sunset, I agrees 100%, and this latest, eh… hypoxia or more precise, cant breathe, is an continuation of what happened some years ago,abled thru the Tryvon Mertin Hoax case, witch also inflamed parts of the imperial banana republic, and when it died out, the persons behind it, didnt, but continued to expand, to what we face to day, and the same players, the same backers, the same founding uh…. fathers are stil into this, incl the CONvid nonsense, witch to me is as Sunset explained it so eloquently, an creation of something witch is coming, and the contures are right there, when nations/states are already talking about forced vaccination and if not, force those that dont, into education camps, and so on.
Then we have this, and the pimping of the second wave, witch, if the vaccines are as bad as I think they are, will be the foundation, since they have already shown to have horrible adverive effects, and if you than take the forced vaccination, I wounder, if this time, millions indeed will die and that Adv. Reaction will be blamed on the second com…. sorry, the second round of the same/similare CONvid uh…. epidemic.
And then we have the perfect storm, with all the coming fall out of this reasent and ongoing events, the militarisation, the surveilance, an totalistaian wet dream come thrue.
 
I fear the coming year/s, will be something beyond our imagination, and if you then take the economic fall out of this lockdowns, into the same equation, the outcome is nothing but an naight mare senario, then we are in whats defined as unchartered teritory of biblical proportions.
 
So, since Sunset gave an good description of the case now and what to come witch I agrees upon, I will focus on some of the debunkers, or just da bonkerers, and I found an “briliant” shithead to give to you as an magificent ex. on what kind of utter bullshit some of the so called experts can infact muster to uh…. counter others whom isnt bowing to their scams, incl physics to medicine, and while I am at this, I am well versed in physics and math, etc, I have no problems with reading what I need to read to realise how much we think is just nonsense, or mathematical prodjections of narratives witch dont really say anything, other than confirming this persons eh… science witch again can be just parts of reality..
And this video is typical, and comes from an person I consdier to be an flatout joke, an eh…. physics something, called Michio Kaka or Kaku and is about anti-vaccsers and humped with flat earthers, you have to watch this, the rethoric is unbelivable idiotic but this persons, by some obscure reason is become celebritys and there by experts, wtich we now have been the leading ugh…. light in this scamdemic.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z71foZ3Xr8A
Yeah, I lauged my ass off.
This is people whom laughs at others, like religious people, while they them self belives in creating something out of absolutelly nothing and things like black matter, dont apor cant explain light, and is materialistic to their pathetic cores, and I wouldnt lett this moron change the wheels on my car, witch I dont think He has the brain capasity to do.
Etc, etc, etc.
 
Never ever belive anything, trust but verify, is rule numbero uno, and I have desided to take a vacation, I am right now enjoying videos and articles so controverisal that I dont for now bother to even link to them but they are for my own plesure, I never dismiss anything, and I mean anything, before I my self is convinced the inconsitencys are to many and/or the holes in their explanations to big, but before that, I dont even waist time on the same called debunkers or experts, some even debunked the Palestinian people.
Have an nice day and take care.
I hope, Sunset, we are wrong, I really do, but every fiber in me tells me that what comes, is something taken out of an dystopian nightmare.
May the lord have merrcy upon us all.
 
peace
 

Tony
Tony
Jun 14, 2020 2:27 AM
Reply to  mikael

Fucking troll. You with your pigeon english/perfect english/fake bad spelling. And your mate Sunset, summed up perfectly by Willem. Back to the drawing board combat 77.

Jura Calling
Jura Calling
Jun 14, 2020 12:08 AM

I think i’d treat statistics in this context with the same disdain as Bill Gates, Fauci, Ferguson, Trump and Johnson. It’s all about agenda.
 
You can make statistics do whatever you like.They’ll dance any dance you like if you throw enough money…
 
China have- allegedly- under reported their numbers because Trump was ordering the west to point fingers at them and unfriend them on facebook and so on.America and Britain have done the opposite as both turned their back- allegedly- on the WHO to leave Gates as their paymaster ( nice move Donald and Boris..no coincidences there is there).
Doctors and nurses are growing in number now wanting to blow whistles. It seems a long time ago now since those first youtube accounts were suspended for posting scenes from various emergency departments in England and America being empty after we had been told via the media that they were like ‘war zones’ and to keep away.It seems an age since Neal Ferguson was called to answer questions about the validity of his model and his projections. Those who raised the questions were also removed from public view.But we were soon reminded of his horror show in the UK with the reckless damage he caused to farmers with terrible inaccurate numbers and predictions.Then we learned how his employers, The Imperial College London were heavily supported by Gates.
 
Then it came to my attention that Bill had a reading list of books he’d recommend to anyone.One jumped out :https://www.gatesnotes.com/Books/How-to-Lie-with-Statistics
 
Then the clouds stepped aside and the lights shined on the real picture.
 
It doesn’t matter that Ferguson revised his initial projection of 500,000 deaths in the UK to around 30,000 ( slight difference).Or that many of the deaths have been attributed indirectly to Covid 19 even if the patients had pneumonia, cancer, or other illnesses.if they were refused treatment it’s vague enough to accept the reason as one that will serve the numbers and the agenda.
 
The ONS don’t impress me.I don’t particularly care that they seem to be tripping over each other and falling on their brains as they try to talks about medicine and science in a vain attempt to justify the vagaries of their babbling away from maths into science. I won’t suggest they’ve been added to anyone;s payroll.I’ll say nothing.But if it walks like a duck it’s probably Bill gates..
 
In the final analysis, there is far too much abstraction for a science that’s supposed to be concrete.Statistical analysis only needs a pen and paper or a calculator.It shouldn’t need a variety of different answers with it’s own interpretation in tandem.And, in the final analysis we’re talking about a nihilistic billionaire with a new euphemistic definition of eugenics that is an extension of a Nazi extermination programme.he can call it population reduction or control- he would.He can’t call it ethnic cleansing.People would gossip.But the Godless that sit within his circle are of the same mind with the same goal. The Technocrat’s technocrat has arrived.he has billionaire friends and millionaire buddies.If you aren’t one- you’re the new ethnicity that has to go I’m afraid.This is the new way. These are the first groans before the birth pains of the chaos.At the end, their new baby will be order.Unless they’re stopped.maybe a few of the doctors who are trying to become Youtube stars over this might do something useful and approach the leaders en masse and demand a debate. Winner takes all.Otherwise this will look like no more than and weekend in hindsight when the real game begins.
 
Remember people ? And care ?And the oath sworn by medics long before we had to clap for their dancing through a pandemic ?
 
 
I swear to fulfill, to the best of my ability and judgement, this covenant:
 
I will respect the hard-won scientific gains of those physicians in whose steps I walk, and gladly share such knowledge as is mine with those who are to follow.
 
*These, for starters, have had to be ignored( disrespected).To a degree the virus can be considered novel.But that shouldn’t mean encouraging or bribing medics to hide information, lie about it, or threaten them with the termination of their contracts should they discuss it outside of the place of work when it’s a public emergency.*
 
I will apply, for the benefit of the sick, all measures [that] are required, avoiding those twin traps of over treatment and therapeutic nihilism.
 
* While the latter is outmoded now.It has some relevance here.Therapeutic nihilism was once considered to mean that some patients would suffer more by treatment than giving them a chance to heal spontaneously.medical progress has put this notion to bed.However,it’s spectre has been spotted during this pandemic.The life saving ventilators that were being ordered by the thousand to give to patients turned out to be more harmful than efficacious.It was accelerating mortality.And the self isolation and refusal to allow patients out of their home or receive treatment for anything else has also accelerated not only a virus but other illnesses.It would have been nice to order cancer cells and other conditions to wash their hands and quarantine until further notice. But it can’t happen.*
 
I will respect the privacy of my patients, for their problems are not disclosed to me that the world may know. Most especially must I tread with care in matters of life and death. If it is given me to save a life, all thanks. But it may also be within my power to take a life; this awesome responsibility must be faced with great humbleness and awareness of my own frailty. Above all, I must not play at God.
 
*Without seeing or meeting patients that were on their way to hospital, a blanket decision was made in more than one country not to treat them if they were outside a certain age limit.That is in contravention of the sworn oath.In the meantime, Gates has gone on record with his ‘good club’ not to let anything like religion hinder their ’cause’ of vaccinating the world. he said this 8 years ago( google is your friend- Gates / good club).The man with a chronic messiah complex has manipulated the game.Irony.*
 
I will remember that I remain a member of society, with special obligations to all my fellow human beings, those sound of mind and body as well as the infirm.
 
* see previous comment*
 
 May I always act so as to preserve the finest traditions of my calling and may I long experience the joy of healing those who seek my help.
 
*According to the ONS,this has been abandoned too.Turning away patients with another blanket decision- ‘covid 19 only’.*
 
So much abandoned in the name of a virus that really is only a name.Millions contracted it; tens of thousands died of it; Software magnates and politicians are talking numbers from graphs and probabilities based on a phantom.They can say how long it will likely to be before a vaccine is found and how long it will take to get it into everyone regardless of them wanting it or not.Yet, a vaccine can not possibly be made without holding this virus isolated on a slide.Underneath a microscope. In a test tube.Yet, despite the millions we’re told that contracted it and those who died of it, nobody in medicine has actually been able to grab it and isolate it.So what are the figures and projections based on if we have little knowledge of it.We had the plans of self isolation, media programmes to instil fear, and endless contradictory advice about masks and self isolation.We have reams of knowledge shared with us by Gates and his RFID chip he’s itching to implement.But the virus that prompted it all ? Zero; nothing; nada..
 
 
 

Martin Usher
Martin Usher
Jun 14, 2020 3:02 AM
Reply to  Jura Calling

There are some pretty good pictures of the virus, they’re a marvel of modern imaging. The popular image you see in many cartoons — the ball with knobbly things on it — is actually a pretty good representation.
 
Its likely that we will never get a decent vaccine for it, just as we don’t have anything that’s effective against the common cold. You’re dealing with a virus that mutates, its a moving target. That said, there are reports that polio vaccine may slow it down; it doesn’t actually stop the coronavirus but it ‘primes’ the immune system to be ready for it.
 
There’s a lot of tail chasing among politicians and pundits but in the scienfitic world there’s a lot of serious work going on. As with a lot of science, though, the more we know the less we understand. I daresay it will all be obvious in hindsight.

breweriana
breweriana
Jun 14, 2020 9:58 AM
Reply to  Martin Usher

There is no ‘virus.’

Objective
Objective
Jun 14, 2020 11:43 AM
Reply to  breweriana

Prove it?

breweriana
breweriana
Jun 14, 2020 6:31 PM
Reply to  Objective

The burden of proof lies with those making the assertion that a ‘virus’ exists.
Evidence – they have supplied exactly NONE.
 
Which is why, as the article points out, they have to attribute cause of death to ‘virus’ even when it is not. Invented, in other words.
 
All you do in going along with their story of a ‘virus’ is take attention away from the REAL killer: the effects the ‘lockdown’ has caused.

Cheezilla
Cheezilla
Jun 14, 2020 12:36 PM
Reply to  Martin Usher

The ball with knobbly things on is actually an exosome.

Harvey
Harvey
Jun 14, 2020 1:07 AM
Reply to  Arsebiscuits

it should be shut down because it is a CIA operation and propaganda machine, not because of it’s history.

John
John
Jun 14, 2020 3:21 AM
Reply to  Arsebiscuits

Hahaha, get them with their own weapons. I signed it for fun.

Objective
Objective
Jun 14, 2020 11:45 AM
Reply to  Arsebiscuits

I love the idea & concept of the petition but I wouldn’t give my personal data to that shit stain of a website.

Arsebiscuits
Arsebiscuits
Jun 13, 2020 11:51 PM

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8414917/Guardian-accused-hypocrisy-backing-BLM-protests-despite-branding-Abraham-Lincoln-abhorrent.html

During the US Civil War 40 years later, it sided with the southern Confederates against President Lincoln, who wanted slavery abolished.

One extract from the paper on October 10, 1862, read: ‘It was an evil day both for America and the world when he was chosen President of the United States.’

A year later it even opposed the Proclamation of Emancipation – which freed slaves – and described the President’s time in office after his assassination as ‘abhorrent’.

But in recent editorials the paper has tried to mask its past, with headlines such as ‘The Guardian view on Colston’s statue: a long time in going’ and ‘The Guardian view on Black Lives Matter worldwide: a common cause’.

Ahhhhhhhhh this is great.

gordon
gordon
Jun 13, 2020 11:29 PM

listen it’s not logans run or soylent green for the goy.
 
the takeover zionist communist marxist satanist called it what thou wilt
was necessary
 
the village has to be burned down the weak must be nil by mouth do not ressusitate
 
must be put to sleep for the greater good
 
the pensions crisis is a world wide one
the aged do not register on ferguson imperial cost analysis gates software
 
we need fresh blood the un compact for migration gives us 100 million slaves
from the poorest regions.
 
 
why slow kill granny and grand dad when we can get are in place harold shipmans to do the business.
glaxo smith kleinfelt castle was not built in a day.
 
 
it is so nice that the worlds governments are doing billions of dollar bail in for the trillion dollar pharma oil and chemi cull industries
 
 
only by liquidating the host can the the crown disease be contained
 
 
soon are nurse and hospital workers will have the time for new dance routines for youtube
iin the er in surgery suite and in mortuary rue morgue
 
a shuffle in memory of granny who lived a life with little vit d and sub par clinical scurvy from lack of vit c
 
she trusted her oil industry worker doctor over her fruit and veg man
 
ho hum
 
neil is not nial ferguson they just work for the same nm rothschild ltd in the city of london
the empire that stills shines brightly

Paul
Paul
Jun 13, 2020 11:06 PM

Good stuff here on Cuba, AID, HIV, Ebola and CV-19.
 
https://www.resilience.org/stories/2020-04-24/cuba-from-aids-dengue-and-ebola-to-covid-19/
 
Quoting:
 
Since 2003, Interferon Alpha 2B has been produced in China by the enterprise ChangHeber, a Cuban-Chinese joint venture. “Cuba’s interferon has shown its efficacy and safety in the therapy of viral diseases including Hepatitis B and C, shingles, HIV-AIDS, and dengue.” Cuba has researched multiple drugs, “despite the U.S. blockade obstructing access to technologies, equipment, materials, finance, and even knowledge exchange.”
 
Ebola and International Aid
 
AIDS and dengue were problems that affected the Cuban population; but Ebola Virus Disease (EVD) was quite different.  Viruses that cause EVD are mainly in Sub-Saharan Africa, an area that Cubans had not frequented for several decades.
 
When the Ebola virus increased dramatically in fall 2014, much of the world panicked. Soon, over 20,000 people were infected, more than 8,000 had died, and worries mounted that the death toll could reach into hundreds of thousands. The United States provided military support; other countries promised money.
 
Cuba was the first nation to respond with what was most needed: it sent 103 nurse and 62 doctor volunteers to Sierra Leone. With 4,000 medical staff (including 2,400 doctors) already in Africa, Cuba was prepared for the crisis before it began.
 
There is a noteworthy disaster when a country refused an offer of Cuban aid. After the 2005 Katrina Hurricane, 1,586 Cuban health care professionals were prepared to go to New Orleans. President George W. Bush rejected the offer, acting as if it would be better for American citizens to die than to admit the quality of Cuban aid. This decision foreshadowed the 2020 behavior of Donald Trump, who searched for a treatment for COVID-19 while pretending that Interferon Alpha 2B does not exist.
 
Donald Trump’s inconsistent rantings about COVID-19 are the epitome of miseducation campaigns. Climate denial has served as a dress rehearsal for COVID-19 denial. The Trump reign has been a practice session in stupefying millions into believing anything a Great Leader says no matter how ridiculous it is. His tweets have a pathological similarity to the intensely anti-intellectual perspective that is dismissive of education, philosophy, art, and literature and insists that scientific investigation should never be trusted.
 
The day before yesterday, they insisted that the world was flat. Yesterday, they believed that evolution was a theory from Satan. This morning, they insisted that heating of the globe is a fantasy designed to choke corporate expansion. How close must it get to midnight before those drunk with Trump’s Kool-Aid are willing to see the facts of COVID-19 growth unfolding before their eyes?

Louis N. Proyect
Louis N. Proyect
Jun 13, 2020 10:48 PM

So when are you guys going to run some articles on the threat posed by vaccines? I see the author of this article has written a book on this subject.

Arsebiscuits
Arsebiscuits
Jun 13, 2020 10:52 PM

Well why do you need an article then?

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 13, 2020 11:35 PM

Amateur Louis – you can’t even get as many down votes as me.

Maybe you should have retired at the top?

Tony
Tony
Jun 13, 2020 11:49 PM

Why don’t you do some research into RNA vaccines Louis? Can you recommend one that works against any type of RNA virus? Just one will do. Hint: The RNA of the virus mutates faster than the vaccine can be developed.
 
Sorry for feeding the troll, folks.

Gary Weglarz
Gary Weglarz
Jun 14, 2020 12:01 AM

Thanks for the reminder Louie. I want to share Robert F. Kennedy, Jr’s site for his organization “Children’s Health Defense” which addresses among other things vaccine safety.
 
Perhaps you’d like to challenge the peer reviewed science his site provides which is a clear counterpoint to your typically credulous & wildly enthusiastic swallowing of whatever State narrative might be under discussion at the moment?
 
https://childrenshealthdefense.org/?utm_source=salsa&eType=EmailBlastContent&eId=d7f95f2a-b4aa-409c-a15a-f3a8c9a5c339
 
 

rachel
rachel
Jun 14, 2020 12:34 AM
Reply to  Gary Weglarz

vaccine safety is like humane slaughter. a contradiction in terms. parents should be jailed 4 having kids poisoned with that shit.

MoH
MoH
Jun 14, 2020 12:04 AM

When are you guys going to write articles on how global organisations fund ‘media’ sites such as Counterpunch so these woke entities push victimhood and hate to polarise society so they can divide and conquer so they can take the spoils? If you had comments on your articles you certainly would find out how inauthentic people nowadays take to such subversion.

rachel
rachel
Jun 14, 2020 12:11 AM

vaccines is negative. not existant reality. regnerative detox is valuable to health n undermining of vaxx ideology. all a vaxx is is a slow lockdown. there was already some social distancing caused n they were amping up like isolating babies. vaccines destroy health. pure evil. black magic. think it was perillouse to be a childrens author when there was a measles vaxx in the works.

Sophie - Admin1
Admin
Sophie - Admin1
Jun 14, 2020 10:50 AM

Let me get this straight – are you saying the only legitimate attitude toward vaccines is to eliminate all consideration of their safety on an individual basis?
 
Do you think safety trials should be abolished? Watch dogs not permitted to publish caveats?
 
Is this type of binary attitude helpful?
 
At OffG we prefer a fact-based and case by case approach. Vaccines in general may well save lives, but a specific vaccine may still prove under-researched or even harmful.
 
Why do you disagree with this?

Anonymous
Anonymous
Jun 13, 2020 10:44 PM

One thing that interests me, is that in many other countries that locked down – for sake of argument, I have a friend from Hungary who says little moved and yet they didn’t die of lockdown.. – indeed excess mortality on euromomo shows a decline in mortality. (I discussed with him the differences in care and how that could affect things; but couldn’t quite figure that out. Numerous lockdown countries don’t seem to have experienced a sharp rise. I shall do some research between dates of lockdown and rises in excess mortality between different countries.). Any further info appreciated however.

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 13, 2020 11:38 PM
Reply to  Anonymous

Check out how the Chinese used it effectively when 3 billion people were going to be in transit at their New Year and it woul have gone not only all over China but most of South East Asia and wherever Chinese expats live across the world!
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30421-9/fulltext

Tony
Tony
Jun 13, 2020 11:53 PM
Reply to  Dungroanin

I’m seriously considering that Dungroanin may well be a web alias of Carole Codswallop. The professional hysteria and hyperbole is a perfect match.
 
China has a population of appproximately 1.39 billion btw.

rachel
rachel
Jun 14, 2020 2:07 AM
Reply to  Tony

you aswell. switch off your wifi b4 bed to protect your neighbours. you wouldt want to be harming their rest night after night.

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 14, 2020 9:28 AM
Reply to  Tony

Tony,
You have caught me out !
I admit it – I am a deepstate , MI6 and Mockingbird plant in the Obsessive Groan, code name ‘C’ ! I am the original Russia baiting, Whore of limited hangout! You have seen through my misdirection of the real DS culprits with my flaky exposes of CA and Novichok and BrexShit perpetrators – which has led everyone to forget that I am a central plank of the integrity initiative project and have provided the cover for all the skullduggery with my MSM colleagues and my cohorts in the alt-media of both wings – after all my flying blue monkeys need a left and a right wing otherwise they’d just fly in every decreasing circles! And end up SPIKED…

————

As for my slight misquote, late at night, which you seem to think is a hook to projection upon – if you had bothered to read the article, it would have been clear.

“ People in China are estimated to make close to 3 billion trips over the 40-day travel period, or Chunyun, of the Lunar New Year holiday.”

I trust that is clear for everyone – always happy to clarify if you have any more queries.

rachel
rachel
Jun 14, 2020 1:54 AM
Reply to  Dungroanin

it comes from china but if you switch the wifi n cell off before bed you will help stop your neighbours catching it.

breweriana
breweriana
Jun 14, 2020 10:02 AM
Reply to  Dungroanin

Come clean and tell who pays you.

Sophie - Admin1
Admin
Sophie - Admin1
Jun 14, 2020 1:20 PM
Reply to  breweriana

I don’t think anyone would pay Dungroanin to post – he just really really needs to defend his original position, no matter how much it’s proven wrong, and doesn’t care about shredding his credibility in the process. He also likes a drink.

Croach
Croach
Jun 14, 2020 2:01 AM
Reply to  Anonymous

Some countries were obviously willing to shut down their economies to save the financial system but weren’t willing to murder their citizens to justify it.
It’s not just a case of quality of care. Policy decisions have been made whereby life saving care is withheld and unofficial euthanasia protocols (murder) have been in effect.
In the UK individual hospital trusts have been refusing care to anyone in a care home.
Many CCGs have been issuing (totally illegal) blanket dnr orders for anyone in their area who is mentally impaired (learning difficulties, senile etc).
The list of UK policies (triage protocols, clinical models, resource management etc.) that at first reading, were obviously going to cause unnecessary deaths is so extensive that I find it hard to just put it down to incompetence.
For example, if everyone presenting to hospital with breathing difficulties is treated as potential covid (current triage protocol) and then on that basis denied aerosol ventilation (CPAP, BPAP), because of fear of spreading the virus, then of course many people with heart failure (most common symptom – breathing difficulties) are going to asphyxiate to death.
It’s a no-brainer.
In Spain they had a similar hospital care lockout for anyone over 70 or in the mid or end stage of serious illness.
People in the high dependency stages of serious conditions were calling the doctor on routine matters regarding their health and having people in hazmat suits turning up and issuing their families with enough morphine to euthanize them.
It’s definitely worth making a note of the countries that didn’t set out to kill their own citizens.
Germany is another one that didn’t.
Sweden has almost the lowest number of critical care beds per head of population in Europe, they made a shambles of protecting care homes but they never felt the need to just wheel seriously ill people past half empty ICUs to be dumped on a general ward to die of neglect.

Anonymous
Anonymous
Jun 14, 2020 7:57 AM
Reply to  Croach

Thanks. I’ll run with that. (Unlike some of the other non-enquiring minds/comments.) Do you write for the site/anywhere else?
Appreciate info.
 

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 14, 2020 9:33 AM
Reply to  Anonymous

I gave you a link to a scientific journal and you didn’t bother reading it?

You can lead a horse to water…

Bye I agree with Croach.

MoH
MoH
Jun 13, 2020 10:26 PM

Lets not forge that the race war they have orchestrated is a distraction from CV 19 and the failing narrative, because if this Floyd charade hadnt have started, there would have been much more of a push back against the petty tyranny such as mandatory face masks, local authority ‘ambassadors’ being employed for £9 an hour to piss people off in high streets and the avalanche of evidence that proves that it is a massive hoax. Its not just a distraction, its about buying time, so they can build the infrastructure of slavery for the ‘new normal’. With this article and similar in recent days, we see a very clear policy of genocide under the fog of all the crazy shit they are spinning. They need to go.

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 14, 2020 12:03 AM
Reply to  MoH

The race war against African Americans by mostLy ‘white’ Americans has NEVER stopped. Both versions are brilliant.

Nina Simone – Mississippi Goddam
Nina Simone – Mississippi Goddam
Nina Simone: Mississippi Goddam

https://youtu.be/LJ25-U3jNWM

https://youtu.be/hBiAtwQZnHs

(Funny how I can’t embed videos- ain’t it ?)

Objective
Objective
Jun 14, 2020 11:51 AM
Reply to  Dungroanin

Hey hypocrite what happened to websites without transcripts rule?
 
Don’t fault your taste in music but not the best Miss Simone recorded.

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 13, 2020 10:10 PM

Lol, what a load of clap trap Iain.

Did you research & write it yourself? (Just asking).

You did add a disclaimer near the end:

“ Critics will rightly point out that I have made some assumptions to arrive at this figure. For example, we don’t know how many of those diagnosed by symptoms alone actually had COVID 19, nor how many positive tests for SARS-CoV-2 were either accurate or led to the patient developing COVID 19. In truth, we may never know.”

I totally agree – you have made assumptions.
I disagree – we will know better than we do now.

For starters May 1st was …over a month ago! Excess Deaths are now approaching 70,000. Once you admitted btl that they were the only true fact.

But I’ll let that pass.

Deaths from cancer and other causes have been within the expected range – miss that did you?

Deaths in hospitals went down as they were decanted into the community incapable of providing a similar level of care.

Deaths from work and traffic accidents went DOWN. As did these from usual hospital surgery. Yet overall deaths were up – so not just Excess but PLUS are in the frame as caused by the CV.

Not long ago you published graphs that this epidemic was just a second flu spike of the likes seen before. But you won’t update that graph to show your error. Because as you told me you aren’t interested in such sordid statistics anymore!

Yet you have again picked on one of these sordid (and out of date statistic) to yet again mislead.

What exactly is your expertise in claiming such authority of the sordid facts you despise?

John Ervin
John Ervin
Jun 13, 2020 10:23 PM
Reply to  Dungroanin

Excellent article, by the way. I wrote as much downthread wordwise, but let me give it 5+, starwise.

Free 723
Free 723
Jun 13, 2020 10:24 PM
Reply to  Dungroanin

Seems you’ve been drinking way too much Corona Kool-Aid. You’re response is in fact the misleading nonsense here. This article is not the only research looking at the massive death toll due the “lockdowns”, a death toll that quite clearly has nothing whatsoever to do with a unproven “infectious pathogen”. Do a little homework next time before spouting off your own hot-air:
 
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/341832637_All-cause_mortality_during_COVID-19_No_plague_and_a_likely_signature_of_mass_homicide_by_government_response/
 
And what “virus” or infectious pathogen in history knows not to target violent anarchists, but only peaceful “lockdown” protetsters?
 
https://globalcooperative.wordpress.com/2020/06/13/virus-not-dangerous-to-violent-anarchists-only-to-peaceful-lockdown-protesters/
 
As well as in the USA killing three-fold the people in Democrat states than Republican. Apart from the fact that 70% of all claimed “virus” deaths are happening in only six countries that account for just 10% of the global population. And on and on and on. These are not just statistical anomalies, they are statistical impossibilities if there was in truth an “infectious pathogen” going around the world.
 
Suggestion: stop drinking the Corona Kool-Aid and wake up to a few facts.

Marilyn Shepherd
Marilyn Shepherd
Jun 13, 2020 11:11 PM
Reply to  Free 723

So many morons seem to think pandemic means huge numbers, nothing will convince people I talk to that this is one of the smallest pandemics in history and is dying faster than it ever spread and the cases get less severe as it spreads. The hysterical responses are best noted in Australia where we kicked about 7 million people out of work, shut all elective surgery down, closed private hospitals, sacked thousands of nurses and the result reminds me of an old kids joke ” I strained and strained and scratched the dunny door and only farted.

14,000 people died from alzheimers last year without a single mention in any media but 50 die of dementia in 4 months and it’s a great tragedy. One teacher supposedly ”tests positive” and they shut the fucking school, we have taken half a trillion from our economy over 7300 cases.

John Ervin
John Ervin
Jun 13, 2020 11:57 PM

Seems like this nano-pandemic (judging by the really hard evidence, not the soft -corrupted?- kind) has been a Trojan Horse to kill a lot of vulnerable people.

(Just now in a very quiet neighborhood where I am about to swim in a bayside, a line of mostly very young, mostly female, all White “pro-testers” came by chanting, “Hey Hey, Ho Ho, these racist pigs have got to go!”

Not your typical demographic. Most seemed a median age of 15, along with one or two out of ten older white males. Their dads? Rather conservative, not aging progressives at all. Certainly not a BLM crowd. Awful. How could it possibly be not staged. Are they paid? They’ve been cooped up for months, so this is their first Saturday out? Almost all well dressed, casually, but expensive enough.

I think I’ll be sick again. Ayy.

Tony
Tony
Jun 13, 2020 11:25 PM
Reply to  Free 723

This virus exists, deffo. It’s a virus that asks a lot of questions of our immune system, deffo. And it’s been around for several months longer than we are being led to believe. I had it last October, and finally cleared it this February. For only the second time in my life, I had to go to bed for several days (the previous time being when I got swine flu in 2009, which also nearly killed my baby boy). A police officer I know told me that it went through his station last December like a dose of salts, and he went to bed for several days (a first for him) with it. Medics I know say, knowing what they know now, it’s been around since at least last September. It’s a nasty illness, for sure. BUT THERE WERE NO EXCESS DEATHS LAST YEAR, OR UP UNTIL MARCH THIS YEAR. THE EXCESS DEATHS ONLY STARTED AFTER LOCKDOWN.

rachel
rachel
Jun 14, 2020 12:59 AM
Reply to  Tony

i had it 5 years ago. triggered by trying to run home from the bar. only cleared up when i found a sunny hotel with a hot bath n sauna.

rachel
rachel
Jun 14, 2020 1:31 AM
Reply to  rachel

had internet dongle to the cell network. must have had a whole load of viruses coz it would get better n then worse. when i left that apartment it got better. vitamin d supplement didnt work neither. had a nasty one last summer but there was this high power wifi repeater on. i think with lockdown there was a lot of wifi in residential errors. more than normal. switching all that off over night would be easy thing 4 people to do.

Martin Usher
Martin Usher
Jun 14, 2020 3:10 AM
Reply to  rachel

If you get breathing problems in a particular building, especailly an apartment, then its worth checking for mold.
 
There are all sorts of things that can cause weird diseases that you don’t really think of until after the event. One we get locally is ‘Valley Fever’ caused by spores in the ground that get kicked up after an earthquake. Another sort of problem comes with rodents. Its so variable, and the effects so varied, that its easy to seize on something concrete like wifi as the cause.

breweriana
breweriana
Jun 14, 2020 10:10 AM
Reply to  Martin Usher

Well spotted.

breweriana
breweriana
Jun 14, 2020 10:08 AM
Reply to  Tony

There is no ‘virus.’
You got the flu. So?

Tony
Tony
Jun 14, 2020 2:53 PM
Reply to  breweriana

I got the flu for four months. Yeah, right.

breweriana
breweriana
Jun 14, 2020 6:41 PM
Reply to  Tony

Spectacular.
You were diagnosed with a fake ‘virus’ that had not even appeared in China when you got sick, you must be really unlucky.
 
Oh wait, no, you are VERY lucky – you survived 4 MONTHS with the fake ‘virus’ and LIVED!
Laura Kuensberg should interview you for the BBC – what a story!
/s

Tony
Tony
Jun 14, 2020 7:49 PM
Reply to  breweriana

The virus has been around since last autumn, at least. It’s not the flu. It’s different, and it’s much harder to shake off once it gets onto your respiratory tract. It’s no more of a killer that the seasonal flu, but it’s different, as anyone who has had it knows. You would quickly stfu with your “it doesn’t exist” nonsense if you started with it, troll.

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 14, 2020 9:42 AM
Reply to  Free 723

“ And what “virus” or infectious pathogen in history knows not to target violent anarchists, but only peaceful “lockdown” protetsters?”

The protestors are almost unanimously not violent anarchists – except for a few deepstate organised agit propers in their black masked outfits – straight out their colour insurgencey playbook which has failed in HK as it has in most places they tried.

Most protesters will obviously not be in the vulnerable age groups or categories- obviously.

What peaceful lock down protestors do you mean? The heavily armed ones that invaded some state building in the paranoid schizoid psychopathic white supremacy little America with tiny dick syndrome gangs?

Tony
Tony
Jun 13, 2020 10:35 PM
Reply to  Dungroanin

Deaths from cancer and other causes have been within the expected range – miss that did you?”
 
Because deaths by cancer have been attributed to covid19.
 
Deaths in hospitals went down as they were decanted into the community incapable of providing a similar level of care.”
 
Because deaths from all causes have gone up due to lack of hospital treatments. And deaths in care homes have gone up exponentially because elderly hospital patients showing ANY signs of respiratory illness have been decanted into nursing homes (sometimes under the false pretence of not having a respiratory condition), thus seeding said nursing homes with whatever respiratory condition the discharged patient was suffering from. All resulting deaths, of course, labelled “covid19”.

WorldParole
WorldParole
Jun 13, 2020 10:39 PM
Reply to  Dungroanin

Deaths from cancer and other causes have been labeled “covid.”
 
The tallies have been predetermined. That’s why you see the near same infection / mortality rates in Cruise Ship pilot program, city health departments, and just wait for CHAZ rates to solidify these same ratios – unless it’s an “accelerated program.”
 
All considered, we really aren’t seeing any numbers too far outside normal fatality rate expected for the year non-covid.

Iain
Iain
Jun 13, 2020 10:53 PM
Reply to  Dungroanin

Thanks DG. I don’t understand your argument. ONS released data that showed excess mortality above the 5 year statistical norm of 12,900 who did not have CV. By June 9th the BBC were reporting 13,601. These people died of something and it doesn’t appear to have been CV. Can we agree on that?
 
The fact that cancer deaths declined is no surprise either. One of the central points in the article is that people with cancer aren’t being screened or treated for cancer so of course there are less recorded cancer deaths. However, as highlighted in the article, the coding of CV deaths is incredibly liberal.
 
There is no reason at all to suspect less people are actually dying of cancer but there are numerous, well documented reasons to suspect those dying of cancer are being recorded as CV deaths.
 
Again you bring up timing. Are you aware that the ONS report cited is their latest analysis? (other than weekly reports) If some broader analysis is required, I am not aware of a more recent ONS report.
 
So too the BBC report cited. That is for estimated deaths up to June 9th. I hope you can appreciate it isn’t possible to provide a running commentary in an article. You can only work with the evidence you’ve got, you can’t anticipate what it will be.
 
So what we are left with is 50,000 or so deaths that occurred during the lockdown that were attributed to CV. The question posed in the article is how reliable is that attribution. I have cited numerous peer reviewed papers, quotes from senior officials and articles in leading journals that address that issue.
 
In my view, as a result, I estimate that at least 34,000 people have died during the lockdown who almost certainly didn’t have CV. We do indeed need to know what they died from. We might guess that at least 40% them died from the top five causes of death. But unless someone actually checks overy death certificate to analyse them we are stuck.
 
We are stuck because two thirds of them have been recorded as CV deaths.
 
By all means challenge my reasoning but please cite some evidence or at least speak about what element of the evidence provided in the article you disagree with. If you think my estimate of asymptomatic cases is wrong please say so and cite some evidence to back up your reasoning.
 
I am up for debate DG but if you don’t evidence your thinking I have little to consider.

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 14, 2020 12:33 AM
Reply to  Iain

Iain,

You have yet again failed to address the points I made at and about your previous articles – have it your own way, it is here for the record now.

I will agree with you only that there are ALL deaths and within that there are Excess deaths.

These are the fixed constants.

Average deaths are recorded with a historical cause of death.

Comparing the current causes of deaths for each periods average, will show whether these averages are consistent. If there are significant variations they will require explanation.

Can you agree with me on that?

You state
“ But unless someone actually checks overy death certificate to analyse them we are stuck.”

I agree and they WILL be checked. There are plenty of researchers who will. Once all the records are in. So don’t worry one of us will be proved wrong!

In the meantime the ONS may have published ‘Covid’ deaths but they didn’t measure them, that was done by other bodies – who work under political guidance. In my opinion they shouldn’t have ‘released’ them as part of their regular reports until the analysis was done. Who knows why they suddenly started reporting these external numbers?

The politicians wanted to visibly understate CV deaths – so they wouldn’t look so drastic. Because they are politicians.
The media are their partners – that’s why they almost all have gone along with that subterfuge.

ALL deaths weren’t tested for CV. So the only reliable way of seeing what may have been these CV deaths is to see how many deaths above expected causes of death there are which can not therefore be classed as these expected causes.

Currently the upper level of that is the Excess Deaths. (As the FT, being a paper that relies on facts for its reputation, has been the only MSM publication to state it.)

These Excess Deaths are therefore the only reliable estimate of CV deaths. Until we have the statistical examination of all death certificates, which as I say will be able to be done.

Probably quicker than usual.

George Mc
George Mc
Jun 14, 2020 8:29 AM
Reply to  Dungroanin

the only reliable way of seeing what may have been these CV deaths is to see how many deaths above expected causes of death there are which can not therefore be classed as these expected causes.

 
The only way of seeing how many unexpected deaths MAY be COVID is to see how many unexpected deaths were unexpected?

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 14, 2020 9:47 AM
Reply to  George Mc

Well done George – you’re finally on the road to getting the hang of analysis of raw data.

Unlike the author (?).

Have a nice Sunday.

IANA
IANA
Jun 14, 2020 2:04 PM
Reply to  Dungroanin

As I’m sure you are well aware what it says on the death certificate and what the actual death was of are 2 very different things. I say you will be aware because evidence was freely available here that described the changes to the recordings of death and who it was done by. This effectively rendered the cause of death as being meaningless. Adding these up to provide some analysis will prove nothing. The mnemonic GIGO was named for just such a process.
 
Can you please provide a link for the assertion ‘politicians wanted to visibly understate CV deaths…’ because all the evidence is clearly to the contrary.
 
As has been stated before politicians and their ‘media partners’ have been using just such figures to justify the unwarranted ‘lockdown’ of this country. To claim that the media are partners in such an activity is risible. Just look at the constant fear porn numbers iterated by the DM on a daily / weekly basis. Those ‘figures’ were used by the media no doubt in conjunction with politicians to enforce the most draconian removal of liberties this country has ever seen.
 
You are clearly using just such figures to support that narrative. But the evidence clearly doesn’t support that.

breweriana
breweriana
Jun 14, 2020 10:13 AM
Reply to  Iain

Why waste time on the paid troll?

S Cooper
S Cooper
Jun 14, 2020 12:00 AM
Reply to  Dungroanin

AVOID THE RUSH, FRAG YOUR GENERAL TODAY!
 
 comment image
 
 
 
 
OBEY!
 comment image?auto=webp&s=16beb1de9d08da9bf7a6dd71321cba37ce989dae
 
SO THE CORPORATE FASCIST OLIGARCH MOBSTER PSYCHOPATHS CAN SCREW YOU EVEN MORE.
 

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 14, 2020 9:49 AM
Reply to  S Cooper

What is the unseen image?

S Cooper
S Cooper
Jun 14, 2020 10:46 AM
Reply to  Dungroanin
George Mc
George Mc
Jun 14, 2020 9:42 AM
Reply to  Dungroanin

Excess Deaths are now approaching 70,000. Once you admitted btl that they were the only true fact. But I’ll let that pass.

 
Which implies …what? That death has now become a synonym for COVID?
 

Deaths in hospitals went down as they were decanted into the community incapable of providing a similar level of care.

 
Deaths in hospitals went down because there were less people in hospital. Well, who would have thought?
 

Deaths from work and traffic accidents went DOWN. As did these from usual hospital surgery. Yet overall deaths were up – so not just Excess but PLUS are in the frame as caused by the CV.

 
Note capitals! This must be significant! Deaths from work went down because almost everyone had to stay home. Traffic accidents ditto. Usual hospital surgery ditto ditto. Yet “overall deaths were up – so not just Excess but PLUS are in the frame as caused by the CV.” Oh! I see now! Since all those deaths that WOULD have happened at home, in traffic and in hospital are now, since they happened elsewhere, “in the frame as caused by the CV” Note weasel manoeuvre: “in the frame as caused by” = “caused by”.
 
You’ve actually revealed the entire CV strategy: Move deaths from here to there and they automatically become “CV”.

breweriana
breweriana
Jun 14, 2020 10:15 AM
Reply to  George Mc

I cannot understand why anyone wastes time on the obviously paid troll ‘DG.’

Steve Hayes
Steve Hayes
Jun 14, 2020 11:34 AM
Reply to  breweriana

Why would anyone pay for such poor trolling?

John Ervin
John Ervin
Jun 14, 2020 5:40 PM
Reply to  Steve Hayes

Those guys have an endless supply of cash, and right now are stealing trillions more. Billions to burn. That should explain it.

Steve Hayes
Steve Hayes
Jun 15, 2020 8:27 AM
Reply to  John Ervin

It might explain why they would pay for trolling; but it does not explain why they would pay for such poor trolling.

Cheezilla
Cheezilla
Jun 14, 2020 12:24 PM
Reply to  George Mc

That death has now become a synonym for COVID?
Covid has become a synonym for death.
“Case” has become a synonym for inevitable death.

rachel
rachel
Jun 13, 2020 10:00 PM

i think their theory would suggest 2nd wave is planned for sooner than autumn ie soon. maby a bluf to make people think there is time. i would suggest rule one should be to switch off the tv. the web is also unreliable n allows them to c what is going on. id suggest printers n photocopiers, phone public meetings parties. share info on lymphatic system. dr morse has videos explaining how it is actually healthy to detox. john rose says how first hand experience with fruit can disspell the virus propaganda that has been heaped on us. expect great success.

breweriana
breweriana
Jun 14, 2020 10:16 AM
Reply to  rachel

2nd wave is planned for”
Late December, to cancel Christmas.

Martin Usher
Martin Usher
Jun 13, 2020 9:46 PM

You have to separate two distinct phenomena. One is a virus. The other is the government’s reaction to it. I think the UK government’s reaction was too much, too late — it was a bit slow in recognizing the problem and then it over-reacted complete with heavy handed enforcement that seemed perfectly designed to annoy and alienate large segments of the population. Here in the US the response has been variable and largely dictated by politics. The Republican response to this has been to a large extent denial; they were slow to take this seriously despite ample warnings, quick to blame everyone and everything for allowing it to get out of hand and now anxious to justify their position by denying that this virus was ever a problem even as its exacting quite a death toll on vulnerable segments of the population.
 
When I read articles like this it sounds very much like the apologists you get in the White House and its media allies plus the usual fringe stuff about conspiracies. The WH deals with inconvenient facts by trying to change the conversation, its a sort of Looking Glass reaction where they convince us that black is white, up is down and , in this case, that the virus is no big deal. (Personally, I’m all for Trump supporters’ denial — I think of it as Natural Selection in action.) There are huge stakes involved, everything hinges on November and with the money involved there’s funding to afford the very best reality shapers that money can buy. The problem is that you can only go so far with this without it starting to look and sound a bit weird. Ultimately what’s at stake is the entire future of monetarism; this ideology has ruled our countries (both the US and the UK) for 40 years or more. It has very shaky theoretical foundations and has proven only capable of resisting economic shocks by gradually eating the stored worth of society as a whole. The result has been obvious to see — its been very profitable for some but its left a lot of others in a poverty trap (and they’ve started to notice). One of the classic defense strategies in this situation is diversion — nationalism to get people to circle the wagons and the dark conspiracies of outsiders being both the reason why things aren’t going that well. Even this is starting to get a bit old and tired, though. Take solace from the fact that if it wasn’t Covid that shook the tree it would have been something else — even if the virus had never happened we were riding for a fall (and anyway, these viruses are like buses — there will be another one along in a minute).

George Mc
George Mc
Jun 14, 2020 2:31 PM
Reply to  Martin Usher

even if the virus had never happened we were riding for a fall

 
I think you’ve got that the wrong way round. We were heading for a fall therefore the virus HAD to happen. And I’m sure there will be as many along in a minute as is required.

Marfanoid
Marfanoid
Jun 13, 2020 9:39 PM

They are doing it right in front of our eyes.Obvious now.The second wave started today.Lockdown.You protesters are to blame is what they will feed you.Lets have a protest then.

rachel
rachel
Jun 13, 2020 11:23 PM
Reply to  Marfanoid

it is like the new rules video from dua lipa. even if you want to go out there is only garden party. i did have a good night in the market square. guitar n nice people. they hooked me up with a tent n sleeping bag but i got out of town the next day. ariana grande has a interesting song called get well soon. i seem to go between confidance n terror. getting happy again. i need to communicate. the worst was sitting back even tho going online freeks me out. ariana has song about breathing. it is like an attack on music this covid shit. i bet she wants to sing live.

Willem
Willem
Jun 13, 2020 9:04 PM

Cause specific deaths are always a bit ‘tricky’, so I would focus on morbidity (hospitalizations), for which hospitals are payed.

When the numbers are in, we will most likely see that admissions due to Covid19 will be counterbalanced by a plummet (as compared with previous years) of hospitalizations due to

Pneumonia
Influenza
COPD excacerbation
Pulmonary embolism
Unstable Angina

And the reason for that is that those diseases are somewhat comparable as towards symptomatology and risk factors of Covid19 (with pulmonary embolism being very comparable to Covid19, which is my hobby-horse…). And the meaning of that is that doctors massively mistreated their patients as if they had Covid19 while in fact that had some of the above, for which you need another treatment than ventilation! So that is where Medicine will know what is sin*

And in terms of cause specific morbidity and mortality where there is no reason for doubt, we will see that suicide attempts and suicides have gone up in 2020. So that is where mathematicians (those who made the stupid ‘flattening the curve’ models) will know what is sin*

I don’t think you need a crystal ball to make such predictions.

Problem is, it will take at least a year when such 2020 data become fully available by national statistics institutes (that is the usual time frame in NL). Given that this damming result can in no way be hidden from the books, and given that those who activated/supported the lockdown are (currently) in no way able to admit their ‘mistake’, I would not consider it unlikely if we, by that time are kept from the truth by yet another distraction, just like we are now distracted from the fact that Covid19 was a nothing burger with the BLM ‘protests’…

What kind of distraction could that be?

Well.. Perhaps by that time it will finally kick in that we are in a huge recession, which can only lead to massive job loss, a stock market crash, and a huge loss of pension funds that are totally depended on the stock market. By that time, ‘we’ might not care about Covid19 anymore since there are many other problems to face, this time real problems…

That sort of future may not come, but I am preparing for the worst.

—————-

*Not that doctors and mathematicians will feel any regret whatsoever. They probably react like ‘Father’ (a scientist who invented the bomb in Vonnegut’s novel ‘Cat’s Cradle’ reacted), that is as follows

‘After the thing went off, after it was a sure thing that America could wipe out a city with just one bomb, a scientist turned to Father and said, ‘Science has now known sin. ‘ And do you know what Father said? He said, ‘What is sin?”

John Ervin
John Ervin
Jun 13, 2020 10:33 PM
Reply to  Willem

It’s too bad they can’t have the bogus fractional voting we are engineering in USA, as Bev Harris writes about, fragmenting the death counts statwise.

If they have to report a death as a Covid death as the chief cause, then it’s almost sure you’re going to see respiratory deaths in those pools of stats plummet in post facto number-crunching analysis? Therein should lie the proof of their statistical pudding. If they crunch the numbers of co-morbidities, unless they’re outright lying, those numbers should show they’re cooking the books to make this relatively harmless corona look like a “cold-blooded” killer?

John Ervin
John Ervin
Jun 13, 2020 10:40 PM
Reply to  Willem

Another literary light, Samuel Beckett, stated that, in modern times, “the only sin is to be born”.

But as a one size fits all cap, that seems to obviate personal responsibility, for any faith worth the word, and also seems a form of what Bonhoeffer calls “cheap grace”, it would appear, by the standards of one who became (as in the name of the film bio of his life) an “Agent of Grace” and whose 1945 martyr’s grace didn’t come so cheaply.

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 14, 2020 9:56 AM
Reply to  Willem

And so it goes…

Of course based on
“I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds.”

Rob
Rob
Jun 13, 2020 9:00 PM

However if you look at the models of how many infections and deaths would have resulted from no action and just take an average it would have been significantly higher than the excess deaths so far. Indeed most of these excess deaths not caused directly by covid would have died anyway and covid merely hastened them.

rachel
rachel
Jun 13, 2020 9:29 PM
Reply to  Rob

models have no basis other than to jutify the attrocity. dr morse explains cold n flu symptoms r detox symptoms easy to clean up on fruit. deaths r from medical treatments eg. paracetamol.

Marilyn Shepherd
Marilyn Shepherd
Jun 13, 2020 11:14 PM
Reply to  Rob

NOw that is just as stupid as basing behaviour on a fake model done by a fake who is always wrong, the nations who didn’t shut down and trash their economies are faring very well.

Dungroanin
Dungroanin
Jun 14, 2020 10:01 AM
Reply to  Rob

Yeah Rob you’ll die too anyway , I’m sure you don’t worry about being ‘hastened’ to your demise – heck you can even sign up for it and head to Switzerland if you aren’t too bothered to hang about – maybe a crowdfunded effort if you haven’t got enough?

Perspective eh?

tonyopmoc
tonyopmoc
Jun 13, 2020 8:55 PM

I’m feeling better now, my wife was seriously complaining watching this on her computer. She said the sound is completely out of synch – like not just a bit, but like the sound was coming out about one second after the lips moved.
 
“DOWNLOAD FESTIVAL TV: SATURDAY – Official Evening Show! (Showing one time only)” 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fX1vDJCmylI&feature=youtu.be
 
So I tried it on my PC with my big screen sound system – and it was all in synch -but she doesn’t like it as loud as me….
 
Can you fix it?
 
So I deleted all her 29703 trackers, and rebooted her PC minus Facebook.
 
Works fine now, so I got her another glass of wine…
 
We will be dancing together in the garden soon and really annoying the neighbours
 
She says no you cannot take the speakers outside.
 
Tony.
 

Marfanoid
Marfanoid
Jun 13, 2020 9:24 PM
Reply to  tonyopmoc

You always want to make us laugh.Thankyou man.

Mikeb
Mikeb
Jun 13, 2020 8:30 PM

In a way it doesnt matter about covid or any other thing. Its whats coming. Its not just me you can “feel it in your water” as my gran used to say. Somethings coming and its not good. I cant say what but im unsettled and have been for a while.
Whether its the asteroid debris were currently going through, whether its the creeping totalitarianism. Somethings not right cant putmy finger on it like a lot if other people. Maybe off guardian could start a blog site so we can keep in touch with each other maybe for mutual support if something does happen?
Or maybe someone else knows of somewhere we can congregate?

Marfanoid
Marfanoid
Jun 13, 2020 9:33 PM
Reply to  Mikeb

I agree.

Marfanoid
Marfanoid
Jun 13, 2020 9:35 PM
Reply to  Marfanoid

Where is Mucho ?

Loverat
Loverat
Jun 13, 2020 9:36 PM
Reply to  Mikeb

Mikeb

I have a similar feeling of unease.

Somewhere to congregate? I suggest Tony’s garden. We can have a glass of wine and a dance and for lunch try some of his second earlies.

By the way, echo the post below. Some great articles on RT today. Incidentally , my comment congratulating the author on a hilarious article about celebrities was declined.

John Smith
John Smith
Jun 13, 2020 10:19 PM
Reply to  Mikeb

I hear you.

Had it hanging over me last week or so.

Quite disturbing truth be told

John Ervin
John Ervin
Jun 13, 2020 10:52 PM
Reply to  Mikeb

What’s “not right”, seems to me, is we have an unprecedented wave or tsunami of tech coming at us, and all the new (and age-old) tech that is quite daunting. Seems to me anyway. Not a lot we can do about it, except come closer to actual goodness, of the eternal variety (eternal as in, above, and outside, all their controlling gadgetry).

And that always shows that their “power” –however mesmerizing– is in the end illusory and far less powerful than it seems, and as a great side effect we are led to the rule of true Power, which is in aggregate One and indivisible.

Almost like this is all supposed to happen!

“Almost”!

Well, I am sure more prayer may well solve that!

gordon
gordon
Jun 13, 2020 11:42 PM
Reply to  Mikeb

5g
 
a military weapon crown control designed in israel
banned in israel
 
a kill grid
an ashkanazi khazar gift
a final solution
certainly for the world
 
something is indeed cooking
the dish
 
microwaved goyim
targeted phased array
way beyond the accuracy of ta sniper team hit triangulation 
 
frying tonight
 

Jim McDonagh
Jim McDonagh
Jun 13, 2020 8:19 PM

Great article . Coincidental to my being banned from RT for criticizing their coverage of the panic-demic as that channel begins its climb down from the MSM covid panic express bus with an article exposing the fraud?