If It Was Allowed, I’d Hold You Down and…
Edward Curtin
I think it is generally accepted that the practice of medicine has changed radically over the past fifty or so years. The medicalization and corporatization of life have “progressed” simultaneously as most doctors have become obedient servants of the corporate state.
But wait, one may object, and with some justification.
The development of micro-surgical techniques has significantly improved the methods of many operations that were formally very invasive and posed a great risk to the elderly and chronically sick. Many people have had knee, hip, and heart surgeries – to name a few – that would have been problematic or impossible in the past. Body part replacements are now common.
Soon everyone will be half-mechanical on the way to full robotization with a bit of pig and cow thrown in for good measure. Whether this is good is debatable on many levels, but the “procedures” (a word that seems to have replaced the more gruesome sounding words “operations” or “surgeries”) have clearly become more efficient and less invasive. These micro-surgical techniques have surely saved lives and improved the quality of life for many.
So much for the technology. I have a little medical tale to tell.
My best friend, an athletic man in his mid-seventies in excellent health and athletic shape, went to a new doctor at a medical practice since his doctor of thirty-five years had retired. The visit was for an annual physical that was required under the practice’s rules. He had previously met this doctor for a required brief meet-and-greet introduction and all seemed copacetic.
This time, he was ushered into the examination room where he sat and waited for the doctor. A nurse took his blood pressure and pulse and departed. The doctor soon arrived with an iPad and sat down next to him. He put the man’s records up on the screen. He then proceeded to review a list of inoculations my friend did or didn’t have. My friend – let’s call him Joe – has always been a guy who took very little medicine and was rarely sick; at the most he would take an aspirin or a few ibuprofen after a vigorous workout.
“I see you had a tetanus shot,” said the doctor.
“Yes, after I cut my hand.”
“And at your age it’s good you had a pneumonia vaccine.”
“I did,” said Joe, “but I kind of regret it.”
“Oh no, at your age you are at great risk from dying from pneumonia,” replied the doctor. He added, “And you haven’t had your shingles vaccination, which I highly recommend. It’s covered by Medicare now. You don’t want to get shingles; it’s terrifying.”
Joe said nothing.
“And you are due for a flu vaccine.”
“I never had one and never will,” said Joe.
“At your age you can die from the flu. It’s very dangerous. I definitely recommend you get it.”
“No thanks.”
“You really should.”
His voice rising, the doctor said, “And I see you have not gotten any Covid vaccines. You are really risking your life by not doing so. You must get them.”
Joe then succinctly explained his deep knowledge about Covid, the “vaccines,” their lack of testing, the mRNA technique, the deaths and injuries, etc. – all the reasons he opposed them.
The doctor became agitated. He argued back; explained how he had gone to Yale and studied the mRNA process under Drs F Teufelmeister and AE Newman and that he knew the vaccines were very safe and effective blah blah blah.
Joe said, “It doesn’t matter that you went to Yale. I emphatically disagree.”
This incensed the doctor, who blurted out, “If it was allowed, I would hold you down and inject you right now.”
“Is that so?” said Joe, incredulous.
The annual physical ended soon thereafter.
The doctor never laid a hand on Joe to examine him. No stethoscope; no ear, throat or nose checks; no hands on any part of his body – the exam was exclusively about vaccinations, read off a screen. Technical in all regards. All about how Joe was so very vulnerable and could die without them. The doctor was Big Pharma’s mouthpiece. Death threats devoid of any human touch, cold and sterile, and a wish that he could hold Joe down and forcibly inject him, the touch of the fascist mind expressed in a wish.
When Joe told me this story, I, being a student of the sociology of medicine, was reminded of the history of eugenics and the sick minds of people who think they can cull the herd because of their power and prestige. The sordid history that continues under euphemisms such as genetic research.
Here was a doctor who dared to say what others no doubt think as well: “I would hold you down and inject you right now,” if only I could. But since he can’t, the state must find other ways to coerce, such as compulsory medical requirements.
Such are totalitarian dreams made of, when death has become a commodity used to sell the dreams of reason, and the healer’s art, once linked to working with nature, has become an adjunct of state propaganda.
When I later met Joe at the coffeeshop, I brought him my copy of Ivan Illich’s Medical Nemesis: The Expropriation of Health, one of the great books of modern times.
Thumbing through it, Joe came to a page where I had underlined the following:
The ritualization of crisis, a general trait of a morbid society, does three things for the medical functionary. It provides him with a license that usually only the military can claim. Under the stress of crisis, the professional who is believed to be in command can easily presume immunity from the ordinary rules of decency and justice. He who is assigned control over death ceases to be an ordinary human. As with the director of a triage, his killing is covered by policy. More important, his entire performance takes place in an aura of crisis.
On my way home I stopped to pick up my sister’s mail. The AARP Bulletin was in the box with her letters. This is one of two publications of the AARP organization, a powerful lobbying group and medical insurance company with 38 million members for people fifty years-old and over. The AARP Bulletin and AARP The Magazine are the largest circulation publications in the United States with a combined distribution of approximately 67 million.
The cover story on The AARP Bulletin is:
How To Stay Safe This Summer
Extreme Weather Covid Concerns Tick-Borne Diseases Bad Drivers Food Poisoning Home-Repair Rip-offs Crazy Utility Bills
Is there anything not to fear in this morbid culture where crises are promoted faster than the therapeutic and hygienic “remedies” offered to deal with them? Create the diseases and all the bogeymen and then offer pseudo-solutions straight from the sorcerer’s playbook.
Build the fear and they will come, knocking at the sorcerers’ doors.
If it were allowed, I would lift you up with a simple truth.
Edward Curtin is an independent writer whose work has appeared widely over many years. His website is edwardcurtin.com and his new book is Seeking Truth in a Country of Lies.
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Threats of death can go both ways, and sometimes they should.
My wife has reminded me to go to the walk-in clinic (I do not have a physician) for a growing wart on my forehead, for about 3 months now.
She is also non-vexxed like me, but she still feels her physician can be trusted. But does she get defensive when I tell her that ANY GP that stays silent on the CoronaPrank cannot be trusted.
A doctor threatening violence, its probably a hate crime call the police.
Your mention of Dr. A.E. Newman brought back memories. I used to see A.E. Newman in a certain magazine. I liked that magazine so much, I was simply MAD about it. But something bothered me about A.E. Newman. He often seemed like he didn’t care about certain things; he would give the impression that he “wasn’t worried”. I’m not familiar with Dr. Teufelmeister though. Maybe draeger can help me out.
Preventive medicine makes allopathic and naturopathic medicine stone age medicine, even most operations can be avoided. We are dealing with suicidal self destructive life styles. Dehydration from tap water, poor diets, pesticides, gmo, chemicals, slavery, media kill, media disinformation etc ..instead of all vaccine articles hardly anything that shows an article about what health really is about..
Maybe a sign to look at.
.this article shows how poor it is in information about what is needed for health to occur, to be sustained and maintained…
I had the great misfortune yesterday to read a lengthy transcript of an interview with Reimert Ravenholt. I assure you that they damn well would love to hold you down and inject you as well as give you a tubal ligation/vasectomy, and they’d do it with a smile.
“Drs F Teufelmeister and AE Newman” — hahahaha perfect!
I am very much like Joe in many respects, generally quite healthy but slowly succumbing to the glorious effects of the aging process. My last visit with the doctor roughly three months ago was not as extreme as what Joe went through, but the suggestions for the pneumonia, flu, shingles, and virus vaccines were made. I declined them all as I have for years.
I am old enough to remember when in my Wonder Years I was give three vaccines, one polio and two others, I can’t remember what they were for. And a tetanus shot for when I was running around carelessly and punctured the bottom of my foot with a nail again. That was it. There are more than 60 vaccines routinely given today I think? How is it that I am in pretty good shape for my age when I had only three?
The fact that parents of litle children are routinely being coerced into injecting their children with several vaccines is very painful.
I wish the deliberate harmful injuries inflicted on children by world oligarchy-controlled pharma and governments would stop right now.
When adults are told to take vaccines, there is at least an opportunity for them to research and say no, or get a fake certificate if it is required to travel or for any other company or govt-required activity.
But what about children? Do they have such a chance to study and research?
No vaccination of children should be allowed. Period. Become adults and then decide for your selves.
Yorks Lancs. Kids childern are out unless you are a believer we are all worthless crumb based coroner’s connected by our umbilical cords. ei ie OH. My Mothers real name was Dorothy. However, as a baby boy teen youngster I was for ever never going to call her by that name exactly…mums were dot. She was always dot,..something we all were aware of to include my self as a two year old baby boy.
In my personal experience there no irony in any physical invention of who you are other than touch. My Mums name was dot, it’s Ironic not an irony..that’s for you Gents and Ladies to figure out I can’t who else can..?
One doctor admitted indirectly that tetanus may not exist as a disease. OTOH, a vaccine that WHO and others pushed has sterilised about 150 million “Third-World” women and girls, and maybe the breast-feeding babies at the material time too. By coincidence, the hormone involved was the same one now causing reproductive damage in the covid-jabbed.
Tetanus need not exist but it does. It’s best left to an Industrial accident endings into the blood stream.
Chum. Shingle is an Industrial bacterial waste toxin. The reason us males notice it more than females is because of aerosol spraying. Yea, it’s a condition frustrating for British people to explain to US medical docs.
If I were Klaus Anal Schwab or Kill Gates and wished to rid the world of a large number of useless eaters because in a few decades there will be enough robots to do the work these useless eaters are now doing while depleting my precious resources, I might use the medical system. Why not.
How would I go about it?
Well, I’d probably scare the shit out of everybody with a novel disease. That in itself would do a lot of psychosomatic damage and get rid of quite a few people. Then, I’d pump fuckccine into them, that should do the trick too. Ditto respirators preventing the fuckers from breathing and locking them up to deprive them of sunshine?
But what about those who could see through that crap? Hmm. I’d probably fuck them up in the head with some shit like that there are no viruses, no diseases, that it’s all synchronization and annual detox, that doctors are asshole out to kill them so never go see them, that cancer is best treated with Vitamin C, and all sorts of other facts. That should get rid of quite a few of these pesky dissenters too.
You’re all sure you’re not being played, eh?
I would blow their brains out, if it were allowed.
Well a lot of doctors are psychopaths. Moron should get struck off for that. AVOID doctors unless absolutely necessary.
I live in an English village, of about 800 people.
About the time that the first Jabs were rolled-out … that is, December of 2020 … I conducted an informal and anonymous Poll of the people in my village.
I asked just one question, “Do you favor people being forcibly-vaccinated against Covid?”
There were only about 60 respondents, but of those, @65% supported the use of force. And, remember, this was before the hysteria really took hold.
My relationship with ‘the rest of Society’ has been forever sullied by that supposed ‘medical emergency’.
This attitude is merely an extension of the age-old attitude: should people be forcibly made to serve their (tribe, village, country) in times of war. The collective has always assumed the right to force the individual to do its bidding.
That’s not At War with The JAB in an English Village Town County or anywhere in the Whole ISLES you PRICK!
Maybe one of the saddest things about this is the “simple truth” that emerges when we pull back the veils.
Good-ish Covid news from Japan. Both I and my wife have been to the doctor’s for this or that including for annual check ups but not once in the Covid era have they asked if we’d been vaccinated. We were masked, socially distanced and separated from the staff with salad guards but nothing ever was said to us re the shots. We think Japanese docs know what’s what but obsequiousness is more important than … anything, so there you go.
His first mistake was going to the doctor when he wasn’t even sick! That’s stupid. The only reason for yearly “exams” is so drugs can be pushed and expensive often invasive tests can be needlessly performed. I quit going to doctors for no reason decades ago. He should do the same.
Never take a new car in for its 2500-mile check-up. They’ll always find something wrong.
True that, and never fall for the old MeCano trick…Lump Tranny Backend either….Head Boxed Arse.
Thank You!!! Wow. Illich’s book in 1974 a knock out. He also wrote the luminescent “Deschooling Society” also along the lines of the Great Parent 1% maintaining parental control over Humanity to thwart us from self-rule and autonomous authority to self-actualize as Ratcliffe so clearly points out.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deschooling_Society
Sounds interesting Sandy, but it doesn’t make much sense look., nothing goes over a hundred. Years months weeks days hours minutes seconds second. Heart beat., chum.
Cheers
“Sounds interesting Sandy, but it doesn’t make much sense… “
Look who’s talking. Pot calls kettle black.
Thus far I’ve read at least 10 of your comments Mr Williams and thus far, not one of them makes any sense.
“Screw your freedom”. Doctors (and most nurses) aren’t alone with that. Remember Arnold S., who just had a tv interview saying he would run for president if only he was qualified. We saw the true colors come out during the first couple years of the scamdemic, they aren’t fading away. They were a warning. One thing that irks me to no end is the support for Trump, the self proclaimed “King of the Covid-19 vaccine”. I’ve seen many conservatives/republicans, etc., come out and say he’d better reverse himself on that, but he keeps doubling down saying HE saved millions of lives. I had thought a good percentage of his MAGA base were on the Covid-19 is fake side, but his self proclamations as King of the Vaccine don’t bother them one bit. That’s disappointing and an indicator that there really aren’t as many of us as we think, at least not as many that are willing to fight it. Somehow, this has to be made a drawing line with the next US presidential election.
I agree with you 100%. Though I tend to side with US conservatives and even more so, libertarian positions, and find the Woke to be braindead zombies, I am gobsmacked by much of the arrogance of these people who pride themselves on their “critical” thinking. And it is not just the Trumptards. They are the first to recite the real (negligible) fatality statistics of the SARS-CoV-2 and its purported cv-1984, and are proud of being “pure bloods,” yet as the bat soup theory falls apart, they are so proud of having advocated the gain-of-function weaponization in the Wuhan lab and its consequent “leak.” For me, this is an obvious Deep State fall back position planned even before the scamdemic rollout which conservatives and many libertarians fell into like a fly into a bucket of piss. Riddle me this Batman. If the real fatality statistics are no greater for SARS-CoV-2 than a moderate flu, exactly what did all this gain-of-function weaponization of a virus from hell produce? While Del Bigtree has done good work warning the public of the dangers of the fake vaccine and the real fatality statistics of cv-1984, he is also so prideful and arrogant of this stupid position.
RFK Jr also promotes this GOF nonsense.
it’s a sort of consolation prize for belief that there was an actual “COVID pandemic” which is clearly rubbish as many articles on the site, as well as other sources (not to mention simple common sense observation), have made clear over the last few years.
Yep. A very deluded and dangerous character.
He’s also a firm and devout believer in the great society wrecking ‘climate crisis’ boondoggle and has even stated publicly that all ‘climate deniers’ should be rounded up and taken to climate change re-education camps.
Watch this snippet from impromptu interview he did in Nov 2014.
https://www.bitchute.com/video/iD1J3uc4M2ho/
The next US presidential election will be the same circus as all the others have been for decades.
Normal citizens have no say in the matter, nor will they be dictating which lines will be drawn by either party. Their input is not required, although of course they can participate in the circus if they wish.
Quite apart from the fact that all western political parties actually follow the US-NATO-
-UN-EU lead when it gets down to the nitty-gritty of foreign policy, elections today are fixed, and there’s not much we can do about it except refuse to accept the lie that they actually mean something.
How many times do we have to witness a western politician campaigning on ‘new’ promises to root out corruption, or proposing a ‘new’ agenda, only to watch him/her crumble in the face of US threats and end up doing what all the others have done for ages?
Is that supposed to be a coincidence?
No. It’s either all pre-arranged, or people go into politics with unspeakable naiveté.
Probably a mixture of both.
How can we talk about ‘democracy and freedom’, when nothing in our political systems can even tolerate the existence of those things?
This is a spiritual war, and nobody who treats it as if it was a purely material concern is going to witness any kind of victory.
Well of course I know that man. Every western country is that way, that should go without saying on a blog like this. I think we’ve gone over that about a million times. It doesn’t mean we can’t make some points along the way. Like telling the MAGA cult how hypocritical they are. The left and democratic party are totally useless at this point but there may be some hay to be made on the right. Or we can just sit back and watch and not do a thing. For me, I’m telling as many people as I can. To me its a war for freedom. If that’s spiritual, then so be it.
I suspect if voters begin to stay away from voting they will cheat on this issue too.
Everybody I know and meet didnt vote, but news says 78% voted, see we have democracy.
I and McCarthy warned you guys. Communism is right here in America coming to your doormat, and you signed, jabbed and voted them in voluntary……..LOL.
There’s nothing spiritual about promulgated, planned disinfo, tyranny, racketeering and fraud. It’s all planned. It’s all war gamed. It’s all premeditated. It’s all lies and disinfo.
That’s not spiritual it’s autocratic. And it can only happen in a despotic, pyramid system, which runs the entire world, not just one country or one bloc.
So the real war is informational. It’s truth versus lies.
if you speak against vaccines, you are a dead man, socially and economically, Trump is not a hero, he is a rich mediocre man.
Similarly, we saw “saviour of free speech” Elon Musk’s true colours when asked about the coup in Bolivia (to grab the lithium deposits and thwart China contracts). His answer was along the lines of “Tough luck”.
He twitted, “We’ll coup whoever we want. Deal with it.” Deleted it later.
Sweet. Elon Musk~olini
Yet it was Trump who, in August 2020, chose Scott Atlas as an advisor to the Coronavirus Task Force, who was a man who was extremely critical of the pandemic and C-19, who wrote the book “A Plague upon our house” and to this day is described in Wikipedia as a man who spread disinformation about COVID-19…
Regardless, he is out there NOW stating that Covid-19 is real, the fake vaccines are effective, and he saved millions of lives. I think that “trumps” appointing Scott Atlas to his task force.
What’s funny is that part of the prestige of being a doctor had always been the almost artistic side of it. Independent gps would treat each patient as an individual and actually listen to them! Now you just work for a corporation and follow guidelines written by drug companies. And to top it off your boss the practice manager doesn’t even have a bachelor’s degree.
this doctor has a lot of potential. in canada, he can become a prime minister.
in australia, he can be a premier and defence minister and advisor to the health minister, all at once.
You forgot to mention that in Canada he can be the deputy prime minister, finance minister, justice minister…name it, it’s his!
From the context it sounds like the friend is enrolled in an HMO in the US. These vertically integrated “Health Maintenance Organizations” are very focused on preventative care because unlike traditional fee for service organizations the have a financial interest in keeping patients healthy. Hence the emphasis on vaccination. The doctor should have ordered a lot of blood work during this visit; its not only the primary diagnostic tool but when you protest that you’re healthy and don’t need all this they’ll say its because they want a baseline to work off in the future.
(How do I know all this? My wife recently had an identical experience. Not the “hold you down” remark, though, but then she’s not very abrasive — not compliant, just someone who avoids pointless confrontation.)
None of this is preventative care is mandatory. Indeed, the friend has a choice — they can go completely fee for service. This does have the snag that any serious condition or accident can rack up significant bills — medical bills are still a leading cause of bankruptcy despite the ACA. You’re stuck with a Devil’s bargain — if you want .an insurer, HMO or PPO, to cover you then you have to submit to their vision of medical care. Including preventative care.
As for the robots, replacement and what have you the key to a lot of this is infection and inflammation control. I’ve had my knees replaced and the process has more in common with car body shop work than what we usually associate with surgery. (Power tools, adhesive, hammer etc.) Surgical robots, where they are used, are just a whole lot better at manipulation than human surgeons — but there’s a human making the decisions and driving the machinery. This is just modern life. Again, feel free to ignore all this, its optional.
So, your justification is that a medical system run FOR PROFIT is just trying to secure profits, so of course one should be forced to do whatever one’s medical practitioner recommends, not matter how detrimental that may be. It’s all to protect the system, correct? So if one needs to be forced, well then one should do as one is told if one wants to live. And when those “medical” costs get a bit too high, well, they’ll just take whatever property you own since it’s more important that they profit than that you live out your life the way you choose to.
You’re justifying coerced “medical procedures” but no worry, they’re just doing their jobs and what they were told to do. And you are not only compliant with this, but fully agreeable to it in order to not be confrontational. I’m assuming you have no issue with mandates? No issue with people losing jobs due to mandating a shot that does NOTHING to protect one and might just kill them? No issue with babies and children being held down and injected with the latest pharma poison? NO issue at all with the sudden rash of unexplained deaths that NO ONE will connect to the elephant in the room?
There is no treatment for stupidity, obviously. When you are held down and forced to take some treatment you don’t even need, will the lightbulb go on then that you’re justifying a system of death instead of life, or will you meekly go along since they were only ordering that nasty little treatment for your safety and the safety of their profits?
I know, I should not bother to respond to such idiocy, what an utter waste of time to attempt to convince the willfully stupid. Now run off and get your latest booster Martin, since you do not want to buck such wonderful people who’d force you down and do whatever they please to you, all for your health and safety of course.
I’m not justifying anything, especially forced procedures. I’m just telling people who may not be used to ‘the system’ how it works. However…….and this is a bit “BUT”…..
All medical systems are ‘for profit’. They may not be as gauche as the US system where actual profit is sought in some sectors (as distinct from HMOs which are typically ‘not for profit’ organizations) but when the chips are down everyone expects — indeed, needs — to get paid. So the argument is never really about healthcare, that’s settled, everyone wants it. Its about how to pay for it, or rather how to share the available finances so that people get the best bang for the buck. Both in the US and the UK is quite possible to completely ignore this system and pay for everything yourself a la carte. If you’ve got enough money. But realistically most of us haven’t. The corner cases are typically where people expect first class treatment for third class contributions (or none at all).
You’re correct in saying that it’s not about healthcare per se, but about the way it’s financed.
Systemically speaking, universal healthcare systems are NOT for profit. They are government-controlled public insurance schemes that pay providers regulated remuneration.
The problem is not so much the delivery and financing of healthcare itself, but the interaction with other sectors and industries that do operate on a for-profit basis, most notably the pharmaceutical industry. Pharma tries to take advantage of the public nature of healthcare financing (there is always plenty of room for corruption) for instance by having their stuff reimbursed through the insurance scheme and all sorts of other nefarious practices.
If the WHO (owned by Bill Gates and the CCP and nominally led by the Ethiopian war criminal) pulls off their global coup d’état, not-a-treaty scheduled for next May, it will be allowed. I suspect then that one of the leading causes of death will become “by gunfire” as doctors accompanied by armed and uniformed thugs, do try to hold one down.
https://www.corbettreport.com/ncitestimony/
Resisting or disobeying a government officer is criminal in many places. The 2010 “Lock Step” plan from Rockefeller Foundation envisaged a vast army of temporary employees doing the jabbing,some of them armed.
‘ Here was a doctor who dared to say what others no doubt think as well: “I would hold you down and inject you right now,” if only I could.’
Most doctors I know, wouldn’t dare to go that far. What they say to ‘their’ patients (see the paternalism) is that they are ‘disappointed’ that the patient does not agree with the therapy that doctor is proposing. It’s that same kind of manipulative behavior one can experience in pathological relationships. Think Kathy Bates towards ‘her’ patient in Misery…
When doctors speak to each other about their patients, it is often with contempt. They also consider some patients more equal than others. Certainly their own class needs ‘special’ care, reason why doctors learn to never admit to the doctor on the warden that they are also a doctor (increases their chances of survival)
Patients are not stupid. Or not that stupid. They usually very kindly let the doctor speak, get the prescription yet never file it to a pharmacy (the costs!), or drop the drug when they find out the side effects, or simply don’t take the drug as they only see doctor as a mechanism that is needed in order for sick days. Or ritual.
Many admitted patients get delirant or die in hospital because doctor continues with drugs that patients have been prescribed but never took. Think about painkillers, antihypertensives, anxiolytics, anticoagulants.
In fiction, the book that comes close to the dangers of medicine, is Samuel Shem’s House of God. I highly recommend it.
To play the devil’s advocate …
I’ve been around for a while now, and when I was a kid, most doctors must have had some wartime experience (I grew up in Europe). They didn’t screw around, they didn’t walk around the patient on eggshells. They ordered treatment. What needed to be done was done. And yes, the patient was in an subordinate position. But doctor ethics back then were light years from what they’re now. Being a doctor was a mission, a public service in the true sense of the word, as opposed to the business relationship it has become.
Maybe I’m nostalgic and I do appreciate modern doctors who factually explain the various aspects of diseases to patients and let them have a say in treatment, but there was something appealing in them old-fashioned doctors.
I’d give the doc in the article the benefit of the doubt; maybe he was one of those and simply wanted to do the best for his patient.
one of the leading causes of death in this country is medical intervention. that is NOT best for the patient!
In the article above, the friend who had managed his health well went for the “required” health check (illness check) because it was a condition (demand) for continued support in a serious situation. IOW, you are not well unless we say you are.
no one is listening. the problem is not our society nor our government; it is the size of the global nation state transparent oligarch owned or controlled corporations. the wealth these corporations accumulate are passed from Oligarch generation to Oligarch generation via the transfer of stock ownership at the death of the original stock owner.
The Corporations are bigger than any government, more powerful than any military, and better distributed across the globe than any nation state, yet it is the corporations that are in charge.. No wonder humanity has been subjected to the current tyranny.
To return control of governance from corporate rule to nation state rule, it is necessary only for the people of the nation states to insist that their legislatures make laws which deny any cooperative business arrangement (corporation, partnership, trust, whatever) owned by any of the same people (or people related to the same people) to operate within the nation state. Example 100,000 shareholders own Corporation A, 1 of the Corporate A owners appears in the ownership of corporation B: the law should say Corporation B cannot open for or do business inside the subject nation state.
Another law should apply to the corporations that are allowed to operate inside of the nation states. That law should tax at 100% all corporate profits retained by the corporation, if such amount retained exceeds $10,000. The way out for this corporation is to distribute all of its excess profits [net income] to the individual owners of the corporation .
Tyranny happens when Business or political arrangements are allowed to exist outside of the political control of the people are allowed.
“Now that the pharma oligarchs own medicine they will instruct the doctors, under threat of being fired, to hold you down and to inject you and to bill you both for the cost of restraining you and for the profit in the unwanted injections.
“The visit was for an annual physical that was required under the practice’s rules”
What ‘practice’ requires a man in his mid-seventies to have a physical?
Your doctor doesn’t own you.
As a music teacher, I might just as well insist upon former piano students showing up for a competence test in their late sixties…
I am also in my mid-seventies, and I never go to a doctor, unless it’s for something like a compulsory eye test connected with renewing a driving licence at my age – logically enough, given that I want to drive.
We must all do what we can to keep ourselves healthy.
Relying upon ‘experts’ is just a modern fashion.
It’s appalling the number of people who gradually adopted the American habit in the 1950s of going to a shrink when a spouse, friend, child, or somebody at work, frowned, or disagreed with them.
Now the British do the same, as do Icelanders, none of whom needs a shrink as much as they need a smark kick in the arse and a good hobby.
False analogy. Plus, making sure that former students keep refraining from them prohibited parallel fifths or augmented seconds is always good!
Most civilized countries have a public insurance scheme, which means that you get treatment for free. It’s only reasonable that people should be required to undergo preventative checks to detect conditions that might be relatively easy and inexpensive to cure at early stages, but the opposite if they’re allowed to develop.
That being said, I don’t remember the last time I saw my doctor. I don’t even know where she has her office, she’s moved twice since. I occasionally e-mail her to ask for prescription for antibiotic ointment that I sometimes use, but that’s it.
I sincerely hope that when it’s my time to go, I’ll croak before they have a chance to cart me off to a hospital.
My analogy isn’t intended to be taken literally, only to pour scorn upon the idea of compulsory oversight of responsible adults.
I’m not saying preventative checks are not a good idea, but having them required of a person in their mid-seventies is still a totalitarian stance.
I sincerely hope when it’s your time to go, it’s this evening
Sometimes seeing a doctor is unavoidable. I have a serious medical condition which requires I get a prescription medication. My doctor (following the rules set out here in NZ) will only allow a refill a certain number of times before I am told I must come in for a visit. So that is a “must” scenario. You might say “can’t you do without the medication?” and the answer is “not without very significant deterioration.” I generally avoid taking medication (including vaccines — which my doctor has never tried to force on me). I exercise and follow a special diet in an effort to alleviate symptoms without having to take higher doses or stronger medicines.
In Qld, Australia, a person 75 and over has to have an annual physical to renew one’s driver’s license.
“If It Was Allowed, I’d Hold You Down and…”
See you after school behind the chemistry lab. Anything is allowed there.
Then we’ll see who holds whom down…
Yes, if any doctor said that to me then I would say to them “Well, I could leather you all over this surgery if I wanted to but I choose not to because I’m not a violent man by nature. But that could change if you ever did try to hold me down.”
I appreciate Ed Curtin’s articles, this one definitely stirs up a strong emotional response.
I often wonder if the current format of comment sections favors those who seek to actively “steer” the organic narrative using machine-learning technologies that exploit the “voting” and the direct “reply to” features.
It would be an interesting experiment to refrain from “thumb” voting and only use the “post comment” box to address the article or a fellow Off-G reader instead of the “reply” button.
Don’t mean to violate your request that the commenting be reformatted — but wanted to say I agree with you.
Update on the psyop of psyops:
https://john-steppling.com/2023/06/a-compulsive-god/
“The lockdowns concentrated the ennui that had been creeping into western social relations for thirty some years. I was out this last Saturday night. In a city of a half a million people. It was the first sunny warm weather this year in Norway, so nearly everyone was outside, wanting to enjoy the weather. And yet, because most restaurants use an app and ask people to reserve ahead of time for dinner, there was no chance of just spontaneously deciding on a place to dine. The problem was exacerbated by how many restaurants had shuttered their doors due to the Covid protocols. Spontaneity is a casualty of the new regimen for Western society. What Debord described as a vague feeling that something has changed in the quality of life for most people, at least in the West, is now much less vague. It is, in fact, glaringly obvious (well, to some) and increasingly disturbing. The so called *mental health crisis* is directly related to the uncontrolled anxiety that comes with this destabilising experience of daily life. Even the most ordinary of activities has taken on a quality of unreality. Life is just out of reach, today. I think it is less clear to people now what constitutes the now and what is memory. The manufacturing of reality, courtesy of Western media, is further and further from nearly everyone’s actual reality…
The professional class, doctors, lawyers, scientists of all types, are captured and compromised. Professional standing is threatened if one speaks out. If one challenges, say, the official narrative on sun screen use, for example, you will be viewed as a crank. A sun screen denier. You cannot find a search engine that will provide anything except paid for *sponsored* links that trumpet the benefits of slathering chemicals on your or your child’s body. The sun once viewed as a life giving source of heat and health, is today another threat that pharmaceuticals must protect against. There are countless examples, however. Meat is bad, crickets are good. Solar panels are green, no, wait, solar panels are not green. Electric cars…no wait. Etc.”
Going to a concert becomes MK Culture:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-65765368
As a retired physician and author of How to Be a Patient and Live to Tell the Tale! I can assure you that yearly physicals in healthy people are completely unnecessary. Doctors today have enough problems trying to figure out what’s ailing you when you tell them your symptoms. Why would you think they can find something wrong with you when you tell them you’re fine? The yearly physical is a scam to find problems that do not need fixing while increasing the provider’s daily receipts.
Ah, but the “pandemic” has shown that it’s when you’re perfectly fine that you’re most likely “sick” and “contagious” and most in need of medical attention.
I believe a scene from a “Sliders” episode frames it beautifully. A lady passed around Camomile Tea and said “It’s when you don’t think you need it that you most need it!” Her aim was to set the house on fire and kill everyone inside.
What we all should have learned from the Scamdemic is that a white coat doesn’t make a physician.
“I’m a Doctor – you can trust me” was completely trashed by recent events.
It haas been replaced by “I’m a Doctor – whose only concern is income”.
And that they rarely use the ubiquitous stethoscopes.
In the lab tests, the various values may vary a lot from one year to the next. The industry may also have narrowed the healthy range of a value, thus increasing the likelihood of your getting flagged
It’s far worse than that. Normal blood pressure used to be less than 140/80. Now it’s 130/70, increasing the number of “hypertensive” people who need medication to treat their non-existent disease. That medication can be very dangerous as well as very expensive. And ALL medications have side-effects, except vitamin C.
That is an example of what I meant.
Rather than being “radical”, the changes over the last few decades are merely in extent and application. Medicine has long been a corporation and its merger with the state began over two centuries ago. That merger has become more totalitarian, but this is just the unfolding of a century-old, Wellsian plan. That plan is known as “Public Health”.
—
G.K. Chesterton – Eugenics and Other Evils (1922)
https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/25308
We now pass from mere individual men who obviously cannot be trusted, even if they are individual medical men, with such despotism over their neighbours; and we come to consider whether the Eugenists have at all clearly traced any more imaginable public authority, any apparatus of great experts or great examinations to which such risks of tyranny could be trusted. They are not very precise about this either; indeed, the great difficulty I have throughout in considering what are the Eugenist’s proposals is that they do not seem to know themselves. Some philosophic attitude which I cannot myself connect with human reason seems to make them actually proud of the dimness of their definitions and the uncompleteness of their plans. The Eugenic optimism seems to partake generally of the nature of that dazzled and confused confidence, so common in private theatricals, that it will be all right on the night. They have all the ancient despotism, but none of the ancient dogmatism. If they are ready to reproduce the secrecies and cruelties of the Inquisition, at least we cannot accuse them of offending us with any of that close and complicated thought, that arid and exact logic which narrowed the minds of the Middle Ages; they have discovered how to combine the hardening of the heart with a sympathetic softening of the head. Nevertheless, there is one large, though vague, idea of the Eugenists, which is an idea, and which we reach when we reach this problem of a more general supervision.
It was best presented perhaps by the distinguished doctor who wrote the article on these matters in that composite book which Mr. Wells edited, and called “The Great State.” He said the doctor should no longer be a mere plasterer of paltry maladies, but should be, in his own words, “the health adviser of the community.” . . .
—
https://archive.org/details/TheGreatState
H.G. Wells et al (1912)
Prefatory Note to The Great State
It is interesting to note certain juxtapositions; this is not a socialist volume, and the constructive spirit has long since passed beyond the purely socialist range. Neither Sir Ray Lankester, nor Mr. Haynes nor Mr. Fry would dream of calling himself a socialist; the former two would quite readily admit they were individualists. That old and largely fallacious antagonism of socialist and individualist is indeed dissolving out of contemporary thought altogether.
—
Health and Healing in the Great State
By C. J. Bond, F.R.C.S.
Chapter V. (pp. 143-80)
(p.166):
In the same way the interests of the community must also be safeguarded against undue regimentation in matters of health. False assumption of authority in administrative matters on the part of the Profession must be prevented by Free Trade in the National Health Service, by free choice of doctor on the part of the individual citizen or social groups, and by freedom on the part of the public to decline any special or improved form of treatment, subject always to the important condition that such refusal does not endanger public safety or run counter to the interests of the community.
(p.174)
The enormous importance of the problem makes it a matter of vital concern that the ingoing information and the outgoing energy of a National Health Service should be co-ordinated in one central brain in one department under the control of a Minister of Health, and this Minister must combine in himself, or be able to obtain at first-hand, medical knowledge and a knowledge of biological Sociology; the Health Department will be the most fundamental of all the departments of State. It will be called upon to advise other departments concerning the biological principles upon which education and labour must be founded, upon which the activities of the soldier, sailor, and other public servants must be guided; and upon which the control and reformation of the mentally deficient, the pauper, and the criminal must be carried out.
—
Forced medical treatment was ALWAYS part of the plan!
Red Flag alert.
Bumped into a nurse from my medical office in the grocery a few years ago. We recognized each other. We chatted. Then she warned me. Somehow she remembered that I had not been in the office for a physical for a couple years. She said, If I did not get into the office soon they were going to drop me as a patient. Nice. I felt like an out of date carton of eggs that was about to be discarded.
The scenario described here is the very reason I have stayed away from my doctor’s office. I would have been combative. I will be combative. That’s my fear.
I fear that I would tell my doctor what I thought about doctors recommending the clot shot.
If he was still brave enough to stay in my presence…..
I would ask what he knew about VAERS. Or, if he followed the Buffalo Bill’s Hamlin story. If he knew about the tens of millions of innocent healthy Americans that were killed and maimed by a clot shot that does not provide immunity or stop transmission. Or the fact that none of the studies that claim safe and effective cannot claim anything because they haven’t been running long enough to prove anything.
Mitigate what symptoms? I would add. Because that would be his argument. What symptoms? You mean the flu? The symptoms are not unique to Covid so how would you know?
How would you know if I had Covid? What symptoms are different from the common flu?
I suspect he would be gone before reaching this point.
If not, bring on the PCR testing discussion.
Something like, “Have you ever heard of Kary Mullis?”…………..
That’s my fear.
Then I would be assigned a “Red Flag”.
An excuse for the government to do anything it wants.
The attack will be on because I would be considered a dissident. A threat to their livelihood.
Their burden. Burden of proof of crimes against humanity.
I can hear the discussion in the business office now.
“Flag’em” Their power.
Like the Federal government charging a political opponent with a crime.
It’s happening.
I am now 61, have not been to a doctor in probably 8 years. I moved across the state after a layoff in 2019, so finding a new one is a chore in and of itself and I just didn’t get to it. I’m no longer on any medications so it wasn’t necessary at the time. Then the covidiocy hit, and it was hard enough for me to go to a damned Urgent Care to get “tested” for the plague when I had a sinus infection a couple years ago. I had no fever, knew damned well what it was as I’ve had them before, and knew what to do to get rid of it. But due to “covid” I could not return to work without their test.
I actually had to wait to see a doctor that day, and that office was crowded with at least one crying child and probably more than one. What an idiotic waste of their time and my time. By the time the doctor walked in I was pretty irritated and stated that this was a waste of time. She of course started to get highly indignant and said “we are in the middle of a pandemic” in a bitchy tone, all ready to confront my rude ass for saying one thing. I told her then I was much more worried about HER time than mine and that shut her down. Placate their ego when possible and you’re bound to get a more friendly reaction….
But now, I know I will probably do just what you’ve outlined above when I am eventually forced to go to a doctor. And they’ll no doubt flag me as a dangerous individual. At times I look forward to that, but I know they can make my life a living hell if I allow myself to say what I want to say to them. So, for now, I keep putting it off.
Hey. I am 66. My previous doctor took an early retirement (maybe because of me and others like me) and I was forced to do a new search. I asked a lot of questions. Middle aged experienced good doctors are almost never accepting new patients. Middle aged doctors that relocate to a new office that is distant from the old office raise questions. But in today’s environment it really doesn’t matter any more. What little credibility they had is gone. Put on a blindfold and throw a dart at the list of available doctors. However, it would probably be easier than ever to pick a better doctor. Just ask the question: Do you recommend the Covid clot shot? You will know immediately by his or her response.
We’ve gone from manufacturing consent to manufacturing crisis, designed to override consent. Chronic crises in order to declare emergency use authorization and suspension of human rights is just a step toward dissolving nation-states altogether. Corporate culture is totalitarian in nature and consent isn’t even in their equation. The only thing that prevents them from going full fascist is free speech. Once everyone is silenced, which is a monumental task considering that humans are social beings, then the killing begins.
“I wish there was something else to talk about, but this is it,” Wood says. “This is the topic of the day. This is what people need to know and understand.
If we are going to fight back against this enemy, which previously has pretty much been unseen, we must recognize who we’re dealing with. Period. We cannot provide any defense or offense to push back on this unless we know who the enemy really is and what they’re thinking, what’s in their head.”
Wood, Mercola: It’s Crucial To Understand What We’re Up Against
You brought up Ivan Illich.
I remember when my dad returned from a trip to the UK with a copy of the very thin but rich “Deschooling Society” as a gift for me.
Illich’s deinstitutionalized ‘skill sharing’ ideas were prophetic and, of course, oppsed to convention.
I remember buying Illich’s “Medical Nemesis,” finding it too a tough read and setting it aside, never having completed it.
Illich arrived with an enlightened and open mind on the cusp of the age of endarkenment.
“Deschooling” people is equally as idiotic as is sorry the state of affairs of the present-day education system.
The correct way, as always, is moderation – education free of indoctrination.
I absolutely hated public school.
I recall Illich’s then eccentric ideas seemed radical, fresh and welcome to me, that I zealously encouraged others to read him and that I was met with universal disinterest.
No one was saying anything like him.
That was close to 50 years ago now.
Have you read Deschooling Society?
I know that slim volume was a struggle for me.
His language was highly academic, tongue-tyingly multisyllabic and so dense I could barely get through a paragraph without having to reach for the dictionary.
What’s “idiotic” about deschooling?
Here’s an excellent synopsis of the top.
*
“Deschooling Society” is a 1971 book by Austrian author Ivan Illich that critiques the role and practice of education in the modern world. Illich proposes a system of self-directed education in fluid and informal arrangements, which he describes as “educational webs that heighten the opportunity for each one to transform each moment of his living into one of learning, sharing, and caring.” Illich debunks the many myths of schooling, including that most learning is a result of teaching, stating that a majority of people acquire most of their insight, knowledge, and skill outside of school. [1] Illich advocates for educational freedom over obligatory graded curriculums, stating that the social and psychological destruction inherent in obligatory schooling is an illustration of the destruction implicit in all international institutions that now dictate the kinds of goods, services, and welfare available to satisfy basic human needs. Illich makes a compelling case to “deschool” society, wean our citizens off institutionalized, factory-style, pointless education, and start thinking of alternatives. [2]
Synopsis (Brave search return “summarizer”), and pdf, (all 50 pages).
Deschooling Society is a 1971 book by Austrian author Ivan Illich that critiques the role and practice of education in the modern world. [1] Illich proposes changes to education in society and learning in individual lifetimes by abolishing modern schools and institutions and bringing them back into the control of people. Illich’s “deschooled” society would consist of numerous community-organized programs where people are allowed to learn what they desire, and where an entirely new elite would be produced, an elite of those who earned their education by sharing it. Illich presents schools as places where consumerism and obedience thrive. [2]
https://monoskop.org/images/1/17/Illich_Ivan_Deschooling_Society.pdf
I hated school with a passion too. I was a smart kid but somewhat hard to control. I would correct the teachers and ridicule them when they made a mistake or babbled nonsense (for instance, my physics teacher’s understanding of electricity went about as far as a simple circuit with a battery and a light bulb, while I was building radios at the age of nine) and they segregated me and gave me extra assignments so that I wouldn’t disturb my kiddie friends, which I did anyway. But I didn’t give that much shit. It was something you gotta do. School gave me a solid basis in sciences, languages, math.
This bullshit about kids choosing what and how they want to learn is total crap. People need to learn discipline, not in the sense of listening to authority but in the sense of having control of themselves. Plus, people are lazy and most will not study and learn if not forced to. And even if they do, they need guidance to learn things in proper order and context.
I do agree that the education system is fucked, but deschooling or some batshit crazy alternative schooling is the other extreme.
I’m a high school dropout.
I learned why I hated school so much when I went and got my GED, just after I turned 40.
I finished with a surprising and excellent result, particularly in mathematics, where I’d done worst of all in school.
What I learned from the GED was that the main obstacle to learning is teachers.
I learned from whomsoever wrote the recommended study guide, which included pragmatic studying suggestions, that, above all, learning well depends on having an appropriate instructor, which I’d never had in math, so got frustrated, fell way behind and came to believe I was a very stupid person.
On the GED, I excelled overall, receiving the best results in, of all disciplines, mathematics, as a result of, in my view, having had the right instructor, even when that instructor was only present a well written guide book.
A year or so after I received my GED, on the advice of a USINS agent who threatened to jail me for five years, then turned me back (twice), I also paid for a third party, professional academic evaluation, and received, from an accredited professor, and then Chair of the NY School of Visual arts, Computer Art Department, an evaluation providing the equivalent of a BSc, based on my prior life’s work and experience in the arts, building, business management, software training and technical publishing.
I wasn’t stupid or lazy, and I earned that degree by a far more rigorous, interesting, enlightening and disciplined route than school.
But I wasn’t allowed into the USA to work — even though I’d been hired by Boeing, in Seattle — on the judgement of the USINS agent, who is (was) the armed frontier Justice that also enforces it.
Unfortunately, neither the Southern border nor the reverse Roxham Road route were options available at the time.
Teachers do matter, for sure. I’ve had some wonderful ones, some real bad ones. I’ve studied at very shitty schools and at some extraordinary schools. In various parts of the world. C’est la vie. C’est toujours comme ca, partout.
You can’t throw out the baby with the bathwater. Just because there are shitty teachers and shitty schools, it doesn’t mean that academic institutions should be abandoned. That’s nuts.
“people are lazy and most will not study and learn if not forced to. And even if they do, they need guidance to learn things in proper order and context“
Thank Goodness your superior intellect is here to guide us poor fools in our confusion
Who is us? You got a mandate from some other people to speak for them?
Or you feel too insecure to speak for yourself and need to prop your pitiful existence by a bunch of others while you’re trying to hump my leg?
exactly!!! he is an authoritarian regardless of what he thinks. does he realize that for hundreds and hundreds of years people didn’t go to a “school”, but strangely we still had scientists, artists, composers, et al. this idea that you need to go to a special building, and face a teacher like a preacher and have them tell you what to think is ridiculous.
It’s not a shock to read you would correct and ridicule teachers.
Neither is it a shock that you would rather be taught, what other people want to teach you, than learn what you want to learn.
If you ever change your mind and decide to learn something on your own rather than be taught something by someone else, perhaps an examination of Bertrand Russell’s observation would be a good place to start: The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wise people so full of doubts.
– Decided to delete my comment.
People need to learn discipline, not in the sense of listening to authority but in the sense of having control of themselves.
Very well put.
thanks for mansplain’ to us what people need. somehow you assume that sitting in a room at a desk all day having some “person” dictate is learning discipline.
Good news! The crisis is over:
(BBC)
What? Is that in the sense of a camera’s sensor being exposed to the light of a scene or the actual experience of being homeless?
Well, he is rolling in oudles of dosh, why doesn’t he put some of it to good used instead of just taking on the role of a figurehead? I’m sure a suitably carved and painted lump of wood would serve just as well for a figurehead.
– Daily Mail, today
Says little Prince Louis: ‘Is it because people like us grabbed everything for ourselves, Daddy?’
They have teams of script writers to ensure that they always know the right thing to say…
“will definitely be exposed” to homelessness
An interesting choice of words, which may prove prophetic 😉
When stupid people get a decent title, they fall into elitism and become arrogant.
If a fool gets arrogant, there will be no better puppet than him.
I had a chance to talk to a psychiatrist about Corona. I said only very common sense. But in the middle of the conversation, I could see a look on her face that looked pitiful to me. And what she said was, “You’re schizophrenic.”
God, I can’t forget this moment.
Perhaps she had not heard of the term ‘cognitive dissonance’?
We are back to Karl Rove’s constantly new realities:
“We’re an empire now, and when we act, we create our own reality. And while you’re studying that reality — judiciously, as you will — we’ll act again, creating other new realities, which you can study too, and that’s how things will sort out. We’re history’s actors . . . and you, all of you, will be left to just study what we do.”
I think there is more than a kind of professional hubris behind all this. Obviously we are witnessing a concerted and unified effort directed from the top. But the unprecedentedly threatening nature of so many media people and doctors betrays something which threatens them. I am not suggesting that they are all being made “the offer they can’t refuse” in a darkened room. But there is a drumbeat issuing from above and it is sounding on all channels and its message is: “Here’s what we want you to do. And you’d better do it or else ….”
Thus there is a smell of fear and it issues from the top. Fear is the most pragmatic motivator. It guarantees extreme compliance in many. And it issues from the top – i.e. it indicates that those at the top themselves are afraid. These are momentous times indeed. The old order i.e. the one we have taken for granted all our lives – and which was, to be sure, quite cushy for us, is now crumbling.
The adoption of a new system – or the modification of the old one – would help but those at the very top have no intention of such a course. It would not even occur to them. Because the system resembles that of a nursery with oversized infants at the top who are wailing for more and more. And they have power over all below them. It used to be that they “bought” the compliance of their minions by various means: the illusion of participation in the legal framework, big crumbs falling from the table, various distractions with the bright shiny paraphernalia of consumerism. But the squeeze is here. Since the infants at the top have no intention of surrendering the slightest of their luxuries and indeed continue to demand more and more, they force their executive arm to resort to more and more extreme measures.
The pandemic theatre was entirely logical and served a number of purposes at once: an excuse to diminish the services everyone depended on, a cull, and a backdoor way of securing even more lucrative production of useless and indeed lethal items etc. But the viral show is fast losing credibility even amongst the toilet roll gatherers. Thus the climate crap etc.
There will be increasing hysteria throughout the media for the foreseeable future.
Unfortunately, and pathetically at least 60-75% (?) of the general population will succumb to the ‘experts’ advice.
They have swallowed the Kool Aid, literally.
the nutritionist convention was sponsored by mcdonalds and coke.
You need to go further in your reflection. This is not an issue exclusively concerning medicine.
What you’re describing is the omnipresently sprawling protectionist ideology, approach to life, the hubristic conviction that man has the ability to conquer nature and resolve any issue combined with the idea that people are entitled to a content, pain-free, prosperous life and that technology will provide that.
This is not something foisted on humanity, humanity is perfectly complicit in foisting this plasticky, artificial way of life onto itself.
yes, we do cocreate this.
I have noticed that everything you post has the aim of totally abstracting from the concrete situation and “eternalizing” it as well as transferring all blame/agency from the top to the bottom. Apparently “we” are responsible for our own degradation. “We” have become spoiled and accustomed to an “unnaturally” bloated lifestyle etc. Thus you ridicule the “idea that people are entitled to a content, pain-free, prosperous life and that technology will provide that”.
So how far back do we have to go to redeem ourselves? Do we undo all “protectionism”? And what does that mean? That we abandon every single technological advance since …. well, when precisely? We are to give up on contentment and resign ourselves to pain? How much pain? We are to “stop conquering nature”. Do we strip ourselves naked and go back to the trees?
And even if we tried to do all these things, how could we succeed with a political/social/military formation above us which will insist on us “reaping the benefits” of the modern world?
Or is there “no such thing as society” after all?
Nobody is entitled to nothing. Whatever you have you gotta work for. Period. If that hasn’t been made clear to you before, it just has.
Beats me why you’d want to go back, the last time I checked, time only goes forward, not backwards. Accordingly, try to come up with a way of life that relies on technology MODERATELY, in a way that does not atrophy human abilities, that does not divorce them from nature.
Formulate such an ideology, make it appealing to the masses, get on the fucking soapbox and sell it to them, and you’re cruising. Or something like that.
Stop whining about them doing things to you. People are totally okay and complicit with the way of life scripted for them by the powers that be. And they want more of it.
And everything you gotta work for is something you work for within a society with its state of technology and its social structure – which is ever different from period to period. How much do you inherit from the past? A vast amount.
Or as Marx once said:
But you say,
Everything there is open to question. How “moderately” is “MODERATELY”? And, by definition, all human technology “divorces from nature”.
By “them” I presume you mean the script writers of the media. They are doing things to me. Sure, I can switch off my TV. But I couldn’t do anything about having my workplace shut down and being sent home for months. I can’t carry out much needed operations that have been cancelled by a total lie. People are “OK” and “complicit” in the sense that we are all born into a society and inherit its traditions and, since we need to be sociable to even survive, have to play along with the “received wisdom” to a degree at least.
But it seems to me your constant disgust at “whining” is an attempt to preclude all critique. Like so many who seem to enjoy going along with this general revulsion of the masses, you play into the ruling ideology. Your entire outlook seems to revolve around a sense of “Those bastards at the bottom have it coming to them!”
I don’t give a whole lot of shit about some Marx. Or any other motherfucker, for that matter. I’ll listen to people who have interesting things to say, but I won’t practice personality cult toward them. You might wanna think about that too.
The beauty of moderation is in the eye of the beholder. As I said, using shit to an extent that doesn’t atrophy your essential abilities would be about it.
You could do everything about your workplace being shut down. You could go there and tell them, “You know what motherfuckers? Shove this piece of shit job up your ass. I quit.” But you’d need balls to do that. Well, you’d need balls to live a life other than scripted by society for you.
People are okay with it not because they’re born into it, even though that is a factor, but because they actively partake in the creation of all the stuff you keep whining about as being imposed on them.
In other words, your perception of ordinary people as being poor little things being foisted on nefarious things by the elite is wrong. Some of that does go on, sure, but that simply not how things go down.
You just flew into an ad hominem against Marx without considering what he actually wrote there. You might wanna think about that too.
And having beauty or anything else for that matter “in the eye of the beholder” gives us zero guide for the moderation of a society.
You’re a regular Rambo aren’t you – ignoring the fact, pointed out by Marx, that you are free to quit any job but not free to quit all jobs which are ultimately regulated by the capitalist system.
Rambo again. Break free from society! …. and go where exactly?
People always “actively partake” in the deeds of their society by merely living from day to day in it. These deeds are indeed imposed on them. And God forbid that I – or anyone else – should “whine” about it. Who needs critique?
And once again the elite get a free pass – or, to be more precise, they are erased from the picture entirely. Hell – I even predict your next step: it’s that “we” brought it all on ourselves! Yes – it was “we” who scripted covid and climate!
You committed the fallacy of appeal to authority by invoking some Marx. I’ve never met the dude, never talked to him, don’t know much about him. Why are you stuffing Marx in my face? Don’t you have your own brain to come up with something instead of parroting some shit some Marx wrote (after who knows how many beers and shots of booze)?
I don’t know where you wanna go. It’s up to you to figure it out. Why don’t you focus on yourself instead of blaming everybody else around you?
People are merely living day to day? You’re now surely talking about some poor bastards in Bangladesh who sew your clothes or in China who put together your phones while living in a cardboard box under the workbench! Surely not the average westerner who enjoys an unprecedentedly luxurious living standard!
I don’t know what you mean that the elite gets a free pass. Yeah, there is always an “elite” in society, there are the losers, there is the middle class, there are the court jesters, the devil’s advocates, all sorts of motherfuckers. What do you want? Some kind of fucking communism where everybody is the same? Or transhumanism where everybody is turned into a fucking android?
You know what? I ain’t got no fucking clue what you’re bitching about! What the fuck is it that you want?
I don’t think this is a case of appeal to authority because what Marx is saying is the simplicity itself, and we can have first-hand experience of it in our lives. It is clear we – in the so called civilised world – live within an economic system that is totalitarian because it encompasses the whole life with its institutions and its culture, whose influence has been shaping our ancestors brains, and ours as a result, in a cumulative way. This is an acknowledgement, an understanding, which doesn’t imply that we like it or surrender to it. It doesn’t imply either that there is nothing we can do about it. This understanding IMO is a precondition if we want to ever overcome this crisis. It *is* true however that what we can do about it, realistically at an individual level at this moment, for many of us is very negligible compared to how we are shaped by it; the latter in fact implying the former.
Everyone of us has their history which leads to their present social and economic conditions, which shape our worldview, and orient our decisions to a great extent. The majority who live and work in cities and whose dependence upon the structure of the system is high will react to what is going on in a different way than those who live and work in an apparent independence of the system. (I say apparent because I’m reminded of those who live “off-grid” but which nevertheless can post videos on how they are living in “total disconnection” from the system; how they hunt, cook, built their houses, make fire, raise animals, etc. These “off-griders” had to invest a lot of money to begin with and have to regularly “get back to civilisation” for all the things they need to buy to go on living that way. Northing like those who had to flee Petrograd in 1917 and immersed themselves in Central Asia fearing death; we don’t hear of those; we can read about them though). The point is, in front of this crisis, those of the first category will react in a more passive way (acquired passivity) and complain more because of their strong dependence on the system which shaped their personality and their way of life; and those of the second category would tend to be active (equally acquired activeness) and reaccommodate the best they can to changes for the exact same reasons. Note that this division in two categories is entirely contingent to the existence of the crisis and would be invisible without it meaning it is artificial and there is no superiority of any kind of either one on the other, for both are reacting *in accordance with, and not resisting* the inclinations dictated by their social and economic condition and way of life, which is *in both cases* the easy way to proceed, the line of least resistance. No extra effort is made by neither. There was an article on here a few months back discussing whether those who hadn’t fallen to the medical theatre are the “chosen ones”, and my view was that the chosen ones are those who *did* fall for it for quite some time, then resisting their inclinations made their research and *then* woke up to the farce. This shows that it is a matter of time before the two categories merge together.
Also, consider the following: what is lost in activity within the first category that abounds in the second is largely compensated for in radicality that lacks in the second and abounds in the first. Those who depend strongly on the system and had not much been active against it are fed up with it and therefore tend to be more radical in their views (note that to be strongly dependent on to something and being fed up with it are not antithetical); on the contrary, those who have always actively adapted to crises in the system are more likely to approach them in a tactical way and be contented by simple reforms if they benefit by them. Therefore, we need both categories, – as a matter of fact each exists only in relation to the existence of the other, just like one can’t be oneself by oneself; we need others to be what we are.
So what is the synthesis between the two conflicting categories? What is the point of view that takes what is essential in each? IMO, it is the one that holds that just like, in my present condition, I’ve have *this* worldview and *this* what I think we should do; everyone else is just having corresponding beliefs; and therefore the synthesis is that everyone do as their condition predisposes them to do until they resist it and change course, while recognising that everyone else has the same right to do just the same. In a word, cultivate putting ourselves in the shoes of others.
This is also relevant:
https://off-guardian.org/2023/05/26/cattes-corner-covid-virus-theory-the-painted-goat/#comment-606763
Naturally, we live within systems that put constrains on us. To begin with, we’re constrained by the physical properties of the world, night and day, summer and winter, gravitation, you name it. Then we’re constrained by society. Psychological conditioning. Etc. That’s a given, redundant to even mention that. We’re all operating within these systemic limits. Unless you’re out there in the sticks with the wolves.
There is, however, a lot of leeway within these systems, and that’s what I’m talking about.
Yeah, invoking Marx probably isn’t appeal-to-authority fallacious because Marx is an authority, but these references to all sorts of dead men irk me. I like people to express their own opinions. Who is to say that Marx is above, say, you or me or this other guy? If you got a valid argument, say it.
Yes, I get you. Unless a quote is self-evident, which I think is the case here though, or it is used to strengthen an argument it can’t substitute for it. And there is a lot of abuse of quotes, I agree; that’s what the internet have got us as opposed to real debates, wherein one has no choice but argue one’s way to the conclusion.
The point I’ve tried to make above is that if we couldn’t convince others of our point of view or be convinced by them, perhaps we just have to agree to disagree for the time being until the next exchange.
In fact, as in everything, this is a deep and old question. Is action the result of the sole will which is independent of and operates notwithstanding the circumstances, or is it the result precisely of these circumstances which crystallize in a will? It is clear the past weighs on us, but on the other hand we’re not entirely incapable of effecting personal improvement. Experience shows that some people will snap out of their mental paralysis by good a kick; others will respond to that with deeper paralysis. One gets the same pattern if one instead just accompanies the paralytic mood until it lifts, if it lifts, which I think it will sooner or later on its own. Maybe there is a time of readiness which is different for everyone. Maybe those who snap out of it were ready and those who didn’t need more time and it is useless or even harmful to push them too hard?
I don’t know what the answer is. I don’t know whether there is one. Well, not quite; I have this idea: the analogy with homeostasis, our innate ability to recover equilibrium of all biological variables when it is disturbed. I think just like one recovers from a flu by simple rest (let’s leave out cases of serious injuries like being shot, etc, even though there are very relevant aspects related to those cases), humanity like a collective organism is having a flu and is going through a recovery process which is always a conflict, a tragedy. And just like in any recovery there is loss of waste material and building of new cells, it means for humanity there will be trouble, suffering and loss of lives to get on other side, whatever it is; and we will get there anyway in spite of what we can rationalise about the “there” thing, just like in a recovery from flu the – what I call – the Spirit does its thing if I leave it alone in spite of what I rationalise about it. In this analogy, I’m assuming there is such a thing as humanity, as a society of humans; that we are social beings whose identity can only be known through our relation to others, no by ourselves. This is what I believe for now; whether it is true in real terms – because this is not science but metaphysics – I don’t know; in the meantime, if someone doesn’t respond to a “Snap out of it!” to start moving I just assume and accept they’re not ready yet.
Yes. You know, if I accepted the notion that your life is formed by the external systemic circumstances, what’s the point of making any effort whatsoever? What’s the point of trying to improve, strive for perfection, excellence? You’re bound to fail from the outset.
Sure, objectively speaking, there are obstacles, constraints. But to have this as a starting point and effectively render any effort futile before you even try is ultimately defeatist.
People should adopt the opposite attitude or else they’ll never accomplish anything.
As to society, it can be either viewed as a homogeneous mass of human units constrained by societal limits or a diverse set of independent cooperating individuals. The idea of the former makes me wanna vomit.
Well, empiric evidence shows that the former kind of homogeneous mass has been increasing in number and spread over the world. Complaining about it didn’t make it go away (we’re talking of centuries of complaining); then the economic system has undergone reforms as to improve things but perhaps after an initial improvement things got back as before or worse. State violence has been tried of course with deaths by the thousands, to no avail; even wars didn’t seem to get rid of them; these people protesting and asking the State for jobs just doesn’t seem to go away. The problem seems to be elsewhere.
There are left two possible reasons unexamined here (they were of course by others): either the problem is somehow in the biology of some humans and the system is fine, and in this case simple removal is indicated; or the problem is in the system and the people are fine.
As far as the first hypothesis is concerned, prevalence of purely endogenous factors inducing the traits we complain about is not consistent with the population target as part of the general population: most people who are diagnosed with psychopathy or other behaviour troubles have a history of family and childhood troubles; one can refer to the works of for instance R. D. Laing. Thus, it’s not endogenous. Only a tiny part could be qualified as endogenously troubled, contrasting with the size of the mass we’re talking about.
On the contrary, there is ample evidence that the economic system has its inherent problems and always creates winners and losers among nations as well as among individuals which on the whole do not correlate with personal abilities. This situation over decades turn systemic and very difficult to improve; specially in the Global South. It is a tradition to mention Marx here, who has studied the current system under its multiple angles, but not only him, there is today an implicit acknowledgment across all official tendencies, political and economic that the system is bust, the vIsible symptoms having always been these masses of people protesting including now global middle class, and the only margin of action is to manoeuvre it so as not to crash.
So, however much we may wish to vomit at a certain sight, there is no guilt there only necessary consequence.
Well you’ve certainly put one over on me. When I initially quoted Marx I wasn’t going to mention his name since I know that automatically drives some people screaming into the hills. It never occurred to me that you wouldn’t even know who he was. Quaint.
I kinda know who he was. I also note that you’re enthralled by his ramblings. I’m not. Keep the guy to yourself. If you wanna talk to me, tax your wit and produce something of your own. If I wanted to talk to fucking Marx, I’d read his books or exhume the motherfucker. Time machine might work too!
“Disgusted” doesn’t want to think about Marx; he doesn’t want to think about anything. He just wants to hijack every comment thread. Ignore him.
Oh I dunno. He’s kinda fun.
Oh my!
Yes, he should definitely be ignored.
I think that ‘Disgusted’ might possibly (??) be an ‘AI bot’. For I noticed yesterday (on the Off-G article where ‘he’ [?] was subjecting me to wholly unwarranted verbal abuse) that the commenter was posting over quite a big span of hours… how many actual human beings would post over the best part of a 24-hour period?
‘Nobody is entitled to nothing’ ?
Don’t you mean ‘anything’
If that’s the case, then ALL of the massively exploitative ‘entitlements’ of the ruling class should be stripped from them.
Even God herself would not have enough hours in a day to actually WORK for, and EARN the DISGUSTING wealth the ruling class PO$$E$$E$..
Their ‘entitlement’ on a planet with limited resources, is a minute fraction of what they lust and drool over.
Who exactly should do it? Either do something about it or shut the fuck up.
Ditto, buddy.
On the money.
It’s babbling nothingness couched in convluted prose where words hold no meaning.
Watch the film I Care A Lot to see where this “protectionist ideology” has morphed into a communitarian, “greater good” doublespeak. The predominant issues that need to be resolved have been artificially created in Hegelian dialectic fashion. And yes, they have all been foisted on humanity, for increased control and profit.
“Humanity” is a meaningless term.
When someone uses this term it indicates that they are incapable of using critical thinking skills and are unable of marshalling any sort of historical, political or economic analysis.
“Omnipresently sprawling protectionist ideology”- say what?
Please refer to Kenneth Burke’s talk at the First American Writers Conference in 1935 titled, “A Feeling That Excrement was Dripping From My Tongue.”
People in the Occident have had it too good for too long. Sky-high living standard, technologies making their lives super easy, entertainment up the wazoo, painless healthcare, a doodad for this, that, and the other fucking thing. Upbringing that makes them spoiled entitled brats.
They wanna preserve it and get more and more, in line with the consumerist ideology.
They’re convinced that they’re entitled to all of this. Hence the protectionist ideology. If you can’t see how it’s sprawling throughout the world, you really need to pull you head out of whatever orifice you got it stuck in. Convid, BTW, was to a large extent due to that protectionism.
And the epitome: carrying the e-bike on the EV and drive somewhere to ride the e-bike.
Covid1984 didn’t force people to consolidate their lives, the same people FORCED THEMSELVES because lack of obedience means the threat of losing $$ was victorious over the reality that they were only gaslit to comply.
If you get a chance, could you please explain why “humanity is a meaningless term?” Are you saying that generalizing the entire human species is too inexact to have any significance?
Realistically, generalizing allows us to write a comment. If we couldn’t generalize, every comment would be book length (some almost are anyway).
This is the ol’ individual vs. collective dichotomy. It’s not either this or that. There are both collective and individual aspects about human existence. And finding a balance between the two is a never-ending struggle.
I’d kinda agree with Maxwell that the term humanity is bogus. The word itself. Don’t like it myself. But everybody’s using it, so one has to go with the flow, doesn’t he, eh?
It’s the idea that expresses the social nature of human beings, that we can’t be by ourselves, only in relation to others. That web of relations is what humanity is IMO. Even the diehard individualist gets their identity from other individualists. Needless to say, it is the object of controversies between those who only believe in the existence of singularities (nominalists) and those who believe in that of universals. According to French philosopher and historian Alain de Benoist, Liberalism is founded upon the nominalist idea of individual and denies the universal of humanity or society.
Hegel mentions this concept in his preface to the Phenomenology of Spirit:
“For the nature of humanity is to impel men to agree with one another, and its very existence lies simply in the explicit realisation of a community of conscious life.”
If it were allowed, you should publish the name and home address of that doctor so people could go round and advise him strongly to resign from the practice of medicine as there was ‘a very great danger’ that his house would be burned down otherwise…..
Yes, but we’re NOT going to do this, just to be clear 😅 I argue it’s probably the WORST thing to do, to give this (or any other) representative of the mundanity of evil the luxury of martyrdom.
Sam – Admin 2, I find the comments of “Disgusted” so rude and disgusting. He (she/they/it/whatever) is certainly entitled to his (etc) opinions and can even, sometimes, make valid points, but he feels compelled to viciously attack and deride every other commenter. His constant use of obscenity is uncalled for. It goes well beyond any required for emphasis. What, if anything, can be done to curb him? I have tried replying to his nasty comments in a civil tone, clearly to no good effect. Perhaps he could be told (privately) to calm down and cut back on the insults and violent language? Perhaps all other readers/ commenters could be warned NOT to respond or react to his attacks — in which case he might just give up and go away? (More likely, I expect, he’d just take up another moniker and resume the attack with a new online identity.)
Everyone else, watch — I would be willing to bet [except I don’t gamble] that he attacks me for asking the Admin this!
Ha ha ha …
Get a life, loser …!
Cut out the rudeness or I will be pruning your output. It’s excessive and juvenile. Thank you. A2
Just scroll past the comments, unless you fear missing out.
Yes, you’re spot-on, re. ‘Disgusted’.
As I mentioned in a post yesterday, a couple of years ago on another site (which I no longer post on) was an article entitled “Don’t feed the trolls”. That’s the stance that, as you so rightly say, should be taken re. ‘Disgusted’.
“Disgusted” is so rude I “snitted” all over the keyboard, shortbread and all.
I think i will behave offended as it is my very right.
This really is a patently idiotic suggestion.
First, you’re dealing with a civilizational issue, a problem that has deep underlying causes that in a way go all the way to the advent of the technological Christian ideology, and you’re gonna take it out on a single guy?
Second, the doctor is probably acting in good faith and, let’s face it, if disease is caused by pathogens (thus far the best documented mechanism, phantasms about ‘synchronization’ notwithstanding), then vaccination is an ingenious preventative method.
assuming by your tone you are not directly on the rockefeller payroll, you might find this illuminating, then once youve mastered the basics you could consider looking deeper into the subject, really its quite something to take on board, the sheer depth of the lies
https://truthcomestolight.com/the-end-of-germ-theory-documentary-an-easy-to-understand-step-by-step-analysis-of-the-history-of-germ-virus-theory-the-erroneous-science-behind-vaccination-a-close-look-at/
Fuck you as far as the rockerfella payroll, cocksucker. I’m sick of pieces of shit of your ilk who accuse everybody who doesn’t agree with whatever dogma you assholes happen to harbor of this and that and the other thing. Yes, fuck you! Fuck you in the ear. Fuck you in the other ear too!
Phooey ..!
Now, that being settled, as far as the subject matter, it’s like this. I know every last thing about the controversy between the germ theory and the terrain theory. Likewise, I know every last thing about virology. I’ve organized workshops with Scoglio, Lanka. Worked on stuff done by Kaufman.
Interesting things. They certainly have a point. Both in respect of the fact that lege artis (look up somewhere what it means, ignoramus) practice has somewhat clay feet, and in respect of what the actual cause of diseases is. To a quite an extent, I agree with them. At the same time, they have just about zero actual evidence other than methodological claims, while virology has zillions of experiments. Virologists do actual work, as opposed to running at the mouth and naysaying. And they do have a point too.
So, to wrap it up, know that I am not a dogmatic motherfucker of your kind who would embrace something without proper substantiation and rabidly attack everybody who is not as stupidly injudicious as you, and for the time being, I consider things to be somewhere midway between the two, germ and terrain.
You assume whatever fucking stance you wish, I don’t give two shits. Now buzz off, motherfucker, and don’t mention fucking rockerfella again.
L fucking OL, man! That was something! I wish we were all in a room instead of spread out across the planet behind computer screens. That would be a riot.
Don’t reply to “Disgusted” and maybe he’ll go away
I found this article annoying but accurate in describing relationships with the medical profession by the still somewhat cognizant elderly . You appear to be suffering from an attempt a to become an ” Existential Libertarian” , I tried that for a brief time in my youth . It leads directly to nihilism in my experience and cannot be sustained as one ages and gains life experience due to the many compromises you will be forced to endure. Religion , Alcohol , or some other form of addiction may be in your future ?
Ha ha ha … funny.
What is an ‘existential libertarian’? And what does it mean that one ages? The number of revolutions of the piece of matter whereon we happen to be futzin’ around the nearest star? Or some kind of mental change, going soft it the head, unwilling to accept new things?
The only thing I observe about myself over the years is that I give even less fuck than I used to.
Disg is an Anarchist.
Does NOT lead to NIHILISM.
Does cause extensive speaking out, though.
It doesn’t follow that even “if disease is caused by pathogens…vaccination is an ingenious preventative method.”
Perfect example of the folly of vaccination is vaccinating a newborn for Hepatitis B. Unless the mother has Hep B, the newborn will most likely not even be exposed to it for another twenty years (if then). Currently, the vectors are either sexual contact or needle sharing.
Here in the US, children receive 72 vaccinations by age 18. This is total lunacy. And pediatricians are paid $400 (by Blue Cross) for every child they vaccinate – if they reach a certain threshold (63% of “patients”). If vaccinations are so crucial, why waste good money paying doctors to vaccinate children?
I was referring to the concept itself, not to how it’s been hijacked and misused. Gotta make that distinction to avoid throwing out the baby with the bathwater, man.
then vaccination is an ingenious preventative method
Gaslighting 2.0, Disg!
If the good doctor cannot practice with humility over what a clusterfuck the Coronadoom was, and at least apologize for exacerbating unnecessary panic on the normies, I would not hesitate to call him out.
You were gaslighting about the vax, right?
First question to any new doctor should be “do you think I should get vaccinated against Covid-19?” Their answer will determine whether they have a future as your doctor.
You cannot save people from themselves. It’s only going to get tougher watching those you love succumb to never-ending engineered crises. People will only wake up when they are ready to do so themselves, by themselves.
but who are the doctors who will say ‘ no I don’t think you should’? Are they even allowed?
Mystical unicorns. Don’t exist in Bangkok. We (not me) are on our 8th injection here…
If you live in US or Europe I think I read that there are lists of dissident doctors with locations and contact details. Maybe the front line doc site (covid19critical care dot com) or world council for health / BIRD telegram channel. Will post links here if I can find tomorrow.
Is it voluntary in Thailand or do they provide some pressure to take it?
8 jabs is insane, so close to ancient Chinese med and India ivermectin.
It is far worse than you surmise . If you ask that question , almost all doctors are forced under the threat of having their license suspended to strongly advise you to get vaccinated post haste .Globally the doctor patient relationship has since the successful implementation Reaganomics and Thatcherism become doctor and client .
Tru$t the $cience…
Aldous Huxley:
Medical science has made such tremendous progress that there’s hardly a healthy human left.
George Orwell:
If you want a picture of the future imagine a boot stamping on a masked human face forever.
COVID-19 = CONJOB-1984